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FPSC Classic Product Chat / [LOCKED] FPSCreator: ReLoaded is now Game Guru

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KeithC
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Posted: 14th Feb 2015 17:24 Edited at: 25th Feb 2015 17:12
Some people are reportedly a bit confused with the latest move by TGC; concerning the fate of FPSCreator: ReLoaded. In order to address that; here is the information on the change, in a nutshell.

Game Guru is indeed FPSCreator: ReLoaded; now re-branded (though still in Beta). Game Guru's ultimate aim, is to provide more than just a platform for a first-person shooter experience. In the future, it will also allow for creation of 3rd-person Games, Real-Time Strategy Games, Driving/Racing Games, Puzzle Games, Horror Games, Fantasy Games, Children's Games, etc.

TGC have set their sights on making Game Guru a total game development platform, that is easy to use, while still providing the robust tools and architecture to create a full-production project. The price-point ($19.99) has been set to be very competitive, and accessible to all who wish to pursue their development ideas and dreams. The (already large) Asset Library will continue to grow, with high-quality (and cost effective) media; while still leaving the option to create and import your own.

Game Guru is one of two main projects for TGC; the other being the App Game Kit.

If you're curious to see what's going on with Game Guru; check out the main boards here: https://forum.game-guru.com

....As well as the Steam boards here: http://steamcommunity.com/app/266310/discussions

If you have any questions about the transition; feel free to ask here, or head over to the Game Guru Boards and start posting.

For our Artist Community around here; the TGC Store is accepting submissions for inclusion. Your cut will be 70%, with 30% going to TGC. Once Game Guru goes live on Steam (February 27th); your potential client base will increase exponentially. Information on getting your media ready for submission to the store can be found here: http://seller.tgcstore.net/?md=upload-guide-index

Information on getting a Store Account set up, can be found here: http://en.tgcstore.net/?md=sell-content
__________________________________________________________


Just to summarize; as a Pledger (of any level), you pay NOTHING more than you already have. Here's the breakdown of what you will get, on launch day (note the new media content will come out sometime in 2015):

* Gold: 5 GameGuru Steam Keys + 4 Model Pack DLCs due in 2015 (total value over $120)
* Silver: 4 GameGuru Steam Keys + 2 Model Pack DLCs due in 2015 (total value over $90)
* Bronze: 2 GameGuru Steam Keys + 1 Model Pack DLC (total value over $39)"

-Keith
MrValentine
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Posted: 14th Feb 2015 23:31
Post more info for others about contributing to the asset library and why it would be a good thing



KeithC
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Posted: 14th Feb 2015 23:41
Good idea.

-Keith
Greenwich
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Posted: 15th Feb 2015 22:59
Does the $20 price point include royalty-free commercial sale of the games produced? Because if so, I feel kinda like a sucker for paying about $100 for "FPSCR Gold" awhile ago.

It's mean time. *averages*
KeithC
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Posted: 15th Feb 2015 23:20
@ Greemwich: Yes it does.

I can understand you feeling that way; however, TGC has accounted for that, by giving you some additional media pack downloads (as yet unreleased) as well as 4 extra Steam Keys to give out to friends and/or Family.

Quote: "* Gold: 5 GameGuru Steam Keys + 4 Model Pack DLCs due in 2015 (total value over $120)
* Silver: 4 GameGuru Steam Keys + 2 Model Pack DLCs due in 2015 (total value over $90)
* Bronze: 2 GameGuru Steam Keys + 1 Model Pack DLC (total value over $39)"


-Keith
Quel
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Posted: 18th Feb 2015 18:18
Half of me is screaming at you now saying it was damn time since my first thought when i first heard of FPSC back then was: "Hurray, like there's not enough low class FPS games out there by professionals! We need more by kids, right?!"

So it's a thing to celebrate that this is becoming an engine for all kinds of games.

On the other hand this is practically the last nail in DarkBASIC's coffin, that has already got like a bigillion nails in, isn't it?

It's an all nail, zero wood coffin.

After they lowered it down we will throw nails after it instead of flowers too.

I just don't understand TGC in the past couple years, running a consumerist kids toy what is AppGameKit, spreading out the already rare competitions and dumbing them down so we must make (FBOMB) flappy bird clones, and an FPS maker now to be ALL GAMES maker with little to zero requirement of thought from creators, why the heck have you turned your back COMPLETELY on the layer of people who would consider themselves to be developers?
Wolf
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Posted: 18th Feb 2015 22:49
Quote: "an FPS maker now to be ALL GAMES maker with little to zero requirement of thought from creators, why the heck have you turned your back COMPLETELY on the layer of people who would consider themselves to be developers?"


