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Geek Culture / What browser do you use to view this forum?

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mr Handy
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2013 20:17 Edited at: 22nd Sep 2013 20:19
This thread, obviously, came to "IE vs Browsers" battle.

For me speed is not important at all (speed may vary from site to site! so in some cases you have to wait for a few seconds even on fastest browser!)
Wikipedia:
Quote: "Internet Explorer criticized for its lack of support for web standards set by the W3C. This means that the browser displays is not what should be displayed according to the W3C standard and therefore can create problems for webmasters"

This. Plus, as I have said earlier, you can't install IE10 on XP without buying new OS. When Chrome and FF runs all W3C standards on XP with ease. That is the M$ greed.

bitJericho
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2013 21:18
Quote: " Yeah I understand. They should have used AJAX, that way submission would not have been necessary; your data would go straight into the database as your input it. Your company should have hired me ."


We didn't have to move data around, we had to approve or disapprove submissions based on the user-entered input. It couldn't properly be automated.

Touch interfaces for customer support sounds aweful. Desktop client software sounds silly for customer service tools, as it would just be a client to a server somewhere anyway. We used telnet to connect directly to the server. Sending text to a client is way faster than running an HTTP server and serving, parsing and rendering html.

That said, I don't think ajax can be as fast as a straight telnet connection, maybe though.

But even with all that work being done, to what end? We'd still end up using it the exact same way. You can copy/paste a telnet window, so if the store wanted to upgrade for that capability, they can just run putty and keep the same infrastructure with many of the new benefits of a gui desktop.

Dar13
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2013 21:49
The speed improvements must in IE11. IE10 still gets its butt handed to it by Firefox and Chrome.

Tom's Hardware Benchmarks.

Chris Tate
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2013 22:18 Edited at: 22nd Sep 2013 22:27
Quote: "Touch interfaces for customer support sounds aweful"


It was a little joke; but I guess I am being a bit vague. I am probably thinking of a narrow classification of customer service; it is such a broad term really.

Sometimes pressing a big fat button the screen is so much more sensible whilst standing and moving in a fast pace environment than hitting F2 whilst avoiding F1 and F3. But in most cases a keyboard is essential.

Quote: "
Desktop client software sounds silly for customer service tools, as it would just be a client to a server somewhere anyway. We used telnet to connect directly to the server. Sending text to a client is way faster than running an HTTP server and serving, parsing and rendering html."


Quote: "That said, I don't think ajax can be as fast as a straight telnet connection, maybe though."


You know more about Telnet than me.. But I might know a little bit more about AJAX, no disrespect or anything.

When I talk about AJAX I am talking about entering information as working in a spreadsheet or form; hitting the tab key to go to the next entry. No pages, just tabs; or child windows, or what ever you need.

There is no submission to the server that you could possibly clock with a stopwatch. Quite literally, each entry is a TCP packet sent direct to your server side application as you input it. It is the basis of many cloud computing solutions, services like Google Maps. Google Docs is an example that springs to mind, only it does not need to be so fantastic; a teenager could set up an AJAX chat program in a few hours with some of the tutorials out there.

AJAX only requires two HTTP transmissions; the ones used to log in and log out.

And with powerful AJAX implementations such as google maps, it is hard to believe it would be slow in a local area network transmitting a couple of 1 or 2 kilobyte packets every minute..

About text vs http; HTTP transmissions are ASCII text based anyway.

That is my explanation of AJAX to the best of my understanding; I am not in web development anymore.

Could you tell me a little bit about Telnet? I've not used it Is it DOS based? If not then I am actually speaking for such systems, not against.
Quote: "
The speed improvements must in IE11. IE10 still gets its butt handed to it by Firefox and Chrome."


You know what, I do not think I would even bother to put much money into internet explorer myself if I were the CEO of Micrsoft; what is the point, so as long as Microsoft's websites work in the thing, who cares about people visiting google or mozilla themed websites. Microsoft have other priorities.

They are too late, they will never claim back the browser market; they should have taken it more seriously before Mozilla did. Not even google with all of their adverts on every street corner can catch up; mozilla do not need to advertise, just go to the majority of your friends houses and see what browsers they are using.

The same thing would happen if in all wierdness, Micrsoft and Google considered to create their own McDonalds themed restaurant; McD's would completely destroy them in the market.

