Sorry your browser is not supported!

You are using an outdated browser that does not support modern web technologies, in order to use this site please update to a new browser.

Browsers supported include Chrome, FireFox, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer 10+ or Microsoft Edge.

Geek Culture / DBPro vs Dark GDK... What's easier to learn?

Author
Message
Storm4
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2008
Location:
Posted: 6th Aug 2009 01:29
Link
DGDK looks easier but is it really. If this is in the wrong forum, could a mod please move this.

www.storm4.webs.com
Back to top
Profile PM Email
n008
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Apr 2007
Location: Chernarus
Posted: 6th Aug 2009 01:53
Link
Dark BASIC is most certainly easier to learn and easier to use than Dark GDK unless the only language you have been using for the past 10 years has been C++ and you ahve been keeping current on Windows Platform.

"I have faith, that I shall win the race, even though I have no legs, and am tied to a tree." ~Mark75
Back to top
Profile PM
heyufool1
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th Feb 2009
Location: My quiet place
Posted: 6th Aug 2009 02:09
Link
DBPro is probably easier to learn but learning Dark GDK would probably be better especially if you are planning on going into the programming industry.

Use Google first... it's not rocket surgery!
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
dark coder
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Oct 2002
Location: Japan
Posted: 6th Aug 2009 02:41
Link
Quote: "unless the only language you have been using for the past 10 years has been C++ and you ahve been keeping current on Windows Platform."


What? C++ is multi-platform(though GDK isn't) so I don't see how you have to keep current on windows to use GDK as it's the same as DBPro basically. Also, you don't have to have to have used C++ for any decent length of time(much less 10 years) to find it easier to use than learning a new language.

If you already know the basics of C++ then GDK should be easier as there's nothing new to learn besides all the API functions, but if you use DBPro then you also must learn the language and all its quirks in addition to the library. I'd advise you use GDK as it's free(for non-commercial stuff, without a licence) and Visual Studio is a trillion times better in every possible way than any DBPro IDE especially when debugging is concerned(though this is the fault of DBPro and not the IDEs).

Back to top
Profile PM Email
Mahoney
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th Apr 2008
Location: The Interwebs
Posted: 7th Aug 2009 04:32
Link
GDK is definitely the way to go. Not only is it free, but C++ will be much better to learn in the long run.

Windows Vista Home Premium Intel Pentium Dual-Core 1.6 Ghz 1GB DDR2 RAM GeForce 8600GT Twin Turbo
Back to top
Profile PM
kaedroho
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Aug 2007
Location: Oxford,UK
Posted: 7th Aug 2009 16:21
Link
DBPro can get you into programming, GDK has similar functions so its easy to switch over once you've learned C++.

Devstorm - Indie Game Development Network
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Benjamin
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Nov 2002
Location: France
Posted: 7th Aug 2009 17:23
Link
If you've never used BASIC before, I'd suggest you go straight to C++ before you pick up bad habits.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
David R
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Sep 2003
Location: 3.14
Posted: 7th Aug 2009 17:32 Edited at: 7th Aug 2009 17:36
Link
I would say you don't really 'learn' DB/DBP as such any way - it's not syntactically complex, so all you really need to know is the list of possible commands: memorizing them is completely pointless if you have F1 at close hand (especially since the commands are named inconsistently and are very verbose). The actual conditions and other structures are very straightforward.

C/C++, on the other hand, actually requires a bit more learning for the syntax itself, though (operators etc.) since it isn't self explanatory. But at the same time, I think this means C/C++ is much more useful to learn - it's a better time investment. Learning DBC/DBP is a cinch, but is so dependent on the commands and plugins present, that knowing how to use it is more about those commands than the language itself. Obviously C/C++ is useless without commands (APIs) as well, but the emphasis on them is less - or at least, most of them require a good understanding of the language itself (for example, use of templates, STL etc.)

09-f9-11-02-9d-74-e3-5b-d8-41-56-c5-63-56-88-c0
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Travis Gatlin
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th May 2009
Location: Oxford, Alabama
Posted: 31st Aug 2009 23:42
Link
DBP would probally be better in the long run because it gives you an idea of what is coming for you in the future,if it is programing you want to do.of course thats just an opinion,if you can understand C++ go with that,if it is DBP then go with that,i just say dont force yourself to learn a language,usually the talent for programing comes natural,like DB did for me

yeah im southern WATCHA GONNA DO BOUT IT?
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
AndrewT
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 11th Feb 2007
Location: MI, USA
Posted: 31st Aug 2009 23:47
Link
Quote: "DBP would probally be better in the long run because it gives you an idea of what is coming for you in the future,if it is programing you want to do."


Whaa?!?!?!?!? DBP most definitely does not give you an idea of what's to come in the future. Sorry to burst your bubble.

i like orange
Back to top
Profile PM
Benjamin
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Nov 2002
Location: France
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 01:05
Link
C++ will most likely be of greater use to you in the future.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
MIDN90
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 11th Mar 2009
Location: Colville, Washington
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 01:08 Edited at: 1st Sep 2009 01:09
Link
DBP is easier.

