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Geek Culture / Your Worst Debugging Nightmares

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 03:35 Edited at: 8th Feb 2011 06:36
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Well, the title says it. What was your worst debugging nightmare? I cant remember mine...

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Benjamin
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 03:40
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I remember spending about 6 hours non-stop debugging something. I did solve the problem in the end.



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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 03:41
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Ouch! Musta been painful

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 03:43 Edited at: 8th Feb 2011 03:44
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Hmm...my worst debugging nightmare?

I'm always afraid that when I get 85% into a project, something new I implement will cause something else somewhere else to break and I won't realize it until it's too intertwined with everything (this is why I've recently started making my code more and more modular).

I'm also afraid that the bug will be so simple it takes a genius to find it and fix it with one command.

The worst thing I did for debugging once upon a time was when I was messing around with file saving/loading with arrays and couldn't figure out what the problem was. Still don't know why it never worked and why I couldn't solve the bug.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 04:10 Edited at: 8th Feb 2011 04:10
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Yeh, Murphy's law states that when you near completion of a nice game, things begin to break, and you have lots of bugs. Lets say you have 10 bugs, fix one, you still have ten bugs

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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n008
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 04:13
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I spent fifteen hours rummaging through about 350,000 lines of assembler (intel) before discovering the bug was an arithmetic error.

"I have faith, that I shall win the race, even though I have no legs, and am tied to a tree." ~Mark75
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t10dimensional
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 04:17 Edited at: 8th Feb 2011 04:21
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Well, yesterday lol. Spent five hours looking for a bug in my game. I, after a while, narrowed it down to 1000 lines of code. Copied that on a notepad and started condensing it. Finally I realized that I had just used "skip" as a variable for three different things.

Other than that I've never had a bug last more than a hour of pain. Actually I kind of like bugs, there a little fun to look for, and usually teach you something. But ya, sometimes its something stupid and I just want to move on with my life

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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 05:22
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Never program when you are tired.
You can spend hours and hours trying to debug the most stupidest mistake...

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 05:24
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Quote: "350,000 lines"
^^^^^^
Must not have been fun...

@razerx Yeh, i tend to really mess up variables when im tired... I generally dont like bugs at all, actually im taking a break from trying to solve one as we speak

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 05:46 Edited at: 8th Feb 2011 05:47
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The worst and most amazing I've mentioned before. It was a long time ago programming in QuickBasic when I was trying to fix a bug for and entire day. I went to bed frustrated and dreamed about the code and eventually fixed the problem in my dream. When I woke up I wrote the code exactly the way it was in my dream and it worked perfectly.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 06:35
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Really! I wish debugging was that simple. Hahah what were you trying to do?

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 10:32 Edited at: 8th Feb 2011 17:36
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I was making a Trade Wars like BBS game that used 125,000 sectors in a realistic 3D space (Trade Wars had 5,000 sectors in a very 2Dish space). I had the data for each device, fighter, planet, hazard, player, port, ship, star, and wormhole in two separate files for each. I was trying to get the math just right to load the right objects in the right sectors from the files since I couldn't use a standard multi-dimensional array to store 125,000x9 bits of data (too much empty space and not enough memory). I think I had 2 megs of memory at the time.

Edit: I just realized a mistake. A the time I was making that game Trade Wars had 1000 sectors and Galactic Warzone had 5,000 sectors.

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thenerd
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 12:32 Edited at: 8th Feb 2011 12:33
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Quote: "Never program when you are tired.
You can spend hours and hours trying to debug the most stupidest mistake..."

This. I remember being so tired one time that I coded about 5000 lines of code, only to find out it wouldn't compile because I didn't put any endifs.

Quote: "The worst and most amazing I've mentioned before. It was a long time ago programming in QuickBasic when I was trying to fix a bug for and entire day. I went to bed frustrated and dreamed about the code and eventually fixed the problem in my dream. When I woke up I wrote the code exactly the way it was in my dream and it worked perfectly."
A good programmer spends more time thinking about his code than actually writing it... I code in my head when I'm in the shower.

