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Geek Culture / No Harddrive, No Opticle drive... The new MacBook

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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 21st Oct 2010 20:28 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 18:05
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iVqYBOC_II

News:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_technews/20101020/tc_yblog_technews/apple-unveils-new-macbook-air-previews-revamped-mac-os-x

Mac have tried making an even thinner laptop.

Its being sold at £1.2k, apparently.

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.
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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 21st Oct 2010 20:53
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The new version of Mac OS X sounds good, but the new MacBook Air? Sounds kinda lame. I still need an optical drive!

SSD for a hard drive though is actually an improvement. Less battery consumption and all of that.

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Satchmo
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 01:13
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Apple wouldn't know design if it bit them in the leg. I seriously think this company is one giant troll.

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Astro Chickster
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 01:27
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Macs seem to be losing even more necessarry features and getting more overpriced than usual.
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Vent
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 01:38
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Do they really need to be that thin? My friend's cat broke his screen when it jumped on it while it was closed.

Call me old fashioned but I prefer that my computer's screen can't be damaged by a small animal.

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Lemonade
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 02:12
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The 11 inch version is basically a slim netbook...it even has netbook specs:

2GB ram
1.4GHz dual-core processor
64 GB SSD (not typical for a netbook)

All these similarities to a netbook just make me lol, since Steve Jobs smugly said "Netbooks aren't good for anything".

The only major difference is the outrageous price.

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Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 02:12 Edited at: 22nd Oct 2010 02:20
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Assuming we're talking about a netbook an optical drive isn't really a necessity. But we aren't, apparently.

It doesn't have an optical drive, it runs MacOS, some might say it's not better at anything. Video pretty much describes my thoughts on this new machine apart from the "being cheaper" part.
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gbark
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 04:24
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Like everything else Apple does: The technology itself is cool and the presentation is good - But it it really necessary?

I mean, I firmly believe that SSD is the way of the future... I just don't see how it will be much more useful than a comperable HDD, considering that the "entry model" computer starts at $1,299 for a mere 64 gigs of memory. While I think SSD is fascinating, I really think it's overkill for this sort of machine.
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Neuro Fuzzy
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 05:31
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I just watched that video in benjamin's post...

What is PC software?! is he talking about windows? in that case... netbooks have windows because he's not making them (explicitly ) and no one is selling computers that run anyone else because windows is the norm (errm, thats mostly true).

I can't imagine this new macbook as much else than a novelty item

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PW Productions
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 07:03
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Quote: "Macs seem to be losing even more necessarry features and getting more overpriced than usual. "


+1!


Redoing my entire website... again. EDIT: Finished it! Whew.
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Melancholic
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 10:13
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That thing is brilliant, i didn't think it was possible to create such a flimsy looking laptop! But seriously that thing cant be very powerful or else there would be heat problems. Their only two options really would be a atom or a ulv, both underpowered and not what you want for £1200, plus a 64 gig ssd does not cost more then £100.

But wait it gets better, no optical drive means Apple are trying to limit you to their new app store, for computers... Where they will take 30% of profit. Come on now Apple, seriously? they don't even look that good


I can count to banana...
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TheComet
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 10:28
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Quote: "Quote: "Macs seem to be losing even more necessarry features and getting more overpriced than usual. "

+1!"


+2!

Steve jobs has done it again, he's made something innovative and new, and is selling it for 5 times the price you'd usually pay for something like that. I do like the idea of having the thinnest laptop on earth, but the price just puts me off...

Apple has always been overpriced, but face it : You're paying for the innovation.

TheComet

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Metal Devil123
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 10:45
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Sure the laptop is thin, but I can fit a regular laptop in my backpack or wherever I am going to put it... I don't see any use for having that thin laptop. And no optical drive will be even bigger no buy for me...

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Van B
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 11:12
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Netbooks have no optical drive, and I've had no end of hassle because of that - installing and re-installing XP on a netbook is a pain in the butt.

