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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Windows 10 - The only malware you'll ever need

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bitJericho
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 14:10 Edited at: 4th Aug 2015 14:14
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Quote: " I would argue that having everything acessible from a terminal is a lot better for tech support related stuff because it allows you to fix issues remotley over SSH much more easily."


Yeah I like the terminal, but telling mom to use vi... You know what... I'm just gonna stop it right there XD Vi is not for experts, let alone normal users Maybe for autists lol.

The other day I got my mom using multiple monitors in windows 8. I'd love to see you walk your mom through multiple monitors in ubuntu:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2220574

Nothing like the following steps to make sure your mom never calls you on your birthday:

Quote: "are you pressing 1 or f1?

if you are pressing 1 try pressing ctrl+alt+F1,but reboot the computer and do it at the log in screen(do not sign in at this screen)

The screen should go black and ask you for your username and password

login and enter the following

Code:

sudo service lightdm start

"


And that's only the beginning!! And the best advice of course on that page is to downgrade to a 3 year old (and two major revisions earlier) version of ubuntu.

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TheComet
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 14:14
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Quote: "I just don't understand how people don't see the same thing over and over on every release.

Boo windows 95 sucks. Dos is way faster and has more apps.

Boo windows 98 is sucky, it is new and terrifying and bsods all the time.

Boo windows ME is windows 98 with lipstick all over it.

Boo windows xp sucks, it requires like 256mb of ram at a MINIMUM?? Preposterous. And that interface? Is this windows or duplos?

Boo windows vista sucks, it's like windows me (the actual complaints were like XP all over again, but people kept referencing ME for some reason, I guess it was the cool thing to do).

Boo windows 7 is... well at least it's not vista and XP is dead even tho I wanna have XPs babies, so I guess we have to use 7 now.

Boo windows 8 has an ugly start screen.

Boo windows 10 has internet cloud features that are on by default."


May I remind you that Windows 95, ME, and Vista all sucked. The sucky level looks kind of like this:



wet fuel can't smelt steel memes
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bitJericho
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 14:15
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Again, XP was notoriously disliked up until at least SP2.

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The Zoq2
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 14:22 Edited at: 4th Aug 2015 14:25
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Quote: "Yeah I like the terminal, but telling mom to use vi... You know what... I'm just gonna stop it right there XD Vi is not for experts, let alone normal users Maybe for autists lol."


Then don't tell her to use vi, tell here to pen gedit just like she would open notepad on windows.

Quote: "The other day I got my mom using multiple monitors in windows 8. I'd love to see you walk your mom through multiple monitors in ubuntu: "


Sure:

Open settings, click display, do it just as you would on windows. Alterlativley:

Tell ger "Hold on, let me ssh to your computer and set it up for you:"

Then run xrandr
you should get something like this:



Finally, run


That will work on any linux distro running xorg which is pretty much any distro and you can do it remotely from across the world if you want to.

Quote: "Nothing like the following steps to make sure your mom never calls you on your birthday:"


I have no idea what is wrong with that guys setup but that's not what you have to go through to get multimonitor setups working normally.

Also, when you mentioned vi, I remembered a really nice thing about linux, the default programs are actually good.

Notepad: you can type text. Gedit: Propper indentation, syntax highlighting, lots of settings.
Firefox / chromium works a lot better than IE.
VLC/ some other video player generally works better than windows media player.

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
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Seditious
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 15:47
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Quote: "May I remind you that Windows 95, ME, and Vista all sucked"


Incorrect.

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TheComet
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 17:20 Edited at: 4th Aug 2015 17:42
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Vista was and still is a pile of garbage. Windows 7 outperforms it in every aspect.

Quote: "The other day I got my mom using multiple monitors in windows 8. I'd love to see you walk your mom through multiple monitors in ubuntu: "


In fact, most of the time you can also just run:


It will auto-detect the optimal settings for each monitor. If that doesn't work then Ubuntu has a nice GUI front-end very similar to the one found on Windows.

