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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / Should I buy DB-Pro?

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Speedhorn
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 02:37
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Ok, there have probably been many threads like this before, so i apologize, but:

I heard that DB-Pro was one of the best games creation tools out there and at a reasonable price. I'm a little worried as i'm completely new to this and you have to code everything yourself.

I'm wondering if any of you guys found the code daunting at first, but found that once you learned the basics it became alot more simple.

I have qualifications in ICT, nothing major, just GVNQ Intermediate and Advanced which i picked up through school and college, but we never did any real programming as such.

Basically, can you put forward any pros for this product for a complete newb in this field.

Thanks.
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TRS80Model1
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 04:13
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I would say that you can do in 1 month with DarkBasicPro which would take most people 3 yrs. to learn with microsofts API with Directx and c++. Basic is one of the easiest programming tools to learn and makes a good link to directx for you.

Just note that DBPro is still under development and contains headache causing bugs, but the developers seem determined, and have done a very good job thus far.

I would say that if you are interested in learning to code, and see a quick visual return, then this is for you.

I suggest you download the demo and take a test spin, eh?

If you like it then buy it, if not then devote your every waking minute to microsoft.

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TogaMario
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 04:53
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It's so darn easy to learn this code that I immediately bought it after I downloaded the demo ... I mean wow, I knew a little bit about c++ and directX programming, and I made 'Pong' in like one month and it sucked. I download DBPro, in three days my camera settings are already pegged just how I like em', complete with gravity (which I never could've programmed in C++) and i'm still chuggin'! I would highly recommend it, but i'd also highly recommend you download the demo and play with it to see how fun it is first

Good luck!

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The admiral
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 06:05
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I also highly recomend buying it i love the language and i love to work with dbpro and se how its growing advancing.So buy it my friend.

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Speedhorn
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 14:23
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I downloaded the demo last night, i'll have a play with it today.

Thanks guys and/or girls

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 17:16
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How can it be "1 million * better" ? It's an API for god's sake, it's not even a language - you can't even begin to compare the two. What on earth do you think DBPro is doing under the hood if it's not calling those exact same functions for you? This has to be the most ridiculous comparison I've heard yet.

"Gentlemen, we are about to short-circuit the Universe!"
DB Team / Atari ST / DarkForge / Retro Gaming
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Rob K
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 19:31
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@Speedhorn

Ignore whatever Sauron says, he periodically pops up, slams DB/P and all its users, makes generally annoying insults, spams the forums, then leaves.

DBPro is pretty easy to pick up. The special effects are very easy but you do need to be prepared to learn a little 3D maths to use it fully.

NOBODY has a forum name as stupid as Darth Shader. I do.
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Kale
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 20:52
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Quote: "It's an API for god's sake"


i think the term 'wrapper' is more correct and yes the two can't really be compared.

What the flame does not consume, consumes the flame.
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 21:09
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No, DirectX is a (set of) APIs. From Microsofts web page and documentation:

"Microsoft® DirectX® is a set of low-level application programming interfaces (APIs) for creating games and other high-performance multimedia applications."

Cheers,

Rich

"Gentlemen, we are about to short-circuit the Universe!"
DB Team / Atari ST / DarkForge / Retro Gaming
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NickIgoe
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 21:26
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Personally I would buy DBPro out of the other languages I`ve used but be prepared to work around quite a bit.The lack of an in depth manual is a bit of a hinderence.
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Puffy
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Posted: 8th Feb 2003 21:44
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^_^ Just goto the darkbasic website and look at top sites... plenty of examples and tutorials (I think) to get you started.

AMD Athlon XP 2100+ OC to 3Ghz/1.5gigs ram/128mb ti4200/120gigs hd/19" monitor/Sound Blaster Audigy Platinum EX/3072kbs Sat Con... I joined in!
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TogaMario
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 01:19
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@Unoriginal Lord of the Rings rip-off

DirectX is easy, eh? Is that a fact or matter of opinion? Well I'm an artist, not a programmer ... and easy is a very relative term. So think before you speak motor mouth.

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Speedhorn
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 02:10
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My first post and everyone is arguing.

