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Work in Progress / cribbage game

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m2design
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Posted: 30th Nov 2012 23:36 Edited at: 19th May 2013 07:04
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|Download removed|

Game no longer available at this location
Latest build now at the Whisper studio web site.
See address below.

Thanks


Request
If anyone has downloaded Lucky Dog cribbage and had any problems getting it to run - Please post the issue.(Missing dll/images,etc)

Thanks to Virtual Nomad for the video



Give it a try and let me know.
Thanks to everyone for your comments[b][/b][b]


http://www.whisperstudio01.com

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m2design
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Posted: 1st Dec 2012 03:13 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 00:22
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Screen shot for Luck Dog Cribbage.Showing graphics and listing some game features



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MrValentine
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Posted: 1st Dec 2012 03:13 Edited at: 8th Dec 2012 23:27
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Oh well...

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m2design
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Posted: 1st Dec 2012 03:20
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Wip means work in progress and that is exactly what my request is.
I would like comments on a work in PROGRESS!
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Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 1st Dec 2012 04:27 Edited at: 1st Dec 2012 04:49
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1st, a screenshot to keep this thread open and invite others to try it (supplying only an .exe is a deterrent, otherwise):



2nd, know that i've been playing cribbage pretty regularly for the past couple years (3-5 times a week, hours on end... work gets slow and i gotta do something...). but, i do lose 50% of the time, so i'm no master (the person i play with has atleast 30 yrs experience on me, so...). that being said, i won 2 out of 5 Lucky Dog Cribbage™ games played thus far

3rd, gameplay was a little clunky as i had to fight for control of the mouse at times (when trying to move over a card... it keeps re-positioning it away from the card) which becomes quite burdening. i see no reason why you should need to re-position the mouse at all.

4th, i watched closely that it was counting points correctly and found no flaws.

5th, i kept a pretty close eye on the AI which seemed solid, tho a couple times the computer did send some cards to the crib that i wouldn't have, or missed an opportunity to score here and there** (see below). again, i'm no master, no card counter, and have never read Cribbage for Dummies, but there were a couple instances that were questionable, in my eyes.

6th, when the "click to count cards" message is there and i click, i don't want to wait for whatever internal timer you have set to time out before the cards are counted; that detracted from the fun.

7th, some of the feedback (and most of the text) was too small. and, tho i'm sure you'll get to it, a few sound effects would go a long way.

8th, how are you deciding on the window size/resolution and are you properly taking the users' display aspect ratio into account? something doesn't look "right" (after the initial "splash" screen) and i found myseld resizing the window to make it so(-ish).

9th, are you tapping into windows' text to speech (or ?). if so, nice feature. if pre-recorded, not so much

10th, any plans to add a 2nd CPU player? 3-way has a whole other dynamic that i'd welcome here. and, what about online play?


i've got a couple cribbage-based game ideas in mind and thought i'd be the only one here who might be interested. therefore, i was pleasantly surprised to see this WIP posted.

thanks for sharing

** in the screenshot attached, i led the 8 (i play aggressively most of the time ) and the CPU countered with the 3 instead of the scoring 7 as i would have expected. am i missing something?

ack: i don't know what happened above while i was playing the demo and posting... it seems one of our self-appointed forum police had an issue but please do re-post as this WIP is exactly proper.

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m2design
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Posted: 1st Dec 2012 05:03
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Virtual Nomad

Thanks for taking the time to download and play the game.I think all of your comments have validity and I will respond to each as soon as I can.