Quote: "I would love your opinions about whatever you use vs onedrive"


I've been forced to use OneDrive for 2 years at uni for synchronising our project data and I hate it.
1) The web interface is very unfriendly and slow
2) It doesn't run properly on my machine (some files aren't synchronised at all and it occasionally forgets my e-mail and login)
3) The download page is confusing. Business edition? Where's the download?
4) You can't download directories from the web interface.
5) It only runs on Windows

Thanks but no thanks. Give me Dropbox or Google Drive any day.

wet fuel can't smelt steel memes
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Indicium
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 17:43
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My university provided dreamspark premium, so I'm currently downloading the education version of Win10, which is built upon the Enterprise edition.
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Chris Tate
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 19:27 Edited at: 4th Aug 2015 19:27
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Ohhh I remember the days of edit.exe and autoexec.bat, when windows explorer was called the file manager, where there were no documents folders or libraries; software installation required a system restart, application purchase transactions were done on foot and you had to launch the majority of your games in DOS mode

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The Slayer
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 20:47
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Quote: "Seriously, how long does it take you guys to get everything just how you want it on a fresh install?"

Isn't that true for any new OS? Or any other program? There's always updates...and bugs, and fixes. It's something we do daily if you ask me. Upgrade programs because the makers updated their product. If they wouldn't upgrade their products, there would be no progress...and we'd be left with the same version.

At least on Windows, i can use the programs that i want, because they run on Windows. If i'd switch to another OS, i'd have a hard time finding a version of the programs i already use, to run on that OS.

Quote: "Close those quotes before they start to spread!...too late! Aaaaaagh!!!
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Seditious
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Posted: 4th Aug 2015 21:27
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Quote: ""Vista was and still is a pile of garbage"


Vista in its final incarnation is pretty good actually (if you know how to use it). I think I prefer 7 though.

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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 00:35
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Quote: "In my opinion, Windows 7/8/10 are at least 10 years ahead of Linux in terms of desktop usability (as in, it's going to take linux at least 10 more years to get to this point, let alone where windows will be in 10 more years)."


While certain things about Windows certainly make it easier (installation for programs, for example, and this is becoming easier and easier with each distro getting some sort of Software Manager similar to Windows Add/Remove Programs function), I would not say that Windows is 10 years ahead of Linux.

Virtual Desktops - Linux has had this for YEARS, it is nowhere near a new feature. It's new to Microsoft, sure, but the technology is nowhere new.

Tabbed browsing in file explorer - Windows STILL doesn't have this! Again, Linux came up with it FIRST, and Apple only followed suit back in early 2014. It seems unlikely Microsoft will ever implement it themselves, for some unknown reason.

Customization - THIS is why people like me choose Linux - being able to customize a whole bunch of crap, which Linux has always let you do. Windows? Not so much.

Just those three things and I would say Linux has been way ahead for a long, long time. Now, in terms of software/developer support, THAT is where it has suffered brutally. However, ever since Valve brought Steam over to Linux, and Unity/Unreal export to Linux executables, games are becoming much more accessible on Linux in general. I just played Civilization 5 on my Kubuntu install and it outperformed when I ran it on Windows 7.

Plenty of commercial programs are getting support for Linux - AppGameKit now works on Linux, which is wonderful because now I code in BASIC on Linux.

Quote: "The other day I got my mom using multiple monitors in windows 8. I'd love to see you walk your mom through multiple monitors in ubuntu"


That is a unique case and would normally never happen. When I first used Ubuntu back in 2010 or so, I plugged a cable from my laptop to another monitor and it worked just fine. Didn't have to tell it to do anything, it auto-detected the hardware and set everything up for optimal settings. It was glorious

Quote: "And the best advice of course on that page is to downgrade to a 3 year old (and two major revisions earlier) version of ubuntu."

That is a worst-case scenario solution. Just like reverting to Windows 7, for example...


Forum President until June 20th, 2016. Bow down to me!
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bitJericho
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 01:00
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Quote: "That is a unique case and would normally never happen. "


Yeah right. The exact same scenario played out for my multi-monitor setup. 3 monitors on 2 graphics cards made ubuntu have a melt down. I spent hours on xandr and everything else and gave up. This was at a time where I decided to switch to Linux permanently. Let's just say it wasn't permanent.

