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The 20 Line Challenge / [STICKY] [DBPro] Space Invaders Challenge – Official TGC Competition

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baxslash
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Posted: 9th Jul 2010 11:44 Edited at: 9th Jul 2010 11:44
Here is what it should look like:



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DVader
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Posted: 9th Jul 2010 18:10 Edited at: 9th Jul 2010 21:20
Hmm, let me get this straight.

* The game with the least amount of characters (not just # of lines)
* Closest replica to the original Space Invaders

It is based solely on character count.

Ok, so from that I take it that if you did a few boxes moving about, and someone else had animated sprites. The person who had worked hardest will lose out because of trying to get it looking authentic. Unless of course they have somehow got graphics in without using more lines, which seems highly improbable. Seems a screwy idea this 20 line challenge to me, always has. It should be called the unreadable code challenge.
I think it would be better to just say space invaders, no media, in as little code as possible, graphics are not important. As to someone like me, saying as close as poss to the arcade makes me think I have made a bad job of it, if it doesn't look somewhat like the arcade.

Can we clarify graphics do not matter unless in a tie situation?
@backslash very odd problem there. Maybe a video driver problem?

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Phaelax
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Posted: 9th Jul 2010 23:11
I'm thinking its more of a DX version problem perhaps. I would say the the results at work would be the correct one as 0 to 3 should by all means draw 4 pixels at 0,1,2,3. Unless the line command was intended to not make the line's endpoint inclusive.


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
baxslash
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Posted: 9th Jul 2010 23:14
Quote: "@backslash very odd problem there. Maybe a video driver problem?"

You could be right but all drivers are up to date!! Could someone tell me if the code I posted looks like good sprites or bad sprites?

Please?!

Quote: "Can we clarify graphics do not matter unless in a tie situation?"

Don't be ridiculous Darth...

I don't want to loose against a bunch of cubes just because the character count is lower!

I'm sure that whoever judges this comp will base it on a combination of sensible ideals such as:
First- It MUST be 20 lines or less (hence the 20 liners board... change the record Steve!)
Second- Some kind of points system with points for; similarity to the original, minimal character count, clever coding etc.

I know the code isn't pretty when it's under 20 lines but the point is you have to think that little bit more about what you are writing.

Sasuke
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Posted: 9th Jul 2010 23:31
Well I'm just going off what was stated: "It is based solely on character count." and... basically baxslash's Second Rule: "similarity to the original, minimal character count, clever coding etc.". Who really cares if it's in the 20 Liners Broad, if there was a Lowest Character Count Board then I would say something, but since there isn't, I'm sticking to what's been stated.

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
Phaelax
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 00:16
@baxslash, I took your 20-line code and was able to trim off an additional 300 characters by simply changing variable names. Also saved about 15 characters using 5 IF statements rather than a SELECT block. Little things like that is how I managed to get my count so low. The way I see it, there are 26 letters in the alphabet, so unless I have more than 26 different variables, no name should be longer than a single character. Ugly to read, yes, but that's why I maintain two versions of code.

I'm all for winning, but I'll still point out ideas to help people.


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
DVader
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 00:28 Edited at: 10th Jul 2010 00:29
Don't be ridiculous Darth...

I don't want to loose against a bunch of cubes just because the character count is lower!

That is my point, if you go by the rules at the start then that is exactly what would happen!

Quote: "Is it based solely on character count?"
It is based solely on character count.

Quote: "So are we limited to only 25 commands per line then or no?"
The character count is the key. The less lines the better, no limit on each line.
It only mentions faithfulness as a side note....
I would hate to see a great version beaten by a bad but smaller one if you know what I mean. More defined rules would be nice as you say points based on both length and quality. What I have seen here so far looks pretty good.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Sasuke
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 00:47
Quote: "I'm all for winning, but I'll still point out ideas to help people."


That's why Phaelax is awesome, though I'm not really sure if that's allowed... I mean not encourage. You'd end up with teams of people helping each other so the judges wouldn't be just judging one persons work, but 2+. Then again you could help each other over IM so I guess that ruins my argument. I don't know how these work, this is my first comp.

Good Luck All !!!!

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
Sasuke
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 00:54
Quick Question:

If I post my code in the near future, then a day later someone posts something with some identical code to mine do the judges take notice of it?

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
DVader
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 02:15
I was thinking the same thing. Hard to judge it I would imagine. There are only so many ways of doing Space Invaders.
The point I have been trying to make is just that as ever the rules seem vague. I would have thought the best way would be to keep within 20 lines. The best version under 20 lines wins, regardless of character count. Am I not right in thinking there is a 256 character limit per line in DB? If versions are too close to call graphically etc then character count would be the final thing to compare. Just my thoughts.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
baxslash
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 02:30
OK, I just realised something. I am no longer commenting on this thread...

