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Geek Culture / Graphics card vs. Killer Xeno

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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 1st Apr 2010 03:45
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Hey guys.

I am going to be getting a new computer soon (hooray) and the one I'm looking at is pretty cool. However, it only has 2 PCI-e slots, which is less than what I want.

I was debating between either a CrossfireX™ ATI Radeon HD 5870 (looks very nice) or a ATI Radeon HD 5970 and the Killer Xeno Pro addon from Alienware. Same price. I was wondering, do any of you guys know which will have overall better performance?

I want a good gaming computer, BTW.

Thanks.

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Lemonade
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 02:12
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What's your price range?
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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 03:10
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Again, there is no difference in the price.

Quote: "Same price."


I mostly want to play single player. Will Killer Xeno help with that?

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Lemonade
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 05:17
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Oh sorry, that's what I get for skimming. Mis-read it completely.

Quote: "I mostly want to play single player. Will Killer Xeno help with that?"


I found this:

"The Killer™ Xeno™ Pro gaming network card is the only high-performance network card built specifically to improve network performance for online games. Featuring exclusive Game Detect™ technology, the Killer Xeno prioritizes online game traffic and delivers smoother, more responsive gameplay during intense online action in all your favorite MMO and FPS games."

Seems like its for online purposes only.
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charger bandit
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 10:25
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That is kind of stupid.No network card will ever improve ping if you have 56k connection or you are running bunch of apps that slow the connection down.And "Killer Xeno prioritizes online game traffic" isnt true.Software does that and you can get such software for free all over internet.Just go for a hardcore gaming system.

My pick from Radeon 5870X2 and 5970 would be: Nvidia Geforce GTX480
Why? Blows the heck out of 5870X2 for much less money.
Pluses are also:

-Proper driver support
-Best support for Shader Model 3.0 which Radeon still hasnt got and its the most widespread Shader Model


A.K.A djmaster
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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 13:17
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Thanks Chargerbandit and Lemonade.

Did not know it was a network card...it only said it would increase framerates. It was very vauge.

Also, Chargerbandit, I want an NVidia card, however that does not seem to be an option on the site when picking your card.

Overall, thanks for the response guys. Maybe I can just get the cheapest card and then sell it.

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Tywald
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 13:33 Edited at: 4th Apr 2010 13:40
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charger bandit:

I disagree about using two 5870 in Crossfire being a slower than one GTX480 in a lot of cases....don't know what numbers you have seen.
The times i've seen the 480 clearly perform "a lot better" is when using heavy "Tesselation" inside the "Heaven Benchmark" wich is currently a synthetic benchmark.
Or when the game tested doesn't have CrossfireX support yet so that only one GPU is being utilized...wich in that case the 480 GTX is faster as one 480 GTX is typicaly 10-15 percent faster than one 5870.

Up to date the 5970 is still the fastest single card out there.
The fastest solution possible is by combining TWO 480 GTX in SLI mode if that's what you're trying to say...but that costs a lot more than either two 5870 or a single 5970.

"Best support for Shader Model 3.0"....
Shader Model 3.0 came whit Direct X9 and the first commercially available GPU that supported it was the R300 (Wich the Radeon 9xxx series of cards used).
So Shader Model 3.0 is really,really old by now and both NVidia and AMD have proper support for it.

- Tywald
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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 13:45
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I think he meant Shader model 2.0...

Now I am confused. I've heard that ATI cards do not support shader 2.0, so I wanted an NVidia. The only SLI or CrossfireX type thing I can afford are 2 5870s...If I get an 5970 or a GTX480 I can only get one.

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Tywald
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 15:41 Edited at: 4th Apr 2010 15:51
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Looks like i got things backwards here.

It was SM 2.0 that came whit the first DirectX 9 that the R300 supported...not model 3.0 wich isn't supported by it at all...so i got my numbers wrong there.

I think it was certain extra instructions (named 2.0a) that NVidia has support for.
Personally though i wouldn't buy diss AMD/ATI cards becuse lack of this becuse frankly that model quite outdated and new games today certainly would use more modern shaders wich the cards supports.

Between the 480 GTX or one of the 5xxx solutions:
The 5970 (or two 5870) is faster than the 480 GTX in a lot of cases today...when that's not the case it's becuse:
There no Crossfire profile for the game wich forces the 5xxx cards to to ackwardly just use one of its GPUs.
Or there's some really heavy Tesselation action going on when using DirectX 11....wich currently no commercial game does...But it is difficult to say if it's worth buying a 480 GTX over those 5xxx solutions just becuse of its superior tesselation....will new games use more of it and before AMD releases a new series of cards whit faster tesselation or not?

