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3 Dimensional Chat / Wolfs 3D Thread

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Wolf
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Posted: 1st Aug 2011 00:08
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Quote: "Wolf, keep rockin' what your doin'."


Will do! I have a new update coming up tomorrow

Quote: "I recommend you post it over at polycount (Or if you don't want to make an account, I could probably ask them for you) and ask about it"


Thank you! I just made an account over there and get going Thanks for your support again!



-Wolf

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The Zoq2
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Posted: 1st Aug 2011 23:37
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I have to agree with you wolf, your texture looks much better than the example

Srry about my english im from sweeden
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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2011 04:30
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readable means being able to actually tell what the material of the object is. Whether is metal, rubber, wood, plastic, whatever. Your texture on the uzi is pretty much unreadable because it is absolutely ALL noise. No material definition whatsoever. And his sword is not "bland" as you put it. It's realistic. Subtly detailed. Like real life objects are. Not 100 percent absolutely wrecked and unrealistically damaged as yours is, and the "bad" examples. That just doesn't happen. And scifi trash? really? So your trying to tell me that an overdone sub machine gun is more creative than what he made? Come on

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Quik
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2011 07:32
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Quote: "I have to agree with you wolf, your texture looks much better than the example"


matter of opinion mostly: I would choose wolf's style for a generarily grungy game, ie resident evil
but other than that i would pick the style of the sword

and for the record, I am a man.

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mike5424
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2011 15:05
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Quote: "readable means being able to actually tell what the material of the object is. Whether is metal, rubber, wood, plastic, whatever. Your texture on the uzi is pretty much unreadable because it is absolutely ALL noise. No material definition whatsoever. And his sword is not "bland" as you put it. It's realistic. Subtly detailed. Like real life objects are. Not 100 percent absolutely wrecked and unrealistically damaged as yours is, and the "bad" examples. That just doesn't happen. And scifi trash? really? So your trying to tell me that an overdone sub machine gun is more creative than what he made? Come on"

+1

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Wolf
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2011 15:09
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Quote: "readable means being able to actually tell what the material of the object is. Whether is metal, rubber, wood, plastic, whatever. Your texture on the uzi is pretty much unreadable because it is absolutely ALL noise. No material definition whatsoever. And his sword is not "bland" as you put it. It's realistic. Subtly detailed. Like real life objects are. Not 100 percent absolutely wrecked and unrealistically damaged as yours is, and the "bad" examples. That just doesn't happen. And scifi trash? really? So your trying to tell me that an overdone sub machine gun is more creative than what he made? Come on"


Thank you! That explains it!!

With scifitrash I ment these glowing lights, like its some laser/steelsword hybrid. Technically its much better than my work of course, you misunderstood me there. I mean that it really looks like a prob from a B-Scifimovie.

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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2011 16:28
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oh haha then yes I totally misunderstood I took it as you were just calling the asset uncreative/bad. well thats a my bad. keep posting I want to see how you improve

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darimc
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Posted: 3rd Aug 2011 17:29
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Quote: "readable means being able to actually tell what the material of the object is. Whether is metal, rubber, wood, plastic, whatever. Your texture on the uzi is pretty much unreadable because it is absolutely ALL noise. No material definition whatsoever. And his sword is not "bland" as you put it. It's realistic. Subtly detailed. Like real life objects are. Not 100 percent absolutely wrecked and unrealistically damaged as yours is, and the "bad" examples. That just doesn't happen. And scifi trash? really? So your trying to tell me that an overdone sub machine gun is more creative than what he made? Come on"
It's still a matter of personal preference. Some people prefer realism in video games, while some lean towards surrealism. I just don't see anything wrong with playing a video game in which you use a weapon that is so grungy and beat up that it wouldn't even be close to usable in real life. It's part of the style of the game. I like a lot of games that have unrealistic, or impossible, aspects of them. I play games to see something different than real life, not for it to be similar, that sort of defeats the purpose in my eyes.

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Quik
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Posted: 3rd Aug 2011 17:53
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I agree to both points: You WANT it to be readable, because you cannot have a baseball bat that looks like a sword, that wouldnt work, but then also it's an art choice really: Grungy or not

and for the record, I am a man.

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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 3rd Aug 2011 22:32 Edited at: 3rd Aug 2011 22:33
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@darimc - yes but there's a difference between something having grunge and wear thats over the top but makes sense and has structure and purpose, such as this weapon http://polygoo.com/port/ak94.html and wear that makes absolutely no sense. If you can pull off that much grunge while it still being smart then more power to you

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Wolf
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 00:05 Edited at: 4th Aug 2011 00:21
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Quote: "while some lean towards surrealism"


So do I Some say "THATS GREAT" other say "THATS WAY TOO MUCH NOISE AND DIRT"
I have those over the top contrastvalues and all the rust and dirt in my games since years now and it kinda starts to be my personal style/signature. Its not professional at all, but I'm a hobby dev. so I don't care.