What seems to be escaping most people is that a Macbook is NOT a Netbook, the experiences will be completely different, despite similar specs. People seem to be picking the worst bits of spec and using that as their example. What about screen resolution and size compared with a Netbook? - or is that an inconvenient comparison.

Quote: "Apple wouldn't know design if it bit them in the leg. I seriously think this company is one giant troll."


I seriously think your deluded, stoned, or just plain trolling yourself with that comment.

Health, Ammo, and bacon and eggs!
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Fallout
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 14:27
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What's with all this super small, super tiny technology? What we need is massive heavy thinkpads to lug around to help combat obesity.

Insert piccy sig here. Eh? Why didn't that work?!?! Must ring help-a-noob. What was the number again? .... where am I?
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Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 15:10
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Quote: "What seems to be escaping most people is that a Macbook is NOT a Netbook, the experiences will be completely different, despite similar specs."


Seems pretty much like one to me. What can it do that a laptop or regular netbook can't for half the price?
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bitJericho
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 15:13
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It can run Linu- er, mac osx.

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TheComet
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 16:03
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lol @ Jerico2day

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Van B
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 16:18
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Have you used a Netbook?, have you used a Macbook?

I'm guessing the answer to one of those questions is no, because otherwise there is no way you'd be comparing them.

I'm talking about the entry level Aspire Ones etc, the new breed of Netbooks, and tablets etc are better, but I haven't used anything too new - I have used a £500 netbook, and it's pretty good, but still nothing like a Macbook. It's not fanboyism, because I'm not justifying the price at all - I'm talking about function and reliability. When I stop having to reinstall Netbooks every 9 months, or go looking for replacement batteries, or replacement rubber feet, or replacement power supplies... then I might change my mind a little. The difference is beyond what you can see, and what Apple can squeeze onto their sales blurb - when you use that Macbook, you know that you'll be using a full computer, your not gonna feel like your using a fraction of a PC. I like Netbooks, but I would never replace a laptop with one, I'd never use it to develop on - Netbooks are designed for youngsters and students, who are more interested in Facebook and YouTube than hard drive space. And they fit that niche perfectly, they make absolutely awesome xmas presents.

A professional won't get laughed out of the conference room if he shows up with a Macbook. It'll be a far more capable machine, the £1.1k model is a dual core processor, the screen resolution won't be stuck at 1024x600, it's keyboard won't look like someone didn't know when to quit.

Health, Ammo, and bacon and eggs!
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Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 16:42 Edited at: 22nd Oct 2010 16:43
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@Van B: You're not getting it. You can get powerful, reliable, fairly slim laptops with an optical drive for a fair price, so what does this new machine bring to the table that wasn't already there?

It's not exactly a portable workstation, nor is it a lightweight (cheap) web machine.
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Van B
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 16:53
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Probably nothing, but considering we are comparing it to a Netbook, I'd say I'm getting it perfectly fine!

If I was buying a new laptop, I wouldn't buy a cheap Netbook or a Macbook, I'd probably go for a standard laptop - or maybe that new Dell tablet thing, that looks pretty good - my current, main laptop weighs a ton, it has a 21'' screen and a full keyboard - I couldn't jump straight down to one of those tiny little keyboards. My quarrel, if you can call it that - is with the comparison to a Netbook, which I think is way off based on my experience. Netbooks are cheap for a reason, Macbooks are expensive for a reason - it's much more difficult to justify the Macs price, but damn easy to justify buying a Macbook over a Netbook - if money is no object(or if someone else is paying).

Health, Ammo, and bacon and eggs!
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Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 16:57
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I guess you could say this new machine is a superior netbook then, but my point is if you wanted something powerful why not opt for the laptop option which does have an optical drive?
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Libervurto
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 17:08
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I didn't think my first reaction to a laptop would be "I could probably bite through that". I don't understand this obsession with slimness, isn't the idea to make it as ergonomic as possible, not as small as possible? I already get annoyed by these slim phones that you have to hold like a claw when using them.