I will just get annoyed... disabling MailBack...

Sasuke
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 12:34 Edited at: 10th Jul 2010 12:35
You guys better pull out all the stops cause I am...



A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.

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IBOL
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Posted: 10th Jul 2010 18:06 Edited at: 10th Jul 2010 18:08
baxslash,
you were looking for help with your problem of differing output on different machines:

i'll tell you:
when i tried your first version of code, it looked just right,
but when you 'edited' it, the invaders looked messed up.

make absolutely sure you're using the exact same code on each machine.

also, is your version (6.2, 7.5, etc.) of DBP the same on each?
DBP changes how it behaves over the years.

@all,
the *length* of the game is judged 'solely on character count',
but the other criteria is :
Quote: " Closest replica to the original Space Invaders
"


there were several version of this game. has anyone found a particularly good resource (videos, pics) about the game?
or maybe you just have one in the corner store (i'd be jealous)

The night coda
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Posted: 11th Jul 2010 01:07
It has just come to my mind that I have looked up the law on running a competition in the UK and it has come to my attention that they have broken a few of the laws requirements these are as such
#Age limits
#Names of jugs
#Aria and location
this means that we actually have the right to a cart case against the game creators Ltd as they have started a competition and have not shown these and I am sure that they have broken a few other law in this one compatible I would hate for this to turn into a court case but they really do need to sort them self out as they are a UK registers company and have to follow by the rules of the contrary.

UK law on competitions:
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2005/ukpga_20050019_en_1
UK Company No. 03738984.

Just so people know I have looked this up for my own rezones before now just I thought about it know

Get it sorted The Game Creators I would hate to do this.

codaing at night alway and forever
Sasuke
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Posted: 11th Jul 2010 02:14 Edited at: 11th Jul 2010 02:17
My progress so far:

- Runs at the same resolution as the original.
- All menu's are done and drawing just like the original.
- The core game is done but not operational because I'm writing it to be condense even further.
+ Want to add the extra menus where the invaders play about with the menu text.

Basically, when it's done, it not possible to get any closer to the original unless I code the font... hmm... y'know I might just do that depending on character count which is very low at the moment.

I made a vid of the menu's, if you chuck this next to original, you won't be able to tell the difference other than the text that is. Btw, don't have a clue why the resolution for the vid came out that way.

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.

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DVader
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Posted: 11th Jul 2010 03:51
Looking good, there's some fantastic looking entries so far. Mine is coming along although I am concerned with character count at the min Still we will have some cool space invaders clones after this!

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Sasuke
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Posted: 11th Jul 2010 11:27
Cheers DVader, can't wait to see yours

The night coda, erm... is that a joke post?

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
David Gervais
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Posted: 11th Jul 2010 13:11 Edited at: 11th Jul 2010 13:14
The night coda, read the following..

"Under the Gambling Act 2005, a competition will not be a lottery if it satisfies the "skill" test or if no payment is required to enter."

This IS a skill test, AND no payment is required. So it is not considered a 'Lotery'

the link you posted has no info on 'contests' or 'compititions' it is all about the lottery laws. I also found this from the same source regarding the Gambling Act 2005..

"If there is no payment to participate in your contest, it will not fall within the scope of the Gambling Act."

and that's all I'm gonna say on this, I'm not a staff member with TGC, but that post was way out of line. Get your facts straight, please.

Cheers!

Phaelax
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 01:40 Edited at: 12th Jul 2010 01:41
The night coda just joined the other day to post a threat against suing TGC? Get a life dude.

Here's a new version, since the goal is to be more like the original. Wish I had the original game to play.

What's the limit for the length of data statements?



Quote: "You guys better pull out all the stops cause I am..."

Mine has sound!


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
IBOL
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 02:36
phaelax,
i get "could not load sound at line 17"
if i take out all sound-related commands, i can play it,
but otherwise not...

i have DBP 7.0
which version are you running?

can anyone else get it to work?

DVader
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 03:47 Edited at: 12th Jul 2010 03:56
Works fine for me. Nice work! And I thought I might steal a march by putting in sound lol. I kinda figured someone else would do it though Glad to see you get the annoying click as well, I have abandoned the sound so far because of it, if I can sort out the click which I have an idea for then I may put it back in. Trouble is my character count is gonna be way high lol.

You may want to put in a 4th base btw, the original had 4.

