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FPSC Classic Product Chat / A note about Piracy, and the VBOTB.

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KeithC
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 05:30
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It brings me no pleasure to announce that the winner of the VBOTB: 2009 (TheK), will be stripped of his title and badge. It had come to my attention that he had given away a copy, of a purchased copy, of Project Blue (an FPSC Mod) to another member...who then gave it to several more. After doing some investigating, I asked TheK about it; he was very honest with me, and forthcoming.

However, TGC's policy on Piracy is very strict (as it should be); and as such, I have had to take action. The banning of TheK is a little different for me, than bans I have administered in the past. TheK held a high honor here, among fellow developers. As a developer himself, I would have hoped that he understood how wrong it is to give away a commercial project that another developer worked hard on. Apparently that was not the case.

All BOTB and VBOTB holders, are placed at a different level than their fellow developers; it's something they've worked hard on, and as such...they are held at a higher standard.

This should show all members here, that no one is "untouchable". It doesn't matter if you are someone new to the community, or a trusted member. Piracy will not, and can not be accepted.

You may discuss this here, if you wish. But please keep it civil.

-Keith
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dark peanut
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 05:39
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Thats a shame..

dark peanut

current projects: a game about a guy
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Bugsy
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 06:07
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I can't believe it.

if theK loses the VBOTB badge, who gets the VBOTB badge?


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Kill Shadow
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 06:19
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How very sad I think you made the right choice although a very hard choice. Kudos to you KeithC on standing up for what is the right choice in my eyes.

Regards,

KillShadow

We all as humans do make mistakes and kudos indeed to TheK for admitting what was done

Stop Drop and Roll works on everything but HELLFIRE!!!!
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KeithC
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 06:30
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It wasn't an easy thing for me to do, but it had to be done.

Quote: "who gets the VBOTB badge"

It has gone to the second place winner: Defy.

-Keith
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Scurvy Lobster
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 09:36
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It is not every day you see such a clear action on anti-piracy efforts. I support the decision but still hope the best for TheK and his future game development. We all do stuff we regret so keep designing and make cool stuff!

And a big congrats to Defy

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Toasty Fresh
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 12:00 Edited at: 19th Mar 2010 17:17
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Sad. One thing though, what was TheK thinking?

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Lewis
VBOTB Developer '10
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 12:50
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Too bad VBOTB can only be given to those who have entered for it..

..Oh well, theres always this year!

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General Jackson
User Banned
Posted: 19th Mar 2010 14:04
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So...is he banned? it is a shame - I voted for him.
But its definitely what he deserves, he knows better.

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DarkJames
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 17:39
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mmm.. one question.. is he banned for ever¿


"Feel free in a world of madness,be the bright spot"
-Bloody James
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KeithC
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 17:44
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No; but is going to be quite awhile till he can come back.

-Keith
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wizard of id
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 17:55
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Quote: "No; but is going to be quite awhile till he can come back."
Lol so that means FPSC X1200.

Sad news indeed.But he did mention he was going to use another engine for the follow up on the EX VBOTB game..

"In my weird politically incorrect hypothetically incoherent contradicting obscured world definitively maybe"

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KeithC
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 18:06
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As said to him personally; I wish him well, and hope he continues his development. I would very much like to see Canalyst come to completion.

-Keith
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Crusader2
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 18:25 Edited at: 19th Mar 2010 18:28
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The ban is acceptable, however I see no reason why he should be stripped of his title. It seems to me that VBOTB is a title that is permenant, no matter someone's actions. He DID create the "Very Best of the Best" title of 2009, and whether or not he gave a way a pirated copy of Project Blue is irrelevent.

As Cesare Beccaria said in On Crimes and Punishments, the punishment should fit the crime. This is a truth I hold to strongly, and I believe that a permenant ban should be admistered, but he should be allowed to retain his title. As he DID win the award, and pirating a copy of software is in no direct way related to VBOTB, I personally believe that he should not be stripped of his title.

I have no personal affiliation with TheK, nor have I ever spoken with him, so I have no personal feelings towards him. This is spoken from true objectiveness.

Also, I have seen TheK's work and thought that it was truly stunning. I'm very impressed with him as a developer, and dissappointed with him as a person.

Just my personal thoughts.

Best Regards,
Crusader2

Some people say that I'm crazy... And I agree.
USE PLY'S MOD!
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FredP
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 18:40
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Quote: "The ban is acceptable, however I see no reason why he should be stripped of his title."


Keith already said we hold the BOTB winners to a higher standard.That's one of the reasons he was stripped of the VBOTB.
I agree with Keith and what he did.I would have done the same thing.
We can't have people do things like piracy (or IMO any bannable offense) and have them keep titles.It's not a good example to other forum members and who wants a badge if a pirate gets one?
BOTB is for those that are the best and the best don't pirate.
On a related note...I feel for Keith.Banning someone (especially with so much potential) is never easy and we just don't do it at the drop of a hat.
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Crazy Acorn
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 18:52
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Well said Fred.... Hey that sounds cool!