Thats an overexaggeration but I can tell you why: Because there isn't much on the market that does that. FPSC was unique at the time and its just logical that they ship another product of that kind.

FPSC has delivered a bunch of impressive games, something you probably don't see eye to eye with me concidering how you phrased your post and I'm sure game-guru...given time...will too.

You see, TGC can't possibly compete with the "more" serious (how serious can you be if you develop a videogame anyway?) products out there by now. If you are so determined to play developer I'd recommend other suites like the great unreal engine or the horrific unity. Alternatively you can support the smaller indie dev-environment "Leadwerks". I use it too, its neat.



-Wolf

"When I contradict myself, I am telling the truth"
"absurdity has become necessity"
KeithC
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Posted: 19th Feb 2015 04:36
@ Quel:

I'm not really sure where all the negativity is coming from? As with any game creator/engine; the developer will make what suits them, whether it's a "flappy bird clone" or an original racing game. TGC is moving ahead with a platform that will allow the developer, or even hobbyist gamer, to create whatever they desire; without the need to learn C++, or learn to create their own game art.

As far as DB goes; it is yet to be determined what it will glean from Game Guru's (and AGK2) development. I really think the future is bright. I'm sorry you don't see it that way.

-Keith
Disturbing 13
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Posted: 19th Feb 2015 10:47
I for one am completely happy with the decision. When other game types other than FPS are introduced, It will finally be in the running with engines like Unity and such. Due to the FPSC(now Game Guru) community and their amazing support, Game guru will be the go to engine. From a marketing standpoint I think it's an excellent move so that the stigma of it only being an FPS Creator is gone. I just don't know why they didn't do it sooner; it's not like the idea wasn't there. Take a look at The 3d Game Maker. Sure it's a kids game creation system but it had native 3rd person camera scripting built in allowing for lots of other game types to be made. Long live Game Guru and the expanded ideas it represents!

Model pack 66-99 high quality items...cheap!!
"Who loves ya baby!"
seppgirty
FPSC Developer
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Posted: 20th Feb 2015 00:06
I, for one, have been waiting for years for Lee to add 3rd person view to fpsc. I didn't buy reloaded because i didn't want another first person view. Now that they are adding 3rd person (hopefully spell casting) and inventory, I will buy it. I think this was a great way to go.

gamer, lover, filmmaker
Wolf
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Posted: 20th Feb 2015 12:02
They'll eventually add a stock inventory but we both know that you will have to script your own spellcasting system, right seppgirty?

"When I contradict myself, I am telling the truth"
"absurdity has become necessity"
xplosys
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Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 20th Feb 2015 18:02 Edited at: 23rd Feb 2015 01:11
Removed by poster.

KeithC
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Posted: 20th Feb 2015 19:01
Brian; I wish you would stick it out, but you are welcome back at ANY time. But seriously, keep in touch and check up on progress from time to time. Things are moving at a rapid pace. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

-Keith
t701ultimatum
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Posted: 20th Feb 2015 23:07
I'm confused as to what this means for backers of FPSC:Re. I backed FPSC:Re back in Nov 2013 with the gold package. Will I automatically be granted GameGuru? Or do I have to pay for GameGuru and FPSC:Re is just dead? Seems difficult to find any news on the topic at all. One week the news was 'New FPSC:Re Weekly News' as if all was well then next week its 'Now its GameGuru'.

If someone can help fill in the blanks for me, it would be appreciated! Also doesn't help that the GameGuru forms seem broken for me, you click on Forums and its just an empty page.
MrValentine
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Posted: 20th Feb 2015 23:11
Gold members get 5 keys for Steam I believe, Silver 3? And Bronze is just two...

Teabone
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Posted: 20th Feb 2015 23:56
With the technology developed to date we are launching a brand new game creation tool called GameGuru - an easy to use game maker that allows anyone to make, share and sell any kind of game on their PC."

I asked Rick if this was a mistake when he said "game" instead of "game engine" he said it was intentional. I've stated my concern with FPSC Reloaded/Game Guru from the start whereas it was more like you were playing a video game rather than making one. As im still not comfortable with the F9 edit mode. I was really hoping for different editing view options in the editor itself, without having to render everything else out to be able to attempt preciese editing of entity placement and terrain modifications.

