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I can't believe nobody here has posted this yet. I saw it on MSN earlier today.

Before I start though, I want to point something out: I do not want this turning into an "OMG the world's gonna end in 2012!" thread. Please, everyone, refrain from posting inflammatory comments and trashing others' beliefs. Better yet, don't post your beliefs, because threads like this also tend to lead into large religious debates that end up getting locked with people feeling disrespected and belittled. Let's all be mature here, please.

I wouldn't have posted this at all, however the science behind it and reports from a few years ago make this quite interesting, and I will admit it's also a little scary.

According to a report published not too long ago, a solar storm of large scale could completely wipe out (for an indefinite amount of time) the following industries: airlines, power suppliers, GPS satellites and the space program. In other words, depending on the area the CME (Coronal Mass Ejection) affected, there could be a huge black out. All communications would cease to exist, all forms of power would be gone (unless you stock up on gas and have a generator), and things could get ugly as people start to panic and raid others' houses for food and other supplies.

The really interesting thing? The fact that this solar storm may happen in late 2011 and last into 2012. While it would not be the end of the world completely, it could be the end of society as we know it. Mankind is far too dependent on technology. If we lost power (and this solar storm could very easily knock it out), we'd essentially lose everything. In other words, and in my opinion, computers are not the things we should rely on. Using them and other technologies has made us become ignorant in some very basic survival skills that if our ancestors hadn't had, we'd have never been here anyway. Technology, in its current form, has probably killed us in some ways. We need to relearn some survival skills. Everybody start watching "Man Vs. Wild" on the Discovery Channel.

Let me admit something: I do not believe in the 2012 Doomsday Theory. Yes, the end date lands on the 13th Baktun (the Mayans' measurement of time), but do people forget that when the Spanish invaded and took over, they destroyed all kinds of the Mayans' artifacts? Their scrolls? Their religious icons? Could it not be that there was yet another calendar made after this one, but it was destroyed when the Spanish came? Who's to say that it just hasn't been found yet, and that the other calendar also ends abruptly on some date?

Also, the Mayans could have simply been predicting this solar storm, or other astrological things as well, not necessarily the end of the world. Maybe they understood something we didn't about predicting storms and were able to pinpoint it almost exactly, to warn future generations. There's so many possibilities. As far as I know, the only reason people jumped to the end of the world theory is because the Mayans believed in four previous cycles of life that all came to an abrupt end. But where's the evidence of such things like that? Where's the evidence of four previous earths or cycles of life? Like any religion, they just believed certain things, probably without knowing why. It's just part of the process.

Unfortunately, I think 2012 has become a "self-fulfilling prophecy".
By that, I mean that the radicals who do believe in it will become (to put it bluntly) morons, and start riots, angry mobs, and perhaps kill people in the streets simply because they have a loaf of bread, and the person holding the gun was hungry and desperate. And if the solar storms do happen, and we lose power for an indefinite amount of time in 2012...well, people are going to start questioning things, become fearful, and it's going to be a giant mess. Thus, society will essentially come to an end as we know it. That's my take on it, anyway. I do tend to worry a bit.

I'm posting this also because it's an interesting piece of news, and not just because of the fact that it lands on 2012. It shows how vulnerable we really are, and I think we should all become aware of how we take so much for granted. Perhaps we shouldn't do that anymore. Perhaps we should prepare ourselves to live life in a completely different and foreign way than we're used to. We need to stop taking things for granted. If we do this, then things maybe wouldn't be so bad.

So what do you guys think about this? What are your thoughts on what would happen if power was knocked out? Would people survive? Would people kill people just for a loaf of bread? What do you think you'll do if they're right and the solar storms cause society as we know it to possibly crumble completely? For civilization to be set back several generations?

I just thought this would be an interesting discussion and I apologize in advance for any arguments this may cause. I just thought that with the science behind this, it was worth posting. Otherwise, I wouldn't have posted it.

I believe this breaks that rule. But i'm not sure just wondering.
Anyway I do not believe in 2012, though I do fear it if it should happen.

