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Geek Culture / TGPF Is Opening It's Doors

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Fallout
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Posted: 12th May 2006 20:25
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Just to mention though, there is a General Discussion board for chat on non-game dev related things, and humour and fun is not discouraged, so long as it's not offensive or antagonistic. You don't have to operate in robot etiquette mode there, so it's still relaxed. It's just clowning around pointlessly and unconstructively that will be frowned upon.

It may take concentration, but if I can restrain myself, so can the rest of you lunatics.

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x1bwork
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Posted: 12th May 2006 21:30 Edited at: 12th May 2006 21:31
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Quote: "ur enginnne suxxorfss minne iz likke 12 ichnes lonnnger"


That baby engine of yours? you satisfy your processor with that thing?


TDK: Sounds like you're onto something. The Death and Rebirth of coders into Coders Heaven. The promised Forum.

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Jeff Miller
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Posted: 12th May 2006 22:35
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I sense that my critical comment was taken as two-pronged, which it was not. On the posting end, I think that anyone hosting a forum or any other interactive site has the unfettered moral right to be as restrictive as he/she wishes in deciding what is proper to post as well as setting qualifications of those who are allowed to post. Frankly, I don't fault TGC for letting so many poor posts through since filtering so many is probably a daunting task, but on the other hand I would not mind it at all if TGC did have the time and staff to tighten things up a bit. I too get weary of sifting through posts that call people vulger names, or posts which - unless I am missing something - contain nothing more than some attempt to spell out a noise or a growl. For that matter, as far as forum hosting or information repositories are concerned, I think it reasonable to charge a fee to participate to offset hosting costs and efforts. I have no criticism whatsoever with the highest restrictions anyone would dream of placing on those whose posts - be they questions or articles - appear on a forum.

My criticism is strictly on the other end. The come-on title of this posted topic - that "TGPF is opening its doors" - is not quite the case. Placing the clearly reasonable and highly justified restrictions on posting-level access to those who would like to merely read so that they might someday be able to share their advice on an advanced topic strikes me as not quite "opening its doors", but rather being discouraging. Repeated use of the "adult" word in the introductory and subsequent posts in a forum that has so many members about the age of my grandson probably does not make them feel particularly welcome. Nor does the admonition that they might be expected to provide a web site of theirs for pre-acceptance review.

So when I noticed a member of this forum throw in the towel and proclaim his own perceived unworthiness for membership, I thought I would level some "adult" criticism. It would do no harm to let him and other beginners at least read the advanced writing or programming accomplishments so that they can see something concrete in the way of a personal aspiration, or learn something useful.
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Nack
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Posted: 12th May 2006 22:55
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Quote: "It's not elitist, it's just filtering out the idiots who aren't interested in programming and just want to lark about - removing the annoyances for the rest of the members."
I like this, it makes the forum more productive and provide more help to those who really need it.

This forum might just be the next big thing. =]

Nack


DC got a name change.....^^...more info soon =]
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Uncle Sam
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Posted: 12th May 2006 23:06 Edited at: 2nd Aug 2006 08:38
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In my signiture is a link to my latest creation. I don't know if this would help either, but I am somewhere near the top in my Visual Basic.net class, while maintaining my 4.0 GPA.

Uncle Sam
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Fallout
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Posted: 12th May 2006 23:55
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@Jeff Miller
You don't have to be an adult. You just need to act like an adult. So everyone can interpret the "adult" thing as having a mature online persona.

Also, all boards will be made publically visible soon. You'll just need to be an approved member to post. Everyone can share in the knowledge. This has just recently been decided.

We're just getting it all ironed out really. The only thing we want to stop is pointless babble, newbie behaviour and scores of newbie level posts/questions. That's why people have to be checked out before they sign up. If we let them sign up then ban them after going on a newbie rampage, they could just sign up with another account and continue.

I don't especially like the idea of people having to prove themselves to get in, but it really is the only way. Don't think of it as us saying "Are you good enough? THEN PROVE IT!". It's much more a case of us saying "Have you got anything productive to offer to game development, or do you just post random rubbish to kill time on the internet?"