TheComet
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2013 22:32 Edited at: 22nd Sep 2013 22:32
I use links. So much better than all of this Fox-fire-chromium-whatever the hell that is you're all using.



TheComet

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Chris Tate
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2013 22:33 Edited at: 22nd Sep 2013 22:33
Looks kinda cool!

bitJericho
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 00:10
telnet is pretty much a terminal emulator without encryption (ssh). Basically if you've ever used linux CLI, a telnet connection looks and behaves the same way (if you telnet into a linux shell)

I imagine ajax and telnet are similar if not the same. The reason I would say telnet is probably even faster though is there is no complex browser or complex front end. For example, on an old computer, google docs is incredibly slow. On the same computer, a telnet connection can be crazy fast.

Chris Tate
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 02:20
Yeah the browser needs to parse javascript; and I guess telnet is hard coded.. hope that sounds right. It is only after the page loads that AJAX could match Telnet's performance, I am guessing.

The DOS operating system I use in a retail distribution and collection warehouse has no copy and paste, it does not even have backspace! It outputs reports on a dot-matrix printer! We have to make an appointment to print out a logistics report!

Phaelax
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 05:15
Quote: "Why don't they post a number of people? 4.7% may be as 47 or 47000!
Quote: "2013 -- Opera -- 1.8 %"
I don't believe it even being Opera hater."


Why don't you like opera? Before Chrome, I used Opera mainly.


Here's the odd thing I recently came across. As just a small project, I wanted to recreate this forum without using all the tables tags and I did. The unusual thing however, is that the code looks the same in Chrome and IE9, but this time it's FF that doesn't display correctly. It's a rare occurrence, but my point is IE is pretty standards compliant these days as long as a doctype is specified in your code (which many websites neglect to include).

Inflictive
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 06:27 Edited at: 23rd Sep 2013 06:32
Personally I hate firefox. I put it on my old laptop when chrome got corrupted somehow, and it was just. so. fricking SLOW. (much worse than IE) And I hated the weird orange button in the upper left and the download window thing.

I use chrome because it's so lightweight, and the UI isn't cluttered with unnecessary buttons and information bars. I used IE for a really long time though, it was not that bad, and I really liked how you could download to a temp location and run the file once.

bitJericho
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 06:54
I don't use chrome because I'm not a slave to an advertising agency. I use firefox

Dar13
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 06:59
Quote: "I don't use chrome because I'm not a slave to an advertising agency."

Use one of the privacy-based forks of Chrome? It is open-source.

Inflictive
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 07:25
Chrome does have adblock if that's what you're referring to.

Quik
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 07:50
Quote: "I don't use chrome because I'm not a slave to an advertising agency."


that's one way to use it - i probably could change to firefox by now, but back when i changed - i changed because chrome was better - simply. It was less cluttered and googling stuff was a lot simpler. Nowadays i hear firefox works the same but, it's way too late to make that change - just for the sake of it



Whose eyes are those eyes?
Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 08:37
Quote: "I don't use chrome because I'm not a slave to an advertising agency."
Well aren't you a special one! I see you are one of those who doesn't support an advertising funded Internet.

mr Handy
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 15:08
Quote: "Why don't you like opera? Before Chrome, I used Opera mainly."

It was long ago, I don't remember why but I remember the hate

Quote: "I don't use chrome because I'm not a slave to an advertising agency."

I am using neat Chrome fork, it way better than original Chrome GUI + no Google spy.

Indicium
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 15:47
Quote: " I see you are one of those who doesn't support an advertising funded Internet."


We're spilling across threads now.


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
The Zoq2
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 16:42
Quote: " no Google spy."


Does that also exclude the Google account browser sync?

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
mr Handy
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 17:08
Quote: "Does that also exclude the Google account browser sync?"

Replaced with Yandex account sync.

Phaelax
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 17:25
Quote: "I use chrome because it's so lightweight, and the UI isn't cluttered with unnecessary buttons and information bars."


Actually, with multiple tabs open you'll probably find FF uses less memory. My issue with FF is its speed. It just feels sluggish.

The Zoq2
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 17:29
Quote: "Replaced with Yandex account sync."


Seriously?

If you are serious I don't really see your logic. If they have acces to your history/bookmarks/other things in that browser, they can do just the same as google. And personally I feel a lot safer trusting that stuff with a company like google than some unknown company that to me dosn't look very serious.

