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Geek Culture / Game released as chapters ?

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Omega Online
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Posted: 14th Nov 2002 18:19
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Hello everyone how ya doing ?

Well I just wanted people's views on releasing game as chapters example below:

A FPS game.
With 25 levels.
13 Chapters.
1st chapter released free (with cut down features etc) One level supplied with the chapter.
Chapters 2-13 have 2 levels each and perhaps priced at around £3 each.
Then if early chapters sell well add more features like Multiplayer etc

So any views, ideas are welcome, as the future for games maybe more successful if released chapters. As if the development team spend lots of money creating one game then releasing it and dosen't sell well, they basically have wasted time. So any views , ideas are welcome.

Omega Online
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rapscaLLion
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Posted: 14th Nov 2002 22:23
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I do't know, the success of something like that depends on how it's implemented. 2 levels per chapter is far too little, as the player would get bored and abandon the game while waiting for the ext chapter to come out. Then, if someones attention wears thin, they won't buy later chapters.
After thinking about, I think this is a bad idea in it's current form. But the concept is still a good one.

Alex Wanuch
aka rapscaLLion
Kousen Dev Progress >> Currently Working On Editors
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 14th Nov 2002 23:34
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Halcyon Sun - that one was free, but i got bored of it right before it got the multiplayer addon chapter.
But each part was like 50mins to download on a 56k and 20mins to play ... gameplay wasn't particularly fun because it didn't run very quick on my P2 266 - Savage4 Pro - 128Mb Ram (which for '97 wasn't a bad machine)

It's a good idea, but think there needs to be some planning involved. I mean 2 levels isn't bad, look at Elite Forces - Portalised Single Worlds over KM's of space.
This isn't really good for an FPS thou, because i mean people will shoot through the levels !bang-bang! complete.
No there has to be some sorta catch like, a good storyline that will drag people to WANT to know the next episode, and they leave them for days wondering what they've missed to complete the level

(^_^) good idea thou

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
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Martyn Pittuck
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Posted: 17th Nov 2002 20:12
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Max Payne

Done in 3 Parts
Each Part has about 8 chapters
Each Chapter has about 8/10 scenes

Great game, allows for small but bery detailed sections as you play for about 10/15 mins before the scene changes

The Outside is a evil place to be, too much light, too much noise and too many distractions....
I went outside once and my FPS rate dropped to 5.
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 18th Nov 2002 05:29
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yeah but i'd of got peeved if i had to buy that game in sections - its more of complete FFA, with Quake if-it-moves-shot-it! rules
And if they released in sections, i really wouldn't care about completeing it - the fact that i've got to the final scene in part one, i can't get past that devil worshiping freak - so i've just put it away and i doubt i'll touch it again for a good 6months

if a game like that is to appear to make people want more, it needs to give them something they REALLY want. I mean if MGS was released like that, i swear it'd of done so well - the only reason i bought that stupid addon pack was cause i was told it was a continuation story, boy did i waste £20

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
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Martyn Pittuck
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Posted: 18th Nov 2002 15:34
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Max Payne is a whole game with section (parts) all on one disk.

The only way to do it is to have somming like a long police investigation:

Part 1: Follow a lead and bust the worlds biggest drugs dealer.
Part 2: Story sying drug dealer has escaped jail sentence and has secretly gone into the arms traid. Guess who get all the bullets their way?
Part 3: Life is soo good without a big illegal opp happening then from the middle of nowhere another ganster has to be busted.

The Life Of a Major Crime Squad

The Outside is a evil place to be, too much light, too much noise and too many distractions....
I went outside once and my FPS rate dropped to 5.
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Freddix
AGK Developer
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Posted: 18th Nov 2002 16:34
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separating the game in chapter and parts depend on the story of the game.
I think you can't fix from beginning , how many chapter and how many parts per chapter you'll use .

Prepare the story and try to cut it in parts . . .
Then When You'll have all the parts , try to find what are the different themes for your game and then separate in chapter ( 1Chapter=1theme= x parts about that theme )

But that idea make me think about a game that was sold like that . . .
You but the First chapter . . .
then buy the second . . .
. . .
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pathfinder
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Posted: 18th Nov 2002 16:54
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I am not sure either. If you make a demo maybe you should release a tutorial map. Ive noticed alot of companies do this. That way people dont have to restart the game, and the plots not going to have to be repeated. by releasing it in parts I assume your trying to keep the costs down for people. I would sell the whole thing, if people like the game then the'll pay. Getting them to buy it is the trick. Talking about money makes me nervious though, no one openly says how much they make from shareware / hobbiest games over the net. I have this horrible feeling they dont make much . You got to be in it for the love, which sucks for all the hard work people put into their games.

wasnt the original wolfnstien sold like that, in chapters?

