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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] About AUP....

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power mousey
User Banned
Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 02:25
some good points and examples, Batvink.

I know you are trying to maintain order, some sense of dignity, and respect and civilty to all these boards and forum.

But here is a suggestion and some thoughts. Let the boars, trolls, flamers, spammers, arrogants, etc
have their messages not only locked,deleted,banned.
But maybe and perhaps sent to an area or too.
Call it the Garbage Dump. And each and every month or time period have a delete cycle. Except for the most funny and/or infamous ones to serve as an example.

And perhaps for those that are really weird, way off topic and very tangent a forum area or section called the Cocaine Train.
And then there is the Arena. Where messages are sent that are really distasteful and ugly.
Even invite people in where they can rant and rave, troll, fight, gripe, whine and complain with each other. And let em if they want and like too.
While others sit back, with beer and popcorn and enjoy the drama and even laugh too. Almost anything goes. Let em waste the time and effort, expend the energy to fight and argue. True! And to serve as example and musuem of warriors, animals and mutants in the Arena.

I don't know what the entire system and policy for warnings, noob slappings, and bannings.

But if the member is going to be banned give them the choice of being allright banned for the particular period or the option of just being allowed to enter just the Garbage Dump, the Cocaine Train, and especially the Arena.
Perhaps a Hall of Shame or Injustice for really good(really bad, but good) ones to show off and teach about flaming, trolling,spamming, causing fights and personal insults and attacks.

Serious.

"_"
MonoCoder
18
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Location: england
Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 02:30 Edited at: 3rd Apr 2008 02:30
So it's a good idea to glorify trainwrecks and the idiots who derailed them by giving them a proverbial hall of fame?

Or am I missing something?

Give me an ounce of Puyo, good apothecary, to sweeten my imagination.
power mousey
User Banned
Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 02:42
hey, why not? at least keep and try to limit the wreakage in certain areas.

Besides, I need some good drama to read and enjoy.
Nothing much good to watch on tv or at the movies.
just joking on that.

But, hey a few other websites I know have a similar policy and framework set up like that.
its their choice if they want to act like pricks and arrogants. Use their rants and wreckage to serve as examples of what not to say and do as a guest in the Dark House....the House of Dark Basic. And to follow the AUP and respect and be cordial to others on here. Hopefully.
They have read or at least agreed to the AUP. You think they should follow it. And no excuse not to read it or at least a good general knowledge of it.

By the way, I have seen and been to a few sites that can detect personal attacks and especially spam and place it in a Spam section. After a few months, the sent posts and replies are deleted.

But in the end, its up to the owners and administrator of the site.

"_"
Jeku
Moderator
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Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 03:09
People will be craving the infamy, and will purposely start posting tons of garbage. It's better to stomp that kind of crap out in the beginning and lock it away to oblivion.


power mousey
User Banned
Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 03:21
I know that.
Its better and more useful in the end.
True.

It was just a suggestion, another way of thinking,
a different perspective. If people here can goto and see and read for themselves some examples.
Perhaps a forum section of posts and replies of what is not following the AUP and especailly of flaming,trolling,spamming,etc.
And in hopes they will not do this or think twice before they make that post or reply to it in disregard to the AUP.

But I see and undestand your points.

"_"
TDK
Retired Moderator
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Location: UK
Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 03:25
Nice ideas in theory, but I know that if I was paying for the servers and bandwidth for these forums I wouldn't want to pay for all the crap that gets posted.

Especially when you weigh up a) how many users of the forum are not even using paid-for versions of TGC products (Eg: Trial versions) and b) how many who just post crap and very rarely post anything remotely TGC product related that would be useful to other users.

These forums are primarily for the support of TGC products and their legitimate users and in all honesty, anything else really has no place here. As the service is provided totally free of charge by TGC, users have no choice but to adhere to the rules laid down by them - including us mods.

If I were TGC, I doubt if I would even bother with a General Chat board to be honest.

Anyone who doesn't like it always has the option to go and create their own forums where they can set their own rules.

TDK_Man

Dr Manette
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 03:27
I agree, people will take advantage of that system.

SunnyKatt
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 04:01
Definately.

