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Geek Culture / License Agreements on TGC Products

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Amd Silver
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2011 23:16
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Has anyone else ever actually read the EULA on TGC products? I found some interesting things in them.

For example, did you know that you are required to credit TGC in the credits and on the box of commercial projects made using FPSC?

Or that Tree Magik is only allowed to be installed on Windows 95, 98, 2000, ME, and XP? According to the EULA you aren't allowed to install it on Vista, Win7, or Linux using WINE.

Anyone else run across unexpected stuff in these EULAs before?

Love,
Zell Faze
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Quik
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2011 23:21
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Quote: "For example, did you know that you are required to credit TGC in the credits and on the box of commercial projects made using FPSC?"


that I take for given tbh .__.' that you should ALWAYS take for granted

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Amd Silver
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2011 23:56
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I personally have no problem with crediting TGC. Although I think putting it on the boxart is a bit much...

It is just that the website would lead you to believe that you didn't have to mention TGC at all.

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Zell Faze
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Quik
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:02
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say you ue DBpro, then putting it on the boxart is no less than using say UDK, unity etc... same with FPSC etc.

dont at all see the big deal in that.

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Amd Silver
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:09
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The big deal it is a requirement and that they imply that there isn't one.

If I use the Unreal Engine, I don't have to say I used it if I don't want to. Most engines that require credit let you know in a somewhat more obvious way.

I'm not saying requiring credit is wrong, I'm just saying that they are going about it the wrong way. I'm just saying, they should let you know.

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Zell Faze
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Quik
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:10
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Quote: "and that they imply that there isn't one."


they actually say that there isnt one?!

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Amd Silver
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:20
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Definition "imply":
Quote: "Verb: Strongly suggest the truth or existence of (something not expressly stated): "the report implies that two million jobs might be lost"."


No they never explicitly say that there isn't a requirement. But they strongly imply that there isn't.

For example from the product page for FPSC:
Quote: "We are pleased to announce that there are NO license restrictions on FPS Creator. You can sell whatever you make and do not have to pay us any royalties. This entitles you to sell your games on your own web site, sell via a publisher, have them placed on magazine cover discs or just give them away for free.

Will my games have a watermark?

No! There is no watermark during any aspect of the game. You can also customise all elements of the menu system, HUD and game graphics as you see fit.

Is there a splash screen?

No! FPS Creator does not have a splash screen. There will be no graphical sign that your game was made with FPS Creator at all."


This implies that you in no way have to acknowledge TGC, which as shown by the EULA is clearly not the case.

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Zell Faze
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Thraxas
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:24 Edited at: 4th Oct 2011 00:27
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I thought all it said was royalty free. That, to me, doesn't imply you don't have to give credit.

I read the EULA on all software before purchase. You'd be surprised what some put in them.

On a magazine cover disc I read how by agreeing to use the disc you gave the writers access to your house for a 2 week holiday.

Quote: "I'm just saying, they should let you know."


They did let you know. In fact they let you know so well, that here you are making a thread about it.

Edit
Ninja'd

Neither of those things imply you don't have to credit the creators. It just says your game won't be splashed with references to FPSC.

Quote: "I like Thraxas as a person, but I don't like him as poster"
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Amd Silver
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:31
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Rarely do people actually read the EULAs. It is silly of them, but true.

Even if you disagree with my point on FPSC, you must still surely agree that the EULA for Tree Magik should be updated. Because of how that is worded anyone using Tree Magik on Windows Vista or Windows 7 is breaking the EULA for it.

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Zell Faze
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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:37
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*Just reinstalled the UDK, didn't read the EULA.*

Let's be honest, how many games have actually went fully commercial with FPSC over the years? It was about three last time I checked...

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Mychal B
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:49
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How about dbpro?

The fastfood zombie killer
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Amd Silver
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 00:58
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I haven't gotten around to reading the EULA for DBPro yet. I have to download it again still.

Once my DarkGAME Studio disc arrives I will be reading all of the EULAs and making a post to highlight things I find in each one of them.

I'll be making EULAs in laymans terms basically. Kinda like Google does.

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Zell Faze
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lazerus
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 01:09
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They hide all the nasty 'small print' behind a wall of text and no-ones the wiser, till you called out on it.


http://lazerus-reborn.deviantart.com/
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Eminent
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 01:19
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Quote: "If I use the Unreal Engine, I don't have to say I used it if I don't want to."


