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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Im Thinking About Designing a Gaming Console...

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Kamakazi
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Posted: 19th Mar 2011 21:45
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I like the design. And I took a browse at the XGameStation web site and must say...I'm very impressed. I actually had his first book, "Tricks of the Game Programming Guru" when it first came out. I have not heard anything more about his work since and now...a game development kit with no strings attached??? What hole did I crawl in to miss this?

Anyway, just a thought...wonder how big the games would be in their BIN format? If it could be possible to play the games using TGCs tools, it would be cost-effective to use a disc-based loading system over cartridge. But, cartridges will last longer and stand up to scratches better.

On a side note, I plan to get one of the XGS consoles and see what I can do with it. The Hydra looks pretty cool.
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 19th Mar 2011 22:06 Edited at: 19th Mar 2011 22:07
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Thanks! I will look at that site a bit more... That one is one that comes in a kit form right? I was thinking about doing that for mine if i put mine into production

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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da power pwnerer
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Posted: 19th Mar 2011 22:54
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Well I have no experience with this at all whatsoever, so I'm just gonna say what I do know. Your concept really just reminds me of some sort of SNES modification with the cartridge slots and all. What you really want to look at is actually how the game data is going to be transferred to the system whether it be by some sort of cartridge (kind of obsolete if I must say haha) or by CD or something along those lines. I would say the easiest would probably be (if you are going to use microprocessors and what not) to use USB and some sort of storage unit on your device. This would allow you to just plug your device into the computer and sync the game data.

"To lead, you must first die in your mind. Let go of life, and embrace it!!!"
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Kamakazi
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 04:26
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@da power pwnerer If Dark basic dude is going to use the XGS, either 8-bit or 16-bit versions, it looks like the mainboard is designed to be fed software using a bi-parallel connection. From the specs read, the "kit" has a small amount of flash RAM built-in (128 k if I'm not mistaken). It might not sound like much memory, but considering that the code seems to be 100% binary when compiled, the developer really wouldn't need a whole lot of space.

Then there is the Hydra model. A 16-bit system that uses some sort of an SX chip that resembles in physical looks to a Z80 CPU or early 68000 series Motorola CPUs. This board has a cart slot, USB port, and PS/2 ports. It's pretty impressive stuff. Although, I'm having somewhat of a hard time just trying to learn the assembly set to the 6502 CPU for Atari development so I wouldn't know what all would be involved in creating games for the systems.

@Dark basic dude I think it's the one in kit form. All I know is that it comes with a lot of reading material which is a plus to learn this side of gaming. I think the board is pre-assembled. The only issues I would see with this system: 1) The graphic setting seem to be set by DIP switches and 2) The sound chip only supports three channels. Granted, the demos I seen were impressive, but one more channel wouldn't hurt. Then again, I'm trying to remember if the Atari 2600 had two or three sound channels as well. I'll have to look up the documents I have sometime.

On a side note, one of my favorite consoles remains to be the Atari 5200. It was the first console I ever owned and I still have it. I've never had the problems that I've heard so many others talk about. I managed to find the schematics to build the 4-port 5200 and have thought about tackling this project but on a slightly smaller scale and attempting to make it a portable. The only issue I seen with this was with the power requirements of the console. I don't think there is a battery capable of supporting the power needed for a lengthy period of time. At least with the kits you have found, it looks like a portable design (if it was thought of) would be easier to produce and easier on any battery found to supply the power.

If you are going to go the cartridge route in any form, it might be advisable to keep in mind the costs of constructing the media. Chips alone are not too costly, but the hardware required to make most carts (e.g; EEPROM burner) can be costly. This is the only reason why I suggested a CD-based console as discs are readily available and cheaper to produce. However, there is the downfall of discs getting scratched. If the system has a USB port, I wouldn't see why an external CD-ROM couldn't be used. The developer would have to create code (possibly) to create a handshake with the device.

I have tons of old PC boards not being used and at one point considered using what parts I could with a 6502 processor I have still in its case. Something about the 6502 impresses me...it just seems like a solid and flexible CPU.
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 07:41
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I will look into the 6502 Well, im not planning to actually 'use' the XGS, i might just research it. I dont want to mess with any USB stuff, though i do think the USB is very cool, just for computers. Looks like i will be using CD's, thank you very much for pointing that out!

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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TechLord
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 11:13 Edited at: 20th Mar 2011 18:03
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Quote: "Maybe this would go well in the kitchen, it would communicate wirelessly to the TV and controllers. If you want to go play a new game, you have to go to the kitchen to switch the game out haha!"



TechLord's Power-Tower Entertainment System


Power Tower Specs


Power Socket Specs


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BlueKlayman
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 12:13 Edited at: 20th Mar 2011 12:13
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Quote: " Maybe this would go well in the kitchen, it would communicate wirelessly to the TV and controllers. If you want to go play a new game, you have to go to the kitchen to switch the game out haha! "


Ah, you are thinking of playing towards the female gamer market.[/sexism]


EDIT: Just realised there was another page... my bad...

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TechLord
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 18:26
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Dark basic dude79, I can see some Super Nintendo influence there...



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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 18:43 Edited at: 20th Mar 2011 18:45
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Lol, no im not going for making it go in the kitchen, i was describing Primal Beans design that he made! I think it's at the bottom of the first page...

