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Geek Culture / Brutual review of FPS Creator!

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Computer Nerd
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:27
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This guy has brutally reviewed FPS Creator among others.

http://www.drgamereview.tk i think I got it right else try it without www.

I don't agree! FPS Creator is a great program.

Quote: "

Next time stick to DarkBASIC Lee. This game maker is the worst ever 3d game maker. Oh boy have fun making a nazi game, or sci-fi game. Or writing a engine(oh sounds like fun *yawn). Yeah, anyways the AI is dumber then Jessica Simpson. Burnnnnnnn!! Anyways, don't quit your day jobs guys stick to DarkBASIC.

Graphics: 4 out of 10 (Dog yomit looks better)
Sound: 3 out of 10(repeitive uh, and ahs and bang)
Game Variety: 1 out of 10(make a nazi or sci-fi game)
Overall: 2 out of 10 Not An Average
"


Sounds like a flamed forum member!

Will I ever learn?
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tpfkat
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:30
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hahahahahahahaha
the basic idea is right though.
the noob will buy it and think that what you have to work with is all in the box.
making prefabs and entities is not easy and the instructions arent that good,i think this reveiw will be the start of many,just because the instructions are basically crap for expanding your collection.

the programmer formarly known as thicko.
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Darkbasic MADPSP
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:40
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fpsc rules although i prefer db fpsc was coding in dbp so eat that

Experienced DB http://www.greatgames3d.com (work in progress site)
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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:40
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Most professional reviews of FPSC are distictly average too. I like FPSC and bought a copy as I have said before, but I think they could have easily avoided so many negative reviews with just a few small changes, mostly easy, built in documentation, and a more obvious way of making and importing your own models which is clearly documented so people know they do't have to stick with the limits of the modles already there.


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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:44
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Since this guys webpage is free and the fact that he only has a little over 5000 visits since it started... I wouldn't worry about any bad publicity from this guys site.

He is but one small anchovie in the entire ocean.


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Richard Davey
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:45
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This review is hardly worth loosing any sleep over. The guy can't even grasp the English language, let alone string together a coherent sentance - what hope does he have of making any kind of game, with anything.

I'll be amazed if anyone actually reads that bag of shit for a site (other than 'interested' parties on this forum of course). That's if you can get through the 'Find a Friend' personal ads (which Dr Game Review (sic) could most likely do with).

Exit Planet Dust
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Hawkeye
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:45
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Quote: "Yeah, anyways the AI is dumber then Jessica Simpson"

Not as cute tho.


I am but mad north north-west; when the wind is southerly I know a hawk from a handsaw - Hamlet, Hamlet
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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:51 Edited at: 6th Jan 2006 20:51
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I used to know Jessica Simpson (well I met her a few time before she started releasing singles) back then she was really spotty


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Darkbasic MADPSP
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 20:53
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Quote: "Quote: "Yeah, anyways the AI is dumber then Jessica Simpson"

Not as cute tho.
"

lol

Experienced DB http://www.greatgames3d.com (work in progress site)
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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 21:01
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Not exactly informative is it ?

Blog:http://spaces.msn.com/members/BouncyBrick/
Web Site:http://www.nicholaskingsley.co.uk
Smoke me a computer chip, I'll be baking breakfast.
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Darkbasic MADPSP
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 21:11
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what the review if you can call it that

Experienced DB http://www.greatgames3d.com (work in progress site)
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BatVink
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Posted: 6th Jan 2006 23:46
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There is nothing like a well-written, constructive, grammatically correct and proficiently composed review.

And that really is nothing like a well-written, constructive, grammatically correct and proficiently composed review.

Unfortunately, although FPSC comes with quite a comprehensive manual, I doubt he could read it or even find the will to learn to read it.

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soapyfish
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 00:53 Edited at: 7th Jan 2006 01:06
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He's entitled to his own opinion but I'd respect his opinion a lot more if he'd spent more time on it. As it it, he hasn't even checked his spelling, grammar or even his facts (just nazi and sci-fi games??????). Good for a laugh, and great for an example of an awful review.

Mucho appreciation to Nicholas Thompson for helping me and my mac get along with each other better.
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BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 01:21
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He's just a clickteam/gamemaker fanboy who sits on his posterior poking around with drag 'n' drop game creators with a very small amount of patience.


