animation problems - GameCreators Forum

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Code eater

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Posted: 31st Mar 2008 14:11 Edited at: 31st Mar 2008 14:13

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I'm using Caligari Gamespace to create my models and animations but when I load an animated model into darkbasic it doesnt animate! Is there any reason for this?

i've tried:

+ Code Snippet

Load object "Mario.3ds",1
set object frame 1,0
set object speed 1,10
do
play object 1
loop

+ Code Snippet

Load object "Mario.3ds",1
set object frame 1,0
set object speed 1,10
play object 1
do

loop

+ Code Snippet

Load object "Mario.3ds",1
set object frame 1,0
set object speed 1,10
loop object 1
do

loop

but none of them work!!

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Latch

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Posted: 31st Mar 2008 14:21

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Could be the model. DBC doesn't accept bone/skinning mesh type animation. Has to be articulated structure animation - each limb is it's own mesh connected in a parent child hierarchy within the figure. I don't know what kind of animation Caligari exports.

Enjoy your day.

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TDK

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Posted: 31st Mar 2008 17:20

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Model animation is something I am learning about myself and at the moment know little about it. So I've been doing a bit of research.

I had a conversation with someone yesterday on this very subject as I have used Truespace for years and had downloaded Gamespace Lite to have a play with.

I was told that neither TS or GS save animations which are compatible with DB - which I thought rather strange seeing as GS is sold on the TGC website.

You might want to take a look at the Character Shop demo (because the full version has a couple of issues meaning that it doesn't work for everyone) and another program called FragMotion.

A lot of people also have a great deal of success animating with Milkshape.

TDK_Man

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Yodaman Jer

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Posted: 1st Apr 2008 20:21

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.3DS models do not support NOR can they be manipulated to actually move. The only way to do that is to animate and save an .X model, but unfortunately I don't think DBC supports that capability. DBPro does, however, and DBP also runs more smoothly, has more advanced features, a debugging mode, lightmapping tools, and lots of other stuff (drool).

Thanks BigAdd!!

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TDK

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Posted: 1st Apr 2008 23:43

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Quote: "The only way to do that is to animate and save an .X model, but unfortunately I don't think DBC supports that capability"

That sounds like you are saying that DBC doesn't support animated .X files...

TDK_Man

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Code eater

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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 22:01

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Man! Thats annoying. spent $200 on gs and i can't even animate with it! anoooooyin!

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Latch

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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 22:43

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Many 3d packages have a scene creator. The scene creator usually makes the kind of animation that DBC can support. The scene animator is where you set up multiple models, the camera, etc and move things around. The problem can be that the scene animator might not export to a file format you want (in this case direct x).

Why should I build a scene? you may ask. A trick is to build your model as if it is a scene. You add limbs as individual meshes (arms, legs, whatever) and you maipulate them with the scene animation commands.

There may also be an option to create mechanical type animation as if you were creating somehting that would have pistons, and gears and parts that don't move according to a skeletal frame or warping skin vertices. This is the type of animation DBC supports. This may be called hierarchal animation but doesn't use any type of mesh deformation. You probably can create the proper animation to use with DBC in Caligari. It is a standard technique - a bit older than mesh deformation, but it's still one of the easier ways to do mechanical movements. In Caligari, you just have to find out what it's called and how to export it.

Enjoy your day.

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TDK

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Posted: 3rd Apr 2008 22:56

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Quote: "Thats annoying. spent $200 on gs and i can't even animate with it"

Yes very!

I'm not quite as miffed as you because I was using TS a long time before I discovered DB. To buy it specially must be a real pain.

Is it (GS) worth keeping for other aspects?

If not (and you don't already have it), it might be worth contacting Caligari support and telling them it won't do what you want it for and asking them if you can exchange it for TrueSpace.

Or contact wherever you got it from. Again, if it's not fit for purpose and you've not had it long, then you should be due a refund or exchange for another product.

TDK_Man

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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 14:31 Edited at: 4th Apr 2008 15:16

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Quote: "A lot of people also have a great deal of success animating with Milkshape.
"

Are you sure that will work as I read on their website that it is a skelital animator.

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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 15:00 Edited at: 4th Apr 2008 15:33

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Cant get the scene idea to work

so ill ask caligari whether i can swap it for a tool that definately will work with DBC

What program/s do you use (if you use one) for animation and model creation for DBC that you know work?