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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 17:38
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Quote: "A good programmer spends more time thinking about his code than actually writing it... I code in my head when I'm in the shower."


I code in my head all the time too... but to code subconsciously is amazing to me.

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Diggsey
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 18:12
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While writing an early version of my DBPro debugger. The debugger would sometimes crash when you tried to start debugging a second time. It turned out to be a threading problem, where certain methods of the debugging API had to be called from particular threads at specific times, which weren't well documented on msdn.

The worst thing about it is that there is no way to solve it except for trying different things. The documentation is almost non-existant, the API is obscure, nobody knows anything about it and even the internet draws a blank for most questions I had.

[b]
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 00:06
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Interesting. yeh, i always think about my code before writing it, sometimes just not long enough One time when i had just learned to program, i thought about the workings of a tic tac toe game for a month, and when i made it, it was flawless nearly the first time. pretty cool when i had only known programming for about two months

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Phaelax
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 01:40
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Finding out scene7 didn't integrate smoothly into lightbox and the bug was tracked to the javascript which made up the lightbox library. I think we had Adobe fix the bug for us, but the headache was mostly related to explaining the issues to the boss.

"Only the educated are free" ~Epictetus
"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ~Einstein
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 02:29
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Strange! You mean the boss of Adobe?

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Phaelax
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 03:06
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No my boss, but we had adobe techs we could call on. For what we were paying for the image servers they better offer support. I was sorta in charge of communication with adobe techs and our company. Not a fun job when two bosses are yelling at you for adobes servers going offline. As if I had any control over it.

"Only the educated are free" ~Epictetus
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 06:50 Edited at: 9th Feb 2011 06:51
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That couldnt be fun. I hate being yelled at when im not to blame Fortunately that only happened to me when i was little...

Also i see by your name it says Silver Codemaster. Im curious as to what it means

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Kevin Picone
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 07:08
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As things get larger it can get tricky tracking down some oddity, in particular when the circumstances aren't clear, even worse when the bulk of app self generates. Back in the day, we'd routinely use native code & data generators for various effects. Had some drama's running our base frame work on 68040 machines, turned out to some missaligned bit sets (from memory).. ohh joy.


Hmm, I wonder what's coming in 2011?
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 07:31
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Interesting... I wasnt alive in the days of assembly but by what ive heard it was a nightmare to debug a large assembly program

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Kevin Picone
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 12:19
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Quote: "I wasnt alive in the days of assembly "


So you're a ghost then ?


Hmm, I wonder what's coming in 2011?
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n008
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 18:55
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Quote: "[quote]I wasnt alive in the days of assembly"


So you're a ghost then ?[/quote]

lolwat indeed.

"I have faith, that I shall win the race, even though I have no legs, and am tied to a tree." ~Mark75
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Fallout
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 19:37
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Threads = giant debuging headaches. Who was the fool who invented threads?!?!

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Neuro Fuzzy
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 20:56
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Quote: "Quote: "
Quote: "I wasnt alive in the days of assembly"

So you're a ghost then ?"

lolwat indeed."

quoted.

o.o wut?

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 23:37
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Indeed, you are currently talking to a ghost!! Nah, what i mean is i wasnt alive when that was the language lots of people programmed in. I dont want to fully give away my age but i was born in the 90's

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Diggsey
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Posted: 9th Feb 2011 23:56
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What makes you think lots of people don't use assembly... I use it a fair bit and I was also born in the 90s. Ever used winzip/winrar/7-zip? Decompression algorithms are very often written in assembly for speed. Sound/video codecs? Emulators? Virtual machines? Operating systems? Hardware drivers? They all use assembly as a significant part of their programming...