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The Zoq2
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 01:33
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When was this jericho, because I have heard that multimonitor support was terrible a while back but has been fixed recently...

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
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Dar13
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 04:06
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Quote: "In my opinion, Windows 7/8/10 are at least 10 years ahead of Linux in terms of desktop usability (as in, it's going to take linux at least 10 more years to get to this point, let alone where windows will be in 10 more years). Years ago I wrote on this very forum that Windows would be dead in 10 years. Turns out that linux went NOWHERE in all that time while Microsoft busted their butts. In fact, Linux probably went backwards (look at how retarded systemd is). Oh, and if you do ever see ads in the start menu/search (I sure haven't, at least not yet), you can blame ubuntu for that kind of BS (http://www.howtogeek.com/126995/how-to-disable-the-amazon-search-ads-in-ubuntus-unity-dash/)"

Systemd has absolutely ZERO to do with desktop usability. A normal desktop user on a properly maintained desktop distribution should never ever have to deal with systemd in any way, shape or form. That project deals with the plumbing layer in Linux(init and service management, the equivalent of svchost in Windows), not the UI. So that's a moot point unless you're a sysadmin or developer.

Quote: "Windows 10 is more usable in every way. Virtual desktops. Better start menu. Better window snap behavior. Better upgrade policy. Better task manager. Better browser. Better "Apps" behavior. Better start bar. Cortana. (it works incredibly well, don't believe the naysayers until you try it out.) New notifications system that works really well. Better multi-monitor support. More personalizations, like the lockscreen. If anything has changed at all in Windows 10, it's been invariably a better change. Except solitaire. That trucking ducks I agree."

A couple of those things are Windows catching up to the *nixes and FOSS in general(virtual desktops and browser in particular). The rest of it is genuine progress so kudos should be given. Cortana is apparently a very slick piece of software, I'm sure it'll be interesting to use for sure.

Quote: "If you are worried that the data is going to be used maliciously"

See the issue isn't that I'm afraid it'll be used maliciously by Microsoft. I'm afraid they'll get hacked or NSL'd or who knows what and then whoever ends up with it then is malicious with it. Wifi Sense is just retarded with all the insecure Wifi routers out there. Default telemetry is more understandable(what developer doesn't want more stacktraces for debugging?).

Quote: "I mean linux is really preposterous to give to users in 2015."

My 83 year old grandfather likes OpenSUSE 13.2 just fine. His only issues have been with proprietary software(Skype), all the open source stuff has been stable as can be expected of software. Of course he might be an anomaly as he adapted to Windows 8 freakishly fast as well.

Quote: " Oh yeah, uninstall unity and go for, say, gnome. Good luck ever getting your install to work as good as it did before you removed unity. http://askubuntu.com/questions/450294/how-to-switch-from-unity-to-gnome"

If you've never left Ubuntu-land, you're sorely missing out. Elementary, OpenSUSE, and Mint are all geared towards comprehensive user experiences. Elementary in particular may have the most well put-together UI I've ever seen in a distribution of Linux. OpenSUSE has a truly excellent package manager and control panel (YaST), and Mint is Ubuntu without the Unity/ads/Canonical nonsense.

Linux has a ways to go, but it won't get there without people actually using it and reporting bugs, making suggestions, and contributing where possible. Some very major companies are starting to devote large amounts of time and money to improving it so the situation may change faster than you would normally think.

Anyways, competition is good. Seems Microsoft has really stepped up to the plate after Windows 8. We'll just have to see if they can keep it up.

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bitJericho
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 06:11 Edited at: 5th Aug 2015 06:12
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I know systems is not anything to do with the desktop. My point is that systemd was even allowed to exist when Linux is missing things like a bluray player.

And no I not living under a rock. I've had trouble with the multimonitor in 12 and 13. I realize Ubuntu is not the end all be all but I've found it much less likely to fail and easier to find answers than any other distro.

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TheComet
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 11:13
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To be fair, when Xorg fails, it fails hard. I spent at least a few days bashing my head against xorg.conf until I was able to get my laptop's GPU and on board graphics chip working together (details below).