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Latch

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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 16:44

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For quick model creation I use Deled 3d. Easy to use, easy to texture, and it has a nice directx exporter. No animation though.

For animation I use Blender 3d. Model creation is a little tough and the interface takes some getting use to, but there are tons of animation options, including parent-child articulated mesh type. Although, I had to write my own custom python script to make a DirectX export that would work with DBC including animation. I also use Anim8or for animation. Again, I had to write my own export to directx to create the proper animation file.

I also use the DBC commands LINK LIMB, ROTATE LIMB, OFFSET LIMB for simple animations. In fact I was putting together an animator written in and for DBC, but I haven't been motivated to work on it in a while. As I write this, I remember Sven B had created an animator in DBC - let me take a quick search....

Ok found it. Read through the whole thread because I think there are updates as it progresses:

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=59665&b=10

Enjoy your day.

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TheComet

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Posted: 4th Apr 2008 20:35 Edited at: 11th Aug 2008 18:19

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Gee, I thought you guys would have found out why...

+ Code Snippet

Load object "Mario.3ds",1
set object frame 1,0
set object speed 1,10
do
play object 1
loop

That obviously doesn`t work. If you have the "play object" in a loop, every time it goes through the loop it will play the object from the start and you will only see the first frame.

+ Code Snippet

Load object "Mario.3ds",1
set object frame 1,0
set object speed 1,10
play object 1
do

loop

That also doesn`t work, because you do not use the command "sync". that will print the object to the screen. Here you will just see the first frame.

+ Code Snippet

Load object "Mario.3ds",1
set object frame 1,0
set object speed 1,10
loop object 1
do

loop

The same problem with this like above. You need a sync

This should work:

+ Code Snippet

rem setup screen
sync on
sync rate 30
backdrop on
color backdrop 0
hide mouse

rem load the object
load object "Mario.3ds",1

rem set the object properties
set object frame 1,0
set object speed 1,10

rem loop the object
loop object 1

rem main loop
do

rem print text to screen
center text 320,20,"If you can see this text, it should be working"

rem REFRESH screen
sync

rem end of main loop
loop

If it doesn`t work, inform me please

TheComet

Suicide is away of telling God, You can’t fire me I quit !!!!!

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Latch

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Posted: 5th Apr 2008 04:55

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@TheComet

I'll give you the first one, the play object in a loop will only play the first frame, but the other snippets should work which makes me think it is the model. It could be sync but there was no declaration of sync on in his code. Here's an example:

autocam off
gosub _characters
position camera 0,0,-400
position object 1,-50,0,0
position object 2,50,0,0

loop object 1
loop object 2

do
loop
end

_characters:
      rem textures
      ink 255,0
      dot 0,0
      get image 1,0,0,1,2
      sync

cls
      ink rgb(255,0,0),0
      dot 0,0
      get image 2,0,0,1,2

rem main character
      make object sphere 1,25
      make mesh from object 1,1
      make object box 2,5,30,6
      offset limb 2,0,0,-15,0
      make mesh from object 2,2
      delete object 2
      add limb 1,1,2
      add limb 1,2,2
      add limb 1,3,1
      offset limb 1,1,-6,-6,0
      offset limb 1,2,6,-6,0
      texture object 1,1
      hide limb 1,0

rem animate
      set object keyframe 1,0
      rotate limb 1,1,30,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,330,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 1,10
      rotate limb 1,1,0,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,0,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,0,0
      set object keyframe 1,20
      rotate limb 1,1,330,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,30,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 1,30
      rotate limb 1,1,359,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,1,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,-.5,0
      set object keyframe 1,38

scale object 1,400,400,400

set object speed 1,25

`loop object 1
      `hide object 1

rem enemy
      make object sphere 2,25
      add limb 2,1,2
      add limb 2,2,2
      add limb 2,3,1
      delete mesh 1
      delete mesh 2
      offset limb 2,1,-6,-6,0
      offset limb 2,2,6,-6,0
      texture object 2,2
      hide limb 2,0
      `hide object 2

rem animate
      set object keyframe 2,0
      rotate limb 2,1,60,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,300,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 2,10
      rotate limb 2,1,0,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,0,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,0,0
      set object keyframe 2,20
      rotate limb 2,1,300,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,60,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 2,30
      rotate limb 2,1,359,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,1,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,-.5,0
      set object keyframe 2,38