I include a pic of my version so far.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081

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Phaelax
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 03:54
oh crap it is 4 bases! No matter, a single number change of 3 to 4 will add no additional code.

What annoying click are you talking about?

IBOL, I'm running 6.7 I think.


I've noticed a very annoying bug with CLS. Seems like whenever I call it, I have to switch back and forth between CLS and CLS 0 for it to actually clear the screen.

If I recall, character count was somewhere around 4900 I think. Removing the sound would shave off 510 characters.


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
DVader
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 04:00
Perhaps the click is due to my sound hardware. Probably why I get it with my code as well. I am at a higher character count than yours (4473) mine is 7000+ at the mo and not finished.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Sasuke
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 05:02
Quote: "Mine has sound!"


Awesome! I had a go at doing it as well, but my comp had some weird sound issue at the time. But playing your snippet now, it seems it's resolved itself on it's own. I might have a go at it again depending on character count which is around 4980 at the moment.

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
IBOL
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 05:28 Edited at: 12th Jul 2010 05:31
phaelax,
could you adjust your code, to make the sound work?
or is it just my machine/version?
or someone explain how to fix it?
i tried working with your code, but i don't understand memblocks.
or wav file structure.


my character count is 4856, without making it into a 20-liner
(adding colons : will increase it )

DVader
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 17:18 Edited at: 12th Jul 2010 19:09
IBOL it works fine on my computer as I said, how can he fix something which is not broken? It must be related to your system. As I said in an earlier post I get clicks at the end of them, but it seems not everyone does. So may be my sound card. Memblocks seem confusing at first, but are quite simple really. Think of them as a big file that you can store practically anything in, sounds, graphics, data.
What has been done in the game above is that a sin wave has been made, loaded into the memblock, with a new header, so it thinks it is a sound file. Then when you use make sound from memblock it makes the sin wave play. Well I assume that's how he did it cause that's how I did it, lol. Not actually read the code, trying not to look too closely at anyones work while I'm working on mine.

So for instance.


That's off the top of my head I may have forgot something.
Edit - yes lol that won't work as it doesn't include the header file. You would need to add it to the start of the array.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Phaelax
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Posted: 12th Jul 2010 22:40
I'll make a demo for you to test on your system IBOL, we'll see if that works and hopefully narrow down the problem.


So do I currently have the lowest character count here? Yippie! But Sasuke has menus


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
DVader
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Posted: 13th Jul 2010 01:24 Edited at: 13th Jul 2010 01:34
I would say you are definitely the lowest count at the moment, unless someone out there has a version we haven't seen. I forgot about the colons adding even more characters to the count Curse those colons!

An exe would work out whether it's a DB version causing the sound problem or not. I'm using the version prior to the latest update (1.071), for ref. Like I say it worked fine except for the click on the end of the sample. I think that is a hardware/software issue on my side though.

I forgot to say like the scan line effect you have by the way

Edit - Just had a thought on the sound thing, although can't see why it would happen if you just download and run your code. I have had the can't load sound error pop up many times in coding this. Pretty much every time it was caused by the header file being corrupted with the wrong data. So maybe that is the cause.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Jammy
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Posted: 13th Jul 2010 19:30
Phaelax your code works just fine here, good job with the sound. I do hear the clicks DVader is talking about, but don’t find them annoying they are probably caused by the waveform not starting or finishing at the “Zero” if that makes any sense. I too had thought about making my effort unique by adding sound but looks like I will just be going for the “bloat-ware” prize. Can’t believe you lot are producing so much with so little.

Sasuke
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Posted: 13th Jul 2010 23:43 Edited at: 14th Jul 2010 00:51
The movement of the invaders is doing my head, really awkward to code if you want to keep your character count down since they move in segments on each row, so one frame 4 invaders on the bottom row could move down, the next frame the others on the row would move down then each other row follows this pattern one frame after the other instead of moving all the invaders as one. Also the 4 types of bullets or bombs, 3 animated 2-4 frames each and animated explosions for the player and saucer at the top is a pain. Not to mention all the animated menus. I really need to get creative with my coding if I want to keep the character count under 6000 (without spaces).

Edit, Just remember, after you win a round the invaders start height is lower than the last rounds start pos. That's why it was impossible to play forever cause every round was made harder by that element. I wonder, if I make it exactly like the original would it be a valid entry since it's not close to the original, but is the original... hmm, maybe tweaking the colours by 1 should put me back into the running

Quote: "But Sasuke has menus"


Not only menus

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
Phaelax
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Posted: 14th Jul 2010 01:32
I need to find a copy of the game to play so I can all the animations. Mine's all based off a picture, so I sorta guessed how the aliens animate.