Les Meno Squas?
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KeithC
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 18:52
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Thanks for your comments, Crusader; I appreciate you taking the time to make them. As I have said in another thread, with another holder of the BOTB...it is not set in stone. The conduct here, and conduct associated with their work here is also a factor; when considering something such as a ban and/or removal of the BOTB/VBOTB badge. As I said; like it or not, BOTB/VBOTB holders are held to a higher standard...both in their work, and in their conduct.

Though he didn't actually pirate his copy of Project Blue; it was used in the making of his level/demo, for the VBOTB. It isn't a cut and dry situation; such as simply banning someone for pirating FPSC, or openly admitting that they pirated 3DSMax...here on the Forum Boards (and we know everyone here claiming to use Max has a legitimate copy...right?).

I will have you know that this decision was a culmination of several days of emails and chat sessions between TheK, the owner of Project Blue, and even Lee himself; as well as several others. In the end; it was left to me to make the decision, so I take responsibility for that.

As such; he has been offered the opportunity to come back in a year and be part of this community again. Hopefully this will sink in not only with him, but with anyone else out there who thinks any form of piracy (even something as simple as giving a friend a copy of a program you paid for, to "check out") isn't tolerated here. There are demos and free versions of nearly every product you could need....they should be utilized.

-Keith
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Crusader2
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 21:56
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Quote: "like it or not, BOTB/VBOTB holders are held to a higher standard...both in their work, and in their conduct"


Quote: " As I have said in another thread, with another holder of the BOTB...it is not set in stone"


Quote: "The conduct here, and conduct associated with their work here is also a factor; when considering something such as a ban and/or removal of the BOTB/VBOTB badge"


Quote: " In the end; it was left to me to make the decision, so I take responsibility for that."


Well said Keith... Honestly, it's not often that someone can sway my opinion, however you've deffinetly succeeded. I, as well as the forum at large, does hold BOTBand VBOTB in extremely high regard, somewhat like a celebrity. While that doesn't nescessarily mean they SHOULD be held to higher standards, however they are. My only concern was about the fact that the punishment "didn't" fit the crime, but I'd failed to look at it from that angle.

My opinion's been changed; I personally believe that you made the correct choice Keith.

Best Regards,
Crusader2

Some people say that I'm crazy... And I agree.
USE PLY'S MOD!
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Shadowtroid
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Posted: 19th Mar 2010 22:09
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Wow...I feel partly responsible. I was a part of figuring it out...

For those who did not know about this, this was a very long process to get to here...

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Woolfman
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Posted: 20th Mar 2010 01:06
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Now that's some great Mod work there KeithC.
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ultraplex
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Posted: 20th Mar 2010 22:44
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yeah the mods are going to Stop piracy good luck with that..
fighting a lose-ing battle if u ask me....

http://www.rawclan.co.uk
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KeithC
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Posted: 20th Mar 2010 23:01
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Quote: "yeah the mods are going to Stop piracy good luck with that..
fighting a lose-ing battle if u ask me...."

Who said anything about stopping it? Did I say that anywhere in my postings?

This was about a single incident that lead to one of the top developers here getting banned and stripped of his title.

-Keith
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ultraplex
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 00:04
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indeed..well done

http://www.rawclan.co.uk
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French gui
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 01:02
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Quote: " In the end; it was left to me to make the decision, so I take responsibility for that."


Well, I think that you've made the only possible choice in this situation, if my humble opinion count, and I'm with you there. Thek loose his VBOTB badge but I'm sure he is smart and talented enough to come back and try to win the next one.
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Toasty Fresh
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 02:29
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Quote: "yeah the mods are going to Stop piracy good luck with that..
fighting a lose-ing battle if u ask me...."


Please stop being an anal-retentive git.

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DarkFrost
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 02:33
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Well done, I'm sure he learned his lesson.

Piracy is an issue that seriously bothers me. I hope this thread is read by many members as it should teach those who hope to or already pirate to stop.

[img][/img]
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Thraxas
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 02:37
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Quote: "yeah the mods are going to Stop piracy good luck with that..
"


It's a very interesting post for a guy who has been banned 5 times for piracy!

Your signature has been [mod edited] :-p
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Bugsy
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 02:43
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well he knows best if he's pirated before.


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Soviet176
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 03:44
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Quote: "It's a very interesting post for a guy who has been banned 5 times for piracy!
"


LOL!!!

"I haz no sig :o"
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General Jackson
User Banned
Posted: 21st Mar 2010 04:04
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Quote: "It's a very interesting post for a guy who has been banned 5 times for piracy!"