Actually if you make a game using UDK or UE3, there's a start-up cinematic that reads "Powered By Unreal" or something similar.
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Amd Silver
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 01:20 Edited at: 4th Oct 2011 01:26
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But that is optional as far as I know.

Although most companies like to have it there because the Unreal Engine is a great engine.

Not everyone though would like to advertise that they use products by TGC, no offense TGC.

EDIT:
And again, even if it isn't optional. I'm sure that they make sure you know that BEFORE you buy the software or at the very least make it not hidden in a wall of text barely anyone ever reads. It needs to be more obvious.

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Zell Faze
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Eminent
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 02:27
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It's non-optional.

Q: Can we change the static UDK splash screen in our UDK apps?

A: For UDKC apps : Yes, you may alter the static splash screen as you see fit. The UDK movie, on the other hand, must not be changed.

A: For UDK:Mobile apps : You may not alter the "Powered by Unreal Engine" logo but you may put whatever you want immediately following.

And it's kind of hidden.
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Wolf
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 04:12 Edited at: 4th Oct 2011 04:13
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Quote: "It is just that the website would lead you to believe that you didn't have to mention TGC at all.
"


I never felt that way. I red the license agreement as I am working on a commercial project and I have to say that I dont get your point,a s anyone who wants to get out commercial software does that. All you need to put on the box is a simple line of text. It can be put below left with the system requirements and doesnt need to be that dominant. Same with a line in the credits.

Quote: "
Not everyone though would like to advertise that they use products by TGC, no offense TGC."


Anyone who wants to hide what software he used might aswell dig himself in the garden. No loss there... I don't think that anyone has a problem with that.

Matter is energy condensed to a slow vibration, we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively Theres no such thing as death,life is only a dream,and were the imagination of ourselves.
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Travis Gatlin
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Posted: 4th Oct 2011 20:57
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If i made a game with TGC products, i would have no problem at all advertising for them on my game. If anything, it will be good for TGC, and i have no problem helping them at all.

http://awolthehunted.blogspot.com/
For the latest news on my FPS in development, check out my blog!
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MrValentine
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Posted: 5th Oct 2011 08:36
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Quote: "If i made a game with TGC products, i would have no problem at all advertising for them on my game. If anything, it will be good for TGC, and i have no problem helping them at all."


+1

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Quik
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Posted: 5th Oct 2011 10:56
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Quote: "Quote: "If i made a game with TGC products, i would have no problem at all advertising for them on my game. If anything, it will be good for TGC, and i have no problem helping them at all."

+1"


+2

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Quel
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Posted: 5th Oct 2011 12:17
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That's very romantic to "read the EULA and accept if you agree" ...

...But what if you freakin need that thing and there is something annoying in the agreement, then just drop the whole thing and forget about it?

...I don't like a comma in the Windows agreement, so drop the whole "working with PC" thing and go out take some flowers?

...some people disagrees with the latest Apple update to their god knows what kind of device, and just throw the thing out the window because he or she "disagrees" ?

You can't be serious.

I would rather say that the whole concept of having a 100 screens long agreement before EVERY FREAKIN' PROGRAM EVER EXISTED is the stupidest thing ever. And people handle it the way it deserves.

Of course this doesn't necessarily stand for productive software, but you may get my point.

-In.Dev.X: A unique heavy story based shoot'em ~35%
-CoreFleet: An underground commander unit based RTS ~15%
-TailsVSEggman: An Sonic themed RTS under development for idea presentation to Sega ~15%
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Thraxas
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Posted: 5th Oct 2011 13:26
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Quote: ".But what if you freakin need that thing and there is something annoying in the agreement, then just drop the whole thing and forget about it?"


Yes return the software to a shop if you purchased it. Or request a refund if you bought it online.

I've done it before.

Quote: "I like Thraxas as a person, but I don't like him as poster"
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bitJericho
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Posted: 5th Oct 2011 13:28
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Quote: "...I don't like a comma in the Windows agreement, so drop the whole "working with PC" thing and go out take some flowers?"


It's called Linux.


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Quik
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Posted: 5th Oct 2011 13:46
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If you dont like how a software is run, then you shouldnt "stick with it because you bought it"
because then you are supporting it. You should return it, get your money back and if you can, mail them and tell them why...
Thats what i would do anyway

and here comes the whiners: "UUUUUUH that wond make any differenceesssreee"

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