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Geek Culture / Google removing H.264 from Chrome

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Phaelax
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 08:37
I've actually been hearing about this for a week or so now. In favor of supporting WebM, they're going to remove H.264. Why? I mean, if they already have existing support in the browser for H264, why remove it? Until the web switches over, many sites may not work in Chrome and Google could lose a large portion of the browser market.

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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 10:40
This is Google were talking about.
They love to constantly change things to really annoy us!

bitJericho
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 11:04 Edited at: 21st Jan 2011 11:04
I say good riddance. I don't use chrome anyway, though, google's getting a little too creepy for me.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 14:41
What's H.264, in fear of sounding ignorant?

bitJericho
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 14:43
A proprietary video codec. It's how the video information is written in a file.

Open codecs for an open internet, is my opinion.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 14:44
Ahhh, and I'm guessing it's what video codec is used in YouTube, etc then?

bitJericho
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 15:22
Yes, it seems to me youtube is keeping support for h.264 for compatibility reasons.

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Indicium
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 16:33
Google owns youtube, correct? So if Chrome switches, surely youtube will also, meaning that youtube users will use chrome, so it'll work in Google's favour.

bitJericho
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 16:55
They've said they'll be keeping h.264.

From what I can tell, it's because of compatibility

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Phaelax
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 18:39
Might have something to do with Apple, since the iphone doesn't use Flash then each video on youtube has to be changed or something. I forget the exact details of how it all works.

I'm not against webm, I'm all for open codec, but I don't see a need to dump H264 support. If if Google keeps youtube on it but ditches the support from Chrome, isn't that kinda like "hmm, i'll shoot myself in this foot"

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"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ~Einstein
IanM
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Posted: 21st Jan 2011 21:31
You have to pay to license H.264, while WebM is absolutely free.

So Google removed it from Chrome, not wanting to pay the license costs - that's not the end of the world though, because Flash player supports it.

BTW, neither Firefox or Opera use H.264 either - both are also going with the WebM codec for HTML5. That leaves Microsoft and Apple (who are part of the group of companies licensing H.264) supporting the inclusion of H.264 still, but even those support WebM in certain situations

Basically, Google's move affects nothing as far as the end-user is concerned, but does put weight on the side of license-free when specifying standards, which is good for all of us.

JoelJ
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2011 01:28
Quote: "So Google removed it from Chrome, not wanting to pay the license costs - that's not the end of the world though, because Flash player supports it.
"

Nah, it's not because they want to avoid the licensing costs, it's really more of a political thing. It's really only to make a stand for open standards.

Quote: "Why? I mean, if they already have existing support in the browser for H264, why remove it?"

Because, they don't want to support anything non-standard out of the box. If you want H264, download Flash or a plugin. Think of IE not using the official standards and making up their own stuff and how it has caused so much trouble for web developers. Google doesn't want this to happen again. If they and other major browsers support a proprietary standard, then web developers are going to use it and fragment the web again. Now, if a developer wants to support it, they can choose to do so, but they do it knowing that their users are going to have to download a plugin of some kind to access it.

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Phaelax
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2011 02:57
I guess I misunderstood what they meant by removing it. I thought Flash videos which used it wouldn't work either.

"Only the educated are free" ~Epictetus
"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ~Einstein
IanM
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Posted: 24th Jan 2011 15:00 Edited at: 24th Jan 2011 15:01
Well, yes it's political in a way, because it blocks potential new alternative open source browsers coming along, but:
Quote: "As to the little matter of whether any of this is the right move for the web at large, we'll paraphrase what Google had to say for itself: H.264 licenses cost money"


(From here)

Here's the specifics on cost:
Quote: "Briefly, MPEG LA represents the patent holders of AVC/H.264 technologies. It is the sole licensing authority for the technology. Typical customers include consumer equipment manufacturers (Blu-ray Disc players and recorders), software developers (encoding programs, DVD players), and content developers. According to the “Summary of AVC/H.264 License Terms,” which you can download from the MPEG LA site (www.mpegla.com/ avc/avc-agreement.cfm), there are no royalties for free internet broadcast (there are, however, royalties for pay-per-view or subscription video) until Dec. 31, 2010. After that, “the royalty shall be no more than the economic equivalent of royalties payable during the same time for free television.”This makes royalties payable for “free television” the best predictor of where internet royalties will stand in 2011. Under the terms of the agreement, you have two options: a one-time payment of $2,500 “per AVC transmission encoder” or an annual fee starting at “$2,500 per calendar year per Broadcast Markets of at least 100,000 but no more than 499,999 television households, $5,000 per calendar year per Broadcast Market which includes at least 500,000 but no more than 999,999 television households, and $10,000 per calendar year per Broadcast Market which includes at 1,000,000 or more television households.”"


(From here)

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