I'm going to eat you!
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Wiggett
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 01:55
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yeah i don't let me dogs inside cause they "Yomit" all over the place. As for the review, they guy doesn't seem to understand what fpsc was created for. "Only makes nazi or sci-fi games", first off I've seen westerns and othe rgenre's pop out, but the overal idea of fpsc as far as i can tell is to make a simple click and play set up of an fps, and it's just come pre packaged with ww2 and sci-fi as they seem the most popular. I think this guy was hoping it would program the next space shuttle launch for him.

http://www.angelfire.com/wizard2/spacerecon/index.html
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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 02:31
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Honestly, maybe it's not the right place to say it, but I think that most of the products that the game creators sell are not so great as they could be. But the potential is there.
FPS creator is nothing that you couldn't whip out in your spare time (and i guess that QUIKLY proves part of it) and all (and I mean ALL) of the Dark Basic products could be far more speed optimized which is my biggest issue...

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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soapyfish
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 02:44 Edited at: 7th Jan 2006 02:55
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Quote: "FPS creator is nothing that you couldn't whip out in your spare time"


But you'd need a lot of spare time and a vast knowledge of DBP. FPS creator is good because it means the people that don't have a lot of spare time and/or don't have a vast knowledge of DBP can still have fun and make games.

Then there's people like me, who don't code but don't use FPS Creator. I'm waiting for TGC to release a product that lets me make a game just by thinking about toast.

Mucho appreciation to Nicholas Thompson for helping me and my mac get along with each other better.
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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 03:31
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Quote: "FPS creator is good because it means the people that don't have a lot of spare time and/or don't have a vast knowledge of DBP can still have fun and make games."

Yeah, but it's very limited and the games run slow on not so modern configurations.
FPS Creator is NOTHING is compare with TGC's products that actually allow you to make quality games without programming and the games ca still be good.
I'm supporting the way that you would code everything from scratch or almost from scratch.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 06:09
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To me FPS Creator is a introduction to programming without scaring them with making them type in code. It can be a stepping stone toward getting Darkbasic.


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Les Horribres
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 06:59
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Quote: "Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun."

I know that quote... I like that movie...

FPSC's Engine Sucks. Let's replace it with the Unreal engine! Will that make you happy? FPSC was never aimed truely at non-programmers, it was really aimed at the DBP community as a level builder.

And according to Van B, FPSC has more stuff built in then most DBP FPS', so therin lies a problem.

Merranvo, The Cool One

Anti-Noob Justice League, an ANJL of Mercy.
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Drew the G
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 07:11
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Hey Rich,
Watch the language please, there are ladies present .

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Darkbasic MADPSP
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 14:35
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lol rich i agree but i won't quote it due to i would get in trouble

Experienced DB http://www.greatgames3d.com (work in progress site)
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BatVink
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 14:44
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Quote: "FPS creator is nothing that you couldn't whip out in your spare time "


...and you haven't whipped out a project of similar proportions because...?

Quote: "Sorry, no games are available at the time. Please check "In Progress" section"


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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 16:05
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Quote: "To me FPS Creator is a introduction to programming without scaring them with making them type in code. It can be a stepping stone toward getting Darkbasic."

I'm sorry to say, but I wouldn't advise getting DB either. I had so many problems with it and now I don't use it. Too many technical problems get in your way. There's alway an alternative if you want to start from Basic language.
Quote: "FPSC was never aimed truely at non-programmers, it was really aimed at the DBP community as a level builder."

And the level building in it is quite limited. Buy Cartography shop or, even better, 3d world studio.
Quote: "..and you haven't whipped out a project of similar proportions because...?"

It's not what I'm interested in. It's that simple. If one day I'll get an idea of making a shooter-creator in DBP believe me I'll at least try to make it. At the moment - I have no interest in doing it.
The level creation is simplistic, the game engine is not so good (I mean, look at the source of the thing!), but I do admit that it's quite intuitive and it can get you started. The thing is that if you make a game using it there's a chance that the size will be enormous, it won't work on somebody else's computer and the game will be repetative as heck because the level editor offer little variety. It's good for a beginner, but only for a first week and then this person should understand all of the limitations of the project and go on to bigger and greater things.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 16:12
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Quote: "but only for a first week and then this person should understand all of the limitations of the project and go on to bigger and greater things."


Using what?

Exit Planet Dust
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Darkbasic MADPSP
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 16:19
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Quote: "Quote: "but only for a first week and then this person should understand all of the limitations of the project and go on to bigger and greater things."

