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Geek Culture / .zip or .rar?

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Tom J
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Posted: 13th Apr 2007 21:29
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I was wondering the other day what it would be better to compress my games as for downloading off my site, zip or rar? I wondered because I know that not all people have winrar, but it makes files with less size and I think you can extract files from zip on any windows computer. Any opinions ?

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Kohaku
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Posted: 13th Apr 2007 21:43 Edited at: 13th Apr 2007 21:43
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I'd have to go for rar out of those two, having found compression to be quite uber with it, plus there's a few free extractors out there for it.

Howeversinski, 7zip rocks. http://www.7-zip.org/
I use it for pretty much everything.


You are not alone.
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Dared1111
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Posted: 13th Apr 2007 21:45
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Zip: windows xp can already unzip without downloading an extra tool

[link]"http://www.greatgamesexperiment.com/user/Dared1111/" my account on GGE[\link]
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5Louiz
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Posted: 13th Apr 2007 23:07
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Windows's native support for .zip is not very good. The people should get a program for this. The decent decompressors support both formats.

Self-extract .exe is a generic solution if you will distribute the archives to Windows users..
7Zip will suit your needs.

Have fun


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Benjamin
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Posted: 13th Apr 2007 23:08
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I personally prefer zip/rar over 7Zip simply because more people have decompression programs that handle them.

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
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Phaelax
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 01:57
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I prefer winrar in the past, but I been using 7zip over the past year.

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Shadow heart
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 02:23
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zip is what i think but i don't know much about rar

to the ones thats trapped inside of you, this is it!!
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Person99
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 02:30 Edited at: 14th Apr 2007 02:31
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I think i'll say zip.

WinRar takes forever, and you have to download it on all systems. Unzippers come with most new operating systems. Kubuntu has one (I know, why would Linux have one?).

The Person99 awards go to: 1. Jack the Ripper for hardest crime scenes. 2. Peter Petrelli for most powers. 3. Superman for longest flight.
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indi
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 06:37
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im pretty sure all compression programs allow you to bundle a self extractor anyway for a few more kilobytes.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 12:00
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Personally I mainly use zips as everyone knows what you are talking about. The amount of stuff we muck around with at work just gets annoying when trying to explain different unzipping programs rather than WinZip to a client (system managers aren't actually that intelligent in my industry).

Saying that I use WinRar for unzipping anything. Haven't seen anything as fast as it basically. Windows built in Zip functionality totally sucks speed wise, and WinZip is good but not as good as WinRar for sheer performance.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
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xtom
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 13:36
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I prefer rar files, compression is way better than zip. Unfortunately there are still a lot of people who only know of zip so if you want to make it easy for the masses at the expense of bandwidth and longer download times then zip is the way to go. If your target audience is very tech savvy then rar should be fine.

In regards to the self extractor options, it may appear dangerous to some people when they see an exe file they are about to download. Especially off an unknown site. Even though an archive could contain a dodgy exe too.


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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 14:18
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7z all the way - If you enable the Self Extractor feature it adds about 20kb to the file, but the compression algorithm generally wipes the floor with zip/rar... I wrote a post about this ages ago... (me goes looking for it)

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GatorHex
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 14:29 Edited at: 14th Apr 2007 14:31
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Zip is more popular and supported.

Rar compresses more.

On a recent DBP game RAR got 7,332,533 v's ZIPs 10,618,398 bytes a 31% improvement in compression.

Not so important now we have ADSL, but it means you download will be 31% faster and you bandwidth usage will be 31% lower.

http://www.KumKie.com http://bulldog.servegame.com
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dark coder
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 15:14
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Well it depends on the file, it won't be exactly 31% for everything, I personally use .rar only and can't stand anything else, if a user cannot open a .rar I've sent to them I often question why I'm even bothering to send them the file in the first place.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 17:31
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The support for the compressor is almost irrelevant as they all included self-extractors.

Here is a post I started on this very topic in October 2004...
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=41308&b=1

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Benjamin
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 17:38 Edited at: 14th Apr 2007 17:39
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Quote: "The support for the compressor is almost irrelevant as they all included self-extractors."

Yes, and not everyone trusts EXE files. One might catch some disease from them, like stupidity.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 17:59
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Well if they dont trust the EXE then whether its self extracting or zip - they wont like the contents either (seeing as we're talking about compressing DBP EXE's)

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Benjamin
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 18:04
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Quote: "Well if they dont trust the EXE then whether its self extracting or zip"

Well I'm sure they would trust an 'exe' if it was a zip due to it in fact not being an exe, but actually a 'zip'.

But yes, your point is quite right.

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NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 19:59
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Zip for me, simply because they open like normal folders in Windows and can be used very quickly. I do not like farting about with wizards or dumb interfaces because an idiot thought 31% would make a difference on 5mb of files. It downloads 31% quicker; so what? Zip can be used 301% quicker.


Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 14th Apr 2007 23:13
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Thats utter crap in my opinion. Most stuff in a zip file will need extracting before it will run - in fact if you're running something it WILL need extracting, the issue is more if there are any resources in the ZIP with it.

So ZIP or non-zip, you still have to double click the archive and then double click the file inside it (at bare minimum).

If you're using a compressing app which wont let you browse and archive and double click a file so it will automatically extract and try to run then you're missing out.

The built in Windows ZIP maker is poor. Its compression isn't as good as a dedicated app like WinZip, WinRAR or 7z and, in the past, I have had minor compatibility issues with the Windows Compressor which was solved by using a dedicated app.

But this is just my opinion/experience. If you prefer the windows one - have a happy life with it hehe

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Phaelax
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 02:36
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Quote: "I do not like farting about with wizards or dumb interfaces because an idiot thought 31% would make a difference on 5mb of files. It downloads 31% quicker; so what? Zip can be used 301% quicker."


What are you talking about?


The newest WinZip has very good compression at its max and very much improved encryption. Only problem is, using it at its maximum compression no other tool has been able to open the new zip file except Winzip so most people just use the standard compression anyway.


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Tom J
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 11:02
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Ok then, I may offer 3 file formats (zip, rar and 7z) so that you have a choice and it also lets some people download it quicker if they have the right software. I'm using fileden so I won't have too much trouble with bandwidth. Also because there seems to be a variety of opinions here.

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Phaelax
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 13:53
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There's no need for multiple formats, zip is supported by most tools.


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Wandering Swordsman
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 14:22 Edited at: 15th Apr 2007 14:24
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RAR!

Haven't used anything else since I started using WinRAR.

When I dream,
I carry a sword in one hand,
a gun in the other...
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Code Dragon
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 15:22 Edited at: 15th Apr 2007 15:23
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I haven't yet met a person (not on these forums) that uses RAR. Probably because many people here are computer savvy. Almost no one will be able to play your games if you use RAR because almost no one's heard of RAR. So I'd say ZIP, I don't have WinRar because it will take up more hard drive space than I will save by changing my ZIP archives to RARs.

By reading this sentence you have given me brief control of your mind.
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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 16:55
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What does it matter what format you use? Make it self extracting and the problem goes away! Just pick the one which makes the file smallest.

WinRar/WinZip,7z is irrelevant. Do you think they have this debate at Microsoft? No - they just compress it and pack it around a self extracting app (in their case, a nice and pretty installer, but thats all it is... a fancy self extractor which also controls where files go).

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Jeku
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 21:54
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Well, like what was said before, less people will be prone to double-click an EXE as a ZIP or RAR file--- myself included. Unless it's a a fairly well-known developer, I don't trust anyone.

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Tom J
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Posted: 15th Apr 2007 23:34
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I've made a self extracting file for .7z(smallest in size) but as Jeku said (as well as others) a lot of people may be concerned about downloading an .exe (although the point you made earlier on is quite correct).

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 16th Apr 2007 00:01
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Zip the self extracting 7z file

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Phaelax
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Posted: 16th Apr 2007 04:37
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Quote: "I haven't yet met a person (not on these forums) that uses RAR. Probably because many people here are computer savvy. Almost no one will be able to play your games if you use RAR because almost no one's heard of RAR."


I used winrar for many years in the past. And as for size, I've always found rar to be smaller than zip.(except in the newer zip compressions)


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Tom J
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Posted: 16th Apr 2007 13:23
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Quote: "Zip the self extracting 7z file"


Cool, I'll probably go with that

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NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 16th Apr 2007 23:30
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You don't know what I mean by poor interface? Press control+a in Windows and it selects all. The appropiate combo in WinZip is shift+a. Not too annoying, but irritating when it throws up the add file dialog instead. Which then causes both CD drives to spin up in turn, read the autorun.inf and load the icon. There. Ten seconds wasted. Then, instead of being able to copy and paste, I have to use the extract wizard! Yay! That means that using the smallest file tree window I have ever seen in any program (PDAs included) I tell it where to dump the files. WinZip often screws up with "open file" on the download page, too, ending up with a corrupted zip. All in all, I would rather just use Windows's Zip program. I've had similar experiences with WinAce and WinRar, the latter of which would not install for some reason.


Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
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UFO
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Posted: 17th Apr 2007 01:03
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You know, you can always just right click on the compressed files and click on extract to...

x_x

There's no need for wizards or copying or anything.

Visit my website!
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Saikoro
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Posted: 17th Apr 2007 03:21
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Some people just arent good with software it seems


My band Phoenix Ophelia : http://www.myspace.com/phoenixophelia
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