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Geek Culture / Work Smart! Not hard!

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glyvin101
19
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Joined: 27th Jan 2005
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Posted: 26th Mar 2007 04:02
Hey I currently am Almost a adult, since I can't give my age I will say that, and I work at mc.donalds. I hate working here I get minimum wage and crappy skin. lol. I've done a few small websites for people but it does not provide me with the income to upkeep my car and pay the few bills I have.

I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on how A smart person like myself could make some money online, or starting a small buissness around town.

My skills mainly lye in computers

I am a decent programmer and web designer

So any idea on ways I could get out of mc.donalds, so i can stop working hard and start working smart?

Thanks,

WIll
indi
22
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Joined: 26th Aug 2002
Location: Earth, Brisbane, Australia
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 04:11
consult your local government website about starting a small business.
In australia they are called sole traders.
Once you have that in place, you can legally start trading.
create a small website that shows your skills and set yourself some prices.
Pretend to be a customer for other companies that do the same thing to get an idea of prices.
Set your price just under these amounts

Richard Davey
Retired Moderator
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Posted: 26th Mar 2007 05:02
Here's my tip - forget dreaming about trying to 'make it rich' online. Don't even waste your energy here, spend the brain cells on applying for better jobs instead.

Never trust a computer you can't throw out of a window
Cash Curtis II
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Location: Corpus Christi Texas
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 05:19
Quote: "I am a decent programmer and web designer"

Get the best job you can. If that is McDonald's right now then so be it. If you are a decent programmer then make a great game or application. Build a solid portfolio and hope that something you make is good enough for you to make money. If not, at least you'll get a good job with your portfolio. The chances of you getting rich quick are about 0%, but you'll never make it if you don't keep trying. And most importantly, don't have kids. You'll never get rich.

Ever.






Ever.


Come see the WIP!
Agent Dink
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Posted: 26th Mar 2007 05:58
Quote: "You'll never get rich.

Ever.






Ever."


Depends on what you consider rich.

I have no signature...
Zaibatsu
18
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Location: Lost in Thought
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 06:18
Quote: "Depends on what you consider rich."


and how hard it is to say no for you.

"I admire its purity, a survivor, unclouded by conscience, remorse, or delusions of morality"

Van B
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Location: Sunnyvale
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 09:44 Edited at: 26th Mar 2007 12:35
Quote: "I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on how A smart person like myself could make some money online, or starting a small *buissness* around town.

My skills mainly *lye* in computers"


First thing I'd suggest is using a spell checker on any application, CV, or letter you send to a company (with letters that have to be hand written, type it first then copy it). Never ever allow a spelling mistake when your looking for jobs in IT, there's just no excuse and employers look for stupid stuff like that - remember most people have little idea about IT, except that computers have spell checkers in them.

I think you have 2 options, either take a fairly low position in a company in IT support or whatever is available, or go to college if you expect a higher position, no company will trust you with their IT without some sort of qualification.

I don't think starting a business is a realistic idea for now, you'd really be working harder than you do at Mac-D's, at least in a company you get rewarded for your hard work usually, with a business often the only reward is staying afloat.


Good guy, Good guy, Wan...
Kentaree
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Location: Clonmel, Ireland
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 11:38
I want to stress one thing at the risk of being patronizing. A lot of people assume that just because they're smart and have some experience with computers that going out into the industry will be easy. I was one of those people, I'm now on my 4th IT job (I think) and I'm still just realizing how much I still don't know. Don't assume you know everything, start off at the bottom like everyone else, and if you really are smart, you'll work your way up now problem as you get more experience.

Eddie Gordo
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Location: Ohio - USA
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 12:16
Yeah, you'll find there is a lot more to do with application of knowledge and work related skills than just knowing something about computers. There are entire worlds of applied skills you wont even encounter until you make them routine in the work world, the stuff they don't teach you in school(at least in the states).

~Cyrano De Bergerac~
Veron
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Posted: 26th Mar 2007 13:47
I believe that if your skills lie in the computing industry, get a part-time job at one! Depending on where you live, and your age and skill, you could get a job as a retail person (just over the counter), or work on PC repairs as a technician, it's up to you! Soon, i'll be getting a part-time job at a computer shop in Australia, NSW, as a technician (install new hardware, fix bugs, etc.)