Back to top
Profile PM
puppyofkosh
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Jan 2007
Location:
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 01:42
Link
Quote: "DBP is easier."


Not really by much though.


And its free.
Back to top
Profile PM
BMacZero
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Dec 2005
Location: E:/ NA / USA
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 03:36
Link
Quote: "And its free. "

GDK, that is



Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
ShaunRW
DBPro Developer
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2008
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 04:31
Link
Go for DBP first, unless you know programming is for you. If i started C++/GDK before DBP, i would of quit.

DBP is also good for learning the process of developing without the hassel of understanding C++ code.

If you do start with GDK don't give up if you can't learn it.


Back to top
Profile PM Email
puppyofkosh
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Jan 2007
Location:
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 04:53
Link
Quote: "GDK, that is"

Ya. That was badly worded.

I meant that GDK is free, and is not that much harder to learn.
Back to top
Profile PM
mike5424
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Mar 2009
Location:
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 15:08
Link
gdk licence dark basic is cheap and easy.

dark basic keywords: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=156401&b=1
my models and textures: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=156401&b=1
Back to top
Profile PM Email
jezza
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Mar 2008
Location: Bham, UK
Posted: 1st Sep 2009 15:24
Link
GDK is free, DBP is not
DBP is easier to learn if you have BASIC background, or no programming background.
Learning a basic language is not necessarily a good idea because it can give you bad habits when you move to C++ (Which you almost certainly will)
GDK gives you more control, and makes it easier to integrate with other libraries.
C++ might be slightly harder for a beginner, but it's definitely worth it. The very basics of C++ (what you need to do the same as you do in DBP) I'd say are hardly harder at all, though.


While Bored Blog
Back to top
Profile PM Email
mike5424
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Mar 2009
Location:
Posted: 2nd Sep 2009 10:11
Link
Quote: "GDK is free, DBP is not"

GDK LISENCE!!! YOU NEED TO PAY TO SeLL YOUR GDK GAMES!!! dbp is around £30 but a gdk lisence is around £300 (i think) lol.

dark basic keywords: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=156401&b=1
my models and textures: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=156401&b=1
Back to top
Profile PM Email
dark coder
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Oct 2002
Location: Japan
Posted: 2nd Sep 2009 10:26
Link
LOLOOL WHAT

Back to top
Profile PM Email
jezza
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Mar 2008
Location: Bham, UK
Posted: 2nd Sep 2009 14:02 Edited at: 2nd Sep 2009 14:03
Link
Quote: "LOLOOL WHAT"

translated:
I see you have been mistaken. The DarkGDK commercial license costs £20 sterling, a £15.99 saving on Dark Basic Professional; besides the fact that not many people end up selling their produce anyway.


While Bored Blog
Back to top
Profile PM Email
heyufool1
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th Feb 2009
Location: My quiet place
Posted: 2nd Sep 2009 21:38
Link
Quote: "I meant that GDK is free, and is not that much harder to learn. "

The commands in Dark GDK are no harder to learn the DBPro but the syntax in C++ is definitely harder to learn, and remember.

Games are like life, they should never stand still.
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Potassium
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 12th Jul 2009
Location:
Posted: 2nd Sep 2009 22:33
Link
I started with DarkGDK, occasionally converting code from Dark Basic Pro, it took me a while, but once i understood, i was on the loose. Sadly these days, I haven't progressed that much as I used to.

There are 2 ways to develop for the N64:
1. Develop C code with PsyQ SDK and illegal Nintendo libs
2. Develop C code with legal kits, such as the Ground Zero devkit (g0dev.zip)
Back to top
Profile PM
dark coder
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Oct 2002
Location: Japan
Posted: 2nd Sep 2009 22:43
Link
Quote: "but the syntax in C++ is definitely harder to learn, and remember."


Not really, to be able to do the same things at least, it isn't. All the C++ control structures have a consistent scope syntax: { } or none for single line ones. Whereas in DBPro you have to remember for/next, while/endwhile, do/loop, repeat/until, gosub|function/return, type/endtype, if/endif etc. The only significant difference would be the string handling, if you use std::string then it becomes fairly close to DBPro plus there are billions of tutorials on the net for the language.

When comparing GDK with DBPro I don't see anything significant on the DBPro side that would entice anyone with the option of both to choose DBPro. Unless you're too lazy to learn a few basic things like strings and pointers of course. C++ is only hard if you make it hard, you aren't required to use classes or setup projects to use other libraries or other things that may cause issues to new users. So all in all, GDK is your best bet out of the two.

Back to top
Profile PM Email
Zeroff
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Feb 2009
Location:
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 12:47
Link
I think that you should start of with DBPro because you don't need to keep on buy a licence if you want to sell your games. It's a one time fee only if you buy DBPro. But I think that you should buy DarkGame Studio because it comes with some game making stuff and a zone making thing and stuff like that.