When did apple become a company who just make toys for rich kids? I cannot imagine anyone using this for any real purpose.


Do oranges know what colour they are?
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Phaelax
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 19:10
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Quote: "
Macs seem to be losing even more necessarry features and getting more overpriced than usual."

Did you read the article?
Quote: " the original 13.3-inch design, plus a smaller 11.6-inch version — boasting considerably cheaper price tags."


Profits went up 70% it said in the video, so I'd say Apple is doing something right.

Many ppl don't use an optical drive, if that were the case then netbooks wouldn't have become so popular. Apple still sells a normal laptop so its not like this Air is all they offer. From a business point of view, think of travelling salesmen or marketing ppl who have to carry a laptop around all day. If I were them, I'd want something light. And if your laptop is setup by a company, chances are you wouldn't have privileges to do anything that wasn't already setup on the laptop so why need a cd-rom?


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" ~ Arthur C. Clarke
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the_winch
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 19:23 Edited at: 22nd Oct 2010 19:26
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Quote: "I guess you could say this new machine is a superior netbook then, but my point is if you wanted something powerful why not opt for the laptop option which does have an optical drive?"


A laptop is bigger, heavier and not much cheaper. If you need portability above all else then you will happily put up with a slower machine.

By way of demonstration, he emitted a batlike squeak that was indeed bothersome.
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Quik
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 19:55
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why would a computer be this small, if you want small stuff, just buy the androids/iphones aso thats coming out nowadays, theyre like small computers.


[Q]uik, Quiker than most
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sprite
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2010 20:24 Edited at: 22nd Oct 2010 20:26
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Personally I've never used the new Macbook air. I however see a good market for them as they will be used by traveling business people.

The lack of a CD drive is not really a problem because you can use another PC or Mac CD drive via wireless. Also the reinstall OS software is on an SDD card I'm not sure on how good that would be to use. I have a feeling I’ll find out soon enough.

The main deal breakers for me are two USB. I use a mouse, tablet and camera. Not the end of the world but its the little things that count. There is no network connection other than wireless unless you use a USB apple drive. Sorry but that's a must for me.

That's why the Macbook air is for people who are traveling around and they would normally only use a wireless based signal. I think of anyone who would want to install CDs at a few thousand feet would get it done before they left.

Now people will argue that a laptop would be cheaper or better at the same price and the answer is yes. However for lightweight and thinness your average company person not going to care about price tags. Their computers are brought for them. The corporate person’s view mostly is it looks good and it turns on that’s all I need to know.

I have a Macbook Pro and a PC for my projects for work. I needed both, as the projects have to work on both. So I got given new Macbook pro and to be honest they are so close now in terms of user interface. I’m starting to think Steve Jobs and Bill Gates are in fact merging companies they just forgot to tell everyone.

I would buy both again in the future as Macs are selling more. So the need for software to work on both increases so having Windows only will only harm the availability of my markets. With the software market being smaller than PC it’s a good idea to jump in now and build up that reputation.

I'll add something later on.
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Lemonade
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 00:05 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 00:15
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Quote: "Now people will argue that a laptop would be cheaper or better at the same price and the answer is yes. However for lightweight and thinness your average company person not going to care about price tags. Their computers are brought for them. The corporate person’s view mostly is it looks good and it turns on that’s all I need to know. "


Sure, this might be a good machine for someone who doesn't care about performance and money...What's left? Oh yeah, looks.

However, for people like me who don't have a $1000 to burn on looks, a machine like the M11x is a much better option. I also happen to think it looks very nice. Specs:

Windows 7
4 GB Dual Channel DDR3
250GB SATAII 7,200 RPM
Intel® Core™2 Duo SU7300 1.3GHz
1GB NVIDIA® GeForce® GT 335M
11.6-inch WideHD 1366x768 (720p) WLED
Internal High-Definition Surround Sound Audio (5.1)

So, same screen size and resolution, 2GB more of DDR3 RAM, roughly the same processor, a better graphics card (with 768MB more RAM), and built in surround sound. Oh yeah, and that only costs $899.