You probably just gave up too early. One does not simply spend "a few hours" with xorg.

My laptop has this power saving feature that tries to disable the external nVidia GPU when you're not using accelerated graphics and uses an on-board Intel graphics chip instead. What Xorg did by default was use the external nVidia GPU all the time, which depleted my battery in like 20 minutes.

I had to read through nVidia's linux driver manual as well as fiddle around with xrandr until I figured out that you had to "pipe" the output of Intel's built in graphics chip to nVidia's external GPU so it gets displayed on the laptop's screen. Additionally, I had to tell xorg.conf to disable the nVidia GPU by default. To make things permanent I had to write a small section in .xinitrc.

wet fuel can't smelt steel memes
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bitJericho
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 11:52 Edited at: 5th Aug 2015 12:07
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As far as I recall I tried for days and in fact I wanna say I got it working but full screen video on the main display was tearing or maybe it was that stuff would get lost in desktop area that couldn't be seen (3 monitor setup). I recall just having lots of trouble with it.

And it doesn't matter, just because you and I can spend days on xorg doesn't mean my cousin who wants to use facebook and watch movies should.

Linux doesn't work all the time, every time, in all manner of configurations. Windows does. It would be different if Linux at least had something better to offer over windows, but often the apps are worse or non-existent. The backend stuff is delicate. The frontend stuff is super configurable but that's hardly a selling point for facebookers.

I bought my uncle a nice soundcard with optical out and in. Checked that it was fully supported. Woot. Put it in, of course I can't get optical in to go to analog out. Why not? Well after about 3 hours of fiddling, he hasn't really wanted to spend any more time on it. Unless I were rude and demanded I get it working for him, he will never have a feature that literally takes plugging in cables (and maybe checking a box) to work on windows (a configuration I'm using right now on Windows 10).

Screw linux man. I recommend it for running nginx and php. Anybody who wants it for desktop use because they think Linux is technicallysuperior is a newb in my book XD

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The Zoq2
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 13:20
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Quote: "And it doesn't matter, just because you and I can spend days on xorg doesn't mean my cousin who wants to use facebook and watch movies should."


Something tells me your facebooking cousin doesn't have 2 GPUS and 3 monitors either. I have not had any issues with multi monitor support on my laptop or desktop.

Quote: " The backend stuff is delicate."


I'd say it's the oposite. My main gripe with windows is that it's terribly inconsistent. The thing that made me fully make the switch from windows was that it randomly decided to block a bunch of programs from writing any files to the disk because they came from the internet. It didn't tell me about it and it didn't do it for all programs. It broke my AppGameKit compiler and prevented me from saving progress in a bunch of games.

Another thing I hate is the 'library' feature in the file explorer, it's sort of my documents, but not really.

Windows to me feels like it is built on top of a very fragile base which keeps being extended. It leads to weird behaviour, lots of security issues and other things. Linux on the other hand feels so much more structured and thought out, if something happens atleast it's consistent and fixable.

Yes, I agree with you that hardware and software support is a bit lacking. Installing GPU drivers, atleast on ubuntu is a total pain and sometimes some hardware won't work at all. Software is similar, a lot of it wont' work but there are alternatives for almost everything.

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
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TheComet
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 15:14
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Quote: "Linux doesn't work all the time, every time, in all manner of configurations. Windows does. It would be different if Linux at least had something better to offer over windows, but often the apps are worse or non-existent. The backend stuff is delicate. The frontend stuff is super configurable but that's hardly a selling point for facebookers."


I can agree with most of that, but you also have to realise that Linux' selling point isn't what facebookers and Candy Crush players are looking for. It's a system written by hackers for hackers. As someone who's been programming applications/games on Linux for years I can tell you it's infinitely better at everything software development related than Windows could ever be.

Yes, people have been trying to make it more user friendly for users who don't know how to computer and just want their facebooks and twitters. I'd argue that in most cases ubuntu/kubuntu/mint has done its job well in hiding all of the technicalities. However, when a technical issue surfaces (such as a monitor not being detected), you can't hide the fact that you're still running Linux, which means you'll have to solve the problem the Linux way.

