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Geek Culture / Shoot 'Em Up Kit

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Mike Johnson
TGC Developer
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Posted: 29th Feb 2012 13:42
We have just released a new product on our site today - Shoot 'Em Up Kit.

The shoot 'em up kit allows you to create your own professional quality 2D or 3D shoot ‘em up using a powerful graphics and audio engine with just a few clicks of a mouse.

A simple game can be created in under a minute while lighting, camera views, behaviours, physics settings, shaders, particle effects and AI can be created and modified to fine-tune a complex game.



More details here: http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2312&page=index
Nickydude
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Posted: 29th Feb 2012 15:42
Where did this come from!? I'd love to see some video / examples.

I reject your reality and substitute my own...
xplosys
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Posted: 29th Feb 2012 17:02
Does it make a stand-alone executable game that can be distributed/played on other computers?

Brian.

!retupmoc eht ni deppart m'I !pleH

That Guy John
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 04:12
Quote: "Where did this come from!? I'd love to see some video / examples."


Yeah.. where did this come from?

License?
Videos?
Scriptable like FPSC?
Ease of importing media?
File formats?

Spill the beans!

And Here Is A Penguin:
FPSC OneSource [DeskTop App] - Bringing everything together into one.
MrValentine
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 09:39
Every post above x2

TOTALLY LEFT FIELD

XGames
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 11:19
Looks fantastic!

I to like to know if it can make stand-alone executable and what the deal with license?

Tall John
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 12:48
Hi, I'm John and I am one of the developers of the Shoot 'Em Up Kit. I'll be spending a lot of time here trying to answer your questions, comments and suggestions.

Firstly, thanks for the comments. It's great to hear some positive feedback.

To answer some specific questions:
The File formats it supports are x and obj for models; bmp, jpeg, png, tga, dds, dib, ppm, hdr, pfm for textures; and wav and ogg for audio.

Videos can be found at the TallStudiosLtd channel of YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/user/TallStudiosLtd
New videos are being uploaded there regularly, and we are building a list of tutorials to show off the different aspects of the Shoot 'Em Up Kit.

It is very easy to add assets. Placing them into your Shoot-Em-Up-Kit Project's models, textures, fx, or audio will cause them to be recognised by the Kit and can then be used by the editors. We are working on some tutorial videos for these at the moment.

There is a behaviour editor, which looks a bit like Unreal's Kismet Editor, and provides an object-oriented method of scripting behaviours using a drag-and-drop style GUI.

The Shoot 'Em Up Kit was designed to be a little bit like Little Big Planet (even though the project started a while before Litlle Big Planet was announced) where people shared there games online rather than building stand-alone executables. However, we have received many comments asking for stand-alone support and so we will add this as a priority.

We will issue details of the license when we have stand-alone support.

We intend to release a "Professional" version in due course which supports creating Flash, Android and iOS games too.

Thanks again for your interest.

John
Nickydude
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 12:50
All info can be found here: http://www.tallstudios.com/.

I reject your reality and substitute my own...
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 13:16
Looks interesting, could be a fun tool to play with. I actually had ideas for Shoot 'em Up a while back, but my prototype in DBP was pretty crap, hence I never ever showed it to anybody . If I decide to go ahead with it, this could be a tempting purchase, I see you've got a trial on your website, so might give it a go later.


Tall John
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 13:38
Thanks Seppuku Arts. Just let me know if I can be of any help.
SOLO DESIGN
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 14:30
Tall John this looks like a good creator, but unless it can create a stand alone program that us guys can create our own commercial/non commercial games with I really do not see the point of it.

Can you let me know when this will be included and how far off is the PRO version and what it has over the standard version please.

Many thanks and well done so far on this creator
Tall John
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 14:55
Hi Solo Design. It is clear that making a stand-alone exe, at least for Windows, is a feature which everyone wants - perhaps because we have partnered with TGC and therefore people are more technically minded than if we'd done a Steam release, for example - and so we have moved this to the top of our roadmap.

We would hope to have a version which allows stand-alone Windows games to be available within the next 2 weeks, and will be a free update the the Shoot 'Em Up Kit.

Work on the Pro version, targeting Flash, Android and iOS, has begun but is still several months off.
Captain Coder
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 17:54
@Tall John:

Welcome to the forums!

