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AppGameKit Studio Chat / UnityExport - UnityImport

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haliop_New
User Banned
Posted: 4th Apr 2019 09:58
What if we could export an AGKstudio project into Unity?

Wait. Stop. Think.

10000000000000000000000000 Unity/Unreal users.
where the benefits are actually mega-developer companies, as you can already know, take 1 developer he will build something great, take 10 they will build something incredible, take 100 you'll probably be noticeable.

10000 Agk users. 1 to 3 tiny-developer company.

most of Unity or Unreal users will not leave their known beloved Engine\Ide or Visual Scripting

so what if, AGKstudio will give a taste of what can be done with the ability to export to Unity? so you might start here but will be able to continue with Unity.
even if TGC will get a very small percentage of unity users to come and test out this incredible tool, its still a lot of people, they will still have to buy it... you are probably thinking of an asset store as I saw like in AgkMobile (which is superb) so what if one of the assets for purchase will be UnityExport or UnrealExport or any other....

The other thing that came to mind, is that if AGkstudio uses the C# abilities as a different way to code in AGKstudio, where you will be able to use both it and Basic on Tier 1 , you could create connections to other Api's with C# instead of Tier 2 C++ which is harder. C# also is what used in Unity.
I saw some examples that AGKclassic C# is working.

The ability to export to another engine such as Unity or Unreal is like being able to run a car that works both on Gas, Electricity, and Water, you will never stop driving as you will probably find ways to refuel your car.
and since Unity and Unreal are free, this could be an Extra way of using Game Engines to your benefits.

I might be way off the road when it comes to business thinking, but maybe its a vice versa way to get a lot of new users into AgkStudio.

I remember when I built maps for Call of Duty\ Unreal Tournament\ CS, it took seconds to get familiar with another Ide since they did not use the same, but the idea was extremely alike, what if we could Take a unity project and import it onto AGKstudio and what if we can take an AGKstudio project and export it into Unity? like creating maps for one game and export them to another and just retweak them on the new Ide.

there are 1000 of games to sell on Unity, where you can simply pay and change the art and you have a ready game. export it into AppGameKit, increase its potential and reSell it. Learn from it.

or if I can export a game into Unity I will be able to then Export it to new Devices that Unity Supports.

can I get your thoughts about it?



Takis76
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Apr 2005
Location: Greece
Posted: 4th Apr 2019 11:05
The idea importing a complete Unity or Unreal project to Application Game Kit Studio is nice but the engines and the languages are different. So the conversion will not be seamless. BUT exporting and importing assets from one engine to another it will be very nice.
For example if you have purchased some asset from Unity Asset store and you are able to convert it to Application Game Kit Studio model and will be compatible to Game Guru too it will be great. Or you have purchased one asset from The Game Creators Marketplace and convert it to Unity asset.
This will be very beneficial for The Game Creators and I agree.
+1
haliop_New
User Banned
Posted: 4th Apr 2019 11:18
Agree, and still, I think there is a method to export from one System to another just like different types of Databases. it's basicly strings... I am not saying it's easy... but it can be done.
I know a lot of ppl who import export stuff from Unreal to Unity and from Unity to Unreal. It's considered as a "normal" thing to do so.
for example, you can use Unreal Tessalation system to export images into Unity for about any model, since Unreal does that automatic you just need to turn it on. on Unity, you have to supply extra data for it to work. both good I guess though I have not seen a Triple-A game from Unity yet.
Kevin Cross
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 15th Nov 2003
Location: London, UK
Posted: 4th Apr 2019 11:24 Edited at: 4th Apr 2019 11:25
It probably isn't a good business move for TGC offering the ability to export from AppGameKit to Unity. However, importing from Unity to AppGameKit might. I don't use Unity though so not something I'd want or need.
OryUI - A WIP AGK2 UI Framework
RobbSnow
4
Years of Service
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Joined: 14th Oct 2015
Location:
Posted: 4th Apr 2019 12:57
I don't know. If someone wants Unity, just use Unity. I am not seeing how if would be worth the effort by TGC or if it is even possible.
haliop_New
User Banned
Posted: 4th Apr 2019 13:28
Cause it will let unity users check out AppGameKit and vise versa
Raven
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 23rd Mar 2005
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 4th Apr 2019 14:55
Well speaking from experience... this suggestion will not do what you think it will.

Now the reason that UE4 and U3D have (some degree) of Cross-Integration is in-part out of Necessity., but also in-part because of Microsoft (Game Studios).
You have to keep in mind that Microsoft more-or-less own Unity today., and they also have a long-standing partnership with Epic for the Unreal Engine that is heavily used by most of their 1st Party Studios.
I've been hearing rumours that this is changing given Epic's unwillingness to give up their partnership with NVIDIA … but eh, let's not get into Industry Politics right now.