Also, while we're on the topic of troubleshooting, are you trying to tell me solving computer issues on Windows is easier than on Linux? I currently have an issue where I can't pipe data to other commands (e.g. "type *.bmp | ffmpeg"). I keep getting the error message "The filename, directory name, or volume label syntax is incorrect". The command works fine on every other Windows computer except for mine.

Like every other issue I've ever had with Windows, you find 10 websites all suggesting some flat, stupid "solution" that - most of the time - has nothing to do with your problem and that's it. If that fails, you're screwed, because there's no way to dig deeper.

"With RSA, how does one choose the two prime numbers when being serious?"
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 18:58
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Hmm,

I wonder if anybody "in the know" can shed some light on this. A guy at work claimed Windows 10 comes with the ability to essentially SLI/Crossfire your graphics cards. I am interested in some evidence for it first. I know the spec for DirectX 12 has this, which sounds fantastic, except...games present are DX9 or DX11 or both. However, work guy claims it's Windows 10 too that does this. But this was prior to release.

Now, I don't know if DirectX 12 brings the functionality to DX9 and DX11 games, but basically, I would like to know if I could essentially stick the GTX770 I just replaced in with my brand spanking new GTX980 without SLI using Windows 10 and/or DirectX 12 with DX9 and 11 games? (because I was stupid and didn't get a Mobo that supports SLI and don't fancy upgrading that yet).

However, if true for Windows 10, I can see it making itself attractive in the eyes of gamers.

I've yet to make the leap to Windows 10. Not sure if I will just yet.

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Seditious
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 19:06
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Quote: "I can agree with most of that, but you also have to realise that Linux' selling point isn't what facebookers and Candy Crush players are looking for. It's a system written by hackers for hackers"


Agreed! That's why it'll never be mainstream, because users want something that's easy to set up and use. It does offer you a lot of power and customization, but not a lot of people want or need this.

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 19:34 Edited at: 5th Aug 2015 19:52
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Quote: "you guys really hate progress"


Very true. I still don't own a mobile phone - which seems to annoy everyone except me.

Edit In fact I'm so far behind the times that I didn't see this page before I posted.



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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 20:19
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Quote: "Agreed! That's why it'll never be mainstream, because users want something that's easy to set up and use. It does offer you a lot of power and customization, but not a lot of people want or need this."


Yep, honestly, 'average' people just wouldn't cope. I offer technical support to a lot of customers each day and most can barely operate their TV, a PC is already confusing as hell to a lot of people and Linux, despite how simple it is to folk like us, to the average person...no. My mum can barely work her iPad.

I can see why they try and simplify things and working with customers, I can understand why Apple are so, well, closed off - yes, one can argue they profit from it - but the benefit to the user is that Apple has a lot more control, can decided how things talk to each other and make things simpler. Also means when speaking to Apple's support, they only have to worry about advising Apple products. But it does mean, the user has less control and has less available to them, but the average person, generally doesn't care.

I think Windows has been trying to be more and more user friendly to the average user. Linux, I still feel is targeted at IT professionals and nerds. Which is fine, because they make excellent servers and are great for technologies and systems and are less bloated. Steam is trying to appeal to gamers with Linux to improve their demographic a bit, mainly because Gabe isn't so much of a fan of where Windows is going. Kudos though, because it is the sensible way to deal with it.

However, I myself, still a Windows fan, once upon a time, I was a hater due to stability issues.

Windows 10 is making me go "mmm" a bit, because of the privacy stuff, but I generally find people who harp on about their personal data being used for marketing and improvement purposes and in some cases, data being sold, also have Facebook and Twitter accounts. I have come to a point where I realise that there's data Google, Facebook and their friends can access and use if they wish - but also realise, the only purpose they have is to use it for marketing and self-improvement - so long as they don't sell my data to serial killers and those who wish to use my data maliciously and keep it secure, then I don't mind. Of course, I would like the option, but when you think about it, these companies already have a butt load of data on me, because I subscribe to their services. If they were truly going to be malicious, they wouldn't need my permission to do it, they'd just do it.

