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Geek Culture / i need A new computer

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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 23:52
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i am new here, and have been shopping for a new computer most of last year, and as of yet, all of this year. at one point, i settled on a 300$ eMachines desktop with mouse and keyboard, then i found out they might not be very good, i found an HP Pavilion computer in my local wal-mart for 100 more, it had a 1.5TB HDD, 6(or 8)GBs RAM, and a single DVD burner. i could upgrade that with a Blu-Ray drive. but i do not wish to settle for a low end computer. i asked a similar question on a different forum, and i got some mixed responses, now i ask you, and hope to gain some good advice.



a Dell Latitude D830 seems good. my dad has an older version, but the D830 seems like a good laptop. i found one interesting thing online, the Panasonic Toughbook it is rated at a drop of 6', has a touchscreen, and seems extremely tough. unfortunately, the ones i have found are less than 100 gigs, i need 500 or more as a base.



as i do not now, nor do i ever see myself in the near future playing WoW, or many of the newer games. i usually like console-based stuff. most of the 3D games i like can be run on my current WinXPMCed PC. so i guess the eMachine might not be such a bad choice... but if i can build a computer with the same specifications or better for less, the same, or a little bit more, i will do so. can anyone on here help me in building a good computer?


Key:
anything with nothing in brackets (like this) is required.
with brackets, it is optional.
levels of optional;
Micro-semi-optional; meaning it is extremely preferred, but not necessary.
semi-optional; meaning preferred, but not needed.
optional; a good thing to have, but not required

requirements:

1TB or more HDD running at 5400 RPM
CD/DVD/Blu-Ray optical drive (preferably 2, preferably also with LightScribe customizable labeling, and with write capacity for at least one of the drives)
3GB or more RAM
a multiple memory reader (like a micro/SD card reader, or more)
multiple 3.5mm audio/headphone jacks
6 (or more) USB 3.0 ports
a hyper transport speed of 4000 MHz
tri(or more) rail PSU
good/decent video card(s)
Genuine Win7 Ultimate 64-BIT (or better)
motherboard with PS/2 ports, and the blue serial port for the screen, and a good kind/type of MoBo
1MB cache or (preferably) better
(micro-semi-optional) USB powered speakers
(micro-semi-optional) mouse like the one included with the eMachine, or better
(semi-optional) a (good[maybe a gaming]) keyboard
(semi-optional) built in Wi-Fi receiver
(optional) ethernet jack(s)
(optional) internal battery power
(optional) dual sound card(s) with 15-Pin input
(optional) stuff compatible with Win98
(optional) decent, but still cheap HDD with a few hundred GBs, loaded with Win98/Linux for hobbying.
(optional) switch to boot either the hobbying drive, or the Win7 OS

the following is copied from the eMachine site. is it necessary?

Network (RJ-45)

here is the page to the computer i am matching specs with

did i miss anything?


i found a few video cards that are less than 100 that support DX11, but they're "workstation" cards, that typically do not support Win7, until i get Win7 ultimate, i will not use windows, rather, i will use linux until i get Win7Ult

i settled on this CPU



thinking about this tower, have narrowed it down to these MoBos, i need a video card that has VGA, since the monitor i have is kind of old, or else a DVI to analog port connector. a GPU that will run WoW, but not be to expensive might also be good as well, so far, i have kept it under 300, but that is just with the case and MoBos, RAM, CPU, and HDD, not to mention SSD, GPU and PSU!



a case without a window is a deal breaker for me.


i need a 1TB or better HDD

apparently you can run OSs on the SSDs faster and safer than HDDs

i have red hat linux around my home somewhere, can it recognize 32GBs o RAM?

tri rail for HDD, GPU and MoBo

would like modular PSU to cut down on clutter

the eMachine i looked at had a faster CPU

these two HDDs i found look good, $159.99. tri rail modular PSU$74.99. i need a GPU that can support Win7 when i get it. found a few MoBos that are good, they support 32GBs o RAM, this is the list, and this one looks the best.

i have a budget of 350

"Do or do not, there is no try"
Yoda in: Star Wars Episode: V The Empire Strikes Back
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Slow Programmer
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 06:29
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Quote: "i do not wish to settle for a low end computer"


Quote: "i have a budget of 350"


That would not seem possible.