@Camouflage Studios:
Quote: "yes but there's a difference between something having grunge and wear thats over the top but makes sense and has structure and purpose, such as this weapon"


this is pretty close to what I want to achieve one day
But since its my third month in modelling... this won't happen so fast.

Quote: "Not 100 percent absolutely wrecked and unrealistically damaged as yours is"


Ever seen the old WorldWar 2 guns they sell on the belgian flaymarket? They look awfully damaged and scratched.
I don't know, the firemechanism could still work, as all visible damage on my gun are minor scratechs and dirt. But I do agree that it has a bit too much noise.



A little work in progress to lighten up the mood
The G3 I made for anayars gunpack
Nevermind the texture stretching...I'll work that out.
The handle will stay as failed as it is now. The player's hand will hide it anyway


-Wolf

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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 00:47
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images directly pulled from weapon orthos? im just wondering as i see that a lot, even i used to do that lol

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Wolf
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 01:12 Edited at: 4th Aug 2011 02:02
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No, just for the magazine. The rest is pretty much selfmade using a horrible photo for the stock as a base and working from that.

There are no good G3 Photos out there I could simply use for the texture. (at least I haven't found any.)

(I'm assuming that by "orthos" you ment "photos"?)

******************

Here it is: I still have to remove the little bolts that are on the shoulderstock on the back. (I just noticed that I forgot that )





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anayar
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 07:20
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Looks awesome! And I personally dont understand why people are screaming about the textures not being clean. Thats Wolf's style and let ti stay that way

Cheers,
Anayar


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Quik
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 14:46
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All we are saying Anayar is that some of the textures are quite hard to read ^^

and for the record, I am a man.

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lazerus
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 17:01
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heheh i caught you on PC

Stay on there, the information, tips, tricks, workflow, tools, general information is invaluable to any artist. That and the networking between companies/lead artists/Ceo is some cases is brilliant. Hell i've been getting schooled by Valais for my Glint project which is a godsend since hes pointed out alot of flaws in it.

Ive been there since 09' and posted 238 times. Dedicated lurking there espeically since ive only ever posted 4 of my own work threads.


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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 17:59
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if I were you wolf I would never directly source from a gun photo. Although I must say you pulled it off better than most can in this example, I think youd learn more and it would end up looking better if you used other techniques. And no orthos mean like the side and front view

And yes I saw you on polycount as well. Stay there, listen and really take in what the people have to say. A lot of them happen to be professionals working in companies like infinity ward and bioware. Personally I've made a HUGE improvement since I joined polycount. Theres so much knowledge there. But you have to find it you know. I spent days looking for useful threads and any information that might have helped me. You should do the same and if you listen to the crits given to you you should improve greatly

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Wolf
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Posted: 4th Aug 2011 21:34
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Okay, I'll stay on polycount. But I think I will be more active there next year when I have more to show



-Wolf

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darimc
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Posted: 5th Aug 2011 19:39
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Quote: "yes but there's a difference between something having grunge and wear thats over the top but makes sense and has structure and purpose, such as this weapon http://polygoo.com/port/ak94.html and wear that makes absolutely no sense. If you can pull off that much grunge while it still being smart then more power to you
"
I still feel like you're missing the point. It's a video game, it could make absolutely zero sense, it's just made up anyway. I don't understand why everything has to be realistic or structurally sound to 3d modelers. Scratches don't have to make sense, for all we know, someone took a knife to it and started scratching random places .

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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 5th Aug 2011 19:46
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i have to say I think you're missing my point, and that everything can make zero sense is 100 percent incorrect. But whatever, I'll cut this discussion off here and let wolf continue

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Wolf
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Posted: 5th Aug 2011 21:20 Edited at: 6th Aug 2011 00:20
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Quote: "and that everything can make zero sense is 100 percent incorrect."


What about women? (yeah, I had to! Please don't hit me...PLEEEAAASSEEE!)

Its my thread...so a little offtopic from my site won't hurt.

I have to release a free pack for that haven't I? Oh dang...again


Well, watcha know...there is an image of a render in 3DSMax attached. It has no shadereffects or any specific value whatsoever as I have not yet understood how to actually "render" a scene



-Wolf

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anayar
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Posted: 6th Aug 2011 18:41
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You bought 3DS Max?

And to apply a texture and shader maps, you just take a stock material, go to Maps> You should see Diffuse, Specular, Bump, etc.

Click on the respective button (Diffuse, etc.) and then choose Bitmap. Then choose your texture. Do this for all the maps What version do you have btw??