Yeah...

Quote: "A laptop is bigger, heavier and not much cheaper. If you need portability above all else then you will happily put up with a slower machine."


Um...the m11x is not very big, and look at the specs (and the price).

Edit:

Oh yeah, and the M11x has a bunch of ports too. It includes three USB 2.0 ports, FireWire, a 3-in-1 media card slot, Ethernet, all of the standard audio jacks, and THREE video out options including VGA, HDMI, and DisplayPort. While the MacBook Air only has...2 USB ports.

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Astro Chickster
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 00:32 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 00:34
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So the macbook air can be used for, uh, watching DVDs? No wait.. Listening to CDs? Oops...

Basically, the only advantage it has is looks - and yet it looks cheap, plasticky and VERY flimsy. If I dropped it, it'd probably snap in half.

If all you want to do is browse the net like Van suggests, you'd buy a low-spec laptop for a fith of the price. And "youngsters and students" would probably want to watch DVDs, wouldn't they?
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 00:34
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@Lemonade
AlienWare also is such a cool name!



Also i think the Alienware series would still have better looks than macbooks, so its really just weight apple are hitting at.

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.
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Astro Chickster
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 00:38
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Alienware are usually too expensive for what you get, they basically shove pretty lights to a plastic case and double the price.
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 00:49
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Quote: "Alienware are usually too expensive for what you get, they basically shove pretty lights to a plastic case and double the price."

Generally that is what a monitor is.

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 00:56
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Quote: "If you need portability above all else then you will happily put up with a slower machine."


Or deal with a heftier price tag.

All this product is doing is offering more choice to people. If it gets Apple a profit, then they're obviously doing something right. If it doesn't get them a profit, then they'll discontinue it. The lack of optical drive obviously hasn't stopped people from buying the previous model, otherwise why would apple have produced a new one still lack in an optical drive?

There's still many uses for a MacBook Air I'd never buy one, but then I don't have a use for one, but I can already see scope for the MacBook Air amongst Mac users. You might prefer a netbook, that's fine, if I needed something light, so would I (even then, I carried a 16" laptop to Uni every day as I didn't mind the heavy weight). But don't expect to be a part of every market a computer company tried to appeal to, they try and appeal to different types of people after all. I'm not a part of the MacBook Air market, and I'm not one of these whiny little Mac-haters who bitches about everything Apple does, so by Apple having the audacity to charge over £1000 for a laptop with NO optical drive doesn't enrage me. Christ, I don't have to buy the damn thing, why should I be bothered? If it makes their customers happy, then surely that's a good thing? Apparently not.

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sprite
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 01:29 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 01:52
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As I said these traveling business people will not care. The M11x is a better machine in places? Yes is it. Sadly if you give it the same spec as a Mac air with the solid state drive it comes in at more than a Mac air with a slower CPU. A fair build putting both on a head to head.

Builds on both Please note all processors were upgraded to max the ram was left at the same speed so not to make the m11x too expensive for 8gb version add £330 to end price

_________ m11x________________________ Mac air
Processor 1.3ghz 800mhz 3mb___________2.13Ghz 1066Mhz 6mb
Ram 4gb DDR3 800mhz (8gb max)_______4gb 1066MHz DDR3
HDD 256GB solid state drive on both
Graphics 1gb GDDR3 GT 335M___________256mb DDR3 320M
OS Window 7 64bit Ultimate OS X 10

Everything else at stock no other add ons.
M11x costs £1559.01 __________________Mac air 1509.02

Now the vs machine bit.
Processor: mac wins
Ram mac wins in speed m11x in upgrades. So hard call
HDD both same no judgment.
Graphics m11x wins
OS both work making use of all ram unlike 32bit. No winner
Cost mac wins

Aimed markets

The m11x is aimed at gamers and not really a business based machine. Its light weight will make it popular for students and the like. Its ability to have lower end parts means that it can be made to be affordable to meet lower end budgets. However it would look out of place in a board room meeting because of that logo.