Thanks for posting the screen shot, it helps (I could not figure out how to do it, on short notice. Because not everyone uses a monitor and or video card that supports 1280x720 the resolution logic looks at all of the resolution combinations on video card, if the card or monitor does not support 1280x720 then the screen setup defaults to 1080x764 which you screen shot indicates is the case.
If true then you have to tinker. Not sure how I will handle this.
As to the lead of an 8 the cpu suspects that lead indicates the player may hold a six(for a run) or (9 for a run) a run of which he does not have a card available to continue said possible run.
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Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 1st Dec 2012 05:12 Edited at: 1st Dec 2012 16:55
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Quote: "the cpu suspects that lead indicates the player may hold a six or a 9"

i was hoping you'd say that as it indicates there is some proper AI in place. thanks. i can wait for the rest of the responses until after you've re-posted the top post

ok, done waiting:

the graphics are nice. it needs some tweaking (i'd suggest higher resolution textures on the card faces, for starters. and, larger text, as mentioned), but it looks good.

is it 100% 3D (including the score pad in the top-left corner of the screenshot above, the Click Now pop-up, and the pegs, too (i just now noticed their long shadows?)) ?

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m2design
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Posted: 1st Dec 2012 23:14
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Item 3. I have removed all position mouse statements - seems to leave the mouse where last used. At some point I had a blinking card problem that repositioning the mouse solved. Tis a mystery. seems to work ok now (I hope)
Item 6. I remove the timer so you should not have to wait.
Item 7. Not sure I agree with text size comment. Could you be specific. The program contains speech but for speech during play you need to click on the voice [On] button below the gribbage board. I am using DBPro expansion pack voice commands. They can sometimes get a little old thus the user choice options. Note the toggle buttons (Blue) control the speed of the card delivery.
Item 8. I do have a problem with window size/resolution. The code seems to work on my computer with no manipulation by the user. DBPro requires me to set a initial size for the opening screen. It is set at 1024x768 to make the program usable for the user that does not have access to the wide screen monitor or graphics card that supports the 1280x720 size and resolution I want to work in. The program initiates in the 1024x768 mode and the cycles thru the resolution settings of the user video card and monitor if 1280x720 is available then the settings are reset to that size. Any hints would be welcome.
Item 9. see above
Item 10. not yet plus I do not understand the process for online play.
I will try to explain the ai in a following post.

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m2design
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2012 00:18
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CPU play logic (AI): step 1.There are 15 possible 4 card combinations that can be formed from 6 dealt cards. The cpu looks at each of the 15 possible 4 card combinations and records in an array the points that will score on each possible hand. The 4 card hand that will score the most points is selected for play and the remaining 2 cards become the crib cards.
Step 2. if several of the 4 card hands counted will score the same amount of points then the cpu will anylize the crib of each of the tied hands and will select the hand with the best 2 crib cards for the computer hand or the weakest 2 crib cards for the player. There are now 25 statements to be used in this determination - the list may get longer during future development.
Step 3. if the computer is to open hand play it will look at each card in his hand to decide which card will not allow possible points. There is always a possibility the opponent will double but that is a smaller risk. If computer hand contains a pair or three of a kind may lead with that card. He will also consider leading with a card that depending on his anaysis of his other cards he has determined a good chance of forming a run.
If the player opens play then the cpu's task is to determine his response. He may respond with a play that results in instant points or based on the player lead may determine his
hand contains cards that will lead to a better oppertunity for a higher score later in play. This decision is based on calculated statistical odds (not always correct)
Note: At no time does the cpu have access to the player card values or suit (No cheating)
This a little brief but the best I can do in a limited space - it can get a little complicated.

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m2design
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2012 00:27 Edited at: 4th Dec 2012 02:13
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Everything is 3d except the score chart upper left corner and the count click prompts,these are sprites.
Even the cards are 3d with the card back image and the face graphics applied to a 3d object that can be rotated to show which ever surface required. The cards are shuffled and stacked into the deck just as in real life - pretty much a real deck of cards.

See top post for latest version posted 12/3/2012.
Waiting for the post to appear - for some reason the forum has decided I am a new to the forum so the will be a delay.
Go figure!