Using what?"

Just what i was thinking

Experienced DB http://www.greatgames3d.com (work in progress site)
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Fallout
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 16:29
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@Anatoly

I've used DBC/P sinse day one, and I've gone through phases where I've doubted it like you, but to be fair, it's pretty good. It could do with optimisations here and there, a few more bug fixes and better documentation, but when you get into the nitty gritty, you can do a lot with it.

Now, I can't comment on FPSC. I've always assumed whatever can be done in FPSC, I could do better in DB, because I can cut out the FPSC layer and code my own optimisations. But, as far as DBP goes, it's pretty solid. I have to say, judging from your website, you're not an experienced game developer or DB user, and therefore not qualified to comment on DB.

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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 16:48
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Quote: "and I've gone through phases where I've doubted it like you, but to be fair, it's pretty good. "

Well, let's start with DBC - it's freakishly slow. It has trouble running on modern configurations and crashes often. Believe me I do have experience with this. If you make something you should be able to run it on a computer five years later. With DBP (wich I don't own a full version of by the way - so I'm judgin by demo) you can't (or you couldn't at the time) do a select inside another select, the game that were full of graphical content were running slow even on pretty good computers. I was fed up with demo really quickly though it has many features it very unoptmized.
Quote: "I have to say, judging from your website, you're not an experienced game developer or DB user, and therefore not qualified to comment on DB."

I must partially agree. I haven't done a complete game in 3 years, but it was because I was trying to a good speed out of DB. It never happened, so I've abandoned it.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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Fallout
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 17:32
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Yes, DBC is slow. I don't really rate it, but DBP does everything DBC does and more, so when DBP came along, I quickly switched over to it.

The thing about DBP is it's not that quick in some areas, but you can work around them if you get into the depths of it. Selects, for example, you shouldn't really be using if you're optimising your game anyway. If else blocks will do the same job and run quicker. The matrices in DB are another example of something quite poor, but you can use the built in mesh/memblock commands to build your own matrices and code to run much faster.

I do agree that there are limitations in the syntax that can be annoying at times, but at the end of the day, you're paying peanuts for a product that performs well enough for an inexperience developer, and can be pushed to perform much better for an experienced db developer. You can make some impressive outdoor and indoor graphical environments if you spend time optimising and designing them with max performance in mind, and don't just rely on the DB engine to do all the optimisation work for you.

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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 17:45
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I couldn't agree more. The only thing is - I shouldn't be working on work-arounds in first place! DBP can do a lot, but it certainly is a pain to get around of nice and quick way to do something that is not all that complex.
The other problem - 3D Game Creator is tough to get to work on modern systems, DBC has compatibility problems very often so who can say that a copuple of years from now we will still be able to run DBP or FPSC games on our computers? That's not a good thing at all.
Quote: "but at the end of the day, you're paying peanuts for a product that performs well enough for an inexperience developer, and can be pushed to perform much better for an experienced db developer."

Ok, I didn't want to say it (because I'll get a bunch of crazy fan trying to defend their product), but I will. I'm an inexperienced programmer. Yes, I can code in Basic, C, Pascal and a little of ASM, but I prefer it the easy way - that's why I'm still using modern Basic compilers. I've tried several basic compilers and the best I could find yet is the ones that Blitz Research produces. BlitzMAX is currently the fastest basic compiler available and it's a shame that it doesn't have a 3d module yet. As for a good alternative to DBP - Blitz3D. Yes, it doesn't have DX9 bells'n'whistles, it doesn't come in a huge box with a nice printed manuals, but it does the job... Did you see platypus? DB would choke of the amount of sprites that game has, but the game was made with a very first version of Blitz2D! Speed it important because I still remember having an out-dated computer and because none of the games made in DBP or Blitz currently remind me of Half-Life 2 they should be able to be played on old configurations.
I hope that you see my point - I'm not just bashing a product that many people like. It has many advantages, but some thing are more important for me and unfortunately these are the things that DB is not very good at.
I should add that tools don't make games - designers doo. I'm very happy that FPSC is used to make a sequel to Pencil Whipped. Lonnie is GOD! I only hope that it will run on my computer when it will come out.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 17:55 Edited at: 7th Jan 2006 17:57
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Anatoly - "FPS creator is nothing that you couldn't whip out in your spare time (and i guess that QUIKLY proves part of it)"

lol thanks that made my day

Seriously though FPSC is a good product which I own myself and have fun using. Yes I believe that Quikly has more potential, simply due to better tools included (model maker, texture maker etc.) and the fact that it can make games other than FPS and output to dbpro code. However thats not to detract from FPSC at ALL, because:

