Sorry your browser is not supported!

You are using an outdated browser that does not support modern web technologies, in order to use this site please update to a new browser.

Browsers supported include Chrome, FireFox, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer 10+ or Microsoft Edge.

Geek Culture / Employer abuse in the video-game industry

Author
Message
Lemonade
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Dec 2008
Location:
Posted: 23rd Apr 2010 01:38 Edited at: 23rd Apr 2010 01:38
So I am preparing to write a research paper on employer abuse, primarily focusing on abuse in general, and then narrowing into the video game industry. Do you guys have any good links or books to suggest? I am having some difficulty finding a variety of reliable sources.

Jeku, I think I remember you saying that you have been through some abuse (long shifts, etc) working at EA. Do have any inside information for me?

I think you guys will find this article interesting:

http://www.boston.com/jobs/news/articles/2006/05/07/frustration_against_video_game_firm_grows_into_crusade_against_overwork/
BearCDP
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Sep 2009
Location: NYC
Posted: 23rd Apr 2010 02:57
You should check out recent developments with Rockstar Spouse.

Check out this WIP flash game from the Global Game Jam!
zeroSlave
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 13th Jun 2009
Location: Springfield
Posted: 23rd Apr 2010 23:51
Unfortunately, I don't deal with abuse in the game industry, but I do deal with abuse on a daily basis from state workers. I'm the DB manager for a state workers union and our organizers are constantly seeing grievances and issues from workers in patient care, corrections, and mental health facilities.

Most issues a worker can have fall into the following categories:
1. Benefits
2. Equipment
3. Favoritism
4. Job Description
5. Mandatory Overtime
6. Pay
7. Promotions
8. Safety
9. Sick leave policies
10. Staffing
11. Treatment by supervisors.

And I would think that when considering abuse in the workforce, it is one of these issues that is being abused.

Whether you agree with union politics or even just unions in general, I would look up some stuff about them. They will mostly be biased in favor of the workers, but it will give you good examples of the extremes of abuse in the workplace.

My green thumb grew the tree my Trojan War horse was crafted from. With roses in our pockets we rally round the tombstones. Ashes to ashes, we all fall down.
Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 24th Apr 2010 00:34 Edited at: 24th Apr 2010 00:37
Quote: "Jeku, I think I remember you saying that you have been through some abuse (long shifts, etc) working at EA. Do have any inside information for me?"


When I was interviewed for the position they told me to expect overtime, so I knew full well that I would be doing my fair share during crunch times to help out.

That being said, I was helping one team crunch, and right after jumped onto another team in the alpha period to help them crunch, then right after jumped onto yet ANOTHER team in the alpha period... it was 3 or 4 cycles in a row. Normally we're supposed to be with our own team the whole project through, then get a few days off at the end to rest (nor nearly the amount we put in, but it's still nice). When I complained to my boss about being jumped around, and then offered to help the last team WITHOUT doing any extra overtime, he guilt tripped me and had a manager hissy fit.

6 months prior to this I had told him I was handing in an application to get transferred to EALA in California, and he had a manager hissy fit.

They plan overtime into the project cycle from the START, which in my opinion is complete BS. I thought one of the qualities of management is to investigate what went wrong in previous cycles to help avoid the mistakes in the future. Not at EA. They simply schedule it in every year. My other manager was offended when I asked him about that practice. Incredulous!

While you should expect overtime during crunch, there was a time when I did 7 weeks straight, 7 days a week for 10-12 hours a day, for no extra pay. On the weekends the managers would bring in food to make it feel like we're getting something back, but that was only IF our manager decided to show up on the weekends. There were a few Sundays where we didn't have food, and the cafeteria was closed on the weekend.

The pay is not good for the programming industry. My current job in the business sector I'm making a good 33% more than I was in the game industry, and not doing a bit of overtime.

I could go on an on. Please don't use my name if you're going to use any of this for your paper


Senior Web Developer - Nokia
Lemonade
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Dec 2008
Location:
Posted: 24th Apr 2010 02:44 Edited at: 24th Apr 2010 02:45
Quote: "You should check out recent developments with Rockstar Spouse."


Awesome, thanks.

Quote: "unfortunately, I don't deal with abuse in the game industry, but I do deal with abuse on a daily basis from state workers. I'm the DB manager for a state workers union and our organizers are constantly seeing grievances and issues from workers in patient care, corrections, and mental health facilities.

Most issues a worker can have fall into the following categories:
1. Benefits
2. Equipment
3. Favoritism
4. Job Description
5. Mandatory Overtime
6. Pay
7. Promotions
8. Safety
9. Sick leave policies
10. Staffing
11. Treatment by supervisors.

And I would think that when considering abuse in the workforce, it is one of these issues that is being abused.

Whether you agree with union politics or even just unions in general, I would look up some stuff about them. They will mostly be biased in favor of the workers, but it will give you good examples of the extremes of abuse in the workplace."


That list is perfect! Thanks, that really helps. I'll look up unions too.

Quote: "When I was interviewed for the position they told me to expect overtime, so I knew full well that I would be doing my fair share during crunch times to help out.