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
Sasuke
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Posted: 14th Jul 2010 01:48 Edited at: 14th Jul 2010 02:02
I've got the game, but you could just look up Space Invaders Arcade on Youtube so something like this: Space Invader Arcade Though this ones a bit fast.

Edit: This ones a lot better: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHMxQUoKxDw - It seems slightly modded since he doesn't lose lives, but gaining lives was part of the game, don't have a clue when you gain them, think it's every 1000 points or something.

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
Jammy
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Posted: 14th Jul 2010 03:14
For those of you who don’t have access to or even played the original.

http://www.bytearray.org/?p=622

I found this Emulator, It uses the original space invaders ROM and is fantastic. At first I thought it was just a screen shot, however it is the original game and fully playable in your browser (think it uses FLASH).

It does have a few things which are different as the programmer “wanted to tune it a bit and give it a disco look'n feel”

First it is orange
Second you have 6 lives
Third I think it runs a bit fast.

However it should provide anyone a good idea of how the game played also you can pause it and see the frames of animated sprites.

Good luck everyone.

http://www.bytearray.org/?p=622

Phaelax
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Posted: 15th Jul 2010 00:24
Hey IBOL, I've uploaded a compiled version of my code, let me know if the sound works for you this time.


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke

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IBOL
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Posted: 15th Jul 2010 00:47
phaelax,
yep, sound works fine as an exe
(and sounds good!)

but the enemy's shots don't kill me.
IDK if that's how it's supposed to be for brevity's sake,
but i thought i should tell you.

Sasuke
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Posted: 15th Jul 2010 01:25
phaelax, for someone who only went off just a picture you've done incredibly well at replicating it.

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
DVader
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Posted: 15th Jul 2010 21:06 Edited at: 16th Jul 2010 01:16
You guys might want to try mame if you are struggling with the look.

Edit - Ok here is a demo of my version so far.

C to put in credits. 1 or 2 for 1 or 2 player. Left Right to move CTRL to shoot.

Edit removed file as it was bugged.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Phaelax
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 00:14
IBOL, the shots kill me when I run it. You have a weird machine.


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
DVader
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 01:15 Edited at: 16th Jul 2010 01:20
Ok here is a new version, the one I posted above had a nasty bug that crept in.


http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081

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Sasuke
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 01:52
DVader, really like your demo, great stuff. I wonder what font that is, I thought I'd leave it to the end of the project, but since yours using the same font it just crossed my mind.

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
DVader
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 02:32
I have coded in graphics and font. So I have no idea what text is used on the game unfortunately.

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
Sasuke
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 02:37
I see. I was planning to do the same with the font cause I'd never seen it before within the standard fonts that come with Windows and other apps. I figured it must be a custom font. Cheers for the info anyway. Great sounds btw, I'm having a play with sounds at the moment.

A dream is a fantasy, if you achieve that fantasy it was never a dream to begin with.
James_TGC
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 14:27
I've posted images from this thread in the TGC fan page so that everyone can see your great work! Feel free to post more images and even videos so that others can see the great stuff you're all producing for this competition via the TGC Twitter, Facebook pages and the YouTube channel

Online Marketer for TGC
BMacZero
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 17:12
Quote: "I would say you are definitely the lowest count at the moment, unless someone out there has a version we haven't seen. I forgot about the colons adding even more characters to the count Curse those colons!"

You haven't seen mine yet, but I don't think it quite beats Phaelax's anyway . I'll post it when I get the bunkers figured out.

@Phaelax (and others): here's a trick that I'm using to cut a few characters in my data statements:


Sasuke
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 17:30
Ahhh!, BMacZero, I was doing the same thing:



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BMacZero
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 17:58
Yep, constants are great .

DVader
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 18:04 Edited at: 16th Jul 2010 18:12
Weird, tried to post a video and it crashed. Now has a message at the bottom saying.

Invalid Board specified. Please return to the Forum Index.

I hope this post clears it. Trying to sort a video on YouTube. Will post when done.



http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081

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DVader
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Posted: 16th Jul 2010 18:50 Edited at: 16th Jul 2010 18:51
Here is the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZ50g8v5-FE

http://s6.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=103081
BMacZero
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Posted: 17th Jul 2010 21:53
@Phaelax - I just tried the compiled one you uploaded and I have the same problem as IBOL - shots go right through me. Win7 64 bit laptop.

BMacZero
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Posted: 18th Jul 2010 01:34 Edited at: 18th Jul 2010 17:22
Alright, I got the bunkers done, so here's mine so far. (It's semi-compressed)

Work in progress, not an official entry


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