TGC have never claimed that FPSC did anything that a skilled user couldn't do in dbpro, or tried to cover the fact its made in dbpro. Its a different product, and one there to simply be there for people who don't have the skill, patience or time (any one of these will do) to do so. The fact I've been developing Quikly for over 4 years now and had nothing but support from TGC (and also Fasttrak) gives me enormous confidence and respect for them all I was HUGELY dissapointed with t3dgm and loudly said so, but I really feel FPSC is a great project and a step in the right direction for tgc.

That said I'm very pleased / flattered you compared it with Quikly, so thanks You made me laugh - have a kiwi


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Fallout
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 18:06
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That's not a kiwi. It's a semi-mechanized sparrow with jaundice. *tuts* Get it right!

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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 18:54
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lol No its a Kiwi - he's from "The NewZealand Story" an 80s arcade game by Taito


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Richard Davey
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 19:11
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Quote: "Well, let's start with DBC - it's freakishly slow. It has trouble running on modern configurations and crashes often."


DBC has less trouble running on PCs than DBPro does given it's much lower system requirements. On modern day PCs it positively flies in comparison to when it was released 6 years ago. It doesn't have any trouble running at all, and I'm curious what you base your 'facts' on. I'll tell you what I base my comments on: the fact that we used it to create the Driving Test Success Practical product.

Part of this process was it being sent to the NVIDIA Testing Team, which it obviously passed. The second thing being that this 100% 3D and quite complex product has sold nearly quarter of a million copies over the last few years, sitting at the top of the budget charts for most of that time. That is more sales than a large percentage of AAA titles get btw.

If it 'had trouble' with modern hardware, or crashed often, this would not have been the case. Customers would have returned it in their droves! and it'd have been pulled from the shelves of all the major computer stores and supermarkets in which it sells even today.

But this didn't happen, and numbers speak volumes. That's a very popular DBC app installed on hundreds of thousands of PCs (at one time or another) with so few issues that we've only ever released one update for the software in 24+ months.

Is the reason more to do with the fact that it was a very experienced developer who created the software? Maybe, it's certainly part of the reason. But he used the exact same DBC that everyone else has access to. I agree with the sentiment that it shouldn't take a very experienced developer to be able to create a rock-solid title like that - that the same basis should apply to everyone who uses it. But it does at least highlight one thing; it IS possible.

Cheers,

Rich

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tpfkat
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 19:33
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the real problem here is not the guys review, he used fpsc and thought it was crap...why??? simple.
tgc advertise their stuff in a way that seems to suger coat things.
fpsc is advertised as easy to make a fps. the screenies on the website and the packaging show some glammed up level.
the instructions teach you the basic core of the software and thats it. i think the instructions are crap really, thus the reason i cant be bothered working out how to make new entities and prefabs so really its a click and play with limited exceptions.

dbpro again advertised as easy to use and learn...again the instructions are crap, basically a load of command words and a lesson in how to load a bsp world......what a load of crap.
you have to buy 3rd party software and books to actually learn to use it/utilise it.
in that case every computer language is easy,you just have to buy extra stuff to learn to use it properly.

this probably wont be the last bad review you hear because tgc assume that everyone who buys their products can already code or already understands how to design prefabs and stuff......this is their biggest letdown. and i see no signs of improving.
as for bugs,ive never had probs with dbpro and fpsc in that sense, its just been a pain in the butt getting decent info to learn with.

the programmer formarly known as thicko.
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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 20:16
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Quote: "and I'm curious what you base your 'facts' on."

Unfortunately I base it mostly on my own experience (I'm a customer, but I NEVER return stuff.). I've also having problems running DBC programs that other people wrote. Well, maybe it's just my configuration? I brought the files to my other friends and guess what? it worked just on two computers out of 4 I've tried to run it on! I've run into DBC made demos back in the day on verious message boards and many people replied that they were unable to run it.
Please, I'm not saying that the DBC made products can't be enjoyed by thousands of paying customers. It seems to be that they are quite succesful. I'm saying that I've encountered problems and I'm not the only one who did.
But you've never commented on a speed issue. Platypus was released in 2001 and had an enormous amount of sprites on screen at the same time. Judging by my personal experience with DBC - there's just no way it can do the same.
I'm not saying that you can't create quality products with DB - you most certainly can. But for ME speed matters. If I'm not writing the very core of the game and byuing it insted I would prefer it to be as optimized as possible.
As for the way TGC products are advertized - almost everything is advertised in this way, so I don't think it's a big issue.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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John H
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 20:24
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Ive never had a problem running any DBC/DBP made app., just for the record.


