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Geek Culture / Real-Time Collaborative World Building

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Gil Galvanti
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 07:54 Edited at: 8th Apr 2010 07:55
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As I was stumbling around the internet, I came across this cool idea:

http://www.heroengine.com/world-building

A world builder that allows you to collaboratively edit the same world in real-time, so that someone could be editing the landscape, while another could be building a city, while another could be building a city. I'm surprised this hasn't been thought of before, I suppose it's mostly because of the technical obstacles that would have to be overcome to get it to work well. It seems like it'd be a great tool for fast game/world development. Anyways, I thought it was a cool idea related to game development, so I thought I'd share.


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DJ Almix
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 08:31
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Quote: "As I was stumbling around the internet, I came across this cool idea:

http://www.heroengine.com/world-building

A world builder that allows you to collaboratively edit the same world in real-time, so that someone could be editing the landscape, while another could be building a city, while another could be building a city. I'm surprised this hasn't been thought of before, I suppose it's mostly because of the technical obstacles that would have to be overcome to get it to work well. It seems like it'd be a great tool for fast game/world development. Anyways, I thought it was a cool idea related to game development, so I thought I'd share."


So, Second Life?

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Gil Galvanti
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 08:41 Edited at: 8th Apr 2010 08:41
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Quote: "So, Second Life?"


No, this is for actual game development. It's like a world builder that a development team would use to create and setup the world for a game. And you're not restrained by an avatar, obviously .


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Peter H
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 08:53 Edited at: 8th Apr 2010 08:55
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Like the forge in halo except online...

I know VanB (or maybe it was zircher?) was doing this a year or so ago on one of his projects. I'm not sure if he was just doing it on a LAN or over the internet though.

One man, one lawnmower, plenty of angry groundhogs.
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Sid Sinister
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 11:39 Edited at: 8th Apr 2010 11:40
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\"So, Second Life?\"

Exactly what I thought when I read the title.

The problem is, you\'d get some jackhole who spends his time undoing everything you do =/ There would have to be a set time where someone can\'t modify what you\'ve touched or something. A few minutes maybe?

EDIT: You know, I would go back through and fix the slashes that TGC so kindly riddled through out my post, but I'd rather this be an example of something that needs to be put on the honey do list for the forums.

"If I have seen a little further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants" - Isaac Newton
Current Project: http://strewnfield.wordpress.com/ (Last updated 06/11/09)
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BULLSHOCK 2
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 11:56
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Quote: "Like the forge in halo except online..."


Forge is online...

Forge doesn't work very well with multiple people editing a map online though...I mean everyone can change things, but when you start lining things up perfectly, the objects are slightly shifted in different directions.

I like this idea though...I know a lot of people like to dive right into maps and things and just start building...and a brainstorm/build session with a tool like that could be really beneficial...

FPS Creator Applications and Indie Game Dev Resources
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Quik
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 13:26
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i really think that this is very interesting!


[Q]uik, Quiker than most
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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 13:52
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The Unreal DK's adding something like this called Source Control, dunno when it's getting fully implemented though...

http://dystopiawipb.blogspot.com/
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Van B
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 14:00
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I did something faintly similar ages ago with an RPG world editor, project used such old tech that it's long abandoned. I did it over lan, and gave each user their own map file which overrides the main map as it's loaded. So if you imagine having your standard level map, I had an extra one for each user, then the main map will be loaded, then all the other users, then the current user on that PC's map. One user is designated boss, and their PC saves the main map data then it's safe to delete those extra map files. I think that's quite a good option for working on lan with a small team, I only got to test mine with 2 other users, but it was pretty fun to work like that.

The main thing, is that level design is tedious and daunting. I don't think any professional would design a map by themselves, at least not one as intricate as the one shown in the videos. Instead of the usual drudgery, it could be a party instead! - at least over LAN. Personally, I'm not sure I would trust the internet to look after big world files, at least if they are just sitting in a network location, it's quick to back them up and come up with systems to look after your file saving.


Health, Ammo, and bacon and eggs!
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RUCCUS
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 14:31 Edited at: 8th Apr 2010 14:33
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Uh...great...

There goes the project Ive been working like crazy on for the past two years. Now I have to finish early or others are going to pick this thing up.

Im not joking, Ive been developing an intense world builder that is entirely based on this concept. Its packed with other features as well, but... this was the premise. Great. Ive already implemented the online functionality, backing up files, checking in and checking out, and a bunch of useful tools similar to SourceSDK. I knew this thing was going to be figured out by someone else eventually, stupid school got in the way from me finishing it early. Well guess I have some competition.
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lazerus
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 15:04
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Well Ruccus, you could always let the forum members loose with it and create worlds together. That make this the worlds greatest forum in my humble opinion. Then you would have a larger entity bank and what not to play with. Lol the best forum game in the world.

