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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / Has DBP been dropped?

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BandP College Man
15
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Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Dorset (U.K.)
Posted: 15th Jul 2015 20:41
It seems to me that \'The Gamecreators\' people seem to have \'lost interest\' in DBP. The newsletters almost never provide articles involving DBP itself. There are many thousands of us (I hope) that still enjoy using DBP and wish to continue expecting updates and info about how we can make our projects better. Am I trying to ride a donkey that\'s lost its poke or can we start a revival?
KISTech
16
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Joined: 8th Feb 2008
Location: Aloha, Oregon
Posted: 15th Jul 2015 23:59
All attention has turned to AppGameKit and FPSC Reloaded. There hasn't been a new release since U77 back in March of 2013. So what we have is what we've got. It's basically been End of Lifed, so I wouldn't expect any updates again.

On the plus side it's fairly stable, there are tons of plugins for it, and it's certainly capable of producing a production quality game as some have already done. I plan on using it for as long as I can, even if I move on to another dev environment I'll still be using it as a utility for rapid development of proof of concepts.

It's sad to see it fall by the wayside, but it happens to everything eventually.
DennisW
15
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Joined: 15th Jun 2008
Location: Ohio
Posted: 16th Jul 2015 05:52
All good things come to a end. That dose not mean it isn't a use full tool. I backed both projects Reloaded AppGameKit and I use AGK. GameGuru not so much. The only place you can get it is Steam and they are too invasive for my taste. So I have been working with DBPro. I learned a lot using DBPro. With the help of the good people of the forum. I don't think it has come to a full end just yet.

Ham and Eggs Breakfast
The Chicken was involved the Pig was Committed
AGK Community Tester
Van B
Moderator
21
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Joined: 8th Oct 2002
Location: Sunnyvale
Posted: 16th Jul 2015 11:14
As I said in the other 'DBPro is dead' thread, a language can only possibly die if nobody is left using it. If you use it, then it's alive and well.

I use it every single day, even though I have AGK1+2, Cryengine, Xcode and probably a dozen other languages. I like it, and these days it redefines the term 'rapid development'. So many of the tools and languages have evolved outside of our requirements, they are being designed more and more towards groups of developers, not individuals like most of us. 1 person can't develop a Unity, Unreal, or Cryengine based game by themselves, not with any real hope of completing the project, the engines are too complicated for organic development.

Turns out, what I really enjoy most about programming is a challenge, to have a system that has specific limitations, and then work within those limits to produce something fun. I dabble with older platforms like the ST and ZX Spectrum for that reason, and now DBPro is at that point. Really, it's not a bad place for a language to be - languages tend to never die, they get superseded, people move on, but there is always someone, somewhere, using something for something
I have an ambitious project bubbling away, and I made more progress on it since switching back to DBPro that a whole year with Cryengine.

I think it breaks down like this....
If you aren't a team of experienced videogame artists, then the art requirements will kill your project.
If you are a team of experienced videogame artists, then the code requirements will kill your project.
If your on your own, you better be rich, if you aren't rich, you have to steal software. There is no alternative to the thousands of pounds worth of software that's required alongside 'yippee free professional engines'. I mean, if you can't make a proper normal map, why would you go to an engine where a normal map is the basic requirement.

If you can make decent art, and you can code, then take on a project you can complete, in a language that people complete projects with. That, and a media creation workflow that doesn't cost more than your PC, your car, or your wife to maintain.

BandP College Man
15
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Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Dorset (U.K.)
Posted: 16th Jul 2015 11:24
All good things do not come to an end. Many good things progress to become better things and some go on to become great things. I used DBP for several years (and up to this year) as the environment of choice for a Developing Computer Games (BTEC) course at my college. The majority of students loved it as it gave them quick and easy satisfaction to their creative ideas. With a few lines of code they can bypass the difficulties of dealing with directx and see stunning results within the space of a 60 minute lesson. I believe that DBP keeps you closer to developing coding skills than some of the [drag and drop] engines out there.
Guido Italy
18
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Joined: 25th Dec 2005
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Posted: 16th Jul 2015 13:27
DbPro must not die![u]
Ortu
DBPro Master
16
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Joined: 21st Nov 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posted: 16th Jul 2015 18:44
the OP in this case is not about if it is dead or used by users, but if it is still supported with expected updates by TGC.

the answer to that is, while there has not and probably never will be a definitive statement by Lee that 'DBpro will no longer be developed or updated. U77 is the final release.' the reality is that this is probably the case.

Adrian
20
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Joined: 11th Nov 2003
Location: My Living Room
Posted: 16th Jul 2015 23:49
Quote: "while there has not and probably never will be a definitive statement by Lee that 'DBpro will no longer be developed or updated. U77 is the final release.' the reality is that this is probably the case."