There are two kinds of computer users. Those that use Macs and those that wish they did.
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SpyDaniel
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 09:07
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I have just spent £680 on a new computer and never got a harddrive or dvd rom, I used my old ones. Prices have gone up too much for HHD's. If you want a good gaming computer, be prepared to spend what I did.
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The Wilderbeast
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 09:25
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1TB or more HDD running at 5400 RPM
Quote: "CD/DVD/Blu-Ray optical drive (preferably 2, preferably also with LightScribe customizable labeling, and with write capacity for at least one of the drives)"

Most DVD drives have write abilities these days. If you intend to do a lot of copying it would be easier to create a disk image of the master DVD, store that on the hard drive (quicker to access), then burn all the copies from that.
Quote: "3GB or more RAM"

I am still using 2GB, which works fine for me (I am adamant about not clogging my system up with unwanted background processes and other useless crap). But if you multitask a lot then I think 4GB is the sweat spot these days. Anywhere between 3GB - 6GB RAM should be sufficient.
Quote: "a multiple memory reader (like a micro/SD card reader, or more)"

£5 for one that sits in the drive bay should do. They're not expensive.
Quote: "multiple 3.5mm audio/headphone jacks"

Again, most motherboards have headers for audio as well as jacks on the IO backboard.
Quote: "6 (or more) USB 3.0 ports"

Good luck getting that on a low-end computer. That's going to bump up the price of the motherboard a fair bit.
Quote: "a hyper transport speed of 4000 MHz"

You linked to an Intel CPU. Intel chips used to use a Front Side Bus, but it would appear the latest Core processors use something different. You'd have to ask someone else for info about this. Though it's only really relevant if you plan on overclocking - in which case you need to allow for extra cooling etc.
Quote: "tri(or more) rail PSU"

You really don't need a Tri-rail PSU. A basic PSU by someone like Corsair should be sufficient, I would recommend about 500W - 600W in case you want to expand your system later.
Quote: "good/decent video card(s)"

You stated that you do your heavy gaming on your console, so there's really no need for a powerful GPU. A cheap passive one will provide more than enough power for old games and YouTube, plus it won't generate any noise (just make sure you have good airflow).
Quote: "Genuine Win7 Ultimate 64-BIT (or better)"

I'm starting to think you're just chucking things in. Get Windows 7 Home Premium. You don't need drive encryption or any of the other enterprise class features in Ultimate unless the feds are onto you (even still it won't be much help).
Quote: "motherboard with PS/2 ports, and the blue serial port for the screen, and a good kind/type of MoBo"

PS/2 ports, people still use those? Actually I have a tactile keyboard which uses them But it's hard to find a mobo with PS/2 ports. Buy a USB keyboard and mouse combo for £20. And the blue serial port? That's a VGA output, there's one on your graphics card so we don't need to use the one on the mobo. As for serial, only a small selection of us find it useful these days.
Quote: "1MB cache or (preferably) better"

Is that on the CPU or what? 1MB is actually quite small, you should be looking at around 4MB, which most modern CPUs come with.
Quote: "(micro-semi-optional) USB powered speakers"

Should be easy enough for you to find some on Amazon.
Quote: "(micro-semi-optional) mouse like the one included with the eMachine, or better"

Again, easy to find.
Quote: "(semi-optional) a (good[maybe a gaming]) keyboard"


(semi-optional) built in Wi-Fi receiver
Don't think any mobos have this built in, but a USB adapter should only be £10 for a cheap one.
Quote: "(optional) ethernet jack(s)"

You don't need more than one NIC unless you're dealing with some serious network traffic. All mobos these days have a gigabit ethernet jack on the board.
Quote: "(optional) internal battery power"

You will need to buy a UPS.
Quote: "(optional) dual sound card(s) with 15-Pin input"

WTF do you need two sound cards for? Is the D-Sub for a game controller or something? If not then the onboard sound will be sufficient (most mobos have sound built in).
Quote: "(optional) decent, but still cheap HDD with a few hundred GBs, loaded with Win98/Linux for hobbying."

Since the floods hit Thailand, there's no such thing as a cheap hard drive any more. Instead load a virtual machine (VirtualBox is a good starting point) onto your existing hard drive and you can run Linux from inside that - it's a completely self-contained environment.
Quote: "(optional) switch to boot either the hobbying drive, or the Win7 OS"

This is done through the BIOS, just press a key on the keyboard when you boot up and you can select which drive to boot from. But like I said, you should install a VM.

Quote: "the following is copied from the eMachine site. is it necessary?

Network (RJ-45)"

RJ-45 = ethernet jack.



