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FPSC Classic Models and Media / modle pack 44 rigged 2 talk?

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seppgirty
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Posted: 30th Aug 2010 04:39
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i was wondering if anyone bought model packs 44 or 45 (i think?) that's the school and the history model packs yet?
i was wondering if those models were rigged to work with the dark voices in FPSC and also what kind of animations they have?
they look pretty good and you can't beat the price

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Nbt
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Posted: 30th Aug 2010 12:05
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They were made for exactly that reason and have all the bones to work with dark voices. As to what other animations they have, sorry can't help you as never bought them. I did see one with a sweeping the floor type animation.

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seppgirty
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Posted: 31st Aug 2010 06:38
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wow, that would be great if they are all rigged for talking. that would make them MUST BUY packs. can anyone else confirm that they are rigged for talking before i purchase them? (not that i don't take your word NBT )

thanks

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tschwarz
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Posted: 1st Sep 2010 07:37
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It would be best if TGC started adding "dark voice enabled characters" to the model pack description. That way we would all know right away.

Shall we play a game?” - Joshua
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Nbt
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Posted: 1st Sep 2010 20:52
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The trouble is TGC do not make the model pack descriptions, the maker of the pack does, so it's not really TGC's fault.

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Conjured Entertainment
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Posted: 1st Sep 2010 22:49 Edited at: 1st Sep 2010 22:51
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Quote: "It would be best if TGC started adding "dark voice enabled characters" to the model pack description. "

I agree, because this is a good question and I was unaware of the fact that those characters were rigged for talking, and that makes a world of difference.

Quote: "The trouble is TGC do not make the model pack descriptions, the maker of the pack does, so it's not really TGC's fault."

Nobody said it was their fault; he said ADD which they could do even though the creator writes the description.
After all, there is an approval process for model uploading at TGC, so it could be added to the description during the approval process.
I agree that this feature should be pointed out to the consumer, because it is definitely a selling point.

Quote: "wow, that would be great if they are all rigged for talking. that would make them MUST BUY packs."

I want all the talking characters that I can get, so the more unique 'talking heads', the better.
I would glady pay for enhancement packs for the old characters with new heads like Bond did for the stock ones.

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seppgirty
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2010 01:37
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from what i was told model packs 44 & 45 ARE rigged to talk and have the stock FPSC animations. only the janitor models can't hold guns because of their mop.

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GregL
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2010 02:24
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The addendum in the docs folder states:

For reference, all characters in model packs 44 and 45 allow full lipsync control.
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seppgirty
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2010 03:41
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that's great GregL i just ordered model pack 44 i'm gonna re-texture (very poorly) the heck out of them.

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Conjured Entertainment
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2010 16:28 Edited at: 2nd Sep 2010 17:18
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You will need to add the soundset1=audiobank\behaviours\yourlipsyncsoundclip.wav if you want the greet player.fpi's talk=$1 to work.
I guess soundset2=x would be for talk=$2 and so on, but I have not tried it yet.
Anyway, they are rigged but no talking sound files have been assigned in the characters' FPE files, so you will need to do that.

Also, it seems as if the mouth on any of these characters is rigged a bit differently than the stock talkers, and I understand after looking at all those facial bones.
I was going to shortcut my riggings and just use DarkVoices to tweak each sound clip for each character.
Since these talking characters are going to be coming out by various artists with various levels of rigging detail; I recommend getting DarkVoices.
That way, you can tweak these things so any talking character will look as good as the other even if the rigging was slightly different.

I'm not saying anyone else is shortcutting like I plan to do.
I am just saying that even the slightest change in the vertice assignments for these bones makes a very noticable difference when lipsyncing.

Here is a video example where you can see a stock talker vs. one of these talkers... (see attached video)
NOTE: This was my first attempt at converting a sound clip to lip sync, so if the mouth is not moving right I am to blame because I have been adjusting it.
I just wanted to show that what works for one character might not work for another, and how each clip will need re-adjustments if used for various characters.

The way the mouth moves is noticably different, and that is okay because there is nothing wrong with it. (the lipsync file just needs tweaking in DarkVoices)
I'm not saying one rigging job is better or worse than the other because that is not the case.
I'm just saying that if one half of a lip is assigned to a bone and another assigns one third, then they will move differently with the same lip sync file.
So, adjusting these lipsync files is a must if you want to get these talking characters made by different artists to all lip sync properly.

@anyone wanting to take FPSC or this model pack to its limits
Check out the DGS Bonanza link at the top of the screen, because that is one awsome deal that includes DarkVoices and DarkShader.
Those two are a must for anyone wanting to take full advantage of Bond1's new shaders and/or the talking characters coming out.

Quote: "The addendum in the docs folder states:

For reference, all characters in model packs 44 and 45 allow full lipsync control. "

Well, that is nice, but it is a bit hidden.
It seems like a splash label or something overlayed in the corner of the characters' screen shot for the model pack might be better.
Only the people who have made the purchase already will get to see that addendum, so TGC is missing out on using that as a lure for potential buyers.

I bought the pack not knowing that the characters were rigged for lip sync because the price is a bargain even if the characters were not rigged that way.
I am just saying that this is a ridiculously low price to pay for that many talking characters. (each one is worth more than the price of the pack)
Making this 'rigged for lip sync' fact better known before the sale makes this offer impossible to refuse.

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tschwarz
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2010 01:09
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Thank you CE for the info, far and above what I expected. You have just made a few more sales for TGC from me.

Shall we play a game?” - Joshua
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seppgirty
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2010 01:17
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thanks for all the info C.E.

looks like i'm gonna have to crack open dark voices this weekend and take these models for a spin i can't wait!