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Mirthin
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Posted: 19th Nov 2002 01:25
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It can work, you just need to implement it right. Some people have waypoints in their series, for example...

Chapter 1 is free

Chapter 2 is bought

Chapter 3 is bought

Chapter 4 is free

Chapter 5 is bought

and so on.

You might ask "but won't everyone just download the free ones and follow the story that way?"

Well, you can use a code that is given at the end of the game that unlocks the next chapter, forcing the player to follow along the line and buying some of the chapters.

However, no matter what you do, you need a hook at the end of each chapter to coax the player on.

This has "Fiasco" written all over it.
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Mirthin
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Posted: 19th Nov 2002 01:27
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Also, you can use the same engine for each chapter, so releasing new chapters will be quicker, and your audience won't expect a better game 'cause it's the next chapter, not a sequel.

This has "Fiasco" written all over it.
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QuothTheRaven
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Posted: 19th Nov 2002 02:24
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If it's really a game worth selling, then there's no way you should be able to *download* parts of it in any reasonable ammount of time. That's like getting a game patch every week for the next 2 years...and everyone hates getting game patches. If you're selling it, that means it needs all kinds of good media, and probably with a big file size involved. A big portion of the gaming market has 56k's, and it really isn't a recommendable idea.
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 19th Nov 2002 06:55
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yeah Wolf3D was
Chapter 1 ; Free
Chapter 2-5 ; $4.99
Chapter 6 ; $6.99

don't ask me why that was cause i have no idea
but you could buy the whole game in a single chunk for $19.99

upto you which seems better value

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 19th Nov 2002 07:08
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ya know what i'd suggest and rather than doing what most companies have done for these kinda games...
Sort out the Entire Story, sort out howto split up the game and then make the whole game.

Then release a part every week or maybe fortnite to make it just like a TV series, people deliberatly having to wait
That way there is no "Oh my god the next chapter will be 6months as there is an annoying bug in my level software.
As all that'll be update will the the level packs rather than entire game packs in the size of around 30Mb wouldn't be unreasonable, a few seconds download for Broadbanders and 2-4hours for Dialup peeps

Quite simple to make an Resumeable Downloader with DarkBasic Pro by pulling down the bytes of the a file and using the new file position command, you could combine it with a built in downloader so they download a small 800kb downloader which allows them to download the game once they use thier order confirmation code

Also been playing TheSimsOnline alot (week off this week so i'm just lazing about,should really be getting onwith my projects here but i want a break ) ... and it has an autopatcher system, i think that would be a good feature to include - like a seperate DarkBasic program that will update the original (or rather just install a new one, unless you fancey making a compare and contrast program - which is dang hard )
but that way the use whenever they play the game, can always be updated so if there is and bug that prevents the use of a later level feature or you want to speed up the game.

Techically this would mean everyone who plays would have a beta style software, because there'd be less chance to test if your on a time scale to keep releasing - but allows you to update thier copies quickly and easily.

I'm sure there are a few talented peeps here who'd like to design a Resumable Downloader, Installer and AutoPatcher.

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
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Mirthin
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Posted: 19th Nov 2002 13:55
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Well, you've got to ask yourself, "is it worth the download?"

People like me don't need to. "A few seconds."

This has "Fiasco" written all over it.
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Puffy
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Posted: 21st Nov 2002 07:19
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chapters... if they pay they should pay for the whole thing at 1 time... but i always thought expansions were new chapters...

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 21st Nov 2002 09:54
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actually that would be a good idea...
when users pay, rather than allowing them a download which could be warez'd easily - send them an addon CD.

I mean TheSims is a great example of a chapter kinda game, each addon pack adds features - but released far enough apart for noone to really notice your paying so much.
I only relised when my brother nicked the collection to go live with dad that all 6 are $29.99 each ...
saw the sum on my bill and thought bloody hell all that for a single game

Thinking about it as there was no demo, if this was me buying it for the first time, then i doubt of spent $180.00 but with all of the addon's there is so much expanded from the original its cool.
But then again TheSimsOnline is to be $34.99 and is to be $10/month access with everything from all the other games, hehee so i kinda feel stupid now

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
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Puffy
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2002 02:52
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its all bill gates evil plot to make people pay for using windows... pay for using there cpu... and so on... i wont have an agreement like the xbox that basically says "i just payed for it i dont own it"... you guys all hear about the xbox and windows banning xbox's off the internet because of mod chips... WHO GIVES A FLYING FUCK THEY PAID GREEDY ASS MICROSHIT...