Jeku
Moderator
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 07:03
Quote: "Perhaps a forum section of posts and replies of what is not following the AUP and especailly of flaming,trolling,spamming,etc.
And in hopes they will not do this or think twice before they make that post or reply to it in disregard to the AUP."


And I can tell you that new people will not bother going to that part of the forum first. They will inevitably post crap in the Geek Culture and we'll have to point them in the direction of that forum, kind of taking away the point of that forum in the first place.

The mods here already have to point out to people every single day to read the AUP


Digital Awakening
AGK Developer
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 12:11
I like the fact that we don't have a general off topic board and that the mods clean up this one, thank you mods

I do think that the mods should have the option to completely lock a thread from reading in those cases it's really needed.

[center]
BatVink
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 12:58
Quote: "If I were TGC, I doubt if I would even bother with a General Chat board to be honest."


I can see it going that way myself. Team requests got ditched because it was a mess and too much to moderate. Geek Culture is having to undergo "Lock Down" every 2 or 3 months as it spirals downwards.

The easy option is to remove Geek Culture and make it product-based only. I wouldn't want that to happen as GC can have some valuable threads. They just seem to be drowned out by rubbish these days.
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 13:25
BatVink:
You should have a warning system where someone violating the rules get a warning and after 2 or 3 warnings the person is banned for a time, like a month. Warnings could also disappear after a couple of months or a year. Such a system I believe would make frequent violators behave, I have seen it on other forums.

I like Geek Culture myself. Wouldn't bother visiting much if it was removed. I usually check the WIP board once a day, the rest of my forum time is GC.

[center]
James H
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 13:35
What if you had to complete a test on the AUP succesfully before your first ever post is allowed?
IanM
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 15:45 Edited at: 3rd Apr 2008 15:54
So, put something in the way to stop people registering in the first place?

To be honest, it's not the newcomers that are the problem here - it's some of the longer-term members who think the AUP doesn't apply to them, but does to everyone else. You can see it all of the time - as soon as someone does something wrong, they jump in pointing it out again and again, ad nauseum, then proceed to fill the thread with junk.

@DA,
We already have that - we call it a slap. It's not quite as scientific as you propose but it does the job. I just think we mods may need to be a little stricter about administering it and following though with bans.

James H
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 16:32
I never had to post anything to register, though its beside the point as the problem isn`t newcomers. I assumed there was a problem with newcomers, sorry about that
Osiris
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 16:50
Maybe there should be a vote slap feature where if a certain amount of people can vote to n00b slap someone (temporarily) until a mod approves or denies it. Of course it would require a lot of voting. However it could be thread based as well. Where they are slapped for that thread but could be really slapped if a mod deems if necessary. Dunno if thats a good idea or not...but its just an idea haha.

RIP Max-Tuesday, November 2 2007
You will be dearly missed.
Agent Dink
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 17:37
Mods, just let me know if I contribute to the problem. I know I have my sarcastic moments but I do try not to lead threads off topic. I've always been a funny guy. At least I think so, and sometimes it's hard not to post that slightly off topic sarcastic comment. I avoid political and religious discussions and stay out of debates... I guess if anything you can lump me in with Rami, Sep, and Grandma and the other overly sarcastic users

BatVink
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 18:25
Agent Dink, you and your posse may be close to moderation looking to the threads I posted as examples. You may not start the rot, but you do contribute once it's there.

All we ask is that threads stay on topic. If a thread is out of order, it's easy to lock from the outset. If we have to check every valid thread to see if it went downhill, the task gets tedious and we clamp down on the slightest misdemeanour.
Agent Dink
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 18:59
Many apologies, I'll watch what I post

Jeku
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 20:58
Quote: "I just think we mods may need to be a little stricter about administering it and following though with bans."


Sometimes I feel like the only one who slaps and bans people


tha_rami
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 20:59
Well, a topic runs the way it does. Unless topics go astray BEFORE the correct answer or the most honest answer has been given, I don't think me, Adam, Seppuku or Grandma do anything overboard.

Losing Geek Culture would lose the whole idea of this forum for me. If it degrades from a place to share our thoughts and questions with peers and people to a place where all we can do is talk about some product, well, I can imagine it'd become far less interesting and definitely drop a lot in usability.

But, to contribute, if anything, I'd like the option to lock my own threads.