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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 6th Aug 2015 01:09
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Quote: "3 monitors on 2 graphics cards made ubuntu have a melt down."


Ah, yeah, I have read about several multi-GPU setups not working with Ubuntu. That is unfortunate, just curious though, were you using nVidia GPUs or AMD/ATI?

AMD actually updates their drivers for Linux, whereas nVidia doesn't support it too well, hence why Linus decided to say this...

BAD LANGUAGE ALERT
Torvalds to nVidia

I echo his sentiments, because I do remember trying desperately to get proprietary nVidia graphics drivers installed on my previous build so that I could something in Linux Mint to work properly, and... there were none. Zero. Zilch. Hadn't been updated in years. It's my understanding that they're rectifying this problem, but it's something that AMD has stayed up on. Hence why I say go with AMD if you're gonna do Linux


Forum President until June 20th, 2016. Bow down to me!
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Indicium
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Posted: 6th Aug 2015 01:40
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Quote: "I wonder if anybody "in the know" can shed some light on this. A guy at work claimed Windows 10 comes with the ability to essentially SLI/Crossfire your graphics cards. I am interested in some evidence for it first. I know the spec for DirectX 12 has this, which sounds fantastic, except...games present are DX9 or DX11 or both. However, work guy claims it's Windows 10 too that does this. But this was prior to release. "


I don't understand the question - you can use SLI on Windows versions older than 10... To use crossfire or SLI your cards have to be from the same range. I.e two of the same card or a HD6850 with a HD6870.
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The Zoq2
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Posted: 6th Aug 2015 02:04
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Quote: "
I don't understand the question - you can use SLI on Windows versions older than 10... To use crossfire or SLI your cards have to be from the same range. I.e two of the same card or a HD6850 with a HD6870. "


I assume he meant that you will be able to use 2 different GPUS with similar to how SLI works now, except they don't have to be identical. For example 1 970 and one 770 working together.

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 6th Aug 2015 03:54 Edited at: 6th Aug 2015 03:55
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That is correct. It is a confirmed feature of DirectX 12, it doesn't even have to be the same manufacturer, you will be able to have an AMD and NVidia card installed and they will work asynchronously, like you would in an SLI or Crossfire set up, without the model limitations of SLI and Crossfire.

What I was curious of, was whether there was truth to what my colleague suggested, "it's not just DirectX 12, but Windows 10 too" suggesting you don't need to play DirectX 12 games to see the benefit.

Or if what he suggested is rubbish (which I strongly suspect is true), would be good to know if DirectX 12 offers any backwards compatibility in that you can get the same feature with DirectX 9 and DirectX 11 games, on any DirectX12 enable system. My gut says not, but still, would be nice to know the facts over the speculation.


Also, for those only just hearing about it (as I may have confused Indicium, but mind you, my braining hasn't been braining this week due to lack of sleep from holiday), more detailed information on DirectX 12's Multi-GPU feature: Link!

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Dar13
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Posted: 6th Aug 2015 04:02
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Quote: " Or if what he suggested is rubbish, would be good to know if DirectX 12 offers any backwards compatibility in that you can get the same feature with DirectX 9 and DirectX 11 games, on any DirectX12 enable system. My gut says not, but still, would be nice to know the facts over the speculation. "

I think it's rubbish. DX 12 puts a lot more power in the developer's hands, but the developer has to explicitly use that power properly. The progression in API models has been: DX9/OGL = Python where a bunch of stuff is done for you but you still control program execution and can muck stuff up if you really want to. DX12/Vulkan = low-level C where very little is done for you but you have near-ultimate control of the hardware.

