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Geek Culture / Help with Oblivion system requirements

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Suicidal Sledder
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Joined: 17th Aug 2004
Location: Tikrit, Iraq
Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 05:08
Hey everyone... I just bought a new computer to run Oblivion and by all accounts it should run it fine but alas it does not. The Sys Reqs are states as:

Quote: "
Minimum System Requirements:
* Windows XP, Windows 2000, Windows XP 64-bit
* 512MB System RAM
* 2 Ghz Intel Pentium 4 or equivalent processor
* 128MB Direct3D compatible video card
* and DirectX 9.0 compatible driver;
* 8x DVD-ROM drive
* 4.6 GB free hard disk space
* DirectX 9.0c (included)
* DirectX 8.1 compatible sound card
* Keyboard, Mouse
"


My computer has Windows Vista, 2GB RAM, AMD Duel core 1.9GHz(which i understand with duel cores would add together to 3.8GHz), 128 Integrated Intel video card (upgraded to 394MBs of dedicated RAM used as video memory(the max my BIOS will allow)), and DX10 of course.


I've tried turning all of the settings as low as they will go, and turning off the shaders, etc. but I still get about 5-10 fps. I'm really not sure why unless its because of the integrated video.

I want to be sure buying an actual PCI card will fix it before i spend 70-80 bucks on a new one.

Thanks everyone!

Satchmo
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 05:22
Well no because dual core does not equal twice the power right off the bat. What Ive heard is oblivion plays off one core and loads off the other, which means your playing on 1.9 GHz which is where your problem might come from.

Your about to get pwned.
Suicidal Sledder
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 05:26
bah then someone lied to me... I was told a Duel AMD 1.9 was the same as a single 3.8 intel... maybe i just misunderstood

Suicidal Sledder
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 05:36
also was running Oblivion and then quickly alt-tabbed to taskmanager and both cores were the same and were only at about 70-80 percent

Satchmo
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 05:39
What? If it lags it should be at full 100% on at least 1 core.

Your about to get pwned.
Suicidal Sledder
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 05:42
thats why i think its a video card problem... plus i forgot to mention that if i stick my face in a corner it runs a lot better but in the opening prison cell i cant get the whole thing to render without slowdown.

i was thinking it might make a difference since my video is integrated , or since the majority of my "video memory" is actually RAM being used as vid mem.

if i got a 256 PCI card plus the 128 of RAM as vid do you think it would fix it?

bitJericho
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 08:41
It's definately not a processor problem. 1.9ghz is plenty fast for any game on the market, and they are faster than a single core model because of the increased cache and optimization over a single core.

So it's not that. I'm going to hazard a guess and say it's your crappy onboard video. You probably won't be able to run most games except on the most minimum settings.

A PCI card won't offer much better, check your mobo and see if you got a pci-express 16x or agp slot and upgrade accordingly. Don't spend much less than 100 USD on a graphics card or you won't get much benefit from it.


The greatest multiplayer text adventure ever...
Van B
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 09:24
I think your non-descript graphics card might be holding you back. I mean I've run Oblivion on a FX5200 at a playable rate, in fact I completed it on that card, so I think you might want to upgrade that.

One thing you should try is disabling bloom, maybe some of the other shaders too if you haven't already.

We're going down... in a spiral to the ground...
Randomness 128
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 19:20 Edited at: 2nd Oct 2007 19:21
Video card most likely. Intel graphics cards are one of my worst enemies. They must be stopped!

Suicidal Sledder
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 23:11 Edited at: 2nd Oct 2007 23:12
Seems like walmart is selling an nVidia Geforce (forget the numbers) with 256 for about 80 usd. The plan at the moment is to get that one unless someone has a better idea.

I'm not sure what slots my computer has. I know it has no AGP and at least 1 open PCI. It also has a black one (not an AGP) and another black one thats super short. About 1/4 the length of a normal PCI slot.

I'll try to take some pictures of them sometime or just check in my Device Manager to identify them.

gamebird
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 23:25 Edited at: 2nd Oct 2007 23:31
It is definetly the integrated graphics. They have trouble running old games at 5-10 fps, i'm surprised it does so well with oblivion.

About the processor- 1.9GHZ dual core is prabably a little better than a 2.8GHZ single core when the program is dual threaded well. A 1.9GHZ dual core is not equal to 3.8 by any means. Many people make this common mistake. You see, not all programs are dual threaded, or written so they run on 2 cores. They are also limited by how much they are dual threaded. Many games say they are dual threaded but still have the first core do most of the work, simply because the way modern programming works we don't have much that can go on another core.