The Mac air well its a business machine aimed at the traveling business people meetings and spreadsheets are its game. Designed for company meeting, hotels and coffee shops where LAN lines are not used or its too much work to configure the mac to the LAN lines. Its price tag however will put off average earners due to the lower end PC market however when placed at the same level as higher end machines it starts to look like a better choice.

Note added __ as the forum messed with my formatting otherwise

I'll add something later on.
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 02:03
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Quote: "The m11x is aimed at gamers and not really a business based machine. "

You dont need to be a gamer to require decent machines, basically anything that requires alot of processing requires a good computer.
Gamers are just a small part of who needs it.

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.
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sprite
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 02:32
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Come on the m11x screams gamer. There are around two things that card on a none gaming setting that laptops 1gb is not totally over kill. Somehow I think power-point would not stress the card too much.

I'll add something later on.
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Uncle Sam
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 02:54 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 03:01
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I don't know where you're getting that price, sprite.
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sprite
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 03:21 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 03:42
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Dell

Dell Alienware m11x

Choose duel core with one year warranty =£749
Choose Processor upgrade to 1.3 GHZ +£ 85
Choose Window 7 64bit Ultimate +£120
Choose 4gb Ram +£100
Choose HDD 256GB solid state drive +£505
Total £1559.01

However dell's own calculator is broken adds a pence. It is even added to basket so I'm including it in the price.

Apple 13 inch =£1349
Choose Processor upgrade 2.13 GHZ +£80.01
Choose 4gb ram upgrade +£80.01
Total £1509.02


M11x £1559.01
Apple £1509.02
Total £ 49.99 saved by choosing a mac air

I'll add something later on.
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 03:42 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 03:47
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Quote: "Choose HDD 256GB solid state drive +£505"

Why are you giving the alien ware a solid state drive?
The main reason apple is using it, isnt because of speed or power consumption, but because of its size and weight.

£1,349.01:
Intel® Core™ 2 Duo SU7300(1.3GHz,800MHz,3MB)
8192MB 800MHz Dual Channel DDR3 SDRAM [2x4096]
500GB (7,200rpm) Serial ATA Hard Drive

...
Can seem to up the graphics card on this one.

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.
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sprite
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 03:48 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 04:08
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To give a fair comparison if you don't choose the same type of parts its not a fair comparison.

You can lower the spec all you want but its just moving the goal posts in your favor the true is out that the M11x is more expensive in a fair on the same level test.

I'll add something later on.
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Eminent
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 03:50
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*facepalm* Wheres the 1 gb Nvidia on mac?


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sprite
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 03:53 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 04:19
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Was pointed out in the test. Please try really hard to read it next time Eminent. I really can't think of why I said the M11x won the graphics round.

Also pointed out what would an every day person on a business trip do with 1gb of graphics that is not a game. The only things that would need that much is rending a movie (you would just send it to a render farm) and making a game in those cases I don't think they would use a the mac air or the m11x. Power point and spread sheet don't need that kind of power.

I'll add something later on.
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 04:26 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 04:40
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Quote: "*facepalm* Wheres the 1 gb Nvidia on mac?"


Not on the Air. Though you've got a 256mb nVidia graphics card, I think asking for 1gb is a bit much on such a lightweight machine. You don't want to be using it for gaming, it's not meant to be a gaming laptop.

So you might want to try a different Mac.