scale object 2,400,400,400

set object speed 2,35

`loop object 2

rem collision
      set object collision on 1
      set object collision on 2
      set object collision to boxes 1
      set object collision to boxes 2

return
`---------------------------------------------------------------------

+ Code Snippet

autocam off
gosub _characters
position camera 0,0,-400
position object 1,-50,0,0
position object 2,50,0,0

loop object 1
loop object 2

do
loop
end

   _characters:
      rem textures
      ink 255,0
      dot 0,0
      get image 1,0,0,1,2
      sync

      cls
      ink rgb(255,0,0),0
      dot 0,0
      get image 2,0,0,1,2

      rem main character
      make object sphere 1,25
      make mesh from object 1,1
      make object box 2,5,30,6
      offset limb 2,0,0,-15,0
      make mesh from object 2,2
      delete object 2
      add limb 1,1,2
      add limb 1,2,2
      add limb 1,3,1
      offset limb 1,1,-6,-6,0
      offset limb 1,2,6,-6,0
      texture object 1,1
      hide limb 1,0

      rem animate
      set object keyframe 1,0
      rotate limb 1,1,30,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,330,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 1,10
      rotate limb 1,1,0,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,0,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,0,0
      set object keyframe 1,20
      rotate limb 1,1,330,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,30,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 1,30
      rotate limb 1,1,359,0,0
      rotate limb 1,2,1,0,0
      offset limb 1,3,0,-.5,0
      set object keyframe 1,38

      scale object 1,400,400,400

      set object speed 1,25

      `loop object 1
      `hide object 1


      rem enemy
      make object sphere 2,25
      add limb 2,1,2
      add limb 2,2,2
      add limb 2,3,1
      delete mesh 1
      delete mesh 2
      offset limb 2,1,-6,-6,0
      offset limb 2,2,6,-6,0
      texture object 2,2
      hide limb 2,0
      `hide object 2

      rem animate
      set object keyframe 2,0
      rotate limb 2,1,60,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,300,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 2,10
      rotate limb 2,1,0,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,0,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,0,0
      set object keyframe 2,20
      rotate limb 2,1,300,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,60,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,-5,0
      set object keyframe 2,30
      rotate limb 2,1,359,0,0
      rotate limb 2,2,1,0,0
      offset limb 2,3,0,-.5,0
      set object keyframe 2,38

      scale object 2,400,400,400

      set object speed 2,35

      `loop object 2

      rem collision
      set object collision on 1
      set object collision on 2
      set object collision to boxes 1
      set object collision to boxes 2

   return
`---------------------------------------------------------------------

However you did make me realize I never saw the actual model.

@Code Eater
Can you post the media of the model? I want to be sure that it is the animation and not something else in the structure. It could be a simple matter that's getting bigger by suggesting alternatives.

Enjoy your day.

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Code eater

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Posted: 5th Apr 2008 11:07

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@TheComet
That code doesn't seem to work. It just says that the model cannot animate.

@Latch
sure ok... there should be: -"mario3.3ds" which is a static model.
-"mario4.3ds" which is a supposedly animated model which doesnt seem to work and i cant load the animation into GameSpace.
-"mario.cob" which i know loads properly with animation into GameSpace (thats what it should look like).
-"mario.x" which is a supposedly animated model which doesnt seem to work and i cant load the animation into GameSpace.

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Latch

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Posted: 5th Apr 2008 11:30

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Quote: "sure ok... there should be"

Uh... where's the media? If you don't want to post it because you don't want it public that's ok. If you can open the X file in a text editor, look for a section near the bottom that has headings and data similar to:

+ Code Snippet

AnimationSet animset {
 Animation {
  {Plane_frame}
   AnimationKey { 
   0;
   0;
   ;
   }

   AnimationKey { 
   1;
   0;
   ;
   }

   AnimationKey { 
   2;
   0;
   ;
   }
  }

 Animation {
  {Plane001_frame}
   AnimationKey { 
   0;
   1;
   0;4;1.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000;;;
   }