A mod has been erased by your signature because it was larger than 600x120
Agent Dink
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 21:57
Quote: "Losing Geek Culture would lose the whole idea of this forum for me. If it degrades from a place to share our thoughts and questions with peers and people to a place where all we can do is talk about some product, well, I can imagine it'd become far less interesting and definitely drop a lot in usability."


I'd probably not come here too often if Geek Culture disappeared I'd be in Game Design Theory and 3D Chat and that's about it.

BatVink
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 00:00
Quote: "...If it degrades from a place to share our thoughts and questions with peers and people to a place where all we can do is talk about some product..."


The point is...it is degrading. People aren't just sharing thoughts. They are mocking others and hijacking threads that they personally have no interest in.

I never said Geek Culture was on the way out either. I'm just pointing out that TGC own this site, and if a board has a negative impact rather than a positive one, then it becomes worthless. It's just something to consider when discussing what is and isn't deemed to be responsible use of a forum that is generally a decent place to hang out.
Dr Schnitzengruber
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 00:11
I might have a crazy idea on this but, if the person who made the thread had more control over it, I think that the uselessness would stop quickly. As a example, if a person had a honest question and the some other user comes around start a discussion on pizza, the thread-starter could hide the useless posts from non-mods. The discussion would stop if nobody could see the posts. To prevent this from being abused, a mod could make a post permanently visible if he thinks it isn't that bad.

RalphY
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 00:30
...wouldn't an easier solution be if we all just stopped posting crap?

This post is probably somewhat hypocritical but there you go.

Oh boy! Sleep! That's when I'm a Viking! | Super Nintendo Chalmers!
Zappo
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 00:34
You could always hide the Geek Culture forum from anyone not logged in. That would prevent any negative sounding threads from appearing in Google searches. It would also prevent casual/new visitors who are here to check out the products stumbling upon dumb threads.
Just an idea.


Chart data provided with kind permission from ELSPA
tha_rami
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 03:57
I think being able to lock ones own threads would be a welcome addition.


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Xenocythe
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 04:15
Yes, that sounds pretty good.

How about a new system, similar to locking, but with a name such as 'solved' or such. When the threads purpose has been fulfilled, like a guys question has been answered, then mods can just put the 'solved' tag on it that allows no more posts.

3.11 We do not tolerate posts made for the purpose of putting down another forum member, group of members, religion, our company, our staff or any of our moderators, past or present.
Zappo
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 04:19
Quote: "I think being able to lock ones own threads would be a welcome addition."

I think that is too open to abuse. People would still make dumb or incorrect comments but then lock the thread to prevent people replying. It just wouldn't work and may result in a lot more useless 'new' threads just so the poster can control them and lock them when they feel like it.


Chart data provided with kind permission from ELSPA
5867Dude
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 11:56
Personally I think it would be handy to change the name. Then you can add
[Resolved] or [Mods Lock This]
Thats what other forums do


Was Cool Kid
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 12:27
Mods:
First I do think you should do some more slapping. If people are misbehaving and nothing happens to them they might start to think it's fun or simply do not care.

I would also like to know if you think we users should use the report buttons more often?

I also agree that it would be nice if people who aren't mods stopped acting mods by creating more off topic posts.

[center]
BatVink
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 13:03
Quote: "I would also like to know if you think we users should use the report buttons more often?"


That's a hotline straight to the top. Mods don't see these requests.
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 13:40
So the answer to that is no?

[center]
tha_rami
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 17:13
I disagree being able to lock your own threads would be open to abuse - it changes nothing but avoiding the flaming and off-topicness after a problem has been solved. If someone abuses the option, they're an easy prey for the moderators.


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BatVink
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 17:49
Quote: "If someone abuses the option, they're an easy prey for the moderators"


...but another option to abuse and more work for the mods

The current system works. The problem is that when the AUP is adhered to and people find themselves on moderation, they wonder why. The answers are all there is one central location.
tha_rami
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 18:20
Why would it be an option to abuse? There's no reason why it would be different from not being able to lock it, besides that we avoid 20 useless posts clogging the server.