Just work hard in your final years at school, get good reports and have a respectalbe resume, and good luck!

Need web design help with PHP or XHTML? E-mail me!
http://veron.sitesled.com Visit Veron! Free games, programs and applications! Made in DBPRO, FPSC, and C++!
Agent Dink
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Posted: 26th Mar 2007 18:37
I wish there were some computer shops closer to me... and the trouble is, even the ones that are around are so small they only need 1 or 2 employees, so they are never hiring

I have no signature...
Jeku
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Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 19:35
I was lucky to get my first computer shop job interview from school. In high school here we have Career and Personal Planning, where they make you write resumes, get a job, etc. in order to graduate. Anyways, the government pays for half the wages, but the crappy thing is the employer doesn't have to pay a dime if they don't want (free work is great I guess).

Ended up getting a nice tech job at the longest running computer shop in town. My job interview? The boss gave me a computer and told me to replace the motherboard. Might sound easy to some of you, but at the time I had absolutely NO hardware experience. So I toiled away at it and they coached me and asked me questions. Ended up getting paid quite good at the time for a high school student

Don't give up. Try to get a job interview through school if they offer it, and don't show up looking like a bum!

Dazzag
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Location: Cyprus
Posted: 26th Mar 2007 23:05
Quote: "don't show up looking like a bum!"
Heh, when I turned upto the company I first worked for (which is still the same 12 years later if you don't count take overs) I was in a suit that was designed for when I was 3 inches shorter and a little thinner, white socks (they were still fashionable in Wales), and 3 Guinesses to the good from the pub across the road (one of my lecturers advised us to have an alcohol drink before an interview or a speech. Probably not 3 though...). Went back to the pub afterwards because I thought I had failed. Years later (when the other way around and doing interviews myself) my bosses said they almost didn't bother because of the white socks and hitched up/ tight trousers.

Luckily I fitted right in with the drinking crowd... But don't forget that drinking is wrong. And you shouldn't do it. Unless you want to fit in and get along with newly made work mates when really young and inexperienced Bad bad bad....

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
glyvin101
19
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 00:44
ok, thanks, I will hit up geeksquad after I get my care repaired
glyvin101
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 02:56
Ok well I did some hunting and found a computer repairs shop about 12 miles from were I live. I am thinking of applying there hoping I get at least a interview.

I have built my own PC and done work on friends and family, but what would you recommend I do to brush up on my skills, any site links would be appreciated.

I also have 2 years of Mc.Donalds as my resume so I can't really impress them with that but I think that if I get a interview I could show them I have what It takes.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated,

Will
Jess T
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 04:27
2 Years at Maccer D's is good experience.
You've had to deal with customer service, hygenic food handling, and best of all public relations!

It's all about how you spin it (although, if the employer has even two brain cells about him, he'll realize that McD's isn't really the best work experience ).

Be honest, too. Tell him/her that you're willing to learn, eager to get more experience under your belt, you're looking for a career in the field, etc, etc. They'll appreciate the honesty, and they'll be able to tell alot more about you from that than any well-spun resume

Nintendo DS & Dominos :: DS Dominos
http://jt0.org
Jeku
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Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 27th Mar 2007 04:45
Actually yah, 2 years at Mickey D's is impressive believe it or not.

And when I said don't look like a bum, that might not always be the case. When I had my first interview at EA in 2003 for a tester position, I wore jeans and a t-shirt. I asked the interviewee girl if it was okay not to dress up, and she said something like "we would have been worried if you weren't dressed casual." It was love at first sight

glyvin101
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 04:50
nice, I might just take apart my computer and put it together a few times
Phaelax
DBPro Master
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Location: Metropia
Posted: 27th Mar 2007 05:17
McDonalds may not be exciting, but it'll show employers that you are reliable. That can take you further than you may realize. And when it comes to IT, its not what you know but what you can learn. The market changes quickly, you gotta show that you can learn new technologies.

Quote: "boss gave me a computer and told me to replace the motherboard?"