I would say that is Definitely the case.
KISTech
16
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Joined: 8th Feb 2008
Location: Aloha, Oregon
Posted: 18th Jul 2015 23:00
I do know that DBPro holds a special place in Lee's heart. I just don't think that's enough at this point to expect any updates. Besides, it's currently very capable and there are fairly straight forward workarounds for any of it's shortcomings.

However, I do agree that it doesn't die as long as someone is still using it. I guarantee COBOL, Pascal, Fortran, and others from ancient times are still in use somewhere. Hell, it wasn't that long ago that the Internal Revenue Service here in the US was still using COBOL on IBM 370s and Univac 2200 Mainframes. (My wife and I used to work there as a programmer..)

In fact, they're still using LOGO today in the beginning computer course at my son's high school. I'm trying to convince the school district to switch to something like DBPro or AGK.
Green Gandalf
VIP Member
19
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Joined: 3rd Jan 2005
Playing: Malevolence:Sword of Ahkranox, Skyrim, Civ6.
Posted: 19th Jul 2015 00:37
Quote: "I guarantee COBOL, Pascal, Fortran, and others from ancient times are still in use"


I'm sure they are. FORTRAN was the first programming language I was taught (back in '67 ) and was still my language of choice for hard-core technical stuff when I retired back in '09. I suspect COBOL was designed for people who didn't like programming.

But DBPro is my favourite of all time. I can do everything I need with it - and decent 3D stuff too. What more could a man want? [Actually, a bit of me still craves for the simplicity of the syntax manual that came with Burroughs ALGOL for the old B5500 machine. Aah, those were the days. ]



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KISTech
16
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Joined: 8th Feb 2008
Location: Aloha, Oregon
Posted: 19th Jul 2015 21:43
Gandalf, if there was a Like button, I'd click it.

The earliest programming I did was on the Radio Shack Color Computer in BASIC, and on the Apple //e in AppleSoft BASIC. The Apple even had the 128K RAM expansion board. I dabbled a little with Assembler on the //e, but didn't stick with it. I ended up with an IBM 286-12 (yeah, 12 MHz..) and never looked back at Apple again.
Green Gandalf
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19
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Joined: 3rd Jan 2005
Playing: Malevolence:Sword of Ahkranox, Skyrim, Civ6.
Posted: 20th Jul 2015 00:21
Quote: "Gandalf, if there was a Like button, I'd click it."


Ditto.



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Hotline
15
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Joined: 22nd Aug 2008
Location:
Posted: 20th Jul 2015 01:41
My first computer was a c64 . It's really ironic as i had some spare money and wanted to buy a cool bike but my friend persuaded me buying a c64 instead of a bike... well i didn't regret it ! It was so amazing what one can do with an 1 Mhz CPU ! approximately 32k ram , 8 hardware sprites and 16 colors (which in multicolor mode was only 4 colors)

After i mastered BASIC i was obsessed with intros (actually thats where my nickname came from "hotline" if you remember those cool hotline intros) after i found out the interpreted basic was too slow for intros i started to learn ASM. Man it was soooo hard ! back then there were no books no internet and since computers wasn't so popular at that time , you couldn't find geeks in your neighbourhood who could help you.So i just started to examine the existing ASM codes and learn by trial and error. It took me one year to understand it.After a while i bought some C64 ASM books (still got them !) and finally mastered it. I made countless intros with it but never managed to complete any of my "game projects".

All in all maybe if i buy the bike instead of the c64 i would never wrote these lines on this forum...

[href=forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=191567&b=5]Spark Particle engine[/href]
[href=forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=199163&b=5]Transform gizmo plugin[/href]
Green Gandalf
VIP Member
19
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Joined: 3rd Jan 2005
Playing: Malevolence:Sword of Ahkranox, Skyrim, Civ6.
Posted: 20th Jul 2015 02:27
@Hotline

Just seen and tested your Spark Particle system. It is brilliant judging by a few sample demos I tested. Very nice.

I hope to give this system a proper "test drive" sometime.

Who needs to use a different programming language when we have such excellent plugins available.





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sadsack
20
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Joined: 27th Nov 2003
Location: here
Posted: 20th Jul 2015 02:51 Edited at: 20th Jul 2015 02:52
I enjoy using DBP for many years, but it is at a stand still. TGC group are not making money with so it is gone. Us DBP and FPSC people made money for them for years and now they dump us.
renny

Life is not fair, so deal with it.
http://www.gusworks.com/
Kafoolwho
10
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Joined: 16th Oct 2013
Location: The Deep
Posted: 25th Jul 2015 23:06
What drew me to DBP was the fact that I started coding in BASIC on the Sinclair ZX Spectrum+ back in 1985. I went on to do a few things in Microsoft BASIC on the Spectravideo 328 a few years later, and when I got my first PC I eventually released a few small games I created in QB 4.5.

I have worked with C and its variants throughout my life, most notably as a programmer at a small indie games company a few years back, but I still prefer BASIC to program in.

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