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Dark Physics & Dark A.I. & Dark Dynamix / Is the ppu worth getting?

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dononeton
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Joined: 12th Jun 2004
Location: Tusaloosa, AL : USA
Posted: 4th Mar 2007 02:58
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I want all my my physics to run the ppu. I read some post about the hardware having memory leaks and it is slower than software mode and only being small percent faster. In the bridge demo I get 10 fps when I say yes to shaders and yes to shadows and yes to reflections.When I say no to all I get 200 fps. Running the physic and shaders at the same time bogs my system down. Thats why I want to run all the physics on the ppu. So is the ppu worth getting? System spec in sig

AMD Athlon 64 x2 Dual Core Processor 3800+,MMX 3DNOW (2CPUs)
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david w
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Location: U.S.A. Michigan
Posted: 4th Mar 2007 03:06
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no
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dononeton
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 03:14 Edited at: 4th Mar 2007 03:30
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simple and quick! Thanks

In the doc it shows for example.

4 walls constructed out of 1700 bricks, a further 200 bricks created and dropped into the scene causing the walls to fall down

software
Low 18 fps


High 31 fps


CPU 100%

harware
Low 42


High 48


CPU 50%


thats 17 fps increase with 50% less cpu usage. Does that mean the other 50% cpu that is not being used could be used for something else and still get a good frame raate?

AMD Athlon 64 x2 Dual Core Processor 3800+,MMX 3DNOW (2CPUs)
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Codger
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 03:38 Edited at: 4th Mar 2007 03:40
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I purchased both the BFG & ASUS unit they performed the same basically no improvement on FPS between hardware and software. Some suggested that having a very fast system (CPU, GPU & Memory) is required to get a benefit from the PPU. This seems somewhat pointless as if you have a cutting edge system you already get the FPS. The only benefit to the PPU is running the Fluid commands which are only restricted to force the purchase of a PPU (Ageia's latest release has the hardware restriction removed)

Edit her is a link to my earlier thread on the subject
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=91835&b=30[href]null[/href]

Codger

p.s. I was able to purchase test and return both PPU's at no cost due to a very generous one month trial period at my local computer store

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PIV 2.8 MZ 512 Mem
FX 5600 256 mem
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dononeton
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 03:44
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hmm...What about Processing, saving the calculations out to a file and used this calculations to save fps. I have not tried it yet. Has anyone tried it yet, if so much improvment?

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dark coder
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 08:37
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It's ofcourse faster with the PPU however, to get to the point where you notice the differences your game will be lagging, like shown above, 18 fps to 42, both are very low for a game, I assume that's from the bricks demo which you would never see in a real game and they are all untextured, so while it does give a preformance boost, I would spend the money on something else, unless ofcourse you see a compo that requires the PPU where the prize money covers for it .

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Hoozer
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 11:27 Edited at: 4th Mar 2007 11:34
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@ dark coder: Your statement "I assume that's from the bricks demo which you would never see in a real game" isn't true for my "game" "PhysiX-Brick-Breakout" from my signature (if you can call it a game), cause it uses only boxes!

The number of boxes are a bit small (when used in the "playable"-configuration), but I found out that in software-mode you are allowed to use more boxes than in hardware-mode! (Seem to be some restrictions requarding the hardware?)

@ dononeton: I would say actually there is no need to use a PPU in DP! Only if you need to use fluids!

The performance maybe gets better in future updates of DP, not to mention the other AGEIA-SDK-features that maybe get also included (I know, I always say the same in any posts requarding the "hardware-question". It's because I really hope TGC makes the best out of their product. At the moment there is to much potential unused!)!


Hoozer

AMD 64X2 4800+ (939); 2GB; GF 6800LE (@12PS, 6VS; 380 MHz, RAM: 434 MHz)
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http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=93582&b=5
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General Reed
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 12:06
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Quote: "future updates of DP"
You must be joking!

Beware, Killing chavs is not a crime, but is the only way to cure the earth
Vist www.scratchyrice-dev.co.uk
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dononeton
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 16:41
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Thanks everyone I am going to hold off on buying the ppu for now.
Did anyone see the Lucas Arts Euphoria Physics engine? The part I liked was they was throwing the R2D2's at the wood, metal,glass and gel objects. It was breaking and denting in real time. Would that be an example of deformable mesh in PhysX

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dononeton
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 18:21
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So if I use fluids and cloth object or large physics scenes the ppu would be good, I know you dont need the ppu for cloth but if I render more that one cloth on screen my fps sucks! So if I just use joints, rigid bodies,particles,Character Controllers software should be fine.

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Hoozer
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 22:09
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@ General Reed: Well, I know it sounds a "bit" like fantasy, but I still hope it. It would be a big mistake, if they would ignore us in the future, cause many who are interested in DP are reading the forum and ask something like "...is it worth to buy DP..." and they read our comments. So I'm sure if they don't improve DP up to a point where every reported bug is fixed (there are some big once as you know), the number of customers will drop and this can't be in the interests of TGC! (If the numbers fall to far, TGC may also think, it is not worth to improve it anymore! BUT I hope they will decide the other way and just make it a total usefull product!)


Hoozer

AMD 64X2 4800+ (939); 2GB; GF 6800LE (@12PS, 6VS; 380 MHz, RAM: 434 MHz)
DP-Sw-Mode-Comp-Entry (updated to V. 1.3):
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=93582&b=5
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Argoon
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Posted: 4th Mar 2007 22:32
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Quote: "I want all my my physics to run the ppu. I read some post about the hardware having memory leaks and it is slower than software mode and only being small percent faster. In the bridge demo I get 10 fps when I say yes to shaders and yes to shadows and yes to reflections.When I say no to all I get 200 fps. Running the physic and shaders at the same time bogs my system down. Thats why I want to run all the physics on the ppu. So is the ppu worth getting? System spec in sig"


If your intention is to use it only for darkPhysics them no (but that is not the PPU fault) if you also intent to use it to play PhysX enabled games outside of this community them yes, i have one and it is in did very powerfull and you already have some good games making use of it, i´m playing now infernal and Cellfactor- revolution and warmonger are coming. Warmonger will be the first game to really need the PPU to play and is made by a small company this just show that they have total confidence in the hardware and are taking the risk. We the PPU users need more developers like this ones that really can see the potential of this tech and are able to take some risks.

Cheers
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