Edit: Haha just noticed you edited in that there was another page

@Tech Lord Your design is cool! It just uses regular PC hardware, the i7... That is what a lot of people have said about it

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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TechLord
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 19:12 Edited at: 20th Mar 2011 19:29
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Quote: "@Tech Lord Your design is cool! It just uses regular PC hardware, the i7... That is what a lot of people have said about it"
Actually its a spin on your statement: 'Maybe this would go well in the kitchen, it would communicate wirelessly to the TV and controllers.'

I can visualize the Power-Tower as a completely viable Game Console. You store the Power-Tower in a nice cool discreet area, connect it up, power it up, load it up. You place the compact Power-Socket in your entertainment center, connect it up, power it up, and turn it up.

The primary difference between the Power Tower Entertainment System and a typical PC is its 1) Slick Case Design(s), 2) Use of specific and regulated hardware/software, 3) Marketing as a Console Entertainment System. The Power-Socket is the poster-boy for what we visualize a console to be by today's Standard. The Power-Tower is what we visualize to be PC/Server by today's Standard. So naturally, folks will attempt to mod it for multi-purpose use like a regular PC. But that's not our problem, because doing so violates the warranty - lol.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 19:41 Edited at: 20th Mar 2011 19:44
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Quote: "Actually its a spin on your statement: 'Maybe this would go well in the kitchen, it would communicate wirelessly to the TV and controllers.'"

Here i was saying what the gaming console Primal Beans designed would do. I want a typical gaming system, the whole thing goes next to the TV like any modern gaming console... But still, nice concept!

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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TechLord
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Posted: 20th Mar 2011 23:41
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Quote: "Here i was saying what the gaming console Primal Beans designed would do. I want a typical gaming system, the whole thing goes next to the TV like any modern gaming console... But still, nice concept!"
Yeah, I know. But, Nintendo/Sony/Microsoft are only offering a Personal Game Console, not a Personal Game Complex.

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heyufool1
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Posted: 21st Mar 2011 00:18
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@TechLord - You sure do enjoy making those designs, don't you?

"So hold your head up high and know, it's not the end of the road"
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 21st Mar 2011 00:41
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Yeh but that is exactly what i want!

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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MrValentine
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Posted: 21st Mar 2011 15:45
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Dark basic dude79

phew hang on getting my breathing back in place... ahhh right now to my final message outputting from my brain... MAKE IT!
umm, I just finished reading through the whole thing (first and second page on this thread, every post)... along the way I had the thought, use standard hardware and it will be easier to use like old XP boot code boot.ini etc... and then begin loading basic os code and then you could save time to create hardware drivers etc...
then I started thinking what a few have mentioned which is make it DB/DBpro code based that way we can all create for it, but then that means you need a windows/dx environment.... going back to making a windows based environment... which means either making your own chips and creating drivers..... a lot of that 0x00000000 crap oh noooo.... I mean thousands of that stuff and more, or using basic windows loading and skip the user login interface etc and jump into console loading game data...
ugh im losing my point above so will end that there you get the gist lol

however my final output from my brain on this topic is...
1) I salute you, I dreamed of this too back in the good old days of SNES NES and PSX (PS1/PSone)
2) I wish I could be of some help, but at present having being burgled and losing so much financially, sorry however I will keep posted here and see how this goes...
3) I am a web developer and can host a free web site for you relating to this, urm you will need to create the site yourself I dont mind supporting you by hosting it, you make it yourself so that you can do the updates or you can just send me a word file with content and images embedded and I can update ^^
4) something supposed to go here, will think about it...
5) I hope you get that kit soon, and I hope its flexible for what I have intended in 7)
6)I put this one to fill space...
and finally
7) instead of cartridges and disks, why not use the old SD card slots and cards (SD/HC is a much more complex data structure and still cost a little more than £1-3 $5-10) I think the original SD interface should be easy to integrate and you can buy 32MB chips for like £0.20p $0.40cents or even the 128MB ones too...

hope this helped and made the sky turn blue ^^ (umm helped with motivation^^)

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 21st Mar 2011 23:40
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You are awesome! i dont think ill be messing with drivers, so here is my first design idea that all of you guys wanted me to post: All communication with and devices will be through memory mapped i/o, and will be accessible to the programmer via assembly code. But i do plan to make for it a very simplified programming language that would be easy and intuitive even for beginners to program in, and would get rid of all the unnecessary assembly code stuff. The language would be a lot like DBPro, maybe even easier.

So back to you MrValentine, i wont be using any standard hardware or Windows stuff, though that would be cool. if i do have to make a driver, i will then consider making that chip an FPGA itself, which would eliminate the need of a driver, or, i would do what i have to, make a driver...
Quote: "I salute you"
Thank you very much!
Quote: "can host a free web site"
Thank you even more!! That would be sweet! Im still not sure if i really will get the kit, though i will do more research on it. Outside the skies are grey now but there is a spot near the horizon that is rather blue, lol!

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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PrimalBeans
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2011 06:54
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"Tricks of the Game Programming Guru" I used to have that book... a long time ago.. i wonder what happened to it...

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2011 23:25
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What kinda stuff did that teach other than basic game programming?

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 23rd Mar 2011 04:06
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@MrValentine So i am taking you up on your offer for a free website I just need a name for my console and i will have the website sport a similar name. I really do appreciate you offering to host a free website for me!

Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
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Jeku
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Posted: 23rd Mar 2011 06:37
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I'm going to lock this because there's another thread on the same topic.

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=183180&b=2&p=0


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