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Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2012 02:52 Edited at: 2nd Dec 2012 03:03
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thanks for the speedy response in both the latest version (which worked without issue, including the mouse behavior) and the follow-up posts.

i'm thoroughly enjoying the update as it feeds my impatience w/ the delays now removed. i don't play casual games casually and you've provided a means to feed both needs.

re: darkvoices: cool. probably the only thing i've played/used with that plug-in. it's fine, and i can turn it off, as you noted, if/when it annoys me (so far, it hasn't so much).

re: the in-game text, it's not necessarily the sizes but the legibility of the font choices and a lack of contrast with surrounding colors. red is a hard color to use on computers, tho i understand the desire to do. it "stands out" but that doesn't mean it's easy to read. and, the relatively thin-lined fonts used in white, red & "gold" doesn't help with that. see fig #1 (these are actual/not re-sized screen snippets):



white on a lighter-blue background in the "Pair for" indicator in #2 is "blurry", as well. the "5" count in #3 suffers most is it's the furthest away.

1) are you setting the camera aspect to match the monitor's? (that's why i asked whether it was all 3d or not)

2) consider kaedroho's anistropic plugin.

3) the 3D "No" indicator shown when we try to play an invalid card (as shown in fig #1 above) would do well if it was pointed at the camera, as would end-of-round scores (tho you'd lose the illusion of them laying on the table).

4) mentioning this last as i'm sure it falls under "not recommended" (tho i've had good luck with it): try sizing the window and display mode to 1/2 the desktop dimensions. the matrix1utils (#13) can help, too.

i'll leave it at that, and please know they're minor issues (in fact, i notice them less and less the more that i play). again, i'm thoroughly enjoying what you've offered here.

re: online play, that can be version 2. i was hoping to challenge you to a match at some point, tho, as we share a common interest

meanwhile, do you have any concerns that haven't been addressed? and, do you have any features that you intend to add/are working on?

ps: nice, new sig. you'll find it comes in handy

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m2design
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Posted: 5th Dec 2012 00:14
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"This is not what a WIP board is for..."

This was posted to this thread and I do not understand why.

I am trying to get feedback on a card game I am trying to finish and this looked like the place to do it. For some reason I was locked out of the thread and had to wait 2 days before I could post again. I was told I was a new user and my posts will have to be reviewed for a period of time.

I have been a member for 2 years.

What did I do wrong?

I do not want to be using the forum in a manner that is incorrect or makes anyone unhappy. Please fill me in on why I might have had a problem.

If this is the wrong area for me to post please tell me why.

Thanks

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MrValentine
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Posted: 5th Dec 2012 05:43
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Quote: ""This is not what a WIP board is for..."

This was posted to this thread and I do not understand why."


I said so, because usually you show an image or two, and then ask for feedback, not whether you should continue on something we cannot see... anyway forget that, this seems to have turned into a WIP board... yet I am unsure... My view counts for nothing in the argument whether it is a WIP board or not, it is up to a MOD...

Regarding your SLAP, did you do something silly lately? I would not know, I would suggest you contacted a MOD and asked them to check the notes on your username... Maybe it was a mistake by one of the MODs...

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Indicium
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Posted: 5th Dec 2012 12:41
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He's slapped for repeatedly making threads to test his avatar, IIRC.


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
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MrValentine
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Posted: 5th Dec 2012 12:47
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Indeed

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Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 17:25
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m2design,

i just saw your edit of the first post; as this thread has become somewhat soiled, you're welcome to email me directly if you wish to continue discussion.

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TheComet
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 17:52
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@ m2design

What people have said about this thread not being a WIP is a bunch of crap. They don't have the right to say if your post qualifies or not, that's up to a moderator to decide. Don't you listen to anyone telling you off if they aren't a moderator, ok?

Now, I'd like to test your game and give you feedback on it, would you mind re-uploading it again?

TheComet

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BlackFox
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 22:39
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@ m2design,

I too saw the edit in the first post. I must say we were really enjoying your progress, since we've played cribbage for many years- my wife and I began playing long before computers starting coming into the home (it was all we had to pass time some nights and we'd end up having tournaments with family members). I hope you will bring this WIP back one day, and if you ever release it, we'd definitely purchase it.

Best of luck.


There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
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MrValentine
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 23:27
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Have a read of this and then repost... I too hope to see more of this soon!!! The late screenshots looked great!

