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Geek Culture / The cost of MMPORG

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pathfinder
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 19:27
We all know how impossibly hard it would be to make the content for a MMPORG but I got bored so I thought ild post the simple costs of running a MMPORG in pure bandwith terms ... sodding scary . looks like most of the time your better off with running stuff off your home dsl.

Pricing not including server costs

1. No. People
2. bandwidth per user
3. max users anytime
4. total bandwidth GB/m
total based on 2.5 pounds per GB/mth


1. 2. 3. 4. 5.

10 2.0 k 40% 8.0 KB/sec 19.4 GB/mth
£ 48.38
20 2.0 k 40% 16.0 KB/sec 38.7 GB/mth
£ 96.77
40 2.0 k 40% 32.0 KB/sec 77.4 GB/mth
£ 193.54
80 2.0 k 40% 64.0 KB/sec 154.8 GB/mth
£ 387.07
160 2.0 k 40% 128.0 KB/sec 309.7 GB/mth
£ 774.14
320 2.0 k 40% 256.0 KB/sec 619.3 GB/mth
£ 1548.29
640 2.0 k 40% 512.0 KB/sec 1238.6 GB/mth
£ 3096.58
1280 2.0 k 40% 1024.0 KB/sec 2477.3 GB/mth
£ 6193.15
2560 2.0 k 40% 2048.0 KB/sec 4954.5 GB/mth
£ 12386.30


Just posted this for a laugh. Notice it costs more than broadband, totally nuts
pathfinder
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 19:28
oops the number after percentage of users is total bandwith used per second

Shadow Robert
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Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 19:55
if you plan to do an MMORPG running from a standard connection isn't an option...
DSL - 256kbit/sec | 512kbit/sec
your bandwidth is 10mbit/sec

this just isn't a valid option, also purchasing a standard games server isn't as you require instant access.

the only true option available is T1 + Server Machine + Server Network Card PER 1Gbit/sec traffic
it seriously isn't cheap or worth it for users of DB

T1 line per year is £2,500 per line
Server Machine Decent enough will also be pretty close to £3,500 especially with graphics can processing abilities required for certain operations ... not to mention you will require one PER 10GB or traffic which is about 10,000 people!
Server Network Cards and Hubs also fetch into the thousands. This isn't including the cost of someone to keep them ticking over and the electrical bill!

i'd do your research a little deeper

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
pathfinder
21
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 20:00
I know its not possible , just thought Ild post what it costs for pure bandwith from a dedicated server package they are flippin sharks . Did say this was just bandwidth cost. Talk about a mega huge bill at the end of the month!!

pathfinder
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 20:08
kind of makes you wonder how the poor sods keep there mmporgs going. They must be bricking it with the amount of publishers jumping on the bandwagon.

pathfinder
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 21:54
Hmm although I was saying that a massive online game is well and truly out of the hobby progammers reach I got hit by a brainwave.

I dont know if any of you lowered yourself to MUD multiuser dungeons but they were a blast.

I used to play this loads, its free btw which is a good thing

http://austin.prg.dtu.dk/

now i played this in the early 90's wonder what the bandwidth was on this baby. Its a text adventure used to have around 200 players online, who says you need 3D! it was in the days of no internet at home *shivers* what the hell did I do in those days , oh yes elite frontier.

anyway a 3d version of a mud game or even make a text mud game might be fun.

Shadow Robert
21
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 23:02
lol it was more of a theme chatroom ... and yeah Frontier was just as addictive as the net wasn't it

Man... if only they could combine the two, not even update the graphics just add online support
Damn i'd be in heaven, pitty they won't release the source even 12years on how stingy is that!!

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
pathfinder
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2002 23:51
very you know I was reading a magazine, they interviewed one of the original progammers to elite (there were only 2 of them). the original Elite program was just 20K!!!!!!!! cant get it into my head 20k gees I could download that in a second .

rapscaLLion
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Location: Canada
Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 01:02
lol

Alex Wanuch
aka rapscaLLion
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ChipOne
21
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Location: Canada
Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 02:44
wow. if you're paying thousands for server NICs and hubs you're getting ripped off.

we bought 4 netfinity 5500's a few years ago for $2900 CDN. they were refurbished, but who cares. there were 2 live servers, each with a redundant back up. we ran 14,000 simulataneous connections with gigs & gigs per month...no problems and we only ever had 1 machine fail over to the backup.

consider, too, that 14,000 ppl x $10 a month helps pay the bills.

we had a 100Mbit upstream connection (over fiber) and it cost us $18,000 CDN to put in and then $1400 a month to service. tech support was included in the service.