The only case where i think it would be a better idea to go for the 480 GTX is if you're going to run two 480 GTX in SLI wich is probably a better idea than four 5xxx GPUs in Crossfire due to the somewhat poor scaling when using more than 2 GPUs.

- Tywald
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charger bandit
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 16:29 Edited at: 4th Apr 2010 16:34
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No I meant SM 3.0.Ask bond1 and he will tell you that Radeon's have a super poor support for SM3.0,sometimes they even have trouble with 2.0.Just go for the GTX480,its pure power,no SLI needed(50% of games dont even support SLI) and its easily overclockable.Also I would pick it for the hell of support and proper drivers.

I had quite some Geforces and Radeons in my life,and Geforce GPU's are way better.Some Radeons simply died,some Radeon drivers couldn't be removed/installed.Geforces were all good,from MX440 64mb to 9500GT 1gb.I bought a Radeon card a week ago cause I got it very cheap,its a 4770 1gb,so far its good except the HUGE power supply it needs.I had to plug a 6-pin power cable into it.Even the GTX480 only has two and its uber superior.


A.K.A djmaster
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Benjamin
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 17:10
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Quote: "No network card will ever improve ping if you have 56k connection or you are running bunch of apps that slow the connection down.And "Killer Xeno prioritizes online game traffic" isnt true.Software does that and you can get such software for free all over internet.Just go for a hardcore gaming system."


Actually, it probably has lower latency than regular networking cards (this is most likely the case). I'm not sure how much it can be improved by, but I guess it's rather useful if you play a lot of online shooters.
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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 17:14
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Quote: "but I guess it's rather useful if you play a lot of online shooters. "


I don't, so I guess that won't be a problem.

I know most games don't use 3.0, but Bond1 media for FPSC (which I enjoy using) does.

I'll go with the GTX480. I'm not super hardcore, I don't need the fastest card ever, just a really really good one that supports as many things as possible.

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draknir_
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 22:45
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5870x2 will get you better performance than a gtx 480. 480 also has higher heat, noise and power draw compared to the 5870.
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bond1
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 22:52 Edited at: 4th Apr 2010 22:53
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Quote: "I know most games don't use 3.0"


Any modern game running on Windows XP will be using directx9 and SM3.0. These same games running on ATI cards and WinXP will probably be using ATI's proprietary SM2.0b shader model. I know, it's weird.

I still do my gaming on an XP system, so that's ONE of the reasons I stick with Nvidia. And since FPSC uses directx9, which works just fine on XP/Vista/W7, I want full support for SM2 and SM3, another reason I use Nvidia.

I can't remember the last time I played a game that had the ATI logo at the splash screen. Every game I buy has the Nvidia logo and the slogan "The Way It's Meant to be Played" on it. Maybe because so many games are adopting PhysX now.

I just got Metro 2033, and this is a beast of a game. It brings even my GTX285 to it's knees at 1920x1200! I had to dial it back to 1440*900 to keep the frame rate over 30!

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"bond1 - You see this name, you think dirty."
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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 22:58 Edited at: 4th Apr 2010 22:59
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I always trust the judgment of Bond1.

It feels good thinking that I will have a better card than Bond1 also.

I'm the kind of person who is willing to forgo the fastest card ever for more support. So yeah, I'm going with the GTX480.

Quick Qs for Bond1:

How is Metro 2033?

And what producer do you think is best? I've been using PNY for a while now.

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bond1
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 23:04
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Wow, going for the 480, huh? Just make sure you've got at least 600 watt power supply. My GTX 285 is from BFG, but I've had PNY cards in the past too, and they were just fine.



Quote: "How is Metro 2033?"


It's very pretty, but so far, the combat is really no better than what you would see with FPSC! Mutants come at you clumsily, and don't react to your shots. It just shows a cheesy blood decal and eventually they fall over! The game does have a good atmosphere, so that counts for a lot. Hopefully it will get better as I get into it more.

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"bond1 - You see this name, you think dirty."
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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 4th Apr 2010 23:08
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Yeah. I made sure I had enough power. 875 watts.

Quote: "It's very pretty, but so far, the combat is really no better than what you would see with FPSC!"


Woah. Didn't see that coming.

I might get it in a month or two. If something else doesn't come up.

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