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Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 00:18 Edited at: 9th Dec 2012 00:18
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Quote: "Have a read of this and then repost... "

why don't you stop playing MOD so threads like this don't get derailed in the first place?

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MrValentine
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 01:44
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When did I play MOD? All I said was it was not how the thread was used when all he had was an exe and a bit of text... and I did make clear I have no voice over the matter... please read...

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Chris Tate
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 14:25 Edited at: 9th Dec 2012 14:27
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A little too fast with the screenshot complaints. It really feels frustrating when you spend hundreds of hours producing work and make announcement about up and coming content; and the first reply you receive is a complaint about the lack of screenshots. I know because the same thing happened to me, and the very first thing I posted contained an extremely large image which linked to screenshots and videos, it was really late at night and I was in the process of preparing further images.

A screenshot is not always desirable; for one thing the game may not look quite ready, however it 99% the work done may not be graphical. This is a programming board, not Deviant Art.

At other times you may not have the experience in the forums to know that having nice easy pictures to look at are a big thing for some people. There's a gallery section for posting major screenshots; right here its more about the program.

Surely this WIP is for customers who purchased a product to showcase their work that's not quite ready; although sometimes people make silly posts, this one was not silly; it's important to have discussion about your plans and ideas; otherwise there's no constructive feedback to work with.

I just feel the guy should not have abandoned the thread over one complaint. Disagreements are to be expected, no matter how good something is, there will always be complaints; if TGC get complaints so will you and me. It's nice to see some card games here once and a while, some variation in genre. The game looks really professional; something relaxing to play.

I hope he changes his mind and makes a new thread, and continues with his good work.

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MrValentine
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 18:34
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Chris Tate /

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m2design
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 23:16 Edited at: 9th Dec 2012 23:31
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Hello..
I have re-posted the file.see top post.Thanks for the comments

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TheComet
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 23:36
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Quote: "When did I play MOD?"


Like... every single post of yours was either playing mod, or trolling?

This thread qualifies to be a WIP, end of story.

@ m2design

Thanks for uploading it again. Now for some feedback *cracks knuckles*

I had no idea what I was doing, because I don't know this card game.

Nevertheless, the graphics are better than what we usually get around here, you even put shadows on the pin thingies on the board.

The controls are intuitive, no problem there in my opinion.

I like how you used the board to print debug information rather than just printing it to the screen.

Also very nice job on the way you "deal" the cards, feels realistic.

I suggest increasing the graphical detail even more by using a shader. You can move on over to EVOLVED for some nice examples. I was thinking bump mapping would give your wood a nice texture. Just download a few of the demos and give them a go.

That's all I can really say about it. It is certainly a good start and I can see this becoming very nice with just a little more work.

TheComet

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MrValentine
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 23:46 Edited at: 9th Dec 2012 23:48
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Quote: "Like... every single post of yours was either playing mod, or trolling?"


Having an opinion counts as trolling? shall keep that in mind,...

And no idea what you are referring to, I never suggested anything...

Quote: "This thread qualifies to be a WIP, end of story."


Agreed

I never intended this to go on as much as it did, just naivety pushes on...
Just reiterating for clarity as I said this and it was ignored and then made ridiculed... which is simply stupid...

Quote: "My view counts for nothing in the argument whether it is a WIP board or not, it is up to a MOD..."


EDIT

Crap all that stupid argumentation made me forget to mention...

m2design, perhaps use a shader to also make those cards have a shiny reflection?

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m2design
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 01:35
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MrValentine/TheComment-Truce, lets all make up

Thanks to both of you for the shader idea,I am looking into now.

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BlackFox
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 03:23
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@ m2design

Since my wife and I play this game every night to relax, we took your game for a spin. We loved the interface. It is nice, clean, and easy to follow. The scoring page on the left once the hand is done showing the points for that hand is very useful. We like the ability to turn sound on/off and adjust the speed of the cards, and we also like how you can save and continue later. So far after two games played, we have seen no errors as far as playing and counting including pairs, runs, last card, and pegging.