   AnimationKey { 
   1;
   6; 
   0;3;1.000000,1.000000,1.000000;;,
   5;3;1.447241,1.447241,1.447241;;,
   10;3;1.057511,1.057511,1.057511;;,
   15;3;1.454459,1.454459,1.454459;;,
   25;3;1.014625,1.014625,1.014625;;,
   40;3;1.000000,1.000000,1.000000;;;
   }
   AnimationKey { 
   2;
   1;
   3;0;0.000000,0.000000,0.000000;;;
   }
  }

 Animation {
  {Cylinder_frame}
   AnimationKey { 
   0;
   0;
   ;
   }

   AnimationKey { 
   1;
   0;
   ;
   }

   AnimationKey { 
   2;
   0;
   ;
   }
  }

 }

and post that, I may be able to tell from the animation keys if the animation itself is the problem. Ideally, though having the whole media of the model (3ds or X) would be best.

Enjoy your day.

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TheComet

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Posted: 5th Apr 2008 11:30

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Quote: "sure ok... there should be:"

Could you compress those files into a .zip file and post that zip file with the button beneath called "browse"?

Oooooops!!! I accidentally formated drive c.

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Code eater

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Posted: 6th Apr 2008 15:32

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woops! lol... sorry forgot to attach. here it is

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Code eater

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Posted: 6th Apr 2008 15:58

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sorry... this is a little of subject but when i creat a model how to i label which limb is limb 1/2/3 etc.?

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chafari

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Posted: 6th Apr 2008 16:21

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Unless you are going to use it in Dbpro, animation by bones doesn´t work in Dark basic Clasic. Anyway, no one of your models has animation at all.

A possible way to animate your mario model for Darkbasic Clasic, is by separated objects (limbs).Other way to do a perfect mesh moving like bone joints, is making a different mesh for each moving...like frames in a movie. I send you a example of this method. I hope you like it

cheers.

oh my god

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Posted: 6th Apr 2008 22:40

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what would i open a .rar file with?

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Latch

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Posted: 6th Apr 2008 23:07

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@Code Eater

Winrar - I believe it is shareware

Also, chafari is right... I didn't see any animation information in your files. Like TDK said, check with Caligari support and see if there is a tool to do the proper animation. If you say "for DarkBASIC" they would probably assume Pro and say the animation is already supported. You'll have to be specific and indicate Direct X 7 , and limbs created as individual meshes in a parent-child hierarchy - exports Direct X animation keys 0 1 and 2 (rotation, offset, and scale) , no skeletons, bones, or skin deformations.

@chafari
Very Clever! You set up each limb as it's own completed animation frame of the whole object, hid all the limbs, and then show each limb one at a time while the animation is playing using hide limb and show limb. Very very clever. I'll have to try that in Anim8or!

Is performance affected with large animations? After all, you are essentially recreating the same mesh as many times as there are frames.

Enjoy your day.

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Posted: 6th Apr 2008 23:42

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so how would i actualy view the .rar file? it sounds interesting... so you actualy make a limb for every "frame" in the animation and just show limb one and hide all the others then show limb two and hide all the others? ok... Im still not really sure how when i create a model i decide what is limb 1 and what is limb 2 etc. do you do it during the model creation? i guess you would.

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chafari

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Posted: 7th Apr 2008 00:56

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Hallo again. Yes ...it is a hard work at first, but we have to do a differente mesh for every keyframe. The best way to do that is coping in the same program you are using, the object SOLDAT, then make for exaple 5 copies of it and rename one by one each copie...(this is not really necessary...just not making a mess).

Then modify each one with a different pose ,starting by object one to six, and put all of them in the same position x,y,z...last export to .3ds o .x file...we can be pretty sure that the object has six limbs no matter its names...now by the method of hiding all limbs and just showing the one we need, we get this effect that looks like mdl model.

cheers.

oh my god

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Posted: 7th Apr 2008 12:36

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Are you saying save the scene because when i load the scene into DBC its invisible... and i dont know how to decide what each individual [u][/u]limb is.

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Posted: 7th Apr 2008 14:49 Edited at: 7th Apr 2008 15:27

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Ive had a try at animating in darkbasic its self and it seems rather tricky...

i did it by making a box for the body and a box for the arm. then making a mesh from the arm and deleting the object of the arm. i then attached the mesh to the main body object as a limb. i then wrote a few for...to commands to make the animation then played it is this the way to do it?