And what about single threaded programs? They will only run on one core, which means that they only run at 1.9GHZ, which is pretty slow for a single threaded program.Windows will attempt to compensate for them being single threaded, but it this is somewhat limited and doesn't really help that much. And games are almost always too complicated for windows to help them at all.

Something else to consider with oblivion- oblivion plays better or worse depending on where you are. In order to keep from sacraficing detail, oblivion has indoor and outdoor environments. And the environments are different too. So any performance readings you get from oblivion will be many times be vastly different depending on where you are.

And if you get a new graphics card: don't get one thats too good, because your processor will always force the graphics card to wait until the processor is done. This means it will drag down the performance of your graphics card, wasting your money.
bitJericho
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 23:29
buying a graphics card without knowing what kind of card you need is like buying gas for your car but not knowing if you need diesel or regular unleaded

Send us a picture of your motherboard or tell us what type of motherboard you have and we'll help you figure out what type of card to buy.


The greatest multiplayer text adventure ever...
NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2007 23:32
Oblivion will run better on a slow dual core than a fast single. The dual system allows the game to continue whilst stuff loads... a single core system will pause momentarily frequently whilst moving at high speed through the complex landscape. I know from experience.
That said, my system is a single core 1.8gHz Athlon. Barton Core. The best of its time.


Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
Suicidal Sledder
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 00:57
Here are my slots... The bottom two are PCI, and i think the top two are PCIex1 on the lower and PCIex16 on the upper but im not sure.

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Suicidal Sledder
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 01:35
bitJericho
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 01:36
yep, that's a pci-e x16 slot.

You may want to check out some cards on newegg.com, as I know from looking in my local walmart the cards are usually 20-30 dollars more expensive in the store for the lowend cards, and worse for the higher end.


The greatest multiplayer text adventure ever...
GatorHex
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 03:22 Edited at: 4th Oct 2007 11:20
Quote: "which i understand with duel cores would add together to 3.8GHz"


Nah, ebay seller claim this crap, I've even seen them claiming 2x Ggz + 40% (to take into account the Pentium M factor). Most games are only using a single core at the mo. Lost Planet the only exception I can think of.

Your problem is you are relying on motherboard graphics which will be cruddy. Get a Nvidia 8600GT in there

Check out this Dual core baby I just built for £350 / $700. It's got nice big fan on the top blowing cold air in quietly and a 2ghz Core 2 Duo ovclocked to 2.5Ghz





Test yours here -> http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=101716&b=5

DinoHunter (still no nVidia compo voucher!), CPU/GPU Benchmark, DarkFish Encryption DLL, War MMOG (WIP), 3D Model Viewer
Satchmo
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 03:27
Dual core is the past anyways, quad core is the way to go.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117132

That would solve your problem.

Your about to get pwned.
GatorHex
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 03:50 Edited at: 3rd Oct 2007 04:02
Thats a Xeon CPU for a server. If you wanted to go that route you could buy a Dell Octa Quad (2 x Quad Xeon)

Personaly i think you'd do better with the fastest Core 2 Duo Extreme + a 8800GTX for gaming.

DinoHunter (still no nVidia compo voucher!), CPU/GPU Benchmark, DarkFish Encryption DLL, War MMOG (WIP), 3D Model Viewer
Raven
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 05:37
Multiple Cores make very little difference unless you're running something designed to take advantage of it.

Realistically what you'll find is for traditional single core games, you will get about a 30% performance increase from each additional core.

So while your processor is a 2.0GHz 3800+, rather than it performance like a P4 3.8GHz; you'll probably get closer to P4 3.0GHz performance. Still more than enough for modern games mind.
With true multi-core games (i.e. Quake 4) then you'll get closer to the performance that AMD has noted.

Again, this is far more than enough for modern games though.
The problem is no doubt down to your built-in intel graphics, unless it's an X3000; forget about getting any decent performance from games. If it is an X3000, then only games that are not vertex shader heavy will performance reasonably; as all on-board shader cards offload the vertex shaders to the cpu. Even with a beefy Quad-Core processor, you're not going to be able to run most games that heavily rely on them very quickly.