Wish I had an interview like that. I thought computer hardware was common knowledge for all tech geeks. Meeting other people in IT have shown me how untrue that is. You'd be surprised how many people get confused when you hand them a computer with only DOS on it.

dab
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 08:44
Quote: "with only DOS on it."




indi
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Location: Earth, Brisbane, Australia
Posted: 27th Mar 2007 10:04
1 person says go for it, the rest say get a job, thats an indication.
Entrepreneurs are usually the bosses for the people who feel its safer to get a job
sounds about right.

Van B
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 10:13
He's got no qualifications and is working in McDonalds Indi, he needs to get some proper work experience or education before anyone will take him seriously. Things might be different in Oz, but in the UK if you want to start a small business, then you really need a small business first before any bank will even listen. The government will educate the hell out of you on running a small business, but then getting started is a complete nightmare. Even guys running hot snack wagons have a hard time of it with all the legislation and taxes, I wouldn't suggest a qualified IT professional starts his own business over here, let alone someone without qualifications.


Good guy, Good guy, Wan...
Jeku
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Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 27th Mar 2007 10:17
Quote: "Entrepreneurs are usually the bosses for the people who feel its safer to get a job"


But "IT" people are a dime a dozen. Entrepreneurs also must set themselves apart from the pack. If it's just some kid who thinks he's special because he can program in DBP--- well, odds are he isn't (no offense).

Also, most entrepreneurs probably had jobs before they started their own business. Colonel Sanders was already retired before he started the KFC franchise after all

Dazzag
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 11:59 Edited at: 27th Mar 2007 12:00
Quote: "Also, most entrepreneurs probably had jobs before they started their own business"
Deffo. Especially when you are "almost an adult". I mean c'mon, people who start their own businesses are rare, but people who do it after just leaving school? Combine that with people who do this and are successful and we are talking amazingly rare.

Personally I left the UK to go to Cyprus and do my own thing, and the company I used to work for took me up as a contractor doing the same thing from home. Couldn't really turn that offer down. But the point is I was well paid and doing pretty well, with some good ideas for doing my own thing, but even then it took me 12 years to do it (16 years if you count the software business that dealt with pubs (can you see the attraction) me and a mate almost got off the ground before going to Uni). Basically some people are cut out for going alone, and some people aren't. Either way most of them only just get by (as in would do better as an employee) or crash and burn. All I know is I get paid pretty well, but my company charges about £1500 a day for my work (actually it's more like £2000 ($4000ish) when you take the design and PM work that I seem to do all of these days) , and I can tell you right now I don't get paid anywhere near that. Take from that what you want.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
glyvin101
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 17:58
Well I actually have not done much DB Programming, and no offense taken.

My skill are:

VB.net
C++
Basic
Phython a bit

Learning and getting certified tho the W3 programs at:

PHP
HTML / CSS
XML
MYSQL
JAVA

I know a bit of the above things but working on mastering them

Just thought I should let you know my qualifications a bit better,

Will
DrewG
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 18:08
Quote: "Well I actually have not done much DB Programming, and no offense taken.

My skill are:

VB.net
C++
Basic
Phython a bit

Learning and getting certified tho the W3 programs at:

PHP
HTML / CSS
XML
MYSQL
JAVA

I know a bit of the above things but working on mastering them

Just thought I should let you know my qualifications a bit better,

Will "


That's a good start.

Now I may get flamed for this suggestion, but it may help you.

If you young enough, I'd recommend enlisting in the Navy or Airforce, and go to A school as an IT.

Now, you may think you'll see combat, but only the Marines or Army does. THe only people in Air Force or Navy are the special forces.

Otherwise, you could go that route, or do ROTC so they pay for all college while you get some pay along the way.

I mean, if you did go in the military, you'd have great experience getting out that'll look good when applying for an even greater IT position.

Hope that helps.

-Drew
Peter H
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 20:04
sure go into the military...

if you want them to own your soul.

One man, one lawnmower, plenty of angry groundhogs.
glyvin101
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Posted: 27th Mar 2007 23:17
yea, I know politics are not allowed on this forum but lets just say I am really not wanting to fight for the cause that is currently going on , because I do not agree with it
DrewG
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Posted: 28th Mar 2007 01:46
Quote: "yea, I know politics are not allowed on this forum but lets just say I am really not wanting to fight for the cause that is currently going on , because I do not agree with it "


I don't agree either, but just get your education done with and have all that paid for. Who cares why you're doing it, put in your minimum time and get out asap. Then you're smart in the IT field, and you owe them nothing.