This is a very interesting kit - I think I would like to try to purchase it. Just out of curiosity, does this support 1st person? I ask because I am just wondering if there is a new competitor for FPSC

Quote: "The Shoot 'Em Up Kit was designed to be a little bit like Little Big Planet... where people shared there games online"


Will the update still support online sharing, and how is it designed to distribute online (I am not familiar with Little Big Planet)?

Quote: "We will issue details of the license when we have stand-alone support."


I'll be waiting anxiously to hear this.

All in all, looks excellent Hope business will be good for you guys

@Nickydude: Thanks for the link!

Captain Coder

As a believer in Jesus Christ, I am trying to use my passion for game creation for His glory.
henry ham
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 18:47
Quote: "Tall John this looks like a good creator, but unless it can create a stand alone program that us guys can create our own commercial/non commercial games with I really do not see the point of it."


agreed

Quote: "We would hope to have a version which allows stand-alone Windows games to be available within the next 2 weeks, and will be a free update the the Shoot 'Em Up Kit."


great news, i will buy when this comes out

Quote: "Work on the Pro version, targeting Flash, Android and iOS, has begun but is still several months off."


any ideas on the price for this ? if we buy the basic version will there be an upgrade option ?

cheers henry

Tall John
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 18:55
Hi Captain Coder! It would be very cheeky of me to create a rival to FPSC and then ask TGC to promote and distribute it. But, to answer your question, it is a 3D engine and so you can set the camera into first person. However, the AI systems are more suited to shmups than games like Halo or Unreal.

The update will support both online sharing and the creation of stand-alone applications.

The online sharing works by allowing the user to package a game and upload it to a server with a couple of clicks of the mouse.

If you have uploaded a game then anyone with the Shoot 'Em Up Kit can choose "Play" on the main menu, and then click "Search" to retrieve a list of games people have uploaded. Selecting a game will download it onto your PC ready to be played from within the Shoot 'Em Up Kit.

Thanks for your interest and support. It is much appreciated.
Tall John
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 19:08
Hi Henry! Thanks for your kind response.

There will definitely be an upgrade option; and the standard and pro versions will be 100% compatible so that people who have invested time with the standard version will be up-and-running with the pro version immediately.
rolfy
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 20:53 Edited at: 1st Mar 2012 21:07
I have tried importing meshes into this and no success (using free trial).

Quote: "The first steps are to create a 3D mesh using a 3D modelling package such as Softimage Mod Tool. The Mesh should be exported as a DirectX (.X) format model. It may be either a compressed or uncompressed .x file. The model should then be copied into the My Documents\Shoot-Em-Up Kit Projects\models folder."


After following steps and trying both .x and .obj it refuses to show up in the browser tab.


*Edit
Ok scratch that just realised I was putting them in wrong place so imported fine but with missing faces, will take a further look at that.

Awesome! Its one of those threads.
Tall John
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 21:06 Edited at: 1st Mar 2012 21:20
Hi Rolfy,

EDIT: I though this was a bug, panicked, and came to the wrong conclusion. You don't need to restart to add assets, although you do need to close and re-open the model viewer - or, as you mentioned, hit Rebuild.

I like your suggestion of having a named list of models, and we will add this an option.

Thanks for the feedback.
rolfy
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 21:20
I got the missing poly issue fixed and am gonna take this baby for a spin...thanks,

Awesome! Its one of those threads.
michael x
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 03:29 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2012 03:58
I think this is cool I plan to get this. but one thing is there a 64bit version of this program?

more than what meets the eye

Welcome to SciFi Summer
seppgirty
FPSC Developer
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 03:53
this looks very promising and if you can create a 3rd person shooter with this then i am in i agree that it needs a stand alone exe.... could you give more info about the camera. does it do TDS over the shoulder 3rd person camera.... ect...? looking forward to more info.

gamer, lover, filmmaker
Design Runner
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 03:56
The camera is completely free, meaning you can place it anywhere and have you follow anything with it. You can even switch through multiple cameras throughout the game.

rolfy
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 04:41
One thing this does need is more tutorials and better documentation, I have tried linking a camera to player model and can get it to follow but cant seem to get the camera to rotate with the object in true 'over the shoulder' manner when the model changes rotation the camera simply pans alongside till the entity is facing ahead again then follows normally once more.