Ehh ill keep dreaming.


http://lazerus-reborn.deviantart.com/
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David R
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 15:09
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Quote: ". I'm surprised this hasn't been thought of before, I suppose it's mostly because of the technical obstacles that would have to be overcome to get it to work well. "


It has. The guy making 'LOVE' has an editor which does exactly this - he gave a talk and demo on it about 2 years ago in fact, and he has a whole suite of tools based on realtime networked stuff

09-f9-11-02-9d-74-e3-5b-d8-41-56-c5-63-56-88-c0
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RUCCUS
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 15:23
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Ive got a few unique ideas up my sleeve that I still havent seen so Im still in the game. The other premise of my engine is its adaptiveness to any other engine. You customize what and how it exports each entity's data to allow your own engine to load it up, making the world builder speed up engine creation as well. I just need to get started on the companion plugin Ive been putting off that will auto-load the entities into a user's engine if they'd rather that route.
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Van B
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 16:09
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Yeah, keep at it Ruccus, I'm sure teams using DBPro would be very interested. That's the trouble with taking on big ideas, it can take so long to finish them that it looses a lot of it's USP before even being finished.

There's lots of tools that just haven't been created yet - especially with internet based teams in mind, project management and sharing, and I won't even mention source code control. I don't think that there's truly complete solutions for anything like this, it has to allow expansion - which is why I think your on the right track with allowing that custom export control. Whenever I see a cool editor, I have to stop and ask who can use it and for what - it's not like we'll be downloading the DBPro plugin for that thing, or any other editor that we haven't made ourselves. I would disregard the competition Ruccus, your system sounds a lot more relevant to what we do here - and I'm guessing it'll cost a lot less as well.


Health, Ammo, and bacon and eggs!
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KeithC
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 16:21
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Not to mention the potential price of that one, RUCCUS. Keep at it, and show us what you've got coming up.

-Keith
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Gil Galvanti
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 20:15 Edited at: 8th Apr 2010 20:15
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Quote: "The problem is, you\'d get some jackhole who spends his time undoing everything you do =/ There would have to be a set time where someone can\'t modify what you\'ve touched or something. A few minutes maybe?"

Nah, I don't think you understand the purpose of the tool. It's not an MMO where anyone comes in and builds the world (ie: Second Life), it's a game development tool that a development team would use to create a world for their game. That's kind of like saying, "But if I give my save file to the other world builder on the team, what if he deletes all my stuff?". Unless they are trying to sabotage the project, I don't think that's going to happen .


And RUCCUS, keep going with yours, competition isn't necessarily a bad thing, it's what drives people to improve and do better .


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The Master Dinasty
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 20:39
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Quote: " "ZeniMax Online selected HeroEngine because we determined it will serve our needs best. That fact that we can get up and running with meaningful art and content in the near term makes the HeroEngine a perfect fit for us."
Matt Firor,
President of ZeniMax Online Studios"


TES:6 everybody online...

Love the idea, but its price is not for us in the "lower" end of the class since major producers makes games with this i can consider it a lost cost, and hope that ruccus will come up with something better, and cheaper.

-Massap2

We are the magnificent Masters, builders of pyramids.
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RUCCUS
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Posted: 8th Apr 2010 20:55
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Im still determined not to post a WIP thread yet until I have a stable release with all of the preliminary features I outlined for myself. Its been hard enough to hold off for the last two years, but at any rate if anyone is interested here are some of the specs:

- Entity Blueprints: Every entity in the editor is built using a blue print system. You create a new blueprint, define it's parameters, and use this blueprint to create it's children. Modifying the parent blueprint will modify all of it's children. There are several prefab blueprints (weapons, vehicles, props, particle / object emitters, etc.) included, but I've been reworking the system to allow for custom blueprints. This system is done.

- Online world building, this system is done.

- I've programmed the editor to allow for my own engine integration later on down the line, as Im hoping Ill be able to incorperate a few dumbed down engines for things like shooters that the user's can use to test their worlds while the other users continue designing it. "Im getting killed too easily here, I need more cover", "No problem, let me drop that in", "Thanks" kind of thing.

- Probably one of the coolest features is the ability to combine entities. One of my blueprint types (called image sets) allow you to store a sequence of images in a blueprint. The emitter blueprint allows you to spew particles or objects out of an emission point. Make an image set of a series of smoke images, apply this image set to an emitter blueprint, then lock this emitter blueprint onto the back of a projectile blueprint in the form of a rocket. Apply the rocket projectile as a bullet for a rocket launcher weapon blueprint, and now when you shoot the rocket launcher clouds of smoke will spew out from behind the missile. Its things like this that Im trying to incorperate to make the engine flexible, my thinking being that all of these relationships between the blueprints (which children are locked together for example) can be exported as well and loaded into the user's own engine and handled the way they see fit.

Anyways I rambled too much, this isn't my thread nor is it about my project, there are more things I'd love to talk about but I really should keep my concepts to myself for the time being. Just have to wait till next month when college is over for the year to get back to work.
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