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TDK
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Posted: 13th May 2006 00:19
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Quote: "Frankly, I don't fault TGC for letting so many poor posts through since filtering so many is probably a daunting task"


Me neither - I hope that I didn't come across as suggesting I did.

TGC is in a difficult position in that they market a product that caters for kids and adults alike and this forum can legitimately be looked on as a form of support which paying customers expect when they buy something. (The fact that many forum members may be using the free version I've ignored).

The mods here have the ability to clamp down, but are only following guidelines from TGC. Besides, I don't see any reason to do so to be honest. Despite the niggles, I quite like it here.

Quote: "The come-on title of this posted topic - that "TGPF is opening its doors" - is not quite the case."


Actually, as I intimated in an earlier post, we have been discussing what boards to make public (for viewing only) and since that post we have decided to make them all public, so you can now look before you apply for registration.

Quote: "Repeated use of the "adult" word in the introductory and subsequent posts in a forum that has so many members about the age of my grandson probably does not make them feel particularly welcome."


It wasn't meant to.

I too am a grandparent though with a grandaughter. But if I had a grandson who liked programming, at that age I wouldn't be wanting to make him particularly welcome either - until he was old enough to act responsibly.

I would say that the vast majority of idiotic posts on Apollo are made by under-sixteens. That's fine, because at that age you do daft things. We just don't put up with it on TGPF, so why allow as members, the most likely people to do it?

The term adult to me seemed the best to use to describe 'over 16' - despite 18 being the 'official' classification of adult. However, 'adult behaviour' would be closer to what we are talking about here.

Quote: "Nor does the admonition that they might be expected to provide a web site of theirs for pre-acceptance review."


This is irrelevant. The forum is for serious and experienced programmers over 16. What's wrong with asking for proof that they didn't download the demo version of DB the previous weekend?

There are enough free web sites available, though we are also happy to look at WIP work on here too if they have no web site. It still remains that anyone serious about their game coding will have a web site of some description with their work on - free or otherwise. We aren't expecting a .com web site - only proof that they aren't just 'playing'.

Your last paragraph is (or rather was) valid and that has been corrected.

Uncle Sam

To be honest, the 16 years old minimum age is not a legal requirement, it's just the age that we think most 'kids' start acting more adult-like.

I would suggest you apply and see what happens...

TDK_Man

DB Tutorials, Hints & Tips, Utils and lots more...
TGPF - TDK's Game Programming Forums
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lagmaster
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Posted: 13th May 2006 00:29
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whoops seems like i went overboard on the moaning

the reason i moaned yesterday is the fact that, this sort of system has been done before. "dbdn" anyone? fair enough that was a paid model, but it fizzled out over time.

the only disappointment that i have is that tgc havnt invented a 2 or 3 stage access on the forum here, not based upon how long you are registered but based upon praise for knowledge or helpfulness, with going upto for example rank 2, you get an extra forum for them members so they can discuss things more better than the open public forum.

if tgph fails to get a certain amount of members each month and for them to stay active, the forum will simply die out. llrgt was sort of the escape from the users here, that eventually failed because of lack of acive members and topics.

i hope you dont take my comments personally it's just from experience, it's happened before and it may happen if things dip there.

lagmaster
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The Nerd
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Posted: 13th May 2006 00:52 Edited at: 13th May 2006 03:10
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I have applied.

-The Nerd

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SpaceBattle-Shootout
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Fallout
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Posted: 13th May 2006 01:21
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@lagmaster

Well, TGPF will always be a low volume forum because competent coders ask less questions. This is to be expected really. The good thing about that is the posts should be of higher value.

As with any pure forum though, it's all down to the community. So long as we all get stuck in and talk about our game dev, it'll keep going.

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NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 13th May 2006 01:37
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I is t3h 0wn4g3 and I is t3h 4dm1n 4 t3h uber-f0rum!


NeX, you cant be serious - CattleRustler.
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Uncle Sam
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Posted: 13th May 2006 02:12
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Ok, thank you, I have applied.

By the way, is this forum language-proof? I'm sick of swears and people who consistantely post threads with a lot of shift+8.