My aim was to have a 'fly through' caves and tunnels game style which requires the camera rotation with the player, it took a fair bit of trial and error to get what I have so far but cant seem to lock the camera to player direction.

Awesome! Its one of those threads.
Tall John
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 09:33
Hi Michael. I'm pleased you like it.

The Shoot 'Em Up Kit works on 32 and 64 bit editions of Windows XP, Vista and Windows 7. I'm running it on Windows 7 64 bit at the moment.
Tall John
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 09:52
Hi Rolfy. Thanks for letting me know about the problems you have experienced in trying to set up the camera you want.

We are trying to improve the documentation all the time, and create a comprehensive range of video tutorials, so it is useful to hear where people are struggling so that we can focus our attention.
fallen one
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 13:19
This is interesting and has come at the right time, a conclusions I have come to developing apps is that the best business strategy over the sheer lottery and randomness that is mobile development is developing 'long-term' I.P. My large projects can require long development cycles, if a unique and compelling I.P is created, one can create subsidiary quick turnover projects.

Iv'e been working on a mobile 2d shoot em up set in the same game world as one of long term projects, this NEW 3d shoot em up engine, looks like a nice step up from that project below for the future.



Iv'e got a few ideas about using models with baked in textures, matched with the skybox so I can get the same thing that is in my 3d program into this 3d game engine, net result if done right is a game with beautiful visuals, regardless of the engines capabilities.

I think what will make or break this program is functionality, total level size capability, enemies or game content size in level or on screen, if it has any flaws, like extreme file size for relatively small amounts of content, or if you can only have one level per game, or requiring super high computer specs to play for what might perhaps be a low spec game etc.

possible features?
altering camera position, example, go from isometric view to behind view with a smooth track between, also a random movement change, so if we have a side dolly shot, the camera can move slightly (think handheld cam moving slightly, giving a hand held camera feel, as if its not fixed in a tripod) same goes for the dolly track, capability for random angle, this tells the player, yea this is 3d, not sprites viewed only from 'one set' position. It helps sell the 3D perspective more.

'circular' game play, 'central' gun 'surrounded' by incoming waves, beach head game style.

Lots of potential for sure. I think the market is open to this, if it is brought correctly together, potentially its something that could generate a lot of interest.

If any user creates a showcase project in this, it will give it the gravitas to push media interest. It will be interesting seeing what users can come up with.


nnndohh
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 15:03
question, can you do the same things like you can do with game maker 8 ?

like platform games?
add your own code ?

are there any limitations in game building?

if so, this would be a next ( better? ) version of darkbasic pro
Tall John
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 15:42
Hi nnndohh. The Shoot 'Em Up Kit is quite a flexible piece of software, but all the defaults and in-game assets focus around shoot 'em ups.

The Shoot 'Em Up Kit uses PhysX and so it would be possible to create an impulse whenever you want a character to jump, and the character will stop falling when it 'lands' on a platform.

You can add script using the Behaviour Editor, which is a drag-and-drop based object-oriented editor. However, this is more suited to small blocks of code as opposed to DarkBasic Pro which is based around a full programming language.

But there are no limitations in game building. We look forward to seeing what the community creates with this.
michael x
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 16:14
fallen one you are right I do to wonder about the map size.but the low end game specs should not be a big deal. to play AAA game you would need something high end. to make your own AAA game you would need to run at high end specs. the less limit you have the more you can do.not say you will be able to make such a game with this.

Tall John will this have free roaming like starfox64?

I hope does work well with my 64bit. but 64bit made program can take advantage of the extra ram, cores, and more. the limitation will be more up to the programmer.

more than what meets the eye

Welcome to SciFi Summer
Tall John
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 17:39
Hi Michael X and Fallen One. I'm happy to confirm there are no artificial limits on map size, and you can create multiple levels.

You can have a free roaming game like Starfox 64, and we are working on a video tutorial to show how this is done.
michael x
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 19:20
that is great news. cant wait until my order is ready for download. thanks tall john.

more than what meets the eye

Welcome to SciFi Summer
Blobby 101
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 19:25
This looks really great, unfortunately I can't get the demo to work - when I run it I just get these 3 errors in succession: "The D3D device has a non-zero reference count, meaning some objects were not released.", "Failed creating D3D device objects." and a generic error saying that the kit had to close. Any ideas?

mnemonic
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 19:41
I like it. Have not yet played around with it so much. To tell you the thrut I gave up when I relaized that you could not make standalone exes.