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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 20:34 Edited at: 7th Jan 2006 20:35
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Sorry to be a naysayer, but DBC apps ALWAYS crash XP on my 2 pcs, they play for a few minutes then lock up. I still download demos of dbc games to check them out if they look really good, but can never get into them for too long as they innevitably will freeze my pc

They work fine on exactly the same pcs running 98se (I use muliple hard drives with different os for testing my own stuff) but I'm not exactly going to switch hdds just to play games unless they are truly stunning

If it matters, the 2 pcs are
P4 2ghz, 768mb ram, ati 9700pro & 2x ati 7000s
AMD 1800XP, 512Mb ram, gf2mx 64mb

both with latest drivers in both xp and 98se

[edit] t3dgm also crashes in XP for me, even with the XP patch. I sold my copies of t3dgm and DBC for the stability issues in XP...


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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 21:14
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Quote: "Well, let's start with DBC - it's freakishly slow. It has trouble running on modern configurations and crashes often. Believe me I do have experience with this. If you make something you should be able to run it on a computer five years later."


This may insult you but always start a Classic program with the line "sync rate 0:sync on". Yes it's slow but if you don't do that simple thing it will be freakishly slow. The only time Classic doesn't work for me is when I make a mistake in code.

Quote: "With DBP (wich I don't own a full version of by the way - so I'm judgin by demo) you can't (or you couldn't at the time) do a select inside another select, the game that were full of graphical content were running slow even on pretty good computers. I was fed up with demo really quickly though it has many features it very unoptmized."


The select inside a select probably didn't work for you because you nested it wrong (or the demo just didn't have that ability). The way Pro is right now you can have select inside select inside select inside select (probably no limit) if you do it right. I've never ran a Pro program that was slow and i'm at 2.4ghz.

I suggest you get the Pro Trial and try this bit of code.


Darkbasic Pro Trial:
http://darkbasicpro.thegamecreators.com/?f=trial


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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 21:33
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Quote: "This may insult you but always start a Classic program with the line "sync rate 0:sync on"."

That doesn't really insult me, but woudln't this ruin the whole idea of built-in frame-rate sync? I mean, what if I'm builing a game thatrequire percise timing? One of these workarounds I see...
Quote: "The select inside a select probably didn't work for you because you nested it wrong "

You're underestemating me, my friend. Even if I nested it wrong it should give me an error, but not crash the thing! I've tried demo. Works now. But I don't regret that it didn't do it then - I don't think that I will go back to DB unless it fixes my biggest complaint. As for the slow DBP programs - try one of these FPSC made games - some of them WILL be slow in places. And they look nothing like Quake 4 so there's absolutely no reason for being slow.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 21:54
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Anatoly - thats more to do with the programming of FPSC. My Quikly Games have a VERY high frame rate, and in the new versions the graphics are polywie very similar to fpsc. The thing that speeded up the framrate enormously was letting Newton move objects and handle collision. I went from 15-30 fps in my old code to 300+ when I switched to Newton

Oh and the dbpro demo, I haven't tried it recently but the demo I tried was appallingly bad, so bad I newarly didn't buy it. But once I did and updated with the latest patches 96% of the problems were fixed - I know that the old demo certain was a very old version. Until patch 3 DBPro was unusable for me. But since Patch 3 its been pretty good and since 5.8 is excellent So unless the demo has been updated to 5.8 or 5.9 I'd expect lots of errors in it that you wouldn't get in the full version


Preorder EA here:http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=67575&b=8&p=0
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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 22:45 Edited at: 7th Jan 2006 22:46
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Quote: "That doesn't really insult me, but woudln't this ruin the whole idea of built-in frame-rate sync? I mean, what if I'm builing a game thatrequire percise timing? One of these workarounds I see..."