(Teabone)
MrValentine
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Posted: 21st Feb 2015 11:06
Quote: "
•NVIDIA GeForce 400 series or AMD Radeon HD 6000 series, 1GB Video Card (Minimum Shader Model 2.0)
"


They seriously need to add at least Intel HD4000 to the list...

The Storyteller 01
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2015 13:16 Edited at: 22nd Feb 2015 18:03
In fact FPS Creator Reloaded and everything connected to it has simply been buried.

Along with any promises made to the backers and any further obligations to them.

That's not an accusation, I'm just stating the facts. And I'm not saying that it won't pay off in the long run for the backers.

But I know enough about brands and marketing, that throwing away an established product name and creating a new brand from scratch is generally no bargain - unless there are enough advantages to make up for the lost brand awareness. And from a neutral point of view I don't see the advantages.

To have a "fresh start" or a "clean slate" are just hollow phrases used when there is some baggage to get rid of. And to justify the effort to introduce a completely new brand, the baggage has to be significantly cumbersome.

Time will tell the reasons behind that decision.

PS:
Quote: "Game Guru's ultimate aim, is to provide more than just a platform for a first-person shooter experience. In the future, it will also allow for creation of 3rd-person Games, Real-Time Strategy Games, Driving/Racing Games, Puzzle Games, Horror Games, Fantasy Games, Children's Games, etc."

Sounds more like a relaunch of "3D Game Maker" than "FPS Creator" to me - but again, time will tell.

In case you find my grammar and spelling weird ---> native German speaker ^^
xplosys
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2015 17:13 Edited at: 23rd Feb 2015 01:12
Comments removed by poster.

KeithC
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2015 22:07
Quote: "In fact FPS Creator Reloaded and everything connected to it has simply been buried."


That is needed, in order to eliminate future confusion over the name/branding of the product. Game Guru is going to be about more than just a First-Person Shooter Platform.

Quote: "Along with any promises made to the backers and any further obligations to them."


That is simply untrue. All backers of FPSC: ReLoaded are getting everything that they signed up for (and more). For example; a Gold Pledger is getting not one, but FIVE keys/licenses for their original pledge. Along with several Media Packs, not previously released. Some things have come about a bit slower, such as the Zombie Pack; but I don't see any significant difference in what is being offered to previous pledgers....from what was originally promised. All Pledgers will also enjoy lifetime updates, as promised.

Quote: "But I know enough about brands and marketing, that throwing away an established product name and creating a new brand from scratch is generally no bargain - unless there are enough advantages to make up for the lost brand awareness. And from a neutral point of view I don't see the advantages."


There are several advantages; the largest of them being: Variety. Variety in gameplay and Genre. I've illustrated that in previous comments.

Quote: "Sounds more like a relaunch of "3D Game Maker" than "FPS Creator" to me - but again, time will tell."


Well; I hope you stick around to see how things progress, and perhaps give us another chance.

-Keith
The Storyteller 01
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2015 00:43 Edited at: 23rd Feb 2015 08:25
Quote: "Well; I hope you stick around to see how things progress, and perhaps give us another chance."


Trust me, I will buy "Game Guru" as soon as its available on Steam

I have started the journey with FPS Creator until it got abandoned, I will definitely sail along with its successor until it either conquers the world, runs aground and sinks or simply gets abandoned as well.

I'm watching the editor and modding scene for 15 years now, another 15 won't bore me - especially since TCG decided to face the Steam crowd, the toughest, most merciless and well-informed customer group any developer can face.

Quote: "There are several advantages; the largest of them being: Variety. Variety in gameplay and Genre. I've illustrated that in previous comments."

That's got nothing to do with marketing and brand awareness.

Unless of course someone at TCG thinks that the brand "FPS Creator" is so worthless that it's better to take the risk to introduce something completely new.

Kind of a slap in the face for guys like me who still explain in their blog how great FPS Creator is and link to the TCG store.....

In case you find my grammar and spelling weird ---> native German speaker ^^
Zubby1970
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2015 01:00
Please stop, moaning about how ripped off you feel for, the new pricing of the game Guru, And remember that a) the games creators are making great products. and B) you paid for early adopter status and helped this awesome product be developed.

So it does not matter, what you spent, I personally bought gold if I remember right, but the point is we paid to be early adopters, so stop feeling robbed, and feel privileged that you are still testing what people cant get right now. rant over.