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Kale
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 04:39
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Quote: "No, DirectX is a (set of) APIs. From Microsofts web page and documentation:

"Microsoft® DirectX® is a set of low-level application programming interfaces (APIs) for creating games and other high-performance multimedia applications.""


yes! and DBPro wraps around this! hence, the term 'wrapper' is more correct!

What the flame does not consume, consumes the flame.
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Rodro
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 04:57
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That's the norm here .... Speedhorn. It's really amazing.

The sky won't snow and the sun won't shine........
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Rodro
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 05:03
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Who cares if it's a wrapper or API or a language. Just enjoy it, code well and hopefully make money or satisfaction.

Is there another forum where I can get more mature, tech advice/help/info?

The sky won't snow and the sun won't shine........
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Kale
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 05:22
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Quote: "Is there another forum where I can get more mature, tech advice/help/info?
"

nope, this is it! he he... just dig in and put up with it, this is the norm!

What the flame does not consume, consumes the flame.
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AMD XP2100+, Geforce4Ti 4400, 512Mb DDR, Abit KX7, WinXP Home
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Archon
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 10:10
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if you like programming with db then you shuld buy it..
it is very good program

"death is my meat; terror is my wine"
-Asdrubael vect of the Black heart
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 16:30
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"Is there another forum where I can get more mature, tech advice/help/info?"

You can try over at RGT http://www.realgametools.net but you'll find the exact same problems there too (if not more so, but it's worth a shot).

The only place you won't find any of this is on DBDN (but even mentioning that here usually illicits lots of posts about it being too expensive, eliteist, etc - but you avoid all the stuff like this! people there don't tend to challange what you said, dislike your reply and then turn it around against you again* and you'll find a lot more very experienced people there who avoid this place for the those exact reasons. See the link on the bottom of the DB homepage for more details.

Cheers,

Rich

* Kale - I was talking about DirectX being an API, you said it was a wrapper, it's not, end of story - don't try and then make out that I was talking about DBP all along and twist it. (Sorry everyone, it just pisses me off when people argue with you, are wrong and then miss the point totally when you correct them, but I'll leave it be for now).

"Gentlemen, we are about to short-circuit the Universe!"
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Rob K
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 16:49
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No that is not true - generally the RGT forum visitors are far more experienced and have been using DB for a lot longer. If you need code help or want to ask in depth tech questions I suggest you go there.

the url is actually: http://www.realgametools.net/forums

NOBODY has a forum name as stupid as Darth Shader. I do.
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 18:45
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True, but the arguments there equal anything you'll find here just as much - that you cannot deny.

Cheers,

Rich

"Gentlemen, we are about to short-circuit the Universe!"
DB Team / Atari ST / DarkForge / Retro Gaming
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Rodro
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 20:17
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Thanks Rich!! I'll join DBDN & try realgametools. I'm just tired of reading the same ol' BLAH which does nothing to improve my knowledge. I hate to say it, because this forum had potential, but it is a lot like AOL, which I dropped.

Love the product (DBP)!!

The sky won't snow and the sun won't shine........
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Kangaroo2
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 20:35
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For the original question : Its only intimidating if you've never programmed b4 but with an open mind and a very basic understanding of Simple algebra and mathematical Graph plotting you'll be up and running a lot quicker than any other pheasible language out there

As for the whole forum thing, well thats why I wanna join DBDN, but the price is about double what I would consider reasonable for the privaledge Its not that I can't afford it, its just a kinda principle I guess. Just my personal prefernce tho I mean no disrespect to anyone

Coming Soon! Kangaroo2 Studio... wait and quiver with anticipation! lol
[email protected] - http://www.kangaroo2.com - If the apocalypse comes, email me
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Speedhorn
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Posted: 9th Feb 2003 23:11
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Well, i'm a complete noob with no real programming experience.
I taught myself webdesign, nothing amazing, but i could create some pretty decent layouts, will that help in anyway?
Like i said, i've got qualifications in ICT, but there was not really any programming as such.