+ Code Snippet

make object box 1,0.5,0.5,0.5
make object box 2,0.7,0.2,0.2
make mesh from object 1,2
delete object 2
add limb 1,1,1



for a=0 to 6
	offset limb 1,1,0.3,0.02*a,0
	rotate limb 1,1,0,0,10*a
	set object keyframe 1,a
next a

for a=7 to 16
	offset limb 1,1,0.3,0.02*(12-a),0
	rot#=10*(12-a)
	if rot#<0 then rot#=360-abs(rot#)
	rotate limb 1,1,0,0,rot#
	set object keyframe 1,a
next a

for a=17 to 20
	offset limb 1,1,0.3,0.02*(-20+a),0
	rot#=10*(-20+a)
	if rot#<0 then rot#=360-abs(rot#)
	rotate limb 1,1,0,0,rot#
	set object keyframe 1,a
next a

save object animation "Bird.x",1

set object speed 1,1
loop object 1,0,21

do
text 0,0,str$(object frame(1))
loop

also when i say "set object frame" darkbasic stops respoinding and it closes. do you know why?

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chafari

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Posted: 8th Apr 2008 01:54

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Hallo Code eater...I don´t know what you mean about invisible....have you seen my example code?...it works great for me...what version of dark basic are you using?....

Anyway...you can not write non existing comands like:
save object animation...

if you have problems with the file .rar, i can send a Zip one...

This is the code of the animation... cheers.

autocam off:hide mouse
make matrix 1,10000.0,10000.0,25,25
load bitmap "floor1.bmp",1
get image 1,1,1,100,100
delete bitmap 1
prepare matrix texture 1,1,2,2
randomize matrix 1,50.0
set ambient light 100
x#=1200:z#=800
sync on
load object "soldado20.3ds",1
position object 1,1200,120,1200
scale object 1,40,40,40
do
rem Controla la cámara con las teclas de flechas(alante y atras )
if upkey()=1 then x#=newxvalue(x#,a#,10) : z#=newzvalue(z#,a#,10)
if downkey()=1 then x#=newxvalue(x#,a#,-10) : z#=newzvalue(z#,a#,-10)
if rightkey()=1 THEN x#=NEWXVALUE(x#,a#-90,-8)
if rightkey()=1 then z#=NEWZVALUE(z#,a#-90,-8)
a#=wrapvalue(a#+mousemovex()/2)
cam#=wrapvalue(cam#+mousemovey()/2)
position camera x#,150,z#

`limitamos el subir y bajar la cabeza con el raton(vista de camara)
if cam#<=290 and cam#>180 then cam#=290
if cam#>=70 and cam#<180 then cam#=70
rotate camera cam#,a#,0

move object 1,-2
r#=wrapvalue(r#+0.3)

yrotate object 1,r#
for ani=1 to 20
hide limb 1,ani
next ani
loop object 1,1,20
f=object frame(1)
show limb 1,f
set object speed 1,15

sync
loop

+ Code Snippet

autocam off:hide mouse
make matrix 1,10000.0,10000.0,25,25
load bitmap "floor1.bmp",1
get image 1,1,1,100,100
delete bitmap 1
prepare matrix texture 1,1,2,2
randomize matrix 1,50.0
set ambient light 100
x#=1200:z#=800
sync on
load object "soldado20.3ds",1
position object 1,1200,120,1200
scale object 1,40,40,40
do
rem Controla la cámara con las teclas de flechas(alante y atras )
if upkey()=1 then x#=newxvalue(x#,a#,10) : z#=newzvalue(z#,a#,10)
if downkey()=1 then x#=newxvalue(x#,a#,-10) : z#=newzvalue(z#,a#,-10)
if rightkey()=1 THEN x#=NEWXVALUE(x#,a#-90,-8)
if rightkey()=1 then z#=NEWZVALUE(z#,a#-90,-8)
a#=wrapvalue(a#+mousemovex()/2)
cam#=wrapvalue(cam#+mousemovey()/2)
position camera x#,150,z#