Just a couple of questions:

Are you allowing for "skunk" (90 points or less) and "double skunk" (60 points or less)?

Will you allow for cribbage board style? For example, toggle between the one you have, the standard cribbage board, or one in the shape of "29" or any other type that is available.

Overall... Great work on this. We enjoyed it.


There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
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m2design
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 05:36 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 05:41
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BlackFox

Yes, Both features are included - the small gold tiles on the board
indicate the locations for both. I am pretty sure both skunk types work.
My wife says she has been victim and a victimizer several times.

Not sure about other cribbage board styles, not something I had thought about.
Glad you enjoy - let me know if you think Lucky dog is competitive. Or just a so so player

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BlackFox
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 19:26
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m2design,

My apologies for not seeing the small gold tiles marking skunk/double skunk. We did notice one little thing- it is not a bother for us but in case it bothers others. On the last stretch of the board the pegs appear to not be in line with the holes. I've taken a screenshot to show what I mean.



The red pegs (computer player) are perfect, but the green pegs (human player) appear slightly offset from the holes. Other than that, all the counts are correct, including when drawing a Jack or holding a Jack for "nobs", which some people tend to forget. As far as difficulty we find it is good. The first game I lost by 8 points, the second I won by 2, this one looks like I will win again. Are you planning to have a toggle for "difficulty" level, or leaving as one setting?


There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
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m2design
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 20:34
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Thanks for catch on the green pegs - I have played this thing umpteen times and never saw it. I think it might be called tunnel vision!

I hope to come up a thought process for the computer to make the play more intellegent and then back it down from there.
Not there yet.

Thanks

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m2design
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 20:47
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Question ...
if there is anyone who has tried playing the game on a computer that does not support screen size/resolution of 1280x720?

I ask because the game runs a routine to force the resolution to
1024 x 768 if 1280x720 is not available, I think it works but ...
I do not have access to a computer that does not support the higher res.

Thanks

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BlackFox
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 23:28
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Quote: "if there is anyone who has tried playing the game on a computer that does not support screen size/resolution of 1280x720? "


We have a VM that does not support 1280x720- the max resolution I can use is 1024x768 on this particular VM. I assumed by the fact the game opened and played, it did what it was suppose to do by setting to the resolution specified.


There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
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Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 06:02 Edited at: 11th Dec 2012 06:08
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my window's client area comes up as (an un-supported) 1140x720 (1154x754 overall window) and it's a bit blury, as mentioned.

the adjustments to the count and invalid play ("no") indicators definitely made a big difference, to me. thanks for that.

blackfox's comments caused me to google cribbage board images. i never knew there were so many variations. i keep a "travel" board with me at work:


...but hinged in the middle (&a slot underneath to keep the pegs).

and, the "29" is slick!

additional boards is something you could consider if you go any kind of "commercial" with this. there are tons of 3D mah jongg games out there but i've never seen a 3D cribbage, tho i never looked (i'd been playing @ pogo.com until you provided this gem )

thanks for the update.

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m2design
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 07:25 Edited at: 30th Jan 2013 19:05
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Virtual Nomad...

If your system does not support 1280x720 the program should set up
to 1024x768. Check Black Fox post. At that setting on my system it is not fuzzy. I am using the same camera setting used on the 1280x720 setup for the 1024x768 set up causes the image to be a little clipped but not by much.



Here is a listing of the code that sets up the res/monitor

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m2design
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 18:23 Edited at: 30th Jan 2013 19:06
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Virtual Nomad...
If you get a chance, would you please download and run the cribbage test.exe included with this post.This is not official exe
and it will not effect the game version you are using for play just a test version that you can delete if you like.
I have added a line of code that will display what screen resolution the program is setting on your computer.
Please Post the data displayed so I can see the problem I may have.
I do not want to set values that are not official support of the video card.
I have also added the line for aspect as per your suggestion.

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m2design
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 00:57
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MrValentine...
I understand you are using windows 8. If you have time could I impose on you to download Lucky Dog Cribbage from the top post and just see if it will run on win8.