Did you just make that 6?

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Kravenwolf
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 05:39
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Quote: "It's a very interesting post for a guy who has been banned 5 times for piracy! "


And he's still here?

Kravenwolf

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ultraplex
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 10:41 Edited at: 21st Mar 2010 11:18
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sorry,but i have never been banned for priacy,and also never been banned from this forum.
Also i dont like to be accused,i think u should show proof before u accuse peeps...

http://www.rawclan.co.uk
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Thraxas
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 11:27 Edited at: 21st Mar 2010 11:28
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I don't like to be called a liar!



You've been banned 6 times.

Your signature has been [mod edited] :-p

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wizard of id
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 11:30
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rolf pwned

nice one thraxas

"In my weird politically incorrect hypothetically incoherent contradicting obscured world definitively maybe"

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Errant AI
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 11:32
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oooh... it's like seeing inside the ark of the covenant!
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Kravenwolf
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 11:33 Edited at: 21st Mar 2010 11:34
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Lie Counter 1

Kravenwolf

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Johnski
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 12:10
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where can i report piracy because my freind pirated FPSC and he is now using it as a commercial game development is that alowed to create a game and sell it commerccially in pirated version of FPSC

www.syko-games.webs.com
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ultraplex
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 12:19
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i'm interested in these bans can u Email me info...ie reasons cheers..manuchamps2000@hotmail.com

http://www.rawclan.co.uk
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Woolfman
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 15:10 Edited at: 21st Mar 2010 15:11
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Here is some info syko games Piracy, what is it? How can you prevent it? How can you report it? (knowledge base)
But the best way is to E-mail a Mod. KeithC seems to be doing a good job but any of them will do I guess.
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ultraplex
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 17:59 Edited at: 21st Mar 2010 21:06
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Still waiting...if i was banned for piracy i want to know what i was surpposed to have pirated and whatever...give details please...

http://www.pricemears.co.uk/
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KeithC
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 18:09
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The bans were in 2007; no details given. If you'd like your ban renewed; please let us know, and we can assist you.

-Keith
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TerrorNation
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 18:30
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Quote: "If you'd like your ban renewed; please let us know, and we can assist you."

Nice one

Anyway, it always saddens me to see pirates, and why on earth would you pirate a software you spent good money on for a friend? I would tell them to buy it with their own money.
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KeithC
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 18:41
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They could have used Project Green....the free version, to test things out in. As I've said; there's usually a free version that lets you know if it's something you want to buy or not.

-Keith
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FredP
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 18:49
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Ultraplex,
My memory is not the greatest but I remember banning you for piracy.
Maybe we can't stop piracy but we sure aren't to tolerate it either.
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ultraplex
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 20:30 Edited at: 21st Mar 2010 21:13
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ok fred but i need to know what i have supposed to have pirated,as i dont recall pirated anything..
As the other mod said in his first post "banned 5 times for piracy"
can u give the 5 times details please...?
i remember a while back when i upload some models i edit for fps then realise my mistake and deleted the download,Maybe that was one time??
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=69723&b=21

Slander is the spoken or transitory form of defamation of character, a legal term that refers to a falsehood presented as true which could harm the reputation of a person or entity

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KeithC
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 21:34
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In that instance, you deleted the download only after several of us said is wasn't a good idea...and at least 1 person (probably many more by the looks of it) grabbed the illegal content.

-Keith
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ultraplex
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 21:36 Edited at: 21st Mar 2010 21:36
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so that was one ban right? and that was a silly mistake not piracy
ok so what about the other 4?

Slander is the spoken or transitory form of defamation of character, a legal term that refers to a falsehood presented as true which could harm the reputation of a person or entity

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FredP
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 21:44
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I for one am not going to take the time to look up the reasons for the other bans.That isn't even the point of this thread anyways.This thread is not about you.
The only thing I can say is you're damn lucky to be able to post after 5 bans.
Now if we can get on topic.
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ultraplex
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 21:50 Edited at: 22nd Mar 2010 00:03
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I thought mods were surpposed help out members not abuse their power as some do,also i thought in this forum u was entiled to your opinion,not be flamed and be accused of something u didn't do...
like i said before 5 times and now 6 but no reasons why??
i myself have givin a lot to this forum models and stuff for what?

Slander is the spoken or transitory form of defamation of character, a legal term that refers to a falsehood presented as true which could harm the reputation of a person or entity

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Dr Parsnips
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Posted: 21st Mar 2010 21:55
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Quote: "I thought mods were surpposed help out members not abuse they power as some do,also i thought in this forum u was entiled to your opinion,not be flamed and be accused of something u didn't do...
like i said before 5 times and now 6 but no reasons why??
i myself have givin a lot to this forum models and stuff for what?
"

Probably best to sort this out over email, You might find a more direct answer that way aswell.

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