Cheers,
Anayar


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darimc
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Posted: 6th Aug 2011 19:15
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Quote: "i have to say I think you're missing my point, and that everything can make zero sense is 100 percent incorrect. But whatever, I'll cut this discussion off here and let wolf continue"
There is no correct or incorrect. Everything is purely a matter of opinion and personal preference; there is no argument. But I will say, if things need to make sense, then why are there games like LSD? Or even games on this forum such as Umbra? I just feel that since it is a video game, absolutely anything and everything can and possibly will happen. I encourage creativeness and thinking outside of the box, not being bound to the limitations of realism.

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Wolf
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Posted: 6th Aug 2011 19:30
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Quote: "You bought 3DS Max?"


No But you can download the student version for free:

LINKEDY LINK

I won't be able to do models for my commercial projects later on with it. But for rendering and showcase like this, its perfect.

Quote: "
And to apply a texture and shader maps, you just take a stock material, go to Maps> You should see Diffuse, Specular, Bump, etc.
"


Aha! Found it... I need to press M...how sneaky of them



-Wolf

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Quik
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Posted: 6th Aug 2011 20:57
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Quote: "Aha! Found it... I need to press M...how sneaky of them "


to bring up the materials menu you dont HAVE to press M, there is an material button in the top right corner

and for the record, I am a man.

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lazerus
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Posted: 6th Aug 2011 21:28
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Hotkeys you'll need

q - selection, also switches selection types
w - Move
e - rotate
r - scale

Space - locks selection. not really handy just incase you hit it be accident.

x - turns off gizmos again in case you hit it

8 - Environment setup.
Shift + q - Render.
F10 - Render setup.
Crtl - keeps current selection and allows you to add more
Alt - allows you to deselect parts of your selection

Thats all i can think of atm, most are just subconscious habits now, like F9 used to be render in older versions but anit now. Still tend to hit it.


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Quik
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Posted: 6th Aug 2011 21:34 Edited at: 6th Aug 2011 21:35
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Quote: "Shift + q - Render."


isnt f9 render?

edit: oooh both works

and for the record, I am a man.

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anayar
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Posted: 7th Aug 2011 12:55
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F9 doesnt work for me Ive got to do the Shift+Q thing

@Wolf: Good to hear

Cheers,
Anayar


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Wolf
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Posted: 13th Aug 2011 03:33
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You can follow the thread here



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mike5424
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Posted: 14th Aug 2011 02:28
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Again, you've got problems with the textures, they look more like stone.

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Wolf
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Posted: 14th Aug 2011 02:55
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Ya, its some CGTextures stuff. Its good for the game I am using it in. So...

I just wanted to keep this thread updatet.

You can give me feedback on the guns if you want.

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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 14th Aug 2011 21:50
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gee good to know you respond to crits well

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Wolf
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Posted: 14th Aug 2011 22:07 Edited at: 15th Aug 2011 07:23
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Oh! I didn't mean to offend him Its just that I dont want to further more improve on these computer thingies

And I'm always honest

What part of my reply did you find inappropriate?

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darimc
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Posted: 15th Aug 2011 18:03
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Some people here really need to take a good look around them if they think that looks like stone....

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Camouflage Studios
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Posted: 15th Aug 2011 18:35
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darim, it may not look like stone persay, but it sure as hell doesnt look like metal

http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=87661

the work on that page does.

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Wolf
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Posted: 15th Aug 2011 19:00 Edited at: 15th Aug 2011 19:10
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Its that highreflective metal you find in stripbars (sorry, I really was unable to make up another location just right now)...or liftdoors... after years of decay. It looks kind of like that to me.

If I would use this texture on a door...would you say it doesnt look like metal and is overdone and unrealistically damaged? Could be, but its indeed an unedited photograph

You see, they match the scenes I use them in. And they seem dirty.

I'm a total beginner, I really think that its totally awesome that this red line matches on every side of the model.

pointing me to some professional work on polycount is like hitting some hobbypencil artist with the work of DaVinci. Or telling a filmstudent that his work isn't Citizen Kane.

Dont worry I know that texture and modelwise these are just a bunch of boxes and cylinders with some overdone cgtextures stuff... but I like them. We already proved that "hard to read" stuff.

The point I want to make is that my game should look like an amateur game. Like something I made with basic tools and sloppy planning. Especially like something I made. "hey look! it has all this dirt, too much sharpening and contrast...Wolf did that!"
Then there is this by the book, follow tutorials stuff that is, from an objective point of view, much higher in quality but yet lagging any soul. By looking on the average sceneasset in a typical UDK project can you tell who made it? By looking at the texture of a spaceship in scene 1002492 can you say "hey! Bobby made it! Look! It looks exactly like all the other stereotypical stuff...perfect but...completely soulless."
Dont get me wrong, I do want to get better in time, but I dont want to make my stuff end up looking exactly like all the other stuff on the polycount forums. Same workflow, same tools, same tutorials it origins from...same boring stuff.