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
mr Handy
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 17:53 Edited at: 23rd Sep 2013 17:55
Quote: "feel a lot safer trusting that stuff with a company like google"

After Snowden's statement?

Quote: "unknown company that to me dosn't look very serious"

I'd call it Second to Google. And we do not have a paranoid desire to steal user data as in a certain Western country. There are also settings to stop sending crash reports, usage stats, url typos, etc, etc. KGB is not using such services as we have total private data control via vk.com (users upload private data by their own silly will ho ho ho, brilliant)

Indicium
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 18:11
Well I couldn't care less about my privacy, simply because I know that nobody cares what we look at on the internet, anybody here, so long as it's not illegal. I don't know about you but I'm well within the confines of the law so why would anybody waste the time to look?


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
The Zoq2
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 18:14
Personally I had never heard of the company before, hence my suspiccion.

To me it feels like exchanging one company for another, but I don't really care about this anyway. I have nothing against having my browser history tracked since I don't do anything that I don't want tracked. Also, if the US governemnt (or any other government) want information about me, they will find a way to get it even if I don't trust my information with google or any other company. I would much rather have ads that relate to my interests and a browser that has wide support in most webpages than think that my search history is safe from everything

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
mr Handy
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 18:48
I don't care about privacy (maybe a tiny little bit), it's just my browser is better designed than original chrome. Anyway, chrome wins, with or without google inside!

Chris Tate
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 21:56 Edited at: 23rd Sep 2013 21:59
Quote: "It was less cluttered"


Why do people keep on saying Chrome is less cluttered? All of the browsers can be as cluttered as you want them to be??

Just turn off the features.

Chrome has no features to turn off; but you know what I mean; that is not why I use Chrome as my secondary; there are much more weightier benefits than having no darn toolbars...

The irony of this clutter argument is when you open Chrome it eats up more memory, runs multiple processes and threads; and consumes gigabytes of hard disk space. Never judge a book by its cover, Chrome is good but not as clean and efficient as they have you fooled to believe.

bitJericho
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 23:33 Edited at: 23rd Sep 2013 23:37
Quote: "Well aren't you a special one! I see you are one of those who doesn't support an advertising funded Internet."


Yes I am. I would pay for a service as good or better than Google. Same goes for a lot of online services (including the darkbasic developers network, of which I had paid for access).

Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2013 23:37
Ah, gotcha. Was just messing with you

Quik
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Posted: 24th Sep 2013 00:08
Quote: "Yes I am. I would pay for a service as good or better than Google. Same goes for a lot of online services "



I would - arguably - but, being the poor student that I am - mind you, i'm rich compared to most countries students - i would prefer it to be ad based - perhapswith a little bit payment. Like theyre doing with youtube now - certain channels being pay to access. As long as I dont have to pay to use the web - or, as long as it's not being MANDATORY - i'm cool with anything.

If i have to choose between MANDATORY ads, or payments - i choose ads.
I would however - like a bit more, out of both worlds.



Whose eyes are those eyes?
Phaelax
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Posted: 24th Sep 2013 02:22
I remember the days when you didn't even have to pay for internet access.

Quote: "There are also settings to stop sending crash reports, usage stats, url typos, etc, etc"

http://lifehacker.com/5763452/what-data-does-chrome-send-to-google-about-me

mr Handy
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Posted: 24th Sep 2013 02:26
Quote: "I remember the days when you didn't even have to pay for internet access."

Free WiFi exists!

Libervurto
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Posted: 28th Sep 2013 02:07 Edited at: 28th Sep 2013 02:08
This thread prompted me to try out a bunch of obscure web browsers. My favourite was Midori: a very light-weight and clean browser that's as fast as a whippet! I'd recommend it to anyone using a slower machine. The only issue I had with it is that when you initially install it a lot of stuff is hidden from view, so just look through the menus, take a look at the extensions and enable the ones you want, after that it's pretty simple to use like any other browser you are used to.


Formerly OBese87.
Phaelax
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Posted: 28th Sep 2013 09:11
Does anyone here use Waterfox? (64-bit FF basically)

Libervurto
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Posted: 28th Sep 2013 18:04
There doesn't seem to be a linux version.


Formerly OBese87.
PAGAN_old
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Posted: 7th Oct 2013 04:30
Waterfox- a 64 bit modification of firefox
there is also pale moon another more light 64bit firefox created from scratch unlike waterfox which is just heavily modified firefox

dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them

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