Uncle Sam
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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 13th May 2006 02:44
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It has a filter. Trying to circumvent the filter is punishible by death.

EZrotate!
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Uncle Sam
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Posted: 13th May 2006 02:59
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That's great!

By the way, thanks for approving me TDK. I'm honoured

Uncle Sam
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Drew G
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Posted: 13th May 2006 03:26 Edited at: 13th May 2006 03:52
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Once Megaton joins the forums... then There...
Nevermind, I'll let anyone finish that sentence.

EDIT : Megaton Your too hard on yourself..

Benjamin what the heck?
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 13th May 2006 03:44
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There goes a good forum.


It's like a Megaton Cat radar, 24 hours a day.
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Benjamin
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Posted: 13th May 2006 03:48 Edited at: 13th May 2006 03:59
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Too true..

Tempest - P2P UDP Multiplayer Plugin (DBP/DBCe) - 71%
Download the free version
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Drew G
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Posted: 13th May 2006 03:51
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What edit, all I did was edit that Megaton was being too hard on himself.
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 13th May 2006 04:06
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Congratulations on the edit. Now nobody knows what you are talking about and you look like a complete moron. My work here is done.


It's like a Megaton Cat radar, 24 hours a day.
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Drew G
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Posted: 13th May 2006 04:09
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What's your work? To insult others and stand on their backs to elevate yourself? Why can't you feel good about yourself by completing a level or model, or prog. Yes, I'm short to speak, although my current project is nearly done...
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Dave J
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Posted: 13th May 2006 04:26
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I must say, the last lot of posts are really representative of the environment the forum in question is trying to provide.


"Computers are useless, they can only give you answers."
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Dgamer
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Posted: 13th May 2006 04:41 Edited at: 13th May 2006 04:57
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I liked the atmosphere of the forum so I signed up, but i'm not sure exactly sure what your requirements are for approval.

Quote: "Therefore, you will not get immediate access when you apply for registration but will have to be approved. You will be required to supply your nickname on here for that purpose. You will also have to agree to adhering to our very strict AUP."


Is it strictly based on one's quality of posts? amount and quality of released games? or...?


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x1b
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Posted: 13th May 2006 05:40 Edited at: 13th May 2006 05:41
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Quote: "Congratulations on the edit. Now nobody knows what you are talking about and you look like a complete moron. My work here is done."


Mega,that type of attitude is going to have you rejected by the cool kids club...then,you wont be hip anymore. =/

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Saikoro
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Posted: 13th May 2006 05:52
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I've always thought secret societies (yes I'm using it loosely) were lame but necessary for certain things to happen. Unfortunately, I don't see where blocking out not only an entire type of person, but those who could fit in very nicely makes things happen that couldn't happen otherwise. Saying you don't want to have to skim through useless posts is more than a little naive, seeing as how you've all (for the most part) placed unconstructive posts on here. I don't consider myself a great programmer or modeller, but I'm skilled with music, offering up honest advice, and helping out people when they ask for it. I have to respect your abilities in the various areas of game development, but this is borderline conceited. At least you guys are going to make it open viewable.

Best of luck to your forum.

"One World, One Web, One Program" -Microsoft ad.
"Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Führer"(One People, One Kingdom, One Leader)-Adolf Hitler.
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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 13th May 2006 06:15 Edited at: 13th May 2006 06:16
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Quote: "Unfortunately, I don't see where blocking out not only an entire type of person, but those who could fit in very nicely makes things happen that couldn't happen otherwise."

If a person would fit in nicely, then they are welcome. I know a lot of reference has been made about it being for adults, but that term is meant as a measure of maturity, not age.

Quote: "Saying you don't want to have to skim through useless posts is more than a little naive, seeing as how you've all (for the most part) placed unconstructive posts on here."


I think you are missing the point. There is no doubt that I've made pointless posts over the years here and I am a mod at TGPF. TGPF just offers a different atmosphere. There is absolutely nothing wrong with TGC's forums. In fact, I quite like them and will continue to browse and post here. As TDK mentioned earlier, TGPF is not meant to compete with this forum or even be an alternative to this forum. It is more meant to compliment this forum by offering a more serious atmosphere to those that are interested in that sort of thing. People that do join TGPF will most likely continue to use these forums too.