Its like the first star wars movies with all these primitive special effects and the teddybears running around. And then later these mindnumbing boring CGI pieces of nothing that they call "prequels"...this is pretty much what my rant in d minor wants to point out.

Then again, you still didn't elaborate on that "gee good to know you respond to crits well" thing.

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michael x
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Posted: 15th Aug 2011 21:02
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I personally like you stuff wolf.one of the reasons its your impression of work. something that is not done on here much.

Is it met for everyone? no

but it's what you do and I can understand that.your style of work is like you own art.I would not tell you or compare your work with others.this why I don't crits your work i want see your view of creation.many people need to learn to open there mind to others vision of work.your models are very unique to which makes you game unique.

does game look like fpsc game?yes. but compare to other it's unique as it's own which makes it your own.

more than what meets the eye

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JLMoondog
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Posted: 15th Aug 2011 23:27
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Looks like grungy metal to me.

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Quik
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Posted: 15th Aug 2011 23:31
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basicly what josh said, in this case i have to completly disagree with the stone-believers here...

and for the record, I am a man.

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Wolf
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Posted: 17th Aug 2011 15:36 Edited at: 17th Aug 2011 15:36
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Quote: "does game look like fpsc game?Yes."


Really? I actually didn't plan it to look like that...what makes an FPSC game look like an FPSC game anyway...because everyone else told me it does NOT look like one...could you elaborate on what I could change? :-|

******************************

So yeah, new model ahead Air your thoughts. But please dont tell me that one cant see what its made of...I dont know what its made of





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Design Runner
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Posted: 17th Aug 2011 15:48
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I don't like this last one. The texturing is fantastic, but just looking at it I can immediately tell it was made in milkshape. It has the points and roughness which plagues many weapons made in milkshape. Most of your other guns did not have that.

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Wolf
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Posted: 17th Aug 2011 20:27
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Quote: "I don't like this last one. The texturing is fantastic, but just looking at it I can immediately tell it was made in milkshape. It has the points and roughness which plagues many weapons made in milkshape. Most of your other guns did not have that."


Oh? Well, all of my guns are rather rough and simple...but I dont see what separates this one from the others...could you elaborate?



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Design Runner
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Posted: 18th Aug 2011 04:06
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Here is a simple drawing for you. The colored text corresponds with the colored lines.

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michael x
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Posted: 18th Aug 2011 06:45
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@ wolf what I meant was your game looks very good but it look like you are using a more advance fpsc engine.it does not matter what engine it really looks like. so by saying it looks like you use fpsc engine is not a put down. but you have made a very unique looking game with the engine.but I personally can't take the credit away from fpsc by saying (It does not look like the fpsc engine) but I rather say you made better use of the engine in a unique way.it so unique it like the rage game. thats the type of feel i get by looking at your.the things you did with this engine it like you use the tech 5 to bump up your textures.your weapon are also unique and i like them.this can go deeper with time.i have no dislike about your work because ever since you came to this forum your style has been very unique.this game has a mix theme to it.well I can't wait to see more of your work great job as always.

more than what meets the eye

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Wolf
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Posted: 18th Aug 2011 15:04
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Thank you! Looks like I have to get a little bit deeper into graphics for my other projects

@Design Runner: I see.. these grey pixels are not actually there at all...this must have been fragmotion doing some 3D error.

Yeah, a few more polygons on that thing could have helped! You are right

Oh no! Its only textured. The software does not support shader maps.
I'll get a render of it in 3DS Max later.



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henry ham
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Posted: 18th Aug 2011 15:37
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it always makes me laugh the biggest critics usually have the lowest skill levels.

great work here mate keep it up

cheers henry

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JLMoondog
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Posted: 18th Aug 2011 19:58
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I don't think it needs anymore polys. Good work.

http://www.jlmoondog.com/
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Quik
16
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Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Equestria!
Posted: 18th Aug 2011 22:15
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Quote: "it always makes me laugh the biggest critics usually have the lowest skill levels."


Are you implying you need to be better than what you are critisizing to be critisizing it?

pf

and for the record, I am a man.

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mike5424
16
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Joined: 30th Mar 2009
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Posted: 18th Aug 2011 22:32
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Quote: "it always makes me laugh the biggest critics usually have the lowest skill levels.

great work here mate keep it up

cheers henry"

Maybe you need to re-look at this thread, and you're own work, then tell us that we have the "lowest skill levels".

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Wolf
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Joined: 8th Nov 2007
Location: Luxemburg
Posted: 18th Aug 2011 22:44
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Does anyone else get a creepy vibe from this thread where everyone is arguing about something else than the topic?

I make serious coffee - so strong it wakes up the neighbors.
http://serygalacaffeine.deviantart.com/
Twitter:@Serygala
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