`limitamos el subir y bajar la cabeza con el raton(vista de camara)
if cam#<=290 and cam#>180 then cam#=290
if cam#>=70 and cam#<180 then cam#=70
rotate camera cam#,a#,0

move object 1,-2
r#=wrapvalue(r#+0.3)

yrotate object 1,r#
for ani=1 to 20
hide limb 1,ani
next ani
loop object 1,1,20
f=object frame(1)
show limb 1,f
set object speed 1,15

sync
loop

oh my god

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Posted: 8th Apr 2008 13:39 Edited at: 8th Apr 2008 13:44

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Quote: "Anyway...you can not write non existing comands like:
save object animation...
"

??? it works for me... it just saves the animation as an x file... im using version "1.14 enhanced".

yes please can you send it as a .zip please.

when i say invisible i meen that its loaded but when i point the camera at it (point camera object position x(1),point camera object position y(1),point camera object position z(1))its not there... well i cant see it any way... ive also tried scaling it up and colouring it.

thanks.

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Posted: 8th Apr 2008 23:04

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Hey ive just downloaded blender havent had a looked at it yet but i was wondering if you know any good tutorials for it...

thanks

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chafari

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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 02:29

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Hallo Code eater. I don´t know about a tutorial for blender but I suppose that you can find around the net.

I didn´t heard about new version 1.14, as I,v been with Darkbasic pro time ago.

I send you the code in a zip file...and let´s see if you can open it this time ...good luck

oh my god

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Latch

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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 06:44

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@Code Eater

Quote: "Ive had a try at animating in darkbasic its self and it seems rather tricky...

i did it by making a box for the body and a box for the arm. then making a mesh from the arm and deleting the object of the arm. i then attached the mesh to the main body object as a limb. i then wrote a few for...to commands to make the animation then played it is this the way to do it?"

The way you did it works, but it's a bit redundant. The purpose of a keyframe is to set the FINAL position of a series of frames at a particular time. What I mean is, let's say the entire animation was 100 frames long. You might have 6 keyframes set at 20 frame intervals. Maybe frames 0,20,40,60,80,100 are the keyframes. What this does is help you from not having to plot the positions of all your limbs 100 times, but only those final positions at the key frames.

DBC will then interpolate (figure out computationally) the frames in between the key frames. Take a look at my example a couple of posts earlier in this thread. The animation of both characters is 40 frames long but I only use 5 keyframes.

Here's a version of your example that uses 3 keyframes:

+ Code Snippet

sync on
sync rate 60
autocam off

make object cube 1,25
make object box 2,25,5,5
offset limb 2,0,25,0,0
make mesh from object 1,2
delete object 2

add limb 1,1,1
rotate limb 1,1,0,0,45
set object keyframe 1,0
rotate limb 1,1,0,0,0
set object keyframe 1,10
rotate limb 1,1,0,0,45
set object keyframe 1,19

loop object 1

position camera 0,0,-100
sync

The method chafari used was a little different. He's presenting the illusion of a mesh deformation technique where it can appear that the vertices can warp and the mesh can bend. Instead of actually animating a series of limbs through rotation and positional interpolation, chafari is creating a separate mesh for each frame of the animation (much like a cartoon or a movie). He is storing each mesh as it's own limb, and then cycling through the limbs showing the current one and hiding the rest. This is basically "page flipping". DBPro supports an interpolated method where the mesh can deform and you could just set keyframes. DBC does not. Chafari's method sort of bridges that gap but at the price of multiple copies of the same mesh - one for every frame.

Quote: "Hey ive just downloaded blender havent had a looked at it yet but i was wondering if you know any good tutorials for it..."

There should be a bunch of tutorials on the main Blender website.

Enjoy your day.

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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 11:49

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Oh really? I didnt know darkbasic could fill in the gaps between the frames... it does that in Gamespace as well...

that should make it easier...

Quote: "There should be a bunch of tutorials on the main Blender website.
"

Yer but i could only find one on animating which ive watched but it only tells you about animation a cube spining and moving not like how to animate a model.

i will keep looking.

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Latch

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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 17:12

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Take a look at:

http://www.cdschools.org/54223045235521/blank/browse.asp?A=383&BMDRN=2000&BCOB=0&C=55205

Scroll down the page and look at chapter 14 specifically. Should give you an idea of how DBC animation can be done in Blender.

Enjoy your day.

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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 19:04

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blender doesn’t seem to work all to great...