Thanks

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MrValentine
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 01:19
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VOICE = WORKING
GAME = WORKING
ANIMATION SPEED = PRETTY FAST

Works on Windows 8 Pro x64

Hope that helps

Are you using DarkVoices?

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m2design
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 01:49
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Thank you very much - that helps me make a decision on upgrading to win 8.
I am using the voice commands that are part of the expansion package.

Did you have to install the DirectX 9.0c or does win 8 already have that capability?
Again thanks for taking the time.

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MrValentine
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 01:58
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You have to install the DX9.0c library that works for DBP projects, and yeah I figured you were using that... I have it too

I was thinking to use it in my current project and hearing the Windows 8 voices made me decide "Yes" straight away

Word of advice, if you have 3DWS and use it, it does not work [for the time being] in Windows 8 as it uses OpenGL 1.2... other than that as mentioned elsewhere, I have only found "Screen Width, Height, Depth" to have issues so far...

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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 08:24
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Very impressed with your graphics.

I don't really know anything about cribbage, so I cannot offer any constructive criticism there, but I might be able to help with screen shots. I use photobucket. It's very intuitive - I was able to set up an account and get screenshots on my posts here in about 20 minutes.

no Sig
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Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 14:45 Edited at: 12th Dec 2012 14:46
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short on time this a.m. but did run the test version. screenshots attached:



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Chris Tate
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 19:34 Edited at: 12th Dec 2012 19:37
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At last somebody made a card game.

I like the way it looks; it runs smoothly on my old AMD 64 3200 machine. I have no idea how to play, but love the look of it.

I don't personally think it needs more visual attention, as I have seen thousands of card games, loads of card games out there that are making money which don't look half as good and at such a crisp resolution. You've even put shadows in there. I can tell you right now there are more people playing card games which look half as good as yours, than there are people playing many of the AAA titles combined.

All it needs IMO is a menu with options and help for people who do not know how to play.

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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 21:14 Edited at: 30th Jan 2013 19:07
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Virtual Nomad

Thanks for the screen shot - based on that I am confident that the code for game size/resolution is correct. We are both looking at the same thing.
Note: I made a change to the test program. It will show the modes it looked at before selecting. No need to download and re-run unless you are interested.

Thanks for the input

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m2design
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 21:22 Edited at: 12th Dec 2012 21:25
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Here is a screen shot of the data from my computer


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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 21:34 Edited at: 12th Dec 2012 21:36
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Chris Tate/RussCarl

Thanks for the encouragement.You can actually learn by playing.
With this software you can,t really make mistakes. just follow the prompts. Save the wrong cards? No big deal you just won't win as often. The game will not allow a card to be played if it is not valid. I do plan on including help menu as soon as I can.
Meantime try an internet search for simple concept cribbage rules

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Chris Tate
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 21:59
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OK, I'll have another game later tonight; I'm just uploading some stuff.

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Posted: 19th Dec 2012 00:54
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Program update

I have made a few revisions to the cribbage program.
1. Added a couple of information screens.
2. Improvments to the computer's hand and crib selection process.


Future improvments in the works:
1. Additional cribbage boards
2. Additional card back images.

The download has been updated in the Top post to reflect
the changes. Limited testing has been done to weed out any possible
errors but one never knows.
For those using previous version please consider giving the latest a try. Downloading a newer version will not affect game score history. History is saved in a file on you computer and so any revised .exe files use the same file. The exe file has a revised name so you older downloads will still be available on you computer.

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BlackFox
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Posted: 19th Dec 2012 03:44
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@ m2design

We tried out the new addition (Cribbage v2.03). We found the computer playing better than the original version. Choices are better, and it appears the CP is actually watching and pegging better than before, whether attempting to set up runs or pairing at a good chance it will only earn points. It is a more "evenly matched" play for us now.

Great work.


There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
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Posted: 19th Dec 2012 06:34
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BlackFox

Thanks for the feed back - feels good to know it works.
Took me two darn days to figure out how to make him a little smarter.Had a concept but it was a little diffucult to implement
with out messing up other program logic.

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