But now, when I read that this feature will be released, I'm waiting eagerly

www.memblockgames.com
That Guy John
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 20:43
Tall John -
Quote: "Hi, I'm John and I am one of the developers of the Shoot 'Em Up Kit. I'll be spending a lot of time here trying to answer your questions, comments and suggestions. "


You want questions, comments, suggestions... you came to the right market of people here, just watch what you ask for.

On another note, you have found the right community to get involved with on this. If it gains momentum, you will probably see quite a few 3rd Party apps popping up for this.

(downloading Demo)

And Here Is A Penguin:
FPSC OneSource [DeskTop App] - Bringing everything together into one.
Tall John
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 01:24
Hi Blobby 101. A couple of people have experienced this. It is a problem with the shadow mapping shader which, I suspect, is a graphics card driver issue.

We are currently testing a build which doesn't abort (causing the 3 errors in succession) if this shader fails, and will investigate the cause of problem.

If you get in touch via the contact form on the Tall Studios site http://www.tallstudios.com/contact then we can work through the issue with you.

Thanks for bringing this to our attention.
xplosys
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 16:52
Quote: "This looks really great, unfortunately I can't get the demo to work - when I run it I just get these 3 errors in succession: "The D3D device has a non-zero reference count, meaning some objects were not released.", "Failed creating D3D device objects." and a generic error saying that the kit had to close. Any ideas?"


The first time I installed I changed the default install directory, and I got the same errors when I tried to run the program. I uninstalled and then let it install in the default directory and it ran correctly. I don't know if that was the issue or a fluke, but it didn't have to do with graphics card. Perhaps the program is looking for something in a hard coded directory? Just a thought.

Brian.

!retupmoc eht ni deppart m'I !pleH

Tall John
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 22:01
Hi Brian. That's very interesting - thanks for letting me know. We've got a work-around that we're releasing very shortly, but you may have given us a big clue as to the cause. Many thanks!
ploppy4
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 22:30
Will there be a forum for seuk at TGC ?
The one at tall studios is a bit quiet !

In regards to the program, i have managed to crash it once when trying to alter the camera on one of the tutorial files. I forget which one, so not much of a bug report, lol .. but i will see if i can do it again, it may just have been my own pc at fault.

Like someone mentioned, it would be much more appealing if we could create stand-alone files, but i understand thats coming soon.

There is a plus version coming also ? will there be an upgrade path to it ?

regards

<none>
BlackFox
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 23:35 Edited at: 3rd Mar 2012 23:39
Another great software piece for developers wanting to switch gears and develop some "shoot em up" style games. We took this for a spin and really liked what we had seen. Looking forward to purchasing this. May have to clone myself yet again so I can get all my work done in DBP, FPSC, and now this. And buy a second desktop for Mrs. Fox so she can work too.

Quote: "The first time I installed I changed the default install directory, and I got the same errors when I tried to run the program. I uninstalled and then let it install in the default directory and it ran correctly. I don't know if that was the issue or a fluke, but it didn't have to do with graphics card. Perhaps the program is looking for something in a hard coded directory? Just a thought."


I can confirm Brian's findings. We too installed in a folder other than the default "Program Files\Tall Studios\...", and received the errors. Once we uninstalled and reinstalled, it worked fine. Happened both on our Windows 7 64-bit and Vista Premium 32-bit.


Twitter: @NFoxMedia
Tall John
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 23:35
Hi Blobby 101. We have updated the trial and retail versions on the Tall Studios website to include a work-around for the problems you were experiencing. However, we are also investigating xplosys' suggestion that it could be caused by the changing the installation directory.

Thanks for your patience.
Tall John
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 23:47
Hi Ploppy4. Yes, the forum on the Tall Studios site is very quiet, but if you post there it will get picked-up by one of the team and maybe, with time, one of the community. It was pretty much ignored by everyone in the Beta testing stage and it has only been since launching that we've had anyone ask about it.

I'll have a chat TGC and see if they would like to start a Shoot Em Up Kit forum on this site instead.