In any case, as Unity is used by … well everyone as at the bare minimum a Rapid Prototype Middleware for testing concepts, ideas, mechanics, etc. before them committing to Developing such on an in-house proprietary engine (my own studio has our Sunset Engine) or taking a deep breath and cracking open the Unreal Engine 4 Source (oh boy is that "Fun" to modify / expand / extend)., obviously there needed to be a way to fairly rapidly transfer between the two Engines to switch between Prototypes and Production.

Obviously for In-House Engines., most of the Toolchains are also internally produced (and typically specialised for what they need to do) … while for Unreal Engine, well it's a bit more Generalised. This on the whole cuts down on the need for Multiple Content Creation Pipelines (primarily speaking).
What I mean is., you can craft a Characters / Environment / Vehicle Asset for UE4; then simply pull it over into Unity for Prototype Testing and it's (mostly) basically usable without another Work Pipeline specifically for it.

You're not really converting over any actual Mechanical Elements between the two.
Could AppGameKit add support for the Unreal Model Format (umodel) or Unity Model/Scene Format (.model/.scene),. eh I guess... but what would be the point.
AGK like Unity is essentially a Rapid Application Development Environment... why make it easier to use a direct competitor?

And no, of course in terms of Desktop / Console Games; they're not even in the same league … but in regards for Mobile Games., honestly AppGameKit and Unity are very competitive products.
Now in all honestly., I was for the most part unaware that AppGameKit was even capable of 3D or Desktop Development.
Everything I'd seen showcased it as some Visual 2D Game Maker, primarily for Web / Mobile Games.
On top of this, it isn't available via the Microsoft Store (Apps) but instead is available via Steam, which on it's own somewhat cheapens the impression of the product.
Not being funny but from a Professional / Business Owner Perspective... Steam Software is like shopping in the Bargain Bin at a Super Market, and when TGC/AGK Web-Presence is... well nearly non-existent, with a Website that while it LOOKS nice., doesn't really give much information on WTF the Product actually is.

When you then add to that, that after getting frustrated with trying to jump through the hoops to get the "Trial" Version... I just gave up and bought the Basic Package on Steam, just to try the damn thing out.

Yeah... that's not exactly leaving a good impression.
Especially when you can download and start using Unity 3D immediately, all you need is to create an account on the Website.

I'm aware that both products have different License approaches.
Unity 3D having a Tiered Income Royalty., where-as AppGameKit (as best I can gather) is Perpetual and Royalty Free... but to me, it would certainly encourage more people if they did both.
Sure, 10-15 years ago Price Gating made sense; as it was the common practise.
Unity 3D was £85, Dark BASIC Professional was £75, etc... but today... there are just so many alternative options that don't cost a penny to get started with.

And really if you're trying to encourage Developers (Development Studios) like myself to convert over, or encourage a new Generation of Bedroom / Indie Developers to adopt your product... well you want to tempt them in with the Core Product being Free., this might seem like a strange business tactic but once you hook people in … well then you charge for the additional / professional / team / resource elements.

I'd actually instead of a Royalty System, instead suggest a Tier Subscription System.
Say:

Core = Free
Standard = £10 / month (this provides access to the extensions, like VR, Visual Designer, etc.)
Professional = £25 / month (per 5 Seats, as Access to the API SDK, Provides Team Features; such-as GitHub and Shared Project Development)

Heck you could also have say a Quarterly and Yearly Sub that have discounts to encourage longer-term investment., with an Enterprise (50-100 Seat) for Education and Studios for a Yearly Subscription Fee.

By all means, have the Core Edition on Steam / Microsoft Store / Apple Store / etc.
Heck I think it'd be amusing to see it on the Epic Store even... but have the Subscriptions handled via the Website / Account System, that's SEPERATE from 3rd Party Systems.

Notice how nothing I've said so far has anything to do with the Product itself.
Because, really the key thing here for Product Support... is primarily awareness, image and branding.
If you don't have those... then consumer / developer support is always going to be relatively niche., and most importantly here; part of that branding and image is going to come from products that are associated with it that are popularised.

I mean, consider for the moment that the one that TGC themselves tout is the UK Driving Test App that has used Dark BASIC / AppGameKit throughout it's Lifespan.
Even within the UK... I'm not being funny, but most people don't really care too much about that... it's not a big draw.
Where-as., if there was a major (High Quality, PC / Console) Game Release that used it... well that would be a game changer (pun intended).



You want to put AppGameKit "On the Map" … well, that's entirely in your hands to do.
Give TGC something that they can milk for Marketing and Branding Purposes.
Jeku
Moderator
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 5th Apr 2019 22:07
Quote: "On top of this, it isn't available via the Microsoft Store (Apps) but instead is available via Steam, which on it's own somewhat cheapens the impression of the product."


@Raven - Are you sure about that? I don't know of one person who has bought a game or product on the Microsoft store, yet others (myself included) have over 1000 games and software on the Steam store. I wasn't aware that anyone pays real attention to the Microsoft store, as on Windows you typically just go to the company's website and purchase the software directly.

And curious what your studio has developed or is developing? And what's the studio's name?
Senior Software Engineer - RotoGrinders

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