Quote: " I echo his sentiments, because I do remember trying desperately to get proprietary nVidia graphics drivers installed on my previous build so that I could something in Linux Mint to work properly, and... there were none. Zero. Zilch. Hadn't been updated in years. It's my understanding that they're rectifying this problem, but it's something that AMD has stayed up on. Hence why I say go with AMD if you're gonna do Linux "

Nvidia is not helping the open source drivers(nouveau). Nouveau doesn't work with the 900 series of GPUs because Nvidia will not release the firmware necessary to do so, and it has changed from the reverse-engineered firmware the open-source developers have created for previous GPU generations. Both AMD and Intel have contributed to both Mesa(the OpenGL implementation shared across most open-source GPU drivers) and the kernel to increase performance for their GPU products while Nvidia contributes very little if at all. So you're almost right, except Nvidia hasn't changed a bit except to release somewhat new proprietary drivers that still don't work right with the kernel(they don't implement Kernel Mode Setting, which allows for dynamic clock changes/sleep to be properly achieved).

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 7th Aug 2015 14:37 Edited at: 7th Aug 2015 16:08
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Can anyone advise Mrs GG what to do? She has just taken the plunge and installed W10 (I kindly suggested she tried first ). However, after getting the 100% complete message all she has is a black screen with a light blue Windows logo in the centre. Her machine doesn't seem to be doing anything and doesn't react to any user input. What should she do next?

Help!!

Edit Update (). After approx. an hour of downloading/installing W10 and waiting for something to open up we turned the machine off and rebooted. Guess what. Mrs GG still has W7 and no trace of W10 on her machine.

I'm glad it's still not available for my two machines yet.



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Indicium
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Posted: 7th Aug 2015 17:09
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My house mate went the upgrade option and the start menu wouldn't work. I did a clean install, it took 20 minutes and it's working fantastic. Do a clean install if possible. Is that possible using the free version?
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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 7th Aug 2015 17:36
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It's all handled automatically by Windows update I think.



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Dar13
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Posted: 7th Aug 2015 19:25
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A clean install is possible after the update. I don't think you can jump straight to clean install without purchasing a separate license.

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bitJericho
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Posted: 7th Aug 2015 21:27 Edited at: 7th Aug 2015 21:27
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Quote: " A clean install is possible after the update. I don't think you can jump straight to clean install without purchasing a separate license."


Sure you can: http://www.howtogeek.com/224342/how-to-clean-install-windows-10/

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 7th Aug 2015 23:48
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Hey looky! My theory regarding how to stop the auto updates was correct, and does work on Home Edition:

http://www.howtogeek.com/224471/how-to-prevent-windows-10-from-automatically-downloading-updates/

You have the option to set any connection you wish as a metered connection (Windows will remember the setting too), and Windows will not download any updates on connections you have set as metered. If this really is the case, I will seriously consider upgrading to 10.
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Dar13
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Posted: 7th Aug 2015 23:52
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Quote: " You have the option to set any connection you wish as a metered connection (Windows will remember the setting too), and Windows will not download any updates on connections you have set as metered. If this really is the case, I will seriously consider upgrading to 10. "

So you're going to universally disable updates? Considering the security holes in previous MS products that seems like a bad idea.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 00:05
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Quote: "So you're going to universally disable updates?"
Not universally disabling them, just disabling the intrusive automatic nature of them (which itself may not be as bad as I originally thought). When updates are found, Windows will still notify you of them, and at that point you may tell Windows to download and install the updates over your connection, even if you have set it as metered. It would effectively give you the same level of update control as you have in, say, Windows 7 with automatic updates disabled.
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Kezzla
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 05:48 Edited at: 8th Aug 2015 05:49
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Edit: Deleted, didn't see page 3 /edit

I have it on my machine now, though it took forever to install. So far I am happy with it. All the software I have tried works with it no dramas.

One cool feature that I like is right click cast to device. It works really well, it just automatically took over my xbox without the need to do anything on the xbox itself.
Not sure if it was already there on windows 8 but it is nice, no more cables from my computer to my stereo.

The Start menu seems like a good compromise between the trusty old start menu and their terrible windows 8 start screen.

So far so good. It is behaving well.

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 12:30
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Quote: "Quote: " A clean install is possible after the update. I don't think you can jump straight to clean install without purchasing a separate license."

Sure you can: "


@bitJericho

The link you gave says this:

Quote: "If you want to perform a clean install of WIndows 10 and haven’t upgraded to Windows 10 yet on your Windows 7 or 8.1 PC, you have some extra work to do. You’ll need to take advantage of Microsoft’s upgrade offer before performing a clean install."