Ralph, Jesus didn't have wheels.
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Kangaroo2
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Posted: 10th Feb 2003 00:33
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Well if you mean web design as in html programming through html, yes I guess that would help you too understand what a programming language is, and a little about how the pc interprets raw code, but other than that I'm afraid it won't teach you any actual commands you'll use in DBP. Every1s gotta start somewhere tho

Coming Soon! Kangaroo2 Studio... wait and quiver with anticipation! lol
[email protected] - http://www.kangaroo2.com - If the apocalypse comes, email me
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Arrow
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Posted: 10th Feb 2003 00:35
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Well, there is the brginer's forum if you get stuck, plus since it's alot more forgiving. They only chew you out if you ack like an ass.

Am I a butterfly dreaming I'm a man?
Or a bowling ball dreaming I'm a plate of samishi?
Never assume that what you see or feel is real.
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Speedhorn
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Posted: 10th Feb 2003 00:44
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Well, i think i'm gonna give it a go, i'm not going to know if i can get along with it if i don't try.

Ralph, Jesus didn't have wheels.
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Arrow
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Posted: 10th Feb 2003 00:47
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That's the spirit.

Am I a butterfly dreaming I'm a man?
Or a bowling ball dreaming I'm a plate of samishi?
Never assume that what you see or feel is real.
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Kangaroo2
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Posted: 10th Feb 2003 03:12
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Nice1 If you ever get stuck and no1'll help, Email me

Coming Soon! Kangaroo2 Studio... wait and quiver with anticipation! lol
[email protected] - http://www.kangaroo2.com - If the apocalypse comes, email me
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Puffy
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Posted: 10th Feb 2003 03:52
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I'll remember that ...

AMD Athlon XP 2100+ OC to 3Ghz/1.5gigs ram/128mb ti4200/120gigs hd/19" monitor/Sound Blaster Audigy Platinum EX/3072kbs Sat Con... I joined in!
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GravityWell
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Posted: 15th Feb 2003 04:17
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If your new to programming or working alone, then for $99 DarkBASICPro is a way cool! I had a demo with a character walking around in 3d-terrain with snow particles in 2 days. Darkbasic has been recommended in many gamer mags.

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MattIsFun
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Posted: 15th Feb 2003 08:08
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Well, DarkBASIC programs really run in DirectX. Yes, you can get better programs with DirectX, but you'll need a whole team of programmers and years to accomplish what one person can do in DB in a few months. That, and you have to learn how to directly manipulate the DirectX API and you also have to learn C++ before you can do that. And you'll need to spend a few hundred dollars on a C++ compiler... In my opinion, DBPro is much better. Judging by your post, it doesn't sound like you have much programming experience, so you won't want to go into C++ and DirectX. I learned C++ 4 years ago, and I still haven't been able to get the simplest DX program to work right.

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CloseToPerfect
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Posted: 21st Feb 2003 06:53
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I don't visit these forums much, I find RGT's much more polite and helpful, but they are very moderated. that the bad to get the good I guess.

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 21st Feb 2003 21:22
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Oki... someone would like a definitive answer here about using DarkBasic Professional over DirectX with C++

well there isn't one.
DarkBasic is a Machine Compiled Language which relys upon DirectX APi to produce a very stable and fully functioning Engine which is utilising a basic language on a linear path to develop software.

This is more intermediate Software being more of a step between most Basic languages to C and/or C++

Personally if you have the time and the patiance then i'd recommend purchasing Visual C++ .Net (£81 from Amazon.co.uk) and spending a few nites a week checking out a site called GameDev Network and another site called NeHe Productions

Why use C++ over DarkBasic?
well firstly it is one of the primary languages you'll require if you ever want to professionally.
Secondly it is capable of using many Graphics, Sound and System APi - Suchas OpenGL, DirectX, OpenSound, JavaAPi, etc...

The point is though, how would you like to learn programming. DarkBasic is fantastic in its ease of use, with a matter of a few lines of code you can create a square you can walk around the screen ... which within DirectX with C++ takes a good week to understand what is happening enough to reproduce and will also be a good 150-200 lines of code, because DarkBasic does certain things like setup Application Instances, Camera Instances, Track Vertex, Pipelines, Setup Buffers, automatically for you

at the end of the day the decision is yours... and if you require technical specifications, then look about this site and you'll find the technical specs of professional - remember that DirectX can achieve all of them, however being able to is more upto you rather than the Language

If you already understand the understaking and concepts of programming then grab yourself C++ and have fun, if not then stick with Professional for a while.

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
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