1. When ever i put my mouse over the toolbars at the bottom it shows the banner thing that comes up when you start it...

2. when i switch to shading buttons (shortcut f7) and then change to object buttons(f5) the shading thing appears behind the buttons and some of the buttons that should be there are invisible but when i put my mouse over where they would be they appear...
3. When I save the saving box half disappears and then comes back when i mouseover that sort of area...

I have a word document explaining further.

I will look at the tutorial sounds great thanks.

Thanks

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Posted: 9th Apr 2008 20:13

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Also is it posible to load 2 models at the same time because if i have one loaded and import another they kind of jointogether and i can move one on its own. and when i have one open and open another the other one disappears.

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Latch

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Posted: 10th Apr 2008 19:51 Edited at: 10th Apr 2008 19:57

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I haven't needed to upgrade Blender since version 2.41 so there may be bugs in 2.45 - I don't really know. Though, some of the symptoms you describe may be because of OpenGL settings on your graphics card. Blender 3d uses OpenGL quite extensively so you may want to be sure your graphics card is optimized to use OpenGL. You may need the newest drivers as well.

You may also need to tweak some of the settings in Blender. You can do this by pointing the mouse at the line between the grid and the very top menu until a double sided arrow appears. Click and hold the left mouse button and drag downward. This should reveal a series of controls to help set up Blender. I've included a screen shot.

As far as objects combining, make sure you are in Object Mode and that no object is selected before loading in a new one. Use the A key to toggle selection all/none. Also if you click on the grid with the left button, it will reposition the little crosshair. This will be where any new objects are inserted.

Enjoy your day.

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chafari

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Posted: 10th Apr 2008 22:06

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Hallo again friends.... As Latch says ...the method I show here by hiding and showing limbs, cost some frames somehow...but what we have to do, is work with low poly models and use the tecnic just for the limbs that are goint to be animated...

Example... we can make a soldat in just one mesh from waist to head, carrying a gun, and some others meshes for the feets in order to avoid so many verter...just animated limbs must have a group of meshes. So if we take care to repit just the model parts for this animated areas, we gain speed.

We can add so many limb as we need, and just say:
loop object soldat 1,5 // the soldat run
loop object soldat 6,16 // the soldat walk
loop object soldat 17,20 // jump etc etc....

I hope you can find it useful for DBC.

cheers.

oh my god

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Libervurto

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Posted: 11th Apr 2008 05:52

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i'm gonna throw a spanner in the works and suggest mesh deformation using memblocks

I never got far enough to make anything more than a humble triangle with a memblock
it will be my first project when i get a pc!

Ößësê

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Latch

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Posted: 11th Apr 2008 20:19 Edited at: 11th Apr 2008 23:21

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Quote: "i'm gonna throw a spanner in the works and suggest mesh deformation using memblocks "

This starts to get more complex - beyond using 3d programs to make one's meshes for each frame. It could be done with some work.

[EDIT]
I'm assuming you mean writing your own animator/interpolator that moves the vertices of the mesh around.

Enjoy your day.

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chafari

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Posted: 11th Apr 2008 22:41

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Hallo Latch. If we have an animated object by bones,and we want to make differents meshes poses of the object, we need just to export to a folder every frame to .x o 3ds...then when we are in 3D program, we just need to import each mesh from 1 to end of animation...probably we´ll got more than 20 limbs , so we have to be carefull and prepare the model limb and taking care of renaming every mesh to 1-2-3 and so on (if possible in low poly), and finally export again to .x o 3ds . At the end, we will have a model with all different keyframes looking like a prety mesh.
Then by the tecnic I mentioned we got the animation ready

No more than 30 minutes for sure !

cheers.

oh my god

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Latch

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Posted: 11th Apr 2008 23:18

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@chafari
Good idea!

And if the 3d modeling/animation program can use scripts or automation, you could program it to step through the animation and save each frame as it's own mesh automatically.

Does DBpro save meshes in Direct X format? If so, you could write a program that does exactly what you said using any imported model with animation. Each frame could be stepped through, the object converted to a mesh, then the mesh saved in Direct X format. After each frame has been output, load the objects back in and make them into limbs for one main object. Then a final export in direct x format of the model and all it's limbs for use with DBC.

Enjoy your day.

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chafari

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Posted: 11th Apr 2008 23:33

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yep...I,v done it before...I have made some differents meshes from the main object directly from Dbpro, and it works great !... that is what I try to explain, and as you can load all meshes and add as limbs, you can finally prepare the object with just Dbpro.