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Mirthin
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2002 18:18
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Ok, £80 for Windows 98 was bad, but £250 for XP Pro is just taking the biscuit factory. He's an inconsiderate little prick, what about us impoverished students?

This has "Fiasco" written all over it.
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2002 20:38
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its all insane really, I mean wouldn't it make sense if you're trying to stop piracy not to put up prices again?
it's like... Oh we're tired of people stealing Windows, so we're making an unbeatable code to prevent this blah blah blah.

The only thing that actually improves in the inginuity of the pirateers lol

It is insane, that you pay for something just to be told technically it doesn't belong to you - i mean jesus, whats next Banks telling you that once you're morgage is paid off all it entitles you too is more loans the house isn't really yours!?!
I mean for fucks sake, the setup of XP means you have to buy 1 copy PER machine you have at home... I have 6 machines at home, and it'd be a cold day in hell i'm buying 6 copies at $120 when i could buy a Pro/Corp version for $250 ... i mean still a freakin' ripp off, but its senseless.
Technically I'm pirating as is because the licence is for only 5 machines!!
God its insane!!
I mean whats the point in purchasing software or hardware if at the end of the day you don't really own it... what exactly are you paying for RENT??

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
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Mirthin
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2002 22:57
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If only we could turn this world around and make everyone use Linux.

This has "Fiasco" written all over it.
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The Darthster
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2002 00:38
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There's still time.
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Puffy
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I use all three ops =P soon to be 5... once i get the others working *i meant macos windows and linux...*... buying shit from microdick is just like cutting off your hands... if you cant be creative why have em... >=( down with microsoft up with UNIX...

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Mirthin
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2002 19:13
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Thing is, DB won't work in anything other than Windows, afaik.

Who wants cake? I've got a little slice of hell for everyone.
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Puffy
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2002 22:25
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you can get a windows emulator for linux...

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Mirthin
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Posted: 24th Nov 2002 01:23
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But does it contain support for DirectX drivers?

Who wants cake? I've got a little slice of hell for everyone.
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Puffy
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yes ... winehq ... it has limited support for directx right now but there working on it... and a gaming version of mandrake has complete directx support...

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indi
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email stephen king, he did something similar and he may tell you how it panned out.

He released the first chapter of a book a while back if u remember.

http://www.lunarpixel.com

http://www.lunarpixel.com/dt/
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Puffy
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indi indi indi... yeh i remember that... didnt you have to pay per chapter... =\

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indi
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first chapter free then u buy the book online or something.

http://www.lunarpixel.com

http://www.lunarpixel.com/dt/
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Puffy
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really now =\ hrmmm i guess thats a good idea but the first chapter really doesnt speak for the book...

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 24th Nov 2002 21:10
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ever get the feeling we need a chatroom rather than a forum hahaa

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Mirthin
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Posted: 24th Nov 2002 21:56
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We could have a chatroom or 2 aswell, it would be useful.

Who wants cake? I've got a little slice of hell for everyone.
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Shadow Robert
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or an IRC channel
that'd be cool, there was one once wasn't there?
I can't remember - could start one I guess (^_^)

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Puffy
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yes there was one... back before i was part of color arts... but they stopped talking to me about 2 years ago i think... ever since then its been puffinter@ctive....

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indi
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irc.darkbasic.net

#DarkBasic



http://www.lunarpixel.com

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indi
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well it used to work

http://www.lunarpixel.com

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Puffy
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i made one http://chat.cjb.net/PuffInter@ctive its temp until i finish my chat program... then we could all be using DarkCHAT =D

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Shadow Robert
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pitty
hey we can just sponge off of irc.quakenet.org
created the channel #darkbasic (^_^)

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Puffy
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ah come on raven join my chat room... AND DONT PUSH CANCEL ON THE DOWNLOAD...

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Shadow Robert
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hehee... i'll think about it later... right now having fun in Vulcanus

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Puffy
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sure... then give me your msn name... hey ive noticed that indis llama_xmas.gif take a long time to load... compression with the gif problem???

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Shadow Robert
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lol i have no problems with it
rather not give out my msn name here - especially with everyone around, my poor spam blocker is working overtime as is

inbox me at my site forum i'll give ya it, or cometo
irc.quakenet.org #vulcanus - i'm there almost 24|7 hehee

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Puffy
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im in the channel... horah

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Mirthin
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Hey Darth, you could e-mail him for it

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Shadow Robert
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lol damn he now knows my fav haunts, msn androughly where i live.
i think i need to start getting worried

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Puffy
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O_O whys that... raven... i cant let you do that raven... O_O

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