That being said, I was helping one team crunch, and right after jumped onto another team in the alpha period to help them crunch, then right after jumped onto yet ANOTHER team in the alpha period... it was 3 or 4 cycles in a row. Normally we're supposed to be with our own team the whole project through, then get a few days off at the end to rest (nor nearly the amount we put in, but it's still nice). When I complained to my boss about being jumped around, and then offered to help the last team WITHOUT doing any extra overtime, he guilt tripped me and had a manager hissy fit.

6 months prior to this I had told him I was handing in an application to get transferred to EALA in California, and he had a manager hissy fit.

They plan overtime into the project cycle from the START, which in my opinion is complete BS. I thought one of the qualities of management is to investigate what went wrong in previous cycles to help avoid the mistakes in the future. Not at EA. They simply schedule it in every year. My other manager was offended when I asked him about that practice. Incredulous!

While you should expect overtime during crunch, there was a time when I did 7 weeks straight, 7 days a week for 10-12 hours a day, for no extra pay. On the weekends the managers would bring in food to make it feel like we're getting something back, but that was only IF our manager decided to show up on the weekends. There were a few Sundays where we didn't have food, and the cafeteria was closed on the weekend.

The pay is not good for the programming industry. My current job in the business sector I'm making a good 33% more than I was in the game industry, and not doing a bit of overtime."


Nice, thanks for the info. It's just what I am looking for.

Quote: "I could go on an on. Please don't use my name if you're going to use any of this for your paper "


Lol, don't worry. If I do use the info it will be from "an informed source" or maybe "a former EA employee". That would look good in a paper.
bitJericho
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Oct 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 24th Apr 2010 04:06
Quote: "While you should expect overtime during crunch, there was a time when I did 7 weeks straight, 7 days a week for 10-12 hours a day, for no extra pay"


Why would they not schedule overtime when you're willing to do overtime for no extra pay?

Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 24th Apr 2010 22:56
Quote: "Why would they not schedule overtime when you're willing to do overtime for no extra pay?"


Namely employee morale. Sure, in the first year new hires are eager to do everything they can because hey--- it's the game industry! Awesome! After 2, 3, 4 years of the same things going on and on, they should at least give the IMPRESSION that they're trying to straighten things out and lessen the overtime. At least if we knew our manager was fighting for our well being, we would be more eager to put in the effort.


Senior Web Developer - Nokia
BearCDP
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Sep 2009
Location: NYC
Posted: 25th Apr 2010 06:00
I'd be curious to know what the situations are in other studios. The only ones we've heard about are EA and Rockstar. Do successful indies like Behemoth manage well? What about developers that are AAA, but not supermassive like Infinity Ward, Gearbox, Bungie, etc.?

Check out this WIP flash game from the Global Game Jam!
Sid Sinister
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Jul 2005
Location:
Posted: 25th Apr 2010 07:52 Edited at: 25th Apr 2010 07:53
This forum, Polycount, is chalk full of professionals in the industry. Here is there take on the whole Rockstar San Diego thing. Good read and should be very useful to you in looking at the perspectives.

http://boards.polycount.net/showthread.php?t=68961

EDIT: I also talked about this here http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=164024&b=2

"If I have seen a little further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants" - Isaac Newton
Current Project: http://strewnfield.wordpress.com/ (Last updated 06/11/09)
greenlig
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Aug 2003
Location: Melbourne
Posted: 25th Apr 2010 10:56
I've worked at two independent studio's here in Australia. One was very small, but the other was Infinite-Interactive, the makers of Puzzle Quest. I also know a lot of the developers there very well.

Interestingly, Steve Fawkner(CEO) decided some years back that there would be no crunch time at I2. They try to keep things as fair as possible, and if people are required to do overtime, they accrue free time. It's not written in the contract, but the people running that place have such respect for their staff that they are transparent and repay loyalty in kind. I loved the time I spent there, and even though I pulled so massive shifts at times, I wanted to because of how we were treated.

My $0.02

Greenlig

Your signature has been erased by a mod as it is far too big.
Lemonade
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Dec 2008
Location:
Posted: 30th Apr 2010 10:02
Thanks for all the info guys. I'm using a lot of it to refine my searches to find more content. And it's given me some good ideas.

Quote: "1. Benefits
2. Equipment
3. Favoritism
4. Job Description
5. Mandatory Overtime
6. Pay
7. Promotions
8. Safety
9. Sick leave policies
10. Staffing
11. Treatment by supervisors."


Coughmist, what do you mean by "Job description" and "Staffing"?

crispex
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Jun 2007
Location:
Posted: 30th Apr 2010 13:02
Quote: "he pay is not good for the programming industry. My current job in the business sector I'm making a good 33% more than I was in the game industry, and not doing a bit of overtime."


That's the thing, most people say they want to design video games when they grow up, but they fail to realize that only people who are long-time game developers get the cut, the rest only make about 30-40k a year, not bad, but it's not going to make your a millionaire like they all believe.

Temporarly away from the Phoenix Sentry.

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2025-05-24 12:46:39
Your offset time is: 2025-05-24 12:46:39