You aren't going to be in combat if you go Navy or Airforce, and don't go special forces.
Virtual X
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Posted: 28th Mar 2007 02:03
Actually, Sarcasm Stealth Squad has a good point, you can learn and experience situations in the forces that can really prepare you for 'Civvy' life, perhaps even 'mature' you, which is the problem of todays youth - No Discipline! let them pay for it! you could even go down the MCSE route and they will pay for it lol, don't dismiss it completely, do your research, but if you don't want to see combat then Navy or Air Force are your best bets, you could even study for an Bsc, Msc if your good enough! and the plus side - YOU GET PAID FOR IT lol.
Jeku
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Posted: 28th Mar 2007 10:41
Yah, when I was in Uni there was this dude who always came to school in his army uniform (camo and all). I kinda thought he was geeky at the time, but now I realize he's the smart one for getting paid to go to school for free.

Van B
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Posted: 28th Mar 2007 10:51
Air Force all the way. Navy is never what people expect of it, and the Army shouldn't be a consideration. The air force tends to have the most respect from potential employers, and best IT opportunities and funding. I have a few friends and a brother in the RAF who totally love their jobs, these are people who never had technical jobs before - no offence to them (well they'll never read this!) but the air forces must have a damn good training system.


Good guy, Good guy, Wan...
Seppuku Arts
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Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 28th Mar 2007 12:49 Edited at: 28th Mar 2007 12:50
Quote: "Hey I currently am Almost a adult, since I can't give my age I will say that, and I work at mc.donalds. I hate working here I get minimum wage and crappy skin. "


Really? Our McDonalds sounds like a blast to work in, I have two friends there, plus they have good pay, plus free meals (not that I would want to eat a McDonalds) and various discounts at different places, including Dell and Apple. Guess it all depends on which one then

If you're almost an adult, I would keep a part time job at McDonalds, despite your dislike for it (or find another part time job, your McDonalds job sounds a little like my friend's Bakers Oven job and she is looking for a replacement job) and keep yourself educated, if you want to use your brains, you're going to have to work hard first, but the end result will be greater than if you start early...If you can get a job afterwards or pay off student debts (In the UK the second isn't too much of a burden, they're reasonable with what you pay back and the first depends on where you go to study)

Did The Buddha have a Zen micro?
KeithC
Senior Moderator
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Posted: 28th Mar 2007 14:56
What does everybody have against the Army? They've got technical jobs too...it's just that the computers are usually located in a "volatile" environment.

Van B
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Posted: 28th Mar 2007 15:25
Nothing but personal experience with ex-army twats thinking that the world owes them a job just because they joined the army.

Let's be honest here, a lot of people join the army to escape poverty in the UK, they think it'll solve all their problems, they think that it'll guarantee them a job, they think that it'll be a rung in their career, and for a lot of people I imagine it is a good move, but not if your desired career entails working in an office.

People with an interest in working with computers should simply avoid it, there's far better, safer, and more valuable ways to get experience. Anyone believe that an employer is impressed with people who have been in the army?, in an office environment it means practically nothing. It's different for other careers with ex-army, there's lots of more hands-on careers that actually go well with army experience, like the fire service and law enforcement for instance.


Good guy, Good guy, Wan...
DrewG
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 00:24
Not to make a flaming argument, but I'd say Navy is best. I mean, Air Force is cool, but boot camp is lazy lazy lazy. Navy people don't have to chip paint if you're IT, and you get a decent enlistment bonus.

IDK do whatever you feel is best. And I'm talking US forces, not any foreign militaries.
adr
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 12:10
Speaking from personal experience, if you work in a small company, you tend to have your ear close to the ground; you understand the business' processes, how they acquire clients, how they manage clients ... all very useful experience in dealing with business level problems.

Working for a local PC repair shop is an ideal example on understanding how to operate a small business.

Within 12 months of working there you'll be thinking I could do this on my own and at that point, you set up shop...


I'm superfly TNT
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 12:34
Quote: "Not to make a flaming argument, but I'd say Navy is best."


Hehe, I'm sure you won't unless you're like our last Navy friend that was on this forum, he just flamed people for no reason.