Yet to have a signature
Back to top
Profile PM
David R
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Sep 2003
Location: 3.14
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 18:13
Link
Quote: " C++ is only hard if you make it hard"


This = win

09-f9-11-02-9d-74-e3-5b-d8-41-56-c5-63-56-88-c0
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
dark coder
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Oct 2002
Location: Japan
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 18:46
Link
Quote: "I think that you should start of with DBPro because you don't need to keep on buy a licence if you want to sell your games. It's a one time fee only if you buy DBPro"


Yet again, the amount of ignorance regarding GDK is astounding; you only need to buy the commercial GDK licence once, in fact this is better than DBPro as with DBPro you need to buy it regardless, and GDK is even cheaper than DBPro! Plus VSC++ is completely free for commercial products so VV.

Back to top
Profile PM Email
heyufool1
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th Feb 2009
Location: My quiet place
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 20:01 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2009 20:02
Link
Storm4 if I were you I would go with Dark GDK...

Good things:
1. It's free (and the commercial license cost less then DBPro)
2. Learning C++ would be a good idea because it's widely used
3. There are tons of C++ tutorials (not so much for Dark GDK but you can just convert DBPro tutorials into Dark GDK)
4. Dark GDK (not necessarily Dark GDK but C++) is much more flexible in my opinion. For DBPro if you wanted to use havok physics or newton physics or something you need to make a wrapper for it, but in Dark GDK you can use it directly because Dark GDK uses C++ and most physics engines use C++. (though I might be wrong about DBPro for I never used it)

Bad things:
1. Bit harder to learn then DBPro
2. Smaller community although you can still easily get help
3. Not many tutorials (but as I already said you can simply change the code they give you in DBPro tutorials to Dark GDK, ex. "Load Object" is the same as "dbLoadObject")

So by that list I would definitely go with Dark GDK.

Games are like life, they should never stand still.
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
jezza
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Mar 2008
Location: Bham, UK
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 21:46
Link
Quote: "2. Smaller community although you can still easily get help
3. Not many tutorials (but as I already said you can simply change the code they give you in DBPro tutorials to Dark GDK, ex. "Load Object" is the same as "dbLoadObject")"

Though it may be true that DarkGDK has less specific support, most of the DBPro tutorials are relevant for GDK also, and C+ has a waaaayyyy larger community of users for the language itself than DBPro has. You could ask questions about class design or how to build up a large project using DarkGDK on GameDev.net and you'd get relevant answers, and I like to think that those of us who help on the GDK board (*cough*) do a fair job.


While Bored Blog
Back to top
Profile PM Email
Asteric
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 1st Jan 2008
Location: Geordie Land
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 22:43
Link
My 2 cents is, any language is easy to learn, the real difference is the time it takes to learn it, DBP is faster to learn, but not as powerful, if you have some patience at hand, g for C++, if not, shame on you

Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
mike5424
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Mar 2009
Location:
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 23:13
Link
Quote: "LOLOOL WHAT"

damn IE. it showed as £300. lucky i switched!

from what i understand is that the language is the same. just a DB in gdk.

gdk cost's for each game you make (and sell?) but dark basic cost's once.

gdk can use other stuff (can't remember what it's called) but DBPro can only use plugins.

they both have a good and bad side.

dark basic keywords: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=156401&b=1
my models and textures: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=156401&b=1
Back to top
Profile PM Email
AndrewT
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 11th Feb 2007
Location: MI, USA
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 23:23
Link
Quote: "from what i understand is that the language is the same. just a DB in gdk."


No, the languages are totally different--the commands are the same.

i like orange
Back to top
Profile PM
NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Apr 2005
Location: The Fifth Plane of Oblivion
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 23:36
Link
C++/GDK is a Toyota Prius hybrid. Dark Basic is a dump truck. The controls are very similar and knowledge of one can be transferred to another.

A Prius isn't a dump truck though.

Back to top
Profile PM Website
Xenocythe
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 26th May 2005
Location: You Essay.
Posted: 3rd Sep 2009 23:46 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2009 23:48
Link
Quote: "damn IE. it showed as £300. lucky i switched!"

Different web browser's don't change the content of a website.

Quote: "gdk cost's for each game you make (and sell?) but dark basic cost's once."

It's only a one time fee for the commercial license, which is only $30 where buying DBPro costs more than twice as much ($70).

Quote: "gdk can use other stuff (can't remember what it's called) but DBPro can only use plugins."

It's not DarkGDK that's using anything, it's your Visual C++ projects that will use the DarkGDK library. Along with that, you can use most of the DarkBasic Pro plugins as C++ libraries for Visual C++ alongside DarkGDK. Plus all the many, many other libraries that can be used with Visual C++.


Basically, I'd say, to get the hang of DarkBasic's syntax and how it works, spend as much time as you can with the Free Trial of DBP and follow as many tutorials as you can. Then, start learning C++ with Visual C++ 2008 Express Edition and follow beginner's tutorials to learn the basics of C++. Then, just buy DarkGDK and you'll be able to use it with no problem.

Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
puppyofkosh
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Jan 2007
Location:
Posted: 4th Sep 2009 05:45
Link
I wouldn't worry about a 30 dollar fee if you're going commercial.
Back to top
Profile PM
Back to top

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2025-05-26 01:06:58
Your offset time is: 2025-05-26 01:06:58