There can only be one
The Storyteller 01
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2015 01:26 Edited at: 23rd Feb 2015 01:26
Quote: "Please stop, moaning about how ripped off you feel for, the new pricing of the game Guru, And remember that a) the games creators are making great products. and B) you paid for early adopter status and helped this awesome product be developed.

So it does not matter, what you spent, I personally bought gold if I remember right, but the point is we paid to be early adopters, so stop feeling robbed, and feel privileged that you are still testing what people cant get right now. rant over."


You're not talking to me aren't you?

Because I never paid for the privilege to be a backer or early adopter, instead I'm going to pay 14.99 on Steam and that's as cheap as it gets

In case you find my grammar and spelling weird ---> native German speaker ^^
KeithC
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2015 03:08 Edited at: 23rd Feb 2015 05:02
Let's not bicker guys; we're all here for similar reasons.

Quote: "Unless of course someone at TCG thinks that the brand "FPS Creator" is so worthless that it's better to take the risk to introduce something completely new."


Again; it's got less to do with the brand FPSCreator being "worthless", and everything to do with the fact that Game Guru will be a platform that can be utilized to build more than just a First-Person Shooter Game. When people think of FPSCreator; they don't think of making the next big Racing Game with it, or a Third-Person Adventure Game.

Quote: "Kind of a slap in the face for guys like me who still explain in their blog how great FPS Creator is and link to the TCG store....."


I don't see how it's a "slap in the face" at all. I've seen several titles made and shipped, over the years; using FPSCreator Classic. FPSCreator is still around for sale, and still has an active Community. TGC needed to evolve their offerings, in order to thrive in this ever-changing environment. That holds true for ANY Company out there. Evolve or die. They have done, and continue to, bring anyone and everyone along for the ride.

At the end of the day; it's about YOU, the developer, that fuels the success of TGC. Sometimes that road is rocky, but all intentions are good. Looking forward to seeing you on the Game Guru and/or Steam Forums!

@ Xplosys: You've got mail!

-Keith
BlackFox
FPSC Master
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2015 07:30
The decision to "rebrand" the product may leave a bitter taste in the mouth of some that pledged with the expectations that were outlined when the decision to create Reloaded came into fruition, only to have those expectations changed down the road well into development. You cannot fault those users that feel this way, and you cannot expect everyone is going to be dancing with glee and following the norm. While I agree that it is the nature of the industry in some extent, it does happen and there is no point in telling someone they are wrong for feeling flustered because of the decision to take the current route. This forum has a diverse group of people that have various backgrounds and levels of development that not everyone is at the exact same level. Some may have the ability to have a large team to work with while others are just a two or three person team working. Some have a lot of time, some have little time, etc. The point is we are diverse- let us not loose focus of that when people are hesitant.

You want to "rebrand" your product, we get that. To be honest, FPSC does not really have the "best" reputation in the industry. While the software (Classic) has received its bashings and wounds, some of us have attempted to show it is actually a good piece of software once you get to know it inside-out. Some have produced excellent media for us developers to use, some have released games that were unique or had some cool concepts, and some of us have even made good money with the product.

With that said, here is a concern I have which has bothered me (and my wife) for some time- the support. There are a few areas of support that really need some polish, and I would dare say more polish than some of the answers we have read in both the GG forums and the Steam forums as of late. This is where we stop short of jumping for joy and being excited.

First, we hope that you will actually take the time (even if just for a ten minute discussion) and talk about the documentation. While Classic did have the "official community guide(s)", they were not exactly easy for some to follow. They had great information and I do not want to diminish the thought and effort, but they lacked a clear guide for new and beginner people. I'd suggest referral to Ched's Script Syntax Guide which is an excellent example of organization in documentation. It clearly makes the product look good when documents accompany it that have this effort put into it.

Second, when I read a comment such as...

Quote: "we're committed to developing GameGuru for many years to come, and our focus will always be ease of use for powerful results."


...it makes me wonder...how many years will that be? Do you plan to "drop" support once you find a new shiny object to pursue? Again to reference Classic, you left the product unfinished and still in BETA, and to add insult to injury when bug reports are posted, one could get a response such as...

Quote: "FPSC is no longer supported so there won't be any official bug fixes if it is found to be a bug."


...or...

Quote: "The team has moved support to GameGuru now and are pushing towards a Steam release so I doubt any official action will be taken on this now unsupported software."