Apple boast the likes of their iMac are good enough for gaming, they stick ATIs into them, their MacPros would be great for gaming, though they're not marketed towards gamers, they pack a lot of power and if you like upgrading, then you can upgrade one all the way to 2.93ghz 12 core(2x6), 32gb ram, 4x2tb HDDs and 2x1gb ATI HD 5770 cards. It'd be expensive to have one that powerful, but it's the likes of Boxxtech PCs that you'd be competing with and they're just as expensive, or at least, the last time I got a look at their price list (you have to request them now)

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Lemonade
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 05:37 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 05:40
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Also sprite, the mac doesn't come with a 256GB SSD. It's only 128GB.

So, an 11 inch MacBook Air with these specs:

1.6GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB DDR3 1066Mhz
128 GB SSD
Nvidia 320 GFX 256 MB

...will cost $1399.00

On the other hand, a m11x with these specs:

Intel Core i7
4GB Dual Channel DDR3 at 800MHz
128GB SSD (I cut the price of the 256GB version in half...since they have no 128GB SSD option)
1GB NVIDIA® GeForce® GT 335M
5.1 Surround sound card

...will cost $1424.00

$25 more for a beast of a computer...

Of course, since they have no 128GB SSD option, I would just go for the SATAII drive and save $440. What, can't your MacBook Air fit in a SATA hard drive?

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kitty101
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 06:50
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Quote: "@Lemonade
AlienWare also is such a cool name!



Also i think the Alienware series would still have better looks than macbooks, so its really just weight apple are hitting at."





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kitty101
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 06:51
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Quote: "Also sprite, the mac doesn\'t come with a 256GB SSD. It\'s only 128GB.

So, an 11 inch MacBook Air with these specs:

1.6GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB DDR3 1066Mhz
128 GB SSD
Nvidia 320 GFX 256 MB

...will cost $1399.00

On the other hand, a m11x with these specs:

Intel Core i7
4GB Dual Channel DDR3 at 800MHz
128GB SSD (I cut the price of the 256GB version in half...since they have no 128GB SSD option)
1GB NVIDIA® GeForce® GT 335M
5.1 Surround sound card

...will cost $1424.00

$25 more for a beast of a computer...

Of course, since they have no 128GB SSD option, I would just go for the SATAII drive and save $440. What, can\'t your MacBook Air fit in a SATA hard drive?"


Or build yourself a computer and save 450$




Guys stop using alienwares as good examples, its overpriced junk.

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Lemonade
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 09:07
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Quote: "Guys stop using alienwares as good examples, its overpriced junk."


Maybe true, but still cheaper than Apple.

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kitty101
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 10:57
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They're both overpriced, your better off comparing individual components to the components built into macs, then calculate the amount you waste.

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the_winch
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 12:32
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Quote: "Um...the m11x is not very big, and look at the specs (and the price)."


It weighs 2kg. That's twice the weight of an air and many netbooks. Plus it's still really expensive compared to a typical netbook.

The m11x is just a gamer laptop with a small screen. Nobody interested in ultra-portables is going to lug a 2kg machine about, it's far too heavy.

By way of demonstration, he emitted a batlike squeak that was indeed bothersome.
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sprite
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2010 15:11 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2010 15:56
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Lemonade the 13 inch version at £1349 is clearly listed as having 256GB drive. Also my prices have shown the M11x to be more expensive if you use the same level of tech. See my test on page one try please try running it. The air is bigger on screen size as a bigger screen is more helpful not that m11x gives a larger option.

kitty101 yes building a laptop from scratch it is possible but no one does due to not a lot of places sell all the parts. It would be fun to give it a go though. Both being over priced I couldn't agree more with that.

However this all in all the M11x is a gaming laptop. Its not really a business looking or used machine. The M11x would be a waste of a good laptop in a business setup. A nice spread sheet or power point is not its market it is aimed for.

Same way you wouldn't buy the air for gaming it would be just silly. Its place is being taken from meeting to meeting when shape looks are just as important as that 15min presentation. You in a suit that could buy most people a car or two. You need a laptop that says "I'm the business that mac is you choice".

I'll add something later on.
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