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BatVink
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 19:19
Quote: "Why would it be an option to abuse? There's no reason why it would be different from not being able to lock it"


Because you create a post, someone disagrees, you give your provocative opinion back and lock it. The result is users looking to get their own back next time they see the opportunity. Meanwhile, a mod needs to see whether the lock was made under the terms in which the ability was given.
IanM
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 20:20 Edited at: 4th Apr 2008 20:21
Also, just because you've finished with a thread that you happened to start doesn't mean that everyone else has finished. Besides, it's not just your thread - it belongs just as much to everyone else who posted in it, and even to those who have something else to post on the same subject - Locking forces them to create a new thread referring back to the original, making it harder to follow because the conversation covers multiple threads.

BatVink
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 21:03
yes, what IanM says. "I have my answer, please lock" is the most disappointing end to a thread. It goes against the community ethos.
AndrewT
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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 22:15
I think it would be cool to have some kind of 'Solved' flag you can set when you've had your problem solved, that would appear in your thread title; it wouldn't actually effect the status of your thread - i.e. people can still post in it and what not - but it simply shows people that your problem has been solved, so if their looking for an answer to their problem then they could look at your thread, knowing your problem has been resolved.

90% of statistics are completely inaccurate.
tha_rami
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Posted: 5th Apr 2008 00:56
I'd disagree, again, but your point is perfectly valid. I understand your concerns.

Problem solved. Please lock.

(Sorry, couldn't resist )


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Libervurto
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Posted: 5th Apr 2008 02:57
@power mousey
apparently we already have a board for that, and you chose geek culture! :p

hope no-ne's already made that joke.

jasonhtml
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Posted: 6th Apr 2008 03:52
Quote: "yes, what IanM says. "I have my answer, please lock" is the most disappointing end to a thread. It goes against the community ethos."


i have to agree with that. people learn a lot from other people's posts, and even after a problem has been solved, someone can come along and make the answer simpler, more efficient, more complete, ect.

SunnyKatt
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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 02:57
We here at geek culture now are much better behaved way back to the last 5 pages of the entire geek culture board. Many of the threads had names such as "AAAAAAA!" or "WOOT!" or ":0" or "YEAHHHH" etc. Nowadays it means an immediate lock.
However we are more off-topic now.

Dude232
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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 02:58
on another forum you get infractions and if you get three you are perma banned

SunnyKatt
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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 03:00
Ouch.

Megaton Cat
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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 09:35
I honestly don't see why the mods are blowing an "off topic" board out of proportion. I know we re-named it to Geek Culture, but it's just a conservative name for off topic. If this stuff was happening in the DBP forums I would be concerned, but people are actually getting all fired up over threads going off topic in a board that's not really about any specific topic to begin with.

It's hard putting up with it because some of us have developed some good acquaintances over the years, yet the rule enforcement is just getting strange. For example, I was slapped for 7 days, and upon asking 2 mods about it, neither could tell me why or what I was slapped for. It's constantly preached not to break the AUP, but nowadays it seems even if you post along with the crowd in a de-railing thread, you get slapped, because you apparently went "off topic" about nothing at all in the first place.

Formerly known as Megaton Cat
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 12:05 Edited at: 9th Apr 2008 12:06
Personally I hate it when threads go off topic. I've had a few of mine locked because others have posted crap. I think that whoever starts going too far off topic and those who follow suit should all get slaps. If people didn't get involved there would be no mess at all. It's also a waste of my and other's time going through them.

[center]
Jeku
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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 21:49 Edited at: 9th Apr 2008 21:50
Quote: "but nowadays it seems even if you post along with the crowd in a de-railing thread, you get slapped"


Yes, and that's the problem. 10 people "posting along" and de-railing a thread is a bigger problem than an off-topic post here and there. We will continue to slap people for junking up perfectly legitimate threads. And I do recall BatVink pointing out to you the threads that caused all those slaps last week. Do not pretend you don't know why you were slapped


5867Dude
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Posted: 10th Apr 2008 18:55
Quote: "For example, I was slapped for 7 days, and upon asking 2 mods about it, neither could tell me why or what I was slapped for"

Remember this
Quote: "hay guyz i just went 2 ebgames and picked this kool game halflife any1 hurd of it"

From my thread 'Diet Coke and Mentos'
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=126830&b=2
Thats proberly why?
Quote: "even if you post along with the crowd in a de-railing thread"

And YOU started it

Was Cool Kid

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