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DarkBASIC Discussion / Before It's too late...

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Irojo
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Posted: 9th Jul 2008 17:32
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Hi guys, I've been programming with DBC for about 6 months now, and before I start getting into it's specialized code, I want to know: Should I switch to DB Pro? What's the advantages to it?


Thanks,
Irojo

I have mad skills. I can make a dot follow your mouse in 2d. Don't try and tell me someone has done that before.
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Zeus
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Posted: 9th Jul 2008 17:44
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Personally, DBC is best with 2d. DBP is best if you want 3d and business applications. I recommend DBC because I think personally it is easier to use.

When Chuck Norris goes to a gas station, he doesn't pay them $4.09 a gallon, they pay him $4.09 a gallon.
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sinisterstuf
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Posted: 9th Jul 2008 18:38
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I have never used DBC but I hear it only needs DirectX 7 or something... Not sure.
I really enjoy using DBpro and I think it's the best. Never having tried the other one though, I wouldn't be able to say which is easier. DBpro requires DirectX 9 compatible graphics card for you to run it's exes. Even if there is no 3D in your program. Almost anything more than PRINT commands causes the program to close on a lesser graphics card because the "hardware does not support it". This is all as far as I know.
I would recommend DBpro.

No, contrary to popular belief my name is not actually 'Sinister Stuff' but 'sinisterstuf', a misspelling resulting from the latter having too many characters with no spaces in between

oh well
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Irojo
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Posted: 9th Jul 2008 19:31
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Thanks for the input guys. If I wanted to make a living off it, which would I go with?

I urge you to watch the film "Who killed the electric car". Support electric cars! Did you know their used to be more electric cars then gassoline cars?
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TDK
Retired Moderator
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Posted: 10th Jul 2008 00:52
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Quote: "If I wanted to make a living off it, which would I go with?"


Delphi or C++.

TDK_Man

* TDK's Game Programming Forums - Open To All - DB & Team Request Boards *

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Irojo
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Posted: 10th Jul 2008 01:03
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but c++ is so complicated.

Ok thanks for your input. I'm sticking with DBC. (surprise!)

I urge you to watch the film "Who killed the electric car". Support electric cars! Did you know their used to be more electric cars then gassoline cars?
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Sinani201
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Posted: 10th Jul 2008 01:16
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DBC is good, DBP is better, but I personally think it's a ripoff.

If you want to go BIG, then use DBP. I think there's a special deal for upgrading from DBC to DBP.


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Irojo
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Posted: 10th Jul 2008 01:31
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Thanks Sinani.

I urge you to watch the film "Who killed the electric car". Support electric cars! Did you know their