I,v got a piece of code that makes all that....it´s something like an pose creator, and save all meshes while we press spacebar with a different number.

I have to say, that all this is possible starting with a ready object prepared in Max and Dbpro code just change limb rotations ,positions and scaling as we need.

cheers.

oh my god

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Posted: 13th Apr 2008 20:55 Edited at: 13th Apr 2008 20:59

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Ive instaled blender on another pc and it works great do you knoew a python scrypt to export to dbc?

@chafari

Sounds good. so all you would be doing is writing a program (with dbpro) that will load a model that uses skeletal deformation and then save it as what dbc needs.

thanks for all the help guys

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chafari

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Posted: 13th Apr 2008 22:11

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Hallo Code eatar.well...not exactly....what I do, is just manipulate from Dbpro, an existing object created by bones from Max o other program. As Dbc can´t load animated objects, it was just a trick to make something that looks like mdl.

cheers.

oh my god

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Latch

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Posted: 13th Apr 2008 22:55

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Quote: "Ive instaled blender on another pc and it works great do you knoew a python scrypt to export to dbc?"

Here's one I wrote a couple of years back. I haven't updated it or the site since I originally posted it though there are a couple of updates to the script; so the texturing may be off a bit. Read the FAQs and the documentation. The whole site is a bit wordy so be prepared!

If you have any questions, I'll try to answer them.

Blender to DBC

Enjoy your day.

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TheComet

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Posted: 14th Apr 2008 09:19

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@latch

I have used that cool script a lot, but there are some problems:

-The uv textures are back to front.
-It can`t export "donuts" or any 3d tubes shaped into a circle
-There is a cube in the middle of the object

A few months ago, you said you should re-write the script. Have you done that yet?
That would be great!

TheComet

Oooooops!!! I accidentally formated drive c.

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Latch

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Posted: 14th Apr 2008 10:45

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Quote: "A few months ago, you said you should re-write the script. Have you done that yet?
That would be great!"

I've gotten so little feedback or show of interest in the script, I haven't spent any time to make any official updates for release. I may...
The texturing bug I'm aware of can be worked out using blender's UV options. You have to be pretty good at Blender to be able to manipulate the texture coordinates to your liking. However, there are a couple of simple settings in general that will help - like sphere mapping, cube mapping, tube mapping, or cylinder mapping. You have to know what you want to apply, and you may have to adjust the texture scale and position a little. There's also individual face texturing... Also be aware that the front of the object is opposite in Blender than it is in DBC (direct x). It is in the -y direction on Blender which is switched to the +z direction in DBC.

Quote: "It can`t export "donuts" or any 3d tubes shaped into a circle"

Any curves, surfaces, NURBS, and what not, have to be converted to a mesh before export. I don't think I talk about it in the DOCs as I hadn't really thought about it until you mentioned it. I always did that automatically (that's why I need some feedback from users).
Once they are converted, they should export fine. When the curve or surface is selected, use the TAB key to switch to Object Mode. Then either use the Object menu: Object > Convert Object Type or press ALT+A.

Quote: "-There is a cube in the middle of the object"

Whenever Blender is started, there is a default cube that appears at 0,0,0. This is part of Blender and you can choose for this not happen, I can't remember how though at the moment. If you add objects without deleting it, it will be part of the scene. So when you start Blender, press X and choose yes to delete the object if wish.

Enjoy your day.

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Posted: 14th Apr 2008 19:21

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thanks, coolio ill give it a try. ive never tried this but i think you can scroll the texture of an object in dbc so if its back to front you could probably just do it quite easily. i might just be talking rubish

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Posted: 15th Apr 2008 21:48

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how do i get it to run?

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Latch

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Posted: 16th Apr 2008 00:17

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Do you mean how do you playback the animation in Blender? ATL+A

But hopefully you limited your number of frames. The default is 1 to 250. If you didn't limit them, it will run through all 250 (most of which would probably be the last keyframe you entered).

Enjoy your day.

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Posted: 16th Apr 2008 19:55

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Quote: "Do you mean how do you playback the animation in Blender? ATL+A
"

No sorry i ment the script to change it to DBC

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DarkBASIC Discussion / animation problems

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