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Saikoro
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Posted: 13th May 2006 06:32
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So it is. I had thought it was more of a "we hate new people, so we're going to get away from them" kind of thing. I then retract my comments, except for the respect in your areas one. So long as your drive is in the direction of professionals (used loosely) talking to professionals, then I'm all for it. I'd see that maybe the word "adult" isn't correct, but "mature". You use adult in place for it as you said, so why not? More of a politically correctness thing anyway, but with many people under 16 on here, they could take offense to it. Anywho, best of luck regardless, I've scanned over it and I like the information you can get from it already. Great source.

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Uncle Sam
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Posted: 13th May 2006 07:12
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Quote: "I must say, the last lot of posts are really representative of the environment the forum in question is trying to provide."


Yah, I was stupid enough to post my age without thinking. But that's better than people thinking I'm 13.

Uncle Sam
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Darth Vader
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Posted: 13th May 2006 07:33
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So would I be qualified to join this forum?
Looks interesting...


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Saikoro
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Posted: 13th May 2006 07:53
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Only one way to find out

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Hawkeye
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Posted: 13th May 2006 14:32
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Where's Jimmy and a good dose of sarcasm when you need him...


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Darth Vader
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Posted: 13th May 2006 14:45
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Quote: "I too am a grandparent though with a grandaughter. But if I had a grandson who liked programming, at that age I wouldn't be wanting to make him particularly welcome either - until he was old enough to act responsibly."

TDK man, are you that old! Without semming rude I always thought of you in your late thirties!
Yikes!!!


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Lost in Thought
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Posted: 13th May 2006 14:50
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Quote: "I always thought of you in your late thirties!"


You can be a grandparent in your mid 30's quite easily

Happens all the time here. You marry at 18 and have a child, who also marrys at 18 and has a child. This puts you at 36 and a grandparent. Around here by your mid-late 50's you are a great grandparent.

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Becky
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Posted: 13th May 2006 17:44
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There's a lot of people with opinions over whether the TGPF boards are a good thing or are elitist or have described ourselves correctly.

I have something to say to that. If the best you can do is moan then our forum isn't for you and you need not apply.
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x1b
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Posted: 13th May 2006 21:03 Edited at: 13th May 2006 21:42
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Quote: "I have something to say to that. If the best you can do is moan then our forum isn't for you and you need not apply. "


Surely you could simply not accept whom signs up that you dont approve and not post that crap, pissing and moaning about others being liberal with their opinions.

TDK, made it fairly clear. "Sign up, if you're one of the "cool kids" we'll accept you, if not, then denied." Im sure no one misunderstood that.

If your banter was any representation of whats to be expected from this new forum,then suddenly the TGC forum looks more promising.

TDK: Honestly,you where better off keeping it lowkey and unannounced and by invite only and not advertising it on this forum. A long history of Masonic Orders,practice silence about their existance and only invite when absolutely sure about whom is being invited and keeping quite about it after.

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BatVink
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Posted: 13th May 2006 22:00
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The new system is allowing pretty much everyone in. I'm not aware of any rejections. Basically, it's come in and behave yourself and enjoy like the rest of us, or you may be turfed out later on.

The request for proof of your alter-ego on another forum is simply to quickly affirm that someone is already an active developer and not a complete lunatic. The other problem that this avoids is the bots that auto-register themselves and spam the boards with Casino Ads.



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Becky
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Posted: 13th May 2006 23:14
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Quote: "If your banter was any representation of whats to be expected from this new forum,then suddenly the TGC forum looks more promising.
"

Actually it's an existing community and we opened the doors for others to join us if they want too, but they must not upset our equillibrium by doing so - which I truly believe is fair comment.

I merely said some had given flakk because we have done this and that whatever you feel, if you think giving us flakk for being more open is a positive thing, then I believe you are wrong.