[b]
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 10th Feb 2011 00:26
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Well, i guess i always thought assembly was used only back in the day. The i found out lots of OS's use it quite a lot, but that's all i thought. But thanks for clearing that up So i was alive in the days of assembly then! It just seems most use C++, Java, and other high level languages these days

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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thenerd
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Posted: 10th Feb 2011 02:15
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I attempted to write an OS once. I didn't get far at all, but it was a cool learning experience.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 10th Feb 2011 02:50
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That's cool!

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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t10dimensional
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Posted: 10th Feb 2011 03:27 Edited at: 10th Feb 2011 03:28
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Dang, I relate to a lot of these things for the short time I've programmed.

Quote: "
I went to bed frustrated and dreamed about the code and eventually fixed the problem in my dream"


I've never done that but have dreamed about a small game concept and partly how to code it. When I woke up I was excited and started writing down all that I remembered. Lol it turned out that my code ideas would work but the game concept kind of sucked.

Quote: "A good programmer spends more time thinking about his code than actually writing it... I code in my head when I'm in the shower"


I spend almost all day(and definitely the shower lol) thinking of ether how to do, or improve, my games code. And more than once I have debugged something just going through the code in my head.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 10th Feb 2011 04:32
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For some reason im not one to go through code in my head unless it's simple, but what im good at in my head is the getting and creating the concept of the code. Then i just convert it to actual code with the computer. xD

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Fallout
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Posted: 10th Feb 2011 08:31
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Same as you Dark Basic Dude. I don't think about the code. To me that seems a bit odd, unless it's trying to work out a particularly challenging algorithm. I just think about the modular design, the cool game features and how things will link together.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 10th Feb 2011 09:53
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My worst was in 1996. I had been sent to Dubai for three weeks to work on a new system. It turns out our programming team (just 2 of us really) were actually part of a much bigger system that had about 10 teams, and a total of about 300 programmers.

Anyway, I ended up being there 3 months and we were pulling in about 90+ hour weeks. In one month I did 156 hours overtime. A normal day was starting about 7am and finishing about 12pm.

In the end the whole lot went live on the same day. It's all to do with travel systems so it was quite cool to see information appearing from across the globe as areas woke up. Anyway, the main company (Emirates airlines) decided, probably very stupidely, to have a big party that same night.

We went to that big hotel that looks like a boat, or sail, whatever. So there we were about 300 programmers all dressed in these red T-Shirts with the system logo and everything (Mars). And we drinking away merrily mingling with the other programmers and watching a speech by the head of the airline (some sultan or other) thanking us etc. No worries.

Then about 1am all the European teams went to the outside terraces and sat down by the sea to get blotto on various spirits. Suddenly all mobile phones went off. It was like siren city or something. Turned out pretty much every system was erroring and the whole thing went down. All the Indian teams (about 250 or so) zoomed off. All the Europeans stayed where we were. Too drunk to really care and probably would have caused damage anyway.

Next day we spend something like 12 hours debugging the system. Then we watched it (the client insisted) for another 24 hours. We brought in playing cards, games, booze, the lot, but the client stayed until about 4am, so we had to wait to get them out. Annoying.

I was so tired that I fell asleep in a meeting the next day and got sent home. Interesting colours and light headyness on the way back.

Great times though!

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 11th Feb 2011 00:44
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Wow thats a long story thing, so you were programming something for Emirates Airlines?

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Dazzag
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Posted: 11th Feb 2011 10:31 Edited at: 11th Feb 2011 10:33
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Quote: "so you were programming something for Emirates Airlines?"
Yes. Although to be be precise it was Emirates travel and Arabian Adventures which are owned by them and is the bit that does the actual holiday bookings. The whole project was called Mars (I still have the T-Shirt) and was based around some Swiss air system I believe. The travel companies used our system (Unix based effort) and we wrote the ground handling part of the system. So basically the airline system handled anything to do with aeroplanes, and they could link to our systems to book accommodation, car hire, transfers etc.

Best bit was going to their flashy building that looks like an aeroplane (engine bits are massive flight simulators for their pilots) and having a meeting in the "cockpit". Nice.