Issues raised, questions asked and ignored... Not exactly warming us up to switching over to another product now. While my wife and I are only two people and our money may not affect you, others could feel the same way and over time that equals loss of sales.

If you are going to rebrand the image, then I suggest the entire image. A little effort to get us to turn our heads and say "wow, those guys go the extra mile and then some" will just have us as users/developers bragging about your software and even help send more users your way. You are entering the Steam market, where users are going to be relentless when something goes wrong and there is either no good support or the program does not work as promised/intended. You have to take the criticism just as well as you take the compliments, but you can help diminish the amount of complaints if you have everything in place and not "winging it".

There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
BradAus
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Posted: 24th Feb 2015 13:44
It was only mid last year I paid $100 as a gold backer, now because the TGC have renamed the same product they want me to pay more? There was no mention of changing the product name and that the "what you get" $100 fee was only until they change the product name.

Kind of looks like the backers are funding the project and the name change is another way to get them to pay again for the same product.

And it hasn't been a year yet and I am expected to pay more money for something I backed because it stated:

Pledge Price $100

Gold level benefits:

Access to regular Cadence Alpha builds¹

Reloaded Beta Versions ¹

Save and share games

Name on credits roll

Four Model Packs: Modern Day*, Horror, Zombies, Vegetation Plus ² (RRP $80 - FREE with Gold Pledge!)

Sell games you make

Over 400 Classic entity models made Reloaded compatible ³

Lifetime upgrades

When I saw this I thought this was a great deal, I had no problems paying $100 instead of just buying a basic pack as it helps support the project to advance.

However, I also had the choice to only pay $29 and just play with the software. That would have been a better option looking back on it now as all I would have to pay is another $20 and I would have the current copy. That is a total of $49 instead of the $100 I paid.

Within 12 months the product name changes and it has been announced that it is the same product, just a name change. And now my $100 doesn't give my lifetime upgrades?

Look, if you had of sent me an email and said "hey we are working on a new project that is built of Reloaded, would you like to pay $20 to carry over your current deal" I would have said Yep no problems.

But to find out this way is wrong.

I have no issues in supporting this project. I think the team have done a great job. I know that you are offering (if I read it correctly)

Quote: "* Gold: 5 GameGuru Steam Keys + 4 Model Pack DLCs due in 2015 (total value over $120)
* Silver: 4 GameGuru Steam Keys + 2 Model Pack DLCs due in 2015 (total value over $90)
* Bronze: 2 GameGuru Steam Keys + 1 Model Pack DLC (total value over $39)"

If you pay another $20 (please correct me if I am wrong)

To that I say cool, no problems. You are giving something back however I would expect the Lifetime of upgrades still apply and the $100 pledge for FCS reloaded is carried over to the new product so all is not lost.

Within 12 months, not cool. Do I still support the project. Yes. I do believe that there should be some more thought put into this though. I am annoyed as it was less than 12 months ago I paid for this and I would assume this name change would have been planned more than 12 months ago.

If someone paid $100 a couple of weeks before the name change they would be screaming scam as they wouldn't of had time to really get to know the group.

So that being said:

I am happy to support he project still however would expect proper explanation from admin.

I assume the Reloaded packs are still going to work on this new release? and the ability to package up games with your own branding is now available in the "new" release?

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KeithC
Senior Moderator
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Posted: 25th Feb 2015 17:10
@ BradAus: I've amended the initial post here. Thanks for pointing it out; sorry about the confusion.

-Keith
Mystra
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Posted: 28th Feb 2015 17:45
Sorry if I sound harsh, but I gave FPSCR a small nickname, I've called it FPSC Forever, now I will have to call it Game Guru Forever...


When does a fully functional version will be released ?
Teabone
Valued Member
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2015 03:25
I felt a bit insulted at a reply I got back from TGC about some issues I had concerning Game Guru I brought up.

I was a gold pledger and not given the respect as such.

(Teabone)
KeithC
Senior Moderator
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2015 04:25 Edited at: 3rd Mar 2015 18:31
Hello Teabone; what reply are you referring to?

PM me please.

-Keith
KeithC
Senior Moderator
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2015 18:33
Alright guys; thanks for all the input on this. I'm locking this now; if you want to continue seeing what's happening with GameGuru, stop on over to the GameGuru Community (if you already haven't):

https://forum.game-guru.com/

-Keith

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