Those that are Pixel Shader based however, will perform roughly the same to a budget card. So you should get reasonable performance from them.. In-fact one system here has an on-board 6100 which can push a very respectable amount of pixels and triangles; so most games (like Half-Life 2) on max settings run at about 25fps; Doom 3 even on lowest however is closer to 5-10fps. (below that of even a GF5200).

I'd recommend getting a reasonable dedicated graphics card, then you'll get decent performance in all games not just those that rely on pixel shaders.

Lucy
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 10:10
Quote: "AMD Duel core 1.9GHz(which i understand with duel cores would add together to 3.8GHz), 128 Integrated Intel video card"


You cannot add mhz together. All programs are ultimately procedural. Everything has to come in order (even in "Out of Order Execution" there's still a logical order in which everything is executed). As such, if you were to try to use both CPUs to process the same thread, one CPU would have to wait while the other one finishes. also, the results would have to then be passed to the other cpu. As such, you'd actually end up running slightly slower than if you had just one CPU...

No, adding CPUs together does not work. What does work is running two entirely different threads on both CPUs and not having them slow down.

Normally, on a single CPU, the computer actually juggles the tasks. Some people liken it to shuffling a deck of cards. But if you have two CPUs (or two cores) then you can shuffle two decks at once. Assuming each card is a different thread (usually it's one thread per program... very few programs are multithreaded) then you could shuffle half the deck on one core and half the deck on the other and execute twice as fast.

Under ideal circumstances, this can lead to the illusion that you're running at twice the mhz, but each thread still can never execute faster than the speed of one of the CPUs.

Also, sadly, you can't have two cores being two different speeds (or even two different architectures). That's what I miss about Amigas. My old Amiga 1200 (which currently is going to be used to run a CNC machine shortly, as soon as the CNC is finished being built) has a Motorola 68040 and a 740 PPC (the ppc was originally a 603e but i replaced it with a 740 aka G3). The 68040 is clocked to 75mhz while the G3 processor is at 250mhz. Asymmetric multi processing (and asymmetric architectures) is wonderful.

Nothing I say is intended to be rude. My autism means that I do not know what is rude and what isn't rude. I apologize if I seem rude. It is not my intention.
bitJericho
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 10:18
Quote: "That would solve your problem."


No it wouldn't. It wouldn't change a thing. You need a proper graphics card, end of story


The greatest multiplayer text adventure ever...
Redmotion
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 15:27
All the Ghz rating systems are out of the window now. A single 2.8ghz core is still faster than a single core pentium 4. The Ghz rating between Intel and AMD are all over the place.

This site's quite helpful at checking CPU speeds (although the multicore processor scores are misleading):

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/common_cpus.html

I can run oblivion fine on my old rig (Dual Athlon MP 2000+ rated as 1.666ghz per CPU - I do have an AGP ATI radeon x1950pro 512mb - this seems to take up a lot of the slack - even Bioshock runs fine).

I was actually standing in Game last saturday checking the minimum requirements on the back of lots of PC games and wondering that, now Ghz ratings are all over the place, the requirements list on the back is now really unhelpful.

Crysis is listed as

CPU: Athlon 64 3000+/Intel 2.8GHz; Graphics: NVIDIA 6600/X800GTO (SM 2.0); RAM: 768MB/1GB; HDD: 6GB; Internet: 256k+; Optical Drive: DVD; Software: DX9.0c with Windows X

Dual core recommended.

I reckon a lot more people will be able to run it than you might think (thats if you're not obsessed with FPS rates).

gamebird
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2007 23:44
@Jerico- actually it would help, because the integrated graphics offloads all of the polygonal processing (very hard to compute stuff) to the cpu. But a dedicated graphics card would almost certainly do better.

I recommend the 8600GT or the 7600GT, depending on whether you want direct x 10 or not. The 7600GT works with AGP so you way need to go that route. It will also be plenty for oblivion (I can run it on high with some occaisional frame rate drop but nothing major. But then again I run it at 10x8 resolution.)
Xarshi
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Posted: 4th Oct 2007 01:49
Yeah,I wouldn't recommend running oblivion while getting such low frame rates. I did it,and it wasn't fun. I wish I had waited until I had the computer I have now,because my computer now makes it seem more real,but now the game lost its fun cuz I beat it when I had a crappy computer. So now I have to play quake4/doom3/prey... cuz windows live is evil....

Hello
SunnyKatt
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Posted: 4th Oct 2007 03:09
oblivion is amazing. My computer has only 1.5 gig ram and runs on windows and i can play with full graphics with little lag. whats the deal?

2d programmer for life

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