I can appreciate that you are a newcomer to computer internals - a little bit of bodging together stuff should fix that! But I wouldn't suggest you start by blowing all your money on a custom computer. Stick with that eMachines one and use your money to buy a cheap old computer from eBay and then you can learn all of this stuff without risking blowing up some pricey components.

If you really want to go ahead, I'll knock you up a parts list - but I'd advise against it.


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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 19:33
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ok, i found out about the boot multi OSs a while ago, i just copy/pasted what i had posted in a couple other forums to save time. nix hyper transport speed, don't need that. the sound cards were to use some older game controllers with. the UPS is a bad idea, i was just throwing out things when i posted that original thread, i need the PS/2 ports to use with my older mice and keyboards, i want the Win7 Ultimate to have 32GBs of RAM, the Tri-Rail PSU comes highly recommended by some contacts of mine. i want a video card that will run WoW and SWTOR since i at least want to try to play them. i knew about VGA, like i said, i was just copy/pasting some stuff i had typed before and forgot to edit it. i actually found some decent MoBos that had USB 3.0 and were in the price range. they also support 32GBs o RAM. i will NEVER buy a FoxxConn MoBo. the only reason i need VGA is to use my older monitor that was with an old ACER PC that died

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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Dark Frager
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 20:24
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Quote: "32GBs of RAM"


Woah!!! What do you need all that for?

"Before you get too serious with FPSC I think you need to take her out for a nice dinner first. Maybe go see a movie together. Really get to know her. " - Thraxas
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The Wilderbeast
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 23:30
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You don't need Windows 7 Ultimate for 32GB of RAM, any 64-bit OS will do. 32GB of RAM will set you back several thousand, I'm really not sure what you had in mind.

You will need a DVI/HDMI to VGA adapter to use the graphics card with your old monitor as the VGA output on the mobo will be blank if the GPU is plugged in.

I've never played SWTOR, but I know WoW doesn't need a terribly powerful graphics card - I would recommend something like a HD 5670 - it's cheap, will handle all new games (with some sacrifices in settings of course) and is low power enough that it doesn't require a separate connector.

I'm sorry, but you really don't need a triple rail PSU. Dual rail is more than adequate, and even then probably overkill.


What exactly is it you are intending on using the computer for which requires 32GB RAM and a triple rail PSU?


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bitJericho
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Posted: 2nd Feb 2012 10:40 Edited at: 2nd Feb 2012 10:41
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Quote: "I'm sorry, but you really don't need a triple rail PSU. Dual rail is more than adequate, and even then probably overkill. "


Since when is triple rail a selling point? Generally you want a single rail PSU, but they're more expensive than their double/triple rail bretheren.


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The Wilderbeast
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Posted: 2nd Feb 2012 20:42
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As I understood it - it depends what type of split rail it is. If it's a high-end bit of kit then it will have separate PSU circuitry for each rail, which means that the output should theoretically be more stable and each rail is allowed to carry up to the full current specified by the ATX specification. If it's not then the three outputs are actually derived from a single 12V rail - which means less overall current.


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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 02:01
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32GBs won't set me back more than my whole budget. the tri-rail PSU will keep some o the more valued components from dieing if something shorts out or spins up. from what i hear win7 HP can only use 16GBs. i know i need DVI/HDMI to VGA to make it work with my monitor. i just need to be able to upgrade the RAM when i can if i can. my plan is a gaming/programming/etc computer. i use up a gig o RAM in less than a day, and i want to be able to hibernate my PC for a week or so and not lose speed. beside, i just want to be able to upgrade the RAM if i want to, and i will with every chance i can get.

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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bitJericho
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 11:49
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Quote: " i use up a gig o RAM in less than a day, and i want to be able to hibernate my PC for a week or so and not lose speed."


Ram doesn't really work that way. Ram is used and released as needed by your software.


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Indicium
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 14:11
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Dumping 32GB to disk when you want to hibernate isn't exactly quick either, you'd be better of shutting down xD

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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 17:06
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ok then, how do you explain the fact that even when i have only one page open or one program it is always slow? besides, i did not say i needed it, i just want to be able to upgrade to it. now, where can i get broken/old/cheap computers/parts?

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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Indicium
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 18:15
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Quote: "ok then, how do you explain the fact that even when i have only one page open or one program it is always slow?"


I'm guess you either have a really crap computer, or there's lots of background processes.

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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 18:39
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how do i decrease background processes?