Anyway we've had plenty of these threads about 2012 haven't we?

could 2012 be added to that list some time in the future ??
Actually this is an interesting topic that I'm going to watch , Hope it does not get locked but I dont see anything that says you cant debate about doomsday or 2012. Speaking of whitch There are so many things that people believe are going to happen or that will happen so it makes it all the more a very interesting topic.

End of Mankind because of no technology I highly doubt that. Sure all the Modern societies would suffer and could possibly destroy themselves but there are a lot of people in this world living based on older standards (farms or tribal villages etc.) and would be completely unaffected, they might not even notice anything happen.

Edit: btw I don't see why this thread has to be locked just don't talk about 2012 and discuss more maybe the impact no technology would have on your life or the science of solar storms. It could be a very informative discussion.

Pretty much the same society that fans of The Walking Dead would recognize. Except that society has zombies, of course... But who knows?

Why are all the new members from 2010 trying to get the older members into trouble by looking up AUP rules and applying them to topics that do not break any? 2012 is not religious, its a theory as to what people think the Mayan language means, For all we know it might mean it will rain on 2012 with a few sunny patches throughout the day XD

theory ....one that has fascinated many.
Some say the magnetic poles will shift causing a sudden climate change. maybe the earth gets hit with an asteroid as predicted by that one kid. A large volcanic erruption that spews 100's of millions of dust particles in the atmostphere lowering the temperature just a few degrees could throw us into an ice age.
A nuclear war or a dramatic change in the electromagnetic field could make electricity useless. We are already to the point to where almost everything is dependent upon electricity as everything from basic water pumps in towers to well , just about everything. This leaves one to conclude just how vulnerable things really are and it only takes 1 of these things to do it.Anyway , thought I would give you some more to chew on.

And the vaugeness of everything is unbelivable. Its like the nostradamus argument all over again. Our time here is limited, no matter how you look at it. But vauge threats of anihilation are nothing but scare-mungering in the general populace.

The Earth's magnetic field sheilds it from solar radiation. As a matter of fact, we're bombarded with it each and every day. Most of what little radiation does manage to get through our atmosphere is absorbed by our oceans anyway. Satellites are more exposed to this radiation, so it is possible that a large burst of solar radiation might disable GPS, cable, and any other satellite-related luxury, but; nothing worthy of an apocolypse.

However, the Earth's magnetic poles do shift every 10,000 years or so; during which time there is a brief moment where we are completely exposed. But, this is something we're not likely to experience in our lifetime.

Kravenwolf

Power grids are vulnerable as well. If they're hit, we'd lose power and if we lose communications and other things as well, it'd take a while to get everything back up and running.

I don't think it will be as bad as people make it out to be. Life might be a little difficult if we lose power for a few months or years, but we'd get through it. If we built it up once (from scratch!), we should be able to rebuild it. But it definitely shows we're way too dependent on electricity and computer-controlled systems. That's really the main point I was making. And if this all happens in 2012, people are going to panic and it'll probably cause a little mayhem.

It isn't?... Then I would have to go back to reading books... Obviously only if nutters hadn't burnt them for some techno-religious reasons. I've seen them films I have (obviously not read about it or anything)... I have the need for a lighter and an eyepatch...

Cheers

I think if technology suddenly failed, we'd have to adapt - modern society would suffer and there'd be a lot of turmoil, but it's far from the end of humanity. Plenty of people exist in societies that don't rely much on electronics and we'd have to take a leaf out of their book and a great deal of us would have to resort to physical labour - i.e. farm work. We'd have to ration our food too. I've got a garden big enough to grow a lot of vegetables and I suppose we could fit a chicken coop in there. It'd be a start for food production. A lot of people did it during the second world war, because the state couldn't provide for everything.

However, I think society would probably turn into mass panic, because they assume that it's the end of everything - that would likely mean a rise in crimes and death. But it's not as if we're screwed without technology.