It's not a workaround. The default frame-rate sync is already set at zero it's just off (until you use "sync on"). With "sync on" it gives you the option to update the screen when you want it... rather than have it update everytime something writes to the screen. This method speeds up the game like crazy and looks better. If you made a 2D tile map do you think it's normal to have the user see each tile being drawn to the screen? You don't want the users to see the map until it's finished... that is why "sync" was created. You draw the map, then "sync" and as if by magic it's like it's drawn instantly. For precise timing you use the "timer()" command... again not a workaround. With "timer()" 1000 = 1 second so this is very precise.

Try this in Classic and Pro (with Pro increase to 10,000 or even 100,000)... try it first like it is then take off the rem on "sync rate 0:sync on"):



"Sync on" and "sync" are vital for speed in both Classic and Pro.

Quote: "You're underestemating me, my friend. Even if I nested it wrong it should give me an error, but not crash the thing! I've tried demo. Works now. But I don't regret that it didn't do it then - I don't think that I will go back to DB unless it fixes my biggest complaint. As for the slow DBP programs - try one of these FPSC made games - some of them WILL be slow in places. And they look nothing like Quake 4 so there's absolutely no reason for being slow.
"


Sorry for underestimating you. It's been my experience on this forum that a lot of the people that try a "select" command for the first time fail to nest right, get mad, and never use that command again. Of course it's usually because new people don't indent their code at all.

You do realize we're going to defend Darkbasic to the ends of the Earth? I love Darkbasic... it brought me back to programming.


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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 22:48
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"it brought me back to programming" Me too


Preorder EA here:http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=67575&b=8&p=0
+ Model Pro out now in Program Announcements!
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Jeku
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 22:53
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Quote: "I'm not saying that you can't create quality products with DB - you most certainly can. But for ME speed matters. If I'm not writing the very core of the game and byuing it insted I would prefer it to be as optimized as possible."


To me that just sounds like someone's excuse for not creating a game in 3 years. If you want real speed, how about you pick up the Doom 3 engine from Id? I hear it's reasonable priced at 500k US. Unreal Engine is even cheaper at around 350k US (or so I hear).

I haven't had speed issues with DBP since the first year I bought it, because back then I didn't know how to make it tight and efficient. That's with any language. My first C++/Direct3D game was slow on many computers, but it was really just a bunch of cubes with textures. I didn't understand the full workings of D3D until I bought a few extra books and studied it. Now I understand the things I've done wrong and improved the speed.

And I don't know about anyone else, but I never control the timing in my game using the SYNC command. Why would you do that? It's much easier checking timing by comparing timestamps and updating based on time (ms or seconds). That makes the most sense to me, as it would run the same on all computers.


Automaton Games website has been revamped! Check it out!
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Anatoly
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 23:00
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Unfortunately, DarkBasic only boosted my interest in modern Basic-compilers, but Blitz had brought me back to programming. I'm grateful to DarkBasic for discovering Blitz - I've read many things from DB and DBP users who later found it not so great and switched over to Blitz. I'm not trying to convert anyone - use whatever you like! After all - games is what matters.
Quote: "It's been my experience on this forum that a lot of the people that try a "select" command for the first time fail to nest right, get mad, and never use that command again."

Sorry to hear that, but I must say that it's in my ability to make an adventure game engine that works off simple scrpting language and has some basic customization. Of course, technical side of DB got in my way of doing it, so the project was finished in Blitz. Unfortunately after that I've realized that I'm tired of doing 2d stuff and now I'm spending time with all this 3d thing - most of it is a bit confusing because I come from 2d world.
So my destiny lies in Blitz, yours in DBP - I just want us to be all united and make more great games! That's what we are here for anyway!
Peace.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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Benjamin
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Posted: 7th Jan 2006 23:44
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Quote: "FPS creator is nothing that you couldn't whip out in your spare time"
To make such software, requires a lot of time, a lot of knoledge, and a lot of persistence. Not a lot of people on these forums have those qualities.

Quote: "I had so many problems with it and now I don't use it. Too many technical problems get in your way."

Sounds like you don't know how to use it..

Tempest - P2P UDP Multiplayer Plugin - 70%
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Anatoly
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Posted: 8th Jan 2006 00:14
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To make my point - I'm done in this topic. I don't need people telling me I don't know how to program/setup/workaround things.
I'm not here to start a revolution. I'm glad that I've found a program that doesn't have the disadvantages that DB has and I'm happy with it. I see that you people are happy with your choice and I'm glad for you. I think that if you make something called "FPS Creators" you should make something more powerful. FPSC is very limited. But I heard there's a new version coming out or something? That may put things in different perspective.