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Conjured Entertainment
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Posted: 18th Sep 2010 21:42 Edited at: 18th Sep 2010 23:33
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Quote: "I guess soundset2=x would be for talk=$2 and so on, but I have not tried it yet."

Okay, so I got a chance to try it and that did not work, so maybe it is planned but not functional yet, or else I got it all wrong.

Anywho, I did get my random talk working with various lip sync files by calling a straight path to the WAV like so...

:state=6,random=3:talk=audiobank\conjured\barbara_whatshappening.wav,state=10
:state=6,random=3:talk=audiobank\conjured\barbara_wreath.wav,state=10
:state=6,random=3:talk=audiobank\conjured\barbara_getjohnny.wav,state=10

...of course you need to make a lip-sync file for each of those wav's either using DarkVoices or the wav converter (ConvertAllWAVFiles.exe)
As long as you have made a lipsynce file for the wav (in the same folder) then calling it to talk is just like playing a sound file, only you use the talk=x action instead of sound=x

Quote: "i just ordered model pack 44 i'm gonna re-texture (very poorly) the heck out of them. "

lol
Yeah, that assistant teacher is about to become a blonde with no glasses.
My texturing skills are lacking too, but thankfully I am using Bond1's fullscreen cinematic shader and setting it to black and white by removing the color.
The black and white helps hide imperfections somewhat and really makes various styles seem to work better together because the differences are less noticable than in color.
Not that I want all of my games to be black and white, but this one needs to be so I just have a nice side affect on this one.

Quote: "looks like i'm gonna have to crack open dark voices this weekend and take these models for a spin"

I still recommend DarkVoices, and I am getting better with it even though I have not had much time to practice.
I have discovered one thing though; pay careful attention to the placement of your 'f', 'w', 'v', 'm', 'p' moves etcetera, because those make the mouth close.
Timing the closing of the mouth is what is critical for realistic lipsync, and if you get those right then it doesn't take much time to sync a WAV file.

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Conjured Entertainment
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 02:24 Edited at: 20th Sep 2010 02:46
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Okay, here is a look at a talking example of a couple characters from MP44... (see attached video)

The low frame rates are because I had several other programs running in the background.
As you can see, my texture edits leave a lot to be desired in color, but in black and white they will look much better.
Anyway, my lip sync skills are far from perfect but I am starting to get the hang of it.

This is fun fun fun, let me tell you.
So, if you haven't played around with these talkers then you don't know what you're missing.




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Daniel wright 2311
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 03:53 Edited at: 20th Sep 2010 03:54
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Its funny how none of the talking people from dark voices can move there arms or hands at all, it look's as if you are talking to a statue. I read someware that now we have relistic talking people in fpsc, this is not the case at all as there is only head movement.

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Conjured Entertainment
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 05:16 Edited at: 20th Sep 2010 08:45
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Quote: "Its funny how none of the talking people from dark voices can move there arms or hands at all, it look's as if you are talking to a statue. I read someware that now we have relistic talking people in fpsc, this is not the case at all as there is only head movement."

Are you sure?
I haven't tried an animation while talking, but I don't see why it can't if the idle works.

I'll try it and come back with my results.

EDIT
Okay, after a quick test I discovered that you can run an animation while talking, just not while the talk file is loading.
So, it pauses the animation while the lipsync file is loading then goes back to the animation even while the lipsync is still executing.
I have had some success with a hand gesture, but only for certain files (longer ones).
However, when I try to record it the lagg causes it to animate after the talk not during.
It does work in game though, but it takes about two seconds after calling the talk file before the animation runs.

2nd Edit
Okay, I tried calling a short animation right before the talk for a different effect.
Here is a video of an animation of just 5 stock frames... (see attachment)
As you can see, the effect works better on the longer one, because it comes out of the animation while it is still talking.

Anyway, we can get gestures for the talkers; it's just gonna take a bit of effort on our part, scripting and such.

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Daniel wright 2311
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 20:51 Edited at: 20th Sep 2010 20:55
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that's a little better, The one who got them all converted to talk in the first place should have added talking jesters in the first place, but it a good start any how, good job.

edit, I did open one of the talking .x files and tryed to use it with another mesh with no luck, I see how they put it together and can do it myself but still can not export it out right to work.

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Conjured Entertainment
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Posted: 21st Sep 2010 01:17 Edited at: 21st Sep 2010 01:30
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Quote: "that's a little better."

We have to keep in mind too that this is the first installment of the lip sync feature, so I am sure it will be improved at some point.
Anything is better than nothing, so I am thrilled about this incredible new feature and any pack that supports it.

Quote: "edit, I did open one of the talking .x files and tryed to use it with another mesh with no luck, I see how they put it together and can do it myself but still can not export it out right to work."

Yeah, I have had no luck getting one of the talkers edited either. (corruption every time)

Thanks for trying though.

I am very grateful to the person who made this #44 model pack (Fletcher?), because I now have characters that I can at least retexture for my own talking characters.
THANKS

Quote: "The one who got them all converted to talk in the first place should have added talking jesters in the first place, but it a good start any how, good job."

I guess they didn't add them because they thought they couldn't use them, but you just have to plan for that pause.
The talker boneset would be better if it had a few hand gestures for talking added to the end of the animations though.

That animation in my example was a few frames pulled from the stock (320,324), so I could do a lot better with proper gesture animations.
The last frame needs to be a position that gets about a 2 second freeze on that frame, that's all.
So with the hands out in a question like shrug pose would be a good one.
I think this can be pulled off to look a lot better than this example, so the lip sync feature does have promise as it is.

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seppgirty
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Posted: 21st Sep 2010 02:17
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wow C.E. you've done a lot experimenting, haven't you i hope to start messing around with these characters as soon as i get a chance. keep posting your findings. it will help the community out a lot.

you deserve one of these

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