But every time somebody suggests an apocalypse, whether it has a religious or scientific explanation, I tend to ignore it, because we've had predictions time and time again and they've been wrong. My attitude to such a thing is, 'if it happens, it happens'. There's a lot in the universe that's a danger to this planet, so it's no use being frightened of what may happen, allow the proper authorities to prepare us for such scenarios, but we don't actually have much power over what the universe could throw at us.

I completely agree with you, Sepp. I don't believe that losing power would kill us (well, directly I mean), but I think that the nutsos out there that would panic and react violently to such a fiasco could be what gets us.

And yeah, I tend to ignore apocalypse predictions as well, but I thought this one was interesting enough to post and discuss what would or could happen should such an event take place in our lifetimes.

True, true.
To add:
I think most of the damage that would be done would be from panic. A lot of people would think it's the end of the world, therefore they'd go into some kind of frenzy of panic, as though Russians are about nuke us. Others would take advantage, after all, the police rely on technology these days too and so does security, brilliant time for looting and even other crime. At lot of reasons people these days get caught is because of technology. Sensible people would work towards rebuilding their lives and the government would also work towards some kind of way of sustaining their country, though a government can't do much without technology either. A lot of numbers would be thinned as a result, law and order would have to be restored for it to a safe environment. It may well turn out like Mad Max but without the motorbikes, or less dystopic future, which would reflect a time before electricity.

Also, with the lack of music, television, video games and movies, more people ought to read and well, it'd give people like me a great opportunity - there was a time when a storyteller held a very high status in society, so I wouldn't be out of a job.

Not to worry , The government would assure the people that everything was ok and to quietly go to thier homes and stay there while they connect the new power lines.

I've always found the trillions of ways we could get wiped out interesting, but this isn't one...

Sure the world would slow down, but I imagine it'd rebuild and restructure pretty quickly, but hopefully slowly enough that this global warming malarky will get slowed down a huge lot...

Cars could be scrapped with everything else that would break, and used for other things. Major governments keep the important stuff in EMP shielded bunkers miles underground in case of nukes, so we'll keep our society...

The only thing we may lose is all the knowledge we have gathered thus far in human civilisation. Yes. I'm sorry, Wikipedia will go down.

I think society would turn into something similar to Max Brooks' World War Z, where the CEO is useless and the plumber is an essential high ranking citizen...

I read about this, and last I heard, they reckon at worst it'll only affect certain areas for a short periods, which means while some places wouldn't have electricity, a lot of other places would, as well as they reckon that even in the worst situation these periods are only going to be a few weeks at most, which, while it'll cause havoc, it won't end the world. Either way, I'm sure at least DARPA or some other military institution has already developed hardware that'll be immune to this, they've already invented electronics that are EMP proof, so I'm sure they've got something up their sleeves, even if it takes a while to implement.

Yeah, I read something similar, PlanetaryFunk, that it will only affect certain areas for only a few weeks. I just wish I could remember where, exactly....

Anyhoo, I don't think the "blackout" would last for more than a few weeks anyway. Guaranteed the big wigs in control of everything have been planning out a way to get everything back up and running should something like this ever happen, and I'm sure if this does knock out power we'd have it back soon. Like Seppuku said, it's going to be the people panicking and looting everywhere that are going to cause the most damage. Those who think we've only got till December 21st will do stupid things for a last thrill, and it'll be chaos in some parts of the world.

I'm going to keep following this and seeing what the scientists and other such officials say. And if this solar storm does cause all of the damage they say it could, well...it might not be a bad idea to start learning how to do things without electricity.

I also read somewhere that things will still work; it'll just be the powerlines and such that'll need replacing. Cars should still run as long as they have gas (so cars are probably going to be stolen), and things with batteries should still run as well. Am I right, or did I hear something untrue from the internet (which wouldn't be surprising)?

My understanding of why a solar flare would affect earth like that is because of a massive amount of magnetism. If something's off when it hits the electronics should be fine once it passes. But I'm no astrophysicist so I don't really know.

Also, look here:
http://www.universetoday.com/14645/2012-no-killer-solar-flare/

It's an interesting read, and hopefully debunks this whole thing.

maybe its time we hopped ship and found somewhere new =p