Good... Bad... I'm the guy with the gun
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Deadwords
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Posted: 8th Jan 2006 00:53
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Quote: "This game maker is the worst ever 3d game maker."

I've seen very, very worst!

Quote: "Dog yomit looks better"

Import your own media, damn this guy is moron

Quote: "repeitive uh, and ahs and bang"

Import own sounds, moron

Quote: "make a nazi or sci-fi game"

Import own media, moron

Damn, this guy is very moron... Don't worry TGC you did a great job, even if FPSC is not perfect.

Skalex - Nobody can ear you scream ... you're on a forum!
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Joh
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Posted: 8th Jan 2006 01:06
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The guys "review" is totally skewed. Rating programs like games is total nonsense. Graphics? Sound? Game Variety? What?

His comments on Clickteam products are ridiculous. Its like comparing 3dsR4 to Max and saying R4 is better. And yes I am a clickteam fanboy

His FPSC "review" starts off personal, then trails off to incoherent babble, then gets personal again this time towards Jessica Simpson. He then says stick to db, which he does no review.

Then he drags Mike Overmaars gamemaker into the fray. Which scores brilliantly. Obviously the guy likes apples over oranges.

So what I find interesting is that there are no other reviews, DBC, DBP, BB, which all predate FPSC. Well, in my opinion, or "review" in ths case is that its just some little man who desperately needs his soapbox to yell out and rant. Afterall he knows if he said anything like he did on any of the forums, it would start something and quickly (and rightfully) locked. Defeats the effect. This way he can say what he wants, not get bleeped and cause a stir such as this thread. 1-0

And you'd think it would stop there. Absolutely not. It quickly spirals downwards into a "lets slam everything TGC I'm not happy with" fiasco. 2-0

Well, since I'm here. So what gives with all this? Especially all these people who come in here going on about, "Well I used this and that but man, it sucks so I don't use it anymore. What I'm using now is way better than yours." Okay so you're not happy with the food in this restaurant, stop giving me your food review already. Move on. Go to your favourite restaurant, what are you doing here anyway?
( This is generally speaking and not directed at anyone in particular. This is directed more towards FPSC users. I use DBPro, but I'm not good at it neither am I good at coding. So I can't really speak on it. It works for me.)
There really is no comparative product for FPSC. I've been waiting years for something like this. There is just nothing else like it out there. Yes there are other game making programs, which you can make FPS games and others, but not with the simplicity and functionality that FPSC has to offer. At this price too. Yes its not 100%, but what is? At this price range too. This is where many start going on about TGC's candy-coated advertising and expected more. Especially since they paid good money for it. Well, come on folks, if you're responsible enough to wield a credit card online...get with the program. I just paid an equivalent of 1/3 my rent for FPSC and I got exactly what I expected. Happy, albeit broke, customer.

I apologise for this pseudo rant, won't happen again. peace

.
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RUCCUS
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Posted: 8th Jan 2006 01:10
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In my opinion the only people classified to critisize any TGC products are the people able to build something better than the TGC products, its like having a kid playing with a spaceship toy critiquing NASA's new designs, based on the mere fact that it doesnt come with action figures or make cool noises.

Now, there is a difference between critisizing and commenting, which is what I'm about to do;

I think the one major flaw in any of TGC's products is there documentation, as said above quite a bit. It's help files should be called guidelines, as they don't seem to help much at all. The tutorials included in the programs when downloaded are average to say the least, and largely outdated to todays standards, and there examples on using the commands (in DB atleast) is just a single program that calls every command.

If TGC hired maybe 2 or 3 programmers that know the language well (possibly some of the Mods from the forums, unless there are any volunteers that know the language aswell) and had them work on creating some good solid documentation, including a few animated tutorials, links to all of the tutorials user's have created, a completely redone Help File system that included seperate program examples that are exceptionally commented for each command, provided maybe 3 written tutorials that take you through the steps of making your first basic program (like the pong tutorial) to creating an online chat program (to finally show people what DBP truly can do), and anything else they can possibly fit in, theyd be well on their way to getting great reviews.

They could also take notice of the custome IDE's being made a lot around here (like TDK's ide for example) and look at implementing that into DBC/DBP since the current IDE has some flaws.

In the end my opinion doesnt really matter all that much but TGC should really look at fixing what they've got before moving onto even more projects (like forgetting about updating the website and getting back to work on DBP).

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