I'm sorry you have experienced a crash while using a camera. If I can be of any help then just let me know.

We're working on the stand-alone version. To be honest, most of the issues are to do with licensing and so as soon as these are sorted we will provide the upgrade.

We are also working on a Plus (Professional) version and there will definitely be an upgrade path and 100% compatability between the Standard and Professional versions.
Tall John
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2012 23:49
Hi BlackFox. Thanks for taking the Shoot 'Em Up Kit for a spin and, on the way, confirming Brian's findings. It is really useful to know.
Blobby 101
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 00:06
Thanks a lot! The new version works now I have to say, it seems like a really good piece of software! Gonna have a play around with it tomorrow but one thing i've noticed is that the UI can clip through objects in your scene if you get close enough - I think you just need to turn off zsorting on the objects that you're using for the UI.

old_School
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 05:06 Edited at: 4th Mar 2012 05:06
Not sure if this was covered or not but I have some questions:

1. It says "you can create a simple game in a few clicks" and looking it the program/engine its self is very basic so why would I want to use your engine and not just make my own version?

2. Is this full of "little" bugs like FPSC and we will have 18 plus versions before bugs get worked out or is this "bug free"?

3. Do you offer the source code?

4. What language was this written in? I assume DB but I have to ask of course.

5. Final question benifit of your product vs. Visual Studio or other engines out there that are free/paid that would be simular?
tasmanian guy
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 08:05
I've purchased this and am a bit disappointed.

Running on Windows 7 64 bit with 8gb ram and Nvidia graphics card.
I5 2nd gen processor

I click on play.
Click on search
comes up with a list

Click on a game
and it goes back to the selection game.

very buggy for me at the moment :-(

DBPro is the new Amos (I hope)
Tall John
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 13:01
Hi old_School. The Shoot Em Up Kit was created to enable people with little or no programming knowledge to create their own games. An experienced programmer could create their own shmups using visual studio and other engines.

I can't promise this is "bug free" and tasmanian guy seems to have just proved that. But I can promise we are dealing with bugs as soon as they arise.

The Shoot 'Em Up Kit was written in C++; and I'm sorry but we are not offering the source code as this is a retail product and not an engine like Unreal, for example.

Thanks for the questions.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 13:02
Quote: "1. It says "you can create a simple game in a few clicks" and looking it the program/engine its self is very basic so why would I want to use your engine and not just make my own version? "


If you're not a programmer, you want to have a bit of fun and are feeling creative without doing anything too serious. Plus it's less time consuming and that's always a big advantage for somebody who wants to jump in and create.

Quote: "5. Final question benifit of your product vs. Visual Studio or other engines out there that are free/paid that would be simular?"


It's pretty poor to try and compare it to Visual Studio. I guess it'd be like saying, "why buy a car when you can walk?" There's lots of places a car can't access that can be accessed by walking and walking is free, but a car will get you to your destination a lot quicker.

I think that's a fair analogy for these kind of tools vs Visual Studio. But at the end of the day it depends on what you want out of these sorts of tools, if you want what Visual Studio offers, then obviously it's not going to benefit you.


Tall John
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 13:06
Hi tasmanian guy. Thanks for purchasing the Shoot Em Up Kit and I'm sorry some bugs have left you feeling disppointed. As I've just mentioned in my post to old_School, I would like to assure you that we are tackling bugs as soon as they arise.
Tall John
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 13:31
Hi Blobby 101. I'm pleased it's working for you now, and I'm glad that you like it.

Thanks for pointing out the z-clipping issue. It should be sorted quite soon as we are re-working the UI to take advantage of a few optimisations.
Indicium
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Posted: 4th Mar 2012 14:35
Quote: "5. Final question benifit of your product vs. Visual Studio or other engines out there that are free/paid that would be simular?"


I'm starting to think you just love asking ridiculous questions! This is a tool for creating games whereas Visual Studio is a collection of programming languages (which can't make a 3D game without the inclusion of additional libraries). What you've basically asked is, why use blender when I can open notepad and plot the vertices myself? Or as I've said to you before, why use a screwdriver when you could go and build your own?

From what I've seen this looks like a awesome program, I think it's a step up from FPSC (I can't really say that without using it, I know, but that's the way it seems) because it has more control over it. I won't be buying it because I prefer to program myself, but good luck with it.

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