Quote: "IDK do whatever you feel is best. And I'm talking US forces, not any foreign militaries. "


Indeed, I always thought the UK Air force is quite good or even perhaps the SAS, although I'd never do either, the idea of pushing my self and having discipline is good, but I already have martial arts and buddhism.

However my Dad was in the Air Force, and it was my birth that prevented him from flying the harrier jump jet on that fateful day, perhaps that's why he say's the milkman is my real father The airforce seemed pretty great when we lived on the RAF camp, they seemed to provide a lot of things, a house on the base for himself and the family, money, training and any hobbies paid, as he was training professionally as a Squash player (I'm sure this is the same for any military service). I suppose the only catch for him was to go to the Gulf during the first gulf war.

So if you're going into an armed forces you should always be aware of what comes with it and not to be just overwhelmed by the advantages, because if by going to war, you never know your experiences may overweigh the advantages.

Did The Buddha have a Zen micro?
Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 14:37 Edited at: 29th Mar 2007 14:50
@Sarcasm Stealth Squad -
Quote: "You aren't going to be in combat if you go Navy or Airforce"

SSS, I don't want to be rude to you, but that is retarded. What would the purpose of two entire branches of the military if not combat or combat support? Combat support puts you right there on the battlefield, and modern war fronts are much more vague than they used to be. If you join a branch of service honestly believing that you'll never see a combat zone, God help you.


Quote: "Nothing but personal experience with ex-army twats thinking that the world owes them a job just because they joined the army."

Thanks?

Not everyone joins the military because they are dumb or poor. Some people join to serve their country. I also think, with a good measure of experience, that you are completely wrong about all of your other observations. In addition, such ill informed empirical generalizations are extremely offensive.


Come see the WIP!
dark donkey
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 14:52
Quote: "Not everyone joins the military because they are dumb or poor. Some people join to serve their country. I also think, with a good measure of experience, that you are completely wrong about all of your other observations."


Why do people join the army, to potect there country i can understand. But look at it this way. join the army have fun, go into war get shot.
Van B
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 15:10
Personal experience Cash, no offence intended to those Army/ex-army folk with a clue. I don't think I generalised - just had a few experiences that left me doubting the mentality of some ex-armed forces people that I've met.

Remember I'm talking about UK regiments, for example...
My cousin had cigarettes put out on his face during his training.
A friend had his knee and career ruined in a 'friendly' game of football.

There's a nasty tradition of bullying and drug/alcohol abuse in a lot of bases in the UK, look it up in google, like Deep Cut for instance. I'm not just pulling this stuff out of my butt, I can't help it if my POV is negative, but it's certainly not intended to be offensive.


Good guy, Good guy, Wan...
Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 15:10
@Sarcasm Stealth Squad & Van B, from the last page...


@dark donkey -
Quote: "Why do people join the army...join the army have fun, go into war get shot."

What is your point? For some people the desire to serve your country is impossible to understand. For me, cowardice is impossible to understand.


Come see the WIP!
adr
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 15:21 Edited at: 29th Mar 2007 15:24
Quote: "For me, cowardice is impossible to understand."


Dude, you shoulda gone with something more Hollywood, like ...
"Fear is not an option"

And to SSS >

Yet another thread contorted into "Why the US Navy is awesome" thread. Are you on a referral scheme or something?


I'm superfly TNT
dark donkey
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 15:53
Quote: "What is your point? For some people the desire to serve your country is impossible to understand. For me, cowardice is impossible to understand"


what i am trying to say is, being in the army is risky, i lived in the uk, i remember on the news theres was a vid of some army members snorking(if thats the word) crack co cane
Peter H
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 17:00
Whatever you do...

...


..

i wouldn't trust SSS farther than i could throw him.

One man, one lawnmower, plenty of angry groundhogs.
DrewG
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Posted: 29th Mar 2007 18:09
Well yeah, I'm on a referral scheme, I'm not even in yet, and I'm still getting people under me name, yes.

Quote: "i wouldn't trust SSS farther than i could throw him."


Bad pun.

And sorry for bring the military up in this thread, please forgive me for my ignorance in my advice towards someone who asked what they thought, not what people thought of my response to him.

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