Mrs GG has tried another route to perform her upgrade to W10. This new method (I don't know what she did precisely yet ) still failed to complete the upgrade but it gave her far more information during the installation process and we're still digesting it. The specific error given was:

"Error code 0xc1900101 - 0x20017 Installation failed in the SAFE-OS phase with an error during BOOT"

No idea what that means or what to try next. Could something like Norton be causing issues?



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bitJericho
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 12:49 Edited at: 8th Aug 2015 12:49
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Oh shoot sorry, I thought the article was talking about the key stuff before windows 10 was getting installed.

I found another article that mentioned this tip:

Quote: "Another option, rather than installing Windows 10 twice, is to click the small "change what to keep" button during installation, and then select "nothing" from the following screen. This will delete all of your files, apps, and settings. This will be functionally the same as performing a clean installation, but there may be small underlying differences."


Otherwise I would say a call to redmond is in order. On the plus side they'll probably just make it happen for you. Support is actually pretty decent.

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 13:15
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Just found a "solution" to the BOOT error:

[href=http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-windows_install/the-installation-failed-in-the-safeos-phase-with/54db0c8f-f9f0-4093-b2fe-ad378685686a?auth=1[/href]

Unfortunately I don't understand the instructions.

Quote: "Otherwise I would say a call to redmond is in order."


Who or what is redmond?



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Dar13
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 17:46
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Redmond is the city where Microsoft is based in Washington state.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 18:05
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So I want to perform a clean install of 10 from a media disk, and I have a product key for Windows 7 which is currently installed; will that product key work to properly register the new Windows 10 installation?
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bitJericho
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 21:12
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DJD, it seems like you have to first do an upgrade install. Then once 10 is installed you can do a clean install from the control panel.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 21:23
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Gotcha, thanks.
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 9th Aug 2015 17:41
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So...I decided to take the plunge and upgrade to Windows 10. The reason doing so it that the complaints weren't significant enough to put me off and generally the bigger ones have a work-around.

However, I did notice in the installation process if I go to "Custom Settings" instead of "Express Settings" I get these 2 screens:

http://i.imgur.com/U7WCsIN.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/drkuM4h.jpg

Seems the cover a few of the security options there.

Anyway, gonna take this out for a ride, see what it's like.

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Ortu
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Posted: 9th Aug 2015 21:36
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anyone try using dbpro in 10 yet?

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Kezzla
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Posted: 10th Aug 2015 14:43
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Quote: "anyone try using dbpro in 10 yet?"


only a quick test running an old project, but it seems to work fine. The original DBPro IDE is even working again, which it never did on windows 8.

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 10th Aug 2015 18:56 Edited at: 10th Aug 2015 20:11
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Quote: "anyone try using dbpro in 10 yet?"


I've just taken the plunge and have upgraded to W10.

Just tested several of (Edited ) my old DBPro projects and they all work fine - and the editor works fine too. As far as I can see everything is in the same place as before. The main obvious change is that the taskbar looks different. I haven't got to grips with the new Browser yet - mainly because I couldn't work out how to use it for simple tasks. So I'm using IE as always.

I used the Customize option to turn off loads of stuff (in the hope/belief I could turn them back on later if necessary ). But so far so good.

Now to see if I can use email, etc, ...

Edit After an initial system hang () email works fine too. Still can't see where to set IE as my default browser.

Mrs GG still can't get W10 to install. She's had an on-line conversation with an MS techie who said the error was caused by switching off her machine. But how long should she wait for the thing to install? It was all over in a few minutes on my machine - once the download had finished that is.

Edit2 Found out how to set IE as my default browser. Just a few more settings to go and I won't know the difference between W7 and W10. Is there a difference.



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Chris Tate
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Posted: 11th Aug 2015 00:38
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Poor Mrs GG

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Seditious
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Posted: 11th Aug 2015 00:51
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Quote: "Still can't see where to set IE as my default browser."


Why, pray tell, would one want to do such a thing?

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