-= i only do what my rice krispies tell me to do =-
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 04:27
its not the fact of covering costs... its more the fact that if you ask a bank (at say 16yo) if you can have a $20,000 loan to start up a subscription games server, you're likely to be laughed out the bank
and i'm pretty sure most parents aren't gonna fund it...
Players are going to want to be able to connect from the get go!
So really it isn't feaseable and you know it :p
i mean i have a personal server for my JK2 clan which costs me $14.99 a month (free startup) but certain aspects in a game MUST be setup on the server itself which takes a day for any major changes. Plus the server starts to lag at more than 12 people (and it has a 1Gbit/s bandwdith!)

also you have to understand that the majority of games servers are Linux - tried running DirectX on a Linux machine

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
pathfinder
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 15:13
ah to be 16 again actual sod that

Kensupen
21
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Location: United States
Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 15:36
I got a loan for $40,000 at 19. (was the last one I ever got...)

-Kensupen
Mirthin
21
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Location: Land of the Rising Haggis
Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 19:32
> Man... if only they could combine the two, not even update the graphics just add online support <

Ever heard of "Earth and Beyond?" It's pretty sweet.

This has "Fiasco" written all over it.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 19:39
ever heard of earth & beyond... hmm geez no i guess that one slipped by me - Hahaa

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
pathfinder
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2002 21:40
yeah just missed out on the beta for that one, only 1 thing that made me go nah, your stuck with only 3 kinds of ships, I mean come on 3???

rapscaLLion
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Posted: 24th Oct 2002 02:09
You can design your own.

Alex Wanuch
aka rapscaLLion
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 24th Oct 2002 03:07
you know how long it took to rig those 3ships by hand!!
we used them as a base to develop the Ship Creator ... sides the full titles has over 50
so take $35 out ya wallet you stingy burger :p

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
pathfinder
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Posted: 24th Oct 2002 11:43
oh .... bugger

pathfinder
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Posted: 24th Oct 2002 17:40
hmm looked at the starship designer, rofl think 'designer' may be an over statement ok take my statement back a bit though, 6 ships not 3

Mirthin
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Posted: 24th Oct 2002 20:18
Is it not a pay-by-month deal? That's what deters me. Just wait for someone to open a free server, it worked for UO

This has "Fiasco" written all over it.
rapscaLLion
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Posted: 24th Oct 2002 23:44
lol, ya the starship designer is crap, but you can customize your charactor too hell...

Alex Wanuch
aka rapscaLLion
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 25th Oct 2002 02:10
lol - well to tell ya the truth i never actually used the starship creator ... everything was done by hand for me, scripted in Gmax Dev / Max4 (which ya'll know how much i love max lol)

I'm actually quite surprised the tools for Gmax weren't released to be honest. Probably the same reason we haven't updated the Renegades i guess.

From what i know about the payment system (run by EA not us) is that the game is $25 + 1free month then its $9.99 after that per month. Not sure though, most of us arn't as we don't pay nor do we pay much attention to that kinda thing
As the universe is technically a single server in LA, i'm not too sure about free ones poping up. I mean I agree that $10 a month is a lil steep, as per server (which hold 2,500 people) i think it costs about $1/day to run. I mean a yearly subscription of say $60 shouldn't be out of the range of most games players

But also think a free server should be setup, so that people can come on and play but as soon as it hit its limit of say 10,000 people anyone new gets told to wait. I mean this would allow player to get the experience of playing but also give them an inscentive to use the paid one

but then again i'm just a lowly 3D Artist who runs the Cleanup team - what would i know

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
pathfinder
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Posted: 25th Oct 2002 15:02
Think your right raven multiplay elite would truly rock, I guess thats what they were trying to recreate. The engine for the creator I have to say was smooth as anything for me, so I bet the games sweet graphics wise. Only thing that keeps getting to me is why oh why all the color options over coding for different hull types ... ah well. Not to worry this one was close to pulling me in a month ago but it smells a bit to much like DAOC in space. DAOC gave me 6 months most of my friends in beta have given up on it, still impressive though that I played it for 6 months I dread to think the number of hours I stocked up.

pathfinder
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Posted: 25th Oct 2002 15:36
actually even a direct play multiplay elite would be good, seem to remember frontier had multiple pirates in the shader parts of the galaxy. Even my 2 Large Particle Accelorators over heated dealing with them . I had that really huge box cargo ship with the 4 feet didnt have to turn just had a turret top and bottom.

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