Or to put it another way, you need not apply.
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Baggers
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Posted: 13th May 2006 23:32 Edited at: 13th May 2006 23:46
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Having been a member for several months now I can vouch for the forum.
You'll really find some of the best minds here, I still don't know how I got invited so far back but it's certainly helped.
This place will be strict on its rules and that is why I personally love it...If you find any area of the TGC forums oppresive or constrained then do not join TGPF.

Really though it'll be great to see more life round the place, so many of us are kept busy with work (except becky who is racing all the time) so we havnt enjoyed the busy forum life. All that is sure to change though!

[edit]
Woe 3rd page didnt see that.
Quote: "In fact, I quite like them and will continue to browse and post here"

I think this statement is perfectly true, we don't shy away from TGC style forums...most of us post our projects here and at TGPF, and post frequently on both. It is just a different setting, a new option. I enjoy it's stictness and the fact that if I post there the answers are all "advanced", there is no wading through the simpler approaches as we all know we have passed that and instead we look at pushing what we can do with the technology we have.

Quote: "is it strictly based on one's quality of posts? amount and quality of released games? or...?"

Quality of posts...thats it...I have no projects on the board a of yet and nothing I post is looked down on (which is kind as I'm nearly always told better ways to do what I am thinking).

M.I.A is pending
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Baggers
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Posted: 13th May 2006 23:33 Edited at: 13th May 2006 23:33
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<double post>

M.I.A is pending
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x1b
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Posted: 14th May 2006 00:52 Edited at: 14th May 2006 00:52
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Quote: "The new system is allowing pretty much everyone in. I'm not aware of any rejections. Basically, it's come in and behave yourself and enjoy like the rest of us, or you may be turfed out later on.

The request for proof of your alter-ego on another forum is simply to quickly affirm that someone is already an active developer and not a complete lunatic."


Extremely well put,Bat. Much respect.

Quote: "Or to put it another way, you need not apply."


I have not applied. Every community has it "blacksheep", some, more tolerable than others. Your representation of TGPF is what I wish to avoid on yet another forum.

Thanks for your reply. I beleive this conversation is concluded.

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Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 14th May 2006 02:25 Edited at: 14th May 2006 02:30
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It is an interesting idea. Imagine x1b, conversations developing properly over time rather than being quickly lost in waves of "whenn we ghet new help fiiles cuz dees sux?" and "ive just got a question....." topics. And imagine now, a board that by its nature will not have flamewars. Just take a look at the member list. It's DBs finest. I certainly wouldn't want to exclude myself from that.

Everyone who complains about an 'elitist' club, it's not. It's just a group who talks about the same things we do here, but with stricter rules. That's impossible here. Not only does TGC have to cater to customers, but moderating inoffensive dumbness is impossible. And yet still, some people complain about TGCs rules, citing their anger over their lack of 'free speech' and 'tyrannical mods'. It's crazier every time I hear something like that, because a forum can have whatever posting rules that its creators desire. If they're bad, people just won't post there. In the case of this new board, it was put through a test phase and succeeded.

All that being said, I signed up.


Come see the WIP!
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x1b
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Posted: 14th May 2006 03:58 Edited at: 14th May 2006 04:03
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I have absolutely no doubt that,that forum is an excellent idea and with out question,was/is a coders heaven. Such a place would allow me to relax and not be so offensive/defensive and just...well..code and talk development with solid,intelligent feedback and output.

And, its You,LiT,Mega all signed up. Three out of Three of my boys. Would have been paradise.

But now that its announced publically and everyone and their mother can "sign up", it will be a matter of time before it is slowly degraded to every other forum. Thus,think ill just not bother.

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 14th May 2006 05:30
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Quote: "But now that its announced publically and everyone and their mother can "sign up", it will be a matter of time before it is slowly degraded to every other forum. Thus,think ill just not bother."

No. It won't. Anyone can try to sign-up and almost everyone will be accepted... but, not everyone will be allowed to stay. The core members that originaly populated the forum (for the most part) are the mods. We (mods) understand the original vision of the forum pretty well. I think the membership doors would close before we would allow it to degenerate into less that what it is meant to be.