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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charger bandit
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 21:47
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Just dont have a million things opened up. Scan for viruses and do some cleaning. You just gave us some requierments that might just be insane because you dont understand some things about how computers work. You cant just go out and buy a new PC if you dont know what caused to slow down the old one. It might be just okay.


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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 03:40
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..... ok, tbh i just saw some 32GB MoBos and figured i would include 32GBs o RAM in my build. i have been cleaning up my PC for a while now, but i want Win7 and a 1TB+ HDD. i could add the HDD to my exirsting PC< but i need something where my mom will not interrupt me when she wants to get on.

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 8th Feb 2012 00:32
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if for some reason somehow i insulted you, i am sorry

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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sprite
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Posted: 9th Feb 2012 01:49
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WebSlingerBoy there is no way for $350 your get a decent PC with that spec brad new. However use ebay and buy smart. Case is a case why pay $100 for a brand new one when someone will be selling it for $20 second hand.

HDs and windows get these new. However for windows if your a school, college or uni there are programs that allow you to get these on the cheap.

If your not learning do a cheat. Go on a course for evening one like drawing then after a week or two buy adobe cs5.5 for $500 better than paying $5000 for example.

I'll add something later on.
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The Wilderbeast
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Posted: 9th Feb 2012 08:54
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Quote: "Case is a case why pay $100 for a brand new one when someone will be selling it for $20 second hand. "


A case is not just a case, especially for the build that he is planning. It is critical that there is good airflow, and I personally wouldn't spend anything less than $100 on a new case.


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bitJericho
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Posted: 9th Feb 2012 18:52
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Quote: "A case is not just a case, especially for the build that he is planning. It is critical that there is good airflow, and I personally wouldn't spend anything less than $100 on a new case."


I've bought my fair share of 20 dollar cases, but to be fair, I would probably never do it again

I will never again buy a case for myself that requires a screwdriver at all! For someone that wants to dig in there every so often, I'd be way more inclined if it wasn't a 30 minute project just to get into the thing.

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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 9th Feb 2012 18:57
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i can probably just drill into the case to make air holes and replace one panel with plexiglass! can i use 32GB SD cards for RAM and another one for SSD for my OS?

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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The Wilderbeast
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Posted: 9th Feb 2012 21:08
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No, you cannot easily use an SD card as RAM; A 32GB SD card which has the same memory bandwidth as DDR3 RAM would eat a nice hole in your wallet - if they even exist.

Same goes for booting your OS - just buy an SSD.


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sprite
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Posted: 9th Feb 2012 21:43
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When I mean a case is a case don't buy any old crap. Your not going to get anything that's the latests design. UV lights and shouts "PC engaged". While airflow is import the OP really has been price out of new kit.

To be honest I can't think when I looked at my PC case last bar to put a CD in. I don't even look to turn it on. Seriously think about it how much time today have you looked at you PC case. I can bet its less than 5 mins.

For the OP

Hercules ATX Mid Tower Steel PC Computer Case, Black from ebay $30
It is not great case but there are deals out there.

I'll add something later on.
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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 10th Feb 2012 00:18
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what does "OP" mean? u talkin bout this case??

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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sprite
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Posted: 10th Feb 2012 00:37
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OP means Original Poster.

I'll add something later on.
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The Wilderbeast
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Posted: 10th Feb 2012 00:40
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Quote: "To be honest I can't think when I looked at my PC case last bar to put a CD in. I don't even look to turn it on. Seriously think about it how much time today have you looked at you PC case. I can bet its less than 5 mins. "

Who said all cases above $100 have to be flashy? In fact quite the contrary, the more you spend, the less tacky/flashy they get.


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kaedroho
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Posted: 10th Feb 2012 00:42 Edited at: 10th Feb 2012 00:44
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Quote: "6 (or more) USB 3.0 ports"

Quote: "Genuine Win7 Ultimate 64-BIT (or better)"


Just to let you know, Windows 7 doesn't support USB 3.0 natively. Microsoft are not planning support until Windows 8.
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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 10th Feb 2012 01:14
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ok, the USB 3.0 i only need a few since USB 2.0 will work fine. i just want a case with a good deal of fans and cooling, maybe LEDs, but def plexiglass panel so i can see in.

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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WebSlingerBoy
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Posted: 21st Mar 2012 22:00
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i actually bought a new PC. i plan on upgrading my eMachine when the warranty runs out

"Do or do not, there is no try"
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