At the time the bloke who was there all the time from our company (I was only there 3 months) stayed for about 4 years. Because there is no tax out there then the way it works is after a year of working there then every year he could claim his tax back in a lump sum. Nice. Plus he was on about £50 ($80?) set expenses a day (I had unlimited as it happens), free rent in a plush apartment that was in one of two buildings (Tampax towers they were nicknamed) which was mainly used by all the airlines trolley dollies, a car chucked in for free, and petrol paid (not much anyway). He came back to the UK and bought a house outright. Nice.

Heheh, Tampax towers was *awesome*. One day we went out with the bosses of the company and they almost kicked us both out of the taxi because it was some award night for the air hostesses and they were all waiting by the side of the road for taxis dressed up like no tomorrow. There was about a 100 of them. Sigh...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
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Fallout
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Posted: 11th Feb 2011 11:33
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Dazzag, never disappoints with his massively long posts conjured from single one lined questions, and still has the same signature after 9 years.

The man. The myth.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 11th Feb 2011 23:07
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Indeed, if only posts were made of electricity... Then we would have virtually unlimited electricity from him!

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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TheComet
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Posted: 11th Feb 2011 23:57
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Mine was this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RYsSD3oy-o

I was able to track it down to 15 lines of code, and I couldn't spot the problem... So a friend suggested : "Why don't you just re-write that section?". After doing so, the error was solved... *face-desk*

TheComet

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 00:30
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Yes, whenever something doesnt work how you want it then just re write it, that tends to help. I dont know why but the first time i saw this video a while back i laughed so hard at the randomness of the 2nd player going bye bye into the sky when you jumped twice! Its like, "There he goes!" Lol glad you got it fixed
Quote: "*face-desk*"
Original.

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Dazzag
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 14:06
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Quote: "Dazzag, never disappoints with his massively long posts conjured from single one lined questions"
Ah, you only notice it now since Raven left. Look back and I always rabbited on like no tomorrow, but everyone couldn't help but notice the epic sizes of Raven's post instead When the both of us used to get into a discussion then just start reading a book instead...

Quote: "still has the same signature after 9 years"
Wrong! The 2nd part comes from the greatest program ever Darkplace. Or at least the best siminal horror of our or indeed any generation (Quantum leap being a possible candidate...). And that was made in 2004. Or 1984 depending on how you look at things. Plus the first part might have been around since I first started here, which was 2000 I believe (same month as Indi), if you forget about the new fangled Apollo forums... Oh, and the quote is still 100% true, so no point changing it...

This used to be all grass y'know...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
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Dazzag
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 14:09
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Quote: "Yes, whenever something doesnt work how you want it then just re write it, that tends to help"
Yep. Just rewriting my whole bluetooth routines to work better. Massive pain. But it's about my old OCD type thing really. If it just isn't *quite* so then rewrite the whole lot. Only downer is it takes a lot longer when you could have kicked it out ages ago (and had some complaints, but hell fix it later), and by the time you are done with that bit the project looks like rubbish and you have a better idea. And so it goes on in the circle of uncompleted development life... At least the iPhone has realistic money rewards keeping you going I suppose...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 14:35
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what happened to indi?

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bitJericho
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 14:52
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He flipped out and left.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 15:28
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Pretty much. Remember in the beginning when he used to do free logos for people?

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
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bitJericho
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 17:08
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Yeah. He was mostly right too. But that's a discussion for another thread!

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=113433&b=2

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 13th Feb 2011 01:19
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! people turn funny sometimes...

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Neuro Fuzzy
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Posted: 13th Feb 2011 23:22
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Actually, i just ran into a funny java thing. It's not a bug so much as a quirk.

Take this code for example. Since java passes all objects by reference (not duplicating them, they're all the same thing), this code works like you'd expect it: It prints out 11 *s



But... this code doesn't print out anything!



...should I say why or should I leave it hanging there?

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 14th Feb 2011 00:00
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Well i dont know java so say why

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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