EZrotate!
TextureMax!
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Uncle Sam
19
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Joined: 23rd Jul 2005
Location: West Coast, USA
Posted: 14th May 2006 07:14
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Yes, the mods will see to it that it doesn't become trash...or I"m outa there.

Uncle Sam
Nvidia Geforce 7600 GS 256MB PCIEx, 2.66 GHZ Pentium 4 proccessor, 768MB RAM
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Baggers
20
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Joined: 31st May 2004
Location: Yonder over dem dere hills
Posted: 14th May 2006 11:13
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It won't get that bad, mainly as we have been in the forum for months now and it's been serene, if someone started making it go down the pan they would be banned very quickly.

M.I.A is pending
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Fallout
22
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Joined: 1st Sep 2002
Location: Basingstoke, England
Posted: 14th May 2006 12:29
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I infact ventured out into the famous New Forest today and cut down the mightest of trees. From there I carved and whittled it's wood into a fine wacking stick. Having painted my face with camo and climbed into my ninja costume, I now lurk in the TGPF forums, holding aloft my wacking stick, ready to slap troublemakers into the next millenium.

Btw, on the subject of this forum, I've always thought it was great at how relaxed it is! For such a large forum dealing with a professional range of products you can get away with a lot here. The line you cross is just right I think. Have fun, bend the rules a bit, push your luck, but go too far and you're slapped with a ban. Perfect. I used to use the Traxxas forum a lot (RC cars) to get tech help on my Revo. I got warning points for saying things like Damn!

I mean, damn man. That's just going too damn far, damn it! Who do you think your are, you damn fool? Some sort of dam? Damn you Traxxas! Damn you to hell!

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adr
21
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Joined: 21st May 2003
Location: Job Centre
Posted: 14th May 2006 20:48
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Quote: "hell"

I'm sure you mean "heck".

[center]
iv tryed everything!!!!!!!!!! could u please just add The gun and shooting Code thats All!!!!!!!!!
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Phaelax
DBPro Master
21
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Joined: 16th Apr 2003
Location: Metropia
Posted: 15th May 2006 08:20 Edited at: 15th May 2006 09:20
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I never got invited, I'm insulted! (grr, stupid junk filter, nvm)

Any last remaining RGT people (there's a few of us left) have moved to CodersTurf to help Josh get started on the new indy developer site.


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Lost in Thought
20
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Joined: 4th Feb 2004
Location: U.S.A. : Douglas, Georgia
Posted: 15th May 2006 09:06
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I'll stick around here in case I need any help from the noobs left after everyone goes over there.

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TDK
Retired Moderator
21
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Joined: 19th Nov 2002
Location: UK
Posted: 15th May 2006 19:51
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Quote: " I'll stick around here in case I need any help from the noobs left after everyone goes over there."


Admirable of you, but I'm sure it won't come to that...

In all the months that TGPF has been running, I don't think a single member who previously used Apollo (including me) stopped using Apollo.

Please don't promote the 'us and them' attitude which spoiled things for users of LLRGT/RGT and the DB Forums in the past. They will certainly not be tolerated at TGPF because 'them' are actually 'us'.

I think this post has now served it's purpose and is now only attracting negative posts so should now be locked (or deleted at the mods discretion).

Our aims for the TGPF forum have clearly been stated in previous posts so if you join us or not - it's your decision. It's also pretty obvious that the forum is aimed at the more experienced user, so inexperienced users will most likely not be able to join.

They can still read the posts though and hopefully it will be an incentive for them to get stuck in and learn. When they have something to show, they can always apply again.

We are NOT asking anyone to emigrate - it's more like having a holiday villa where you can visit and relax every so often...

So no more negative posts please.

TDK_Man

DB Tutorials, Hints & Tips, Utils and lots more...
TGPF - TDK's Game Programming Forums
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MikeS
Retired Moderator
21
Years of Service
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Joined: 2nd Dec 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 15th May 2006 23:11
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I'll unsticky, but I'll leave it open for now.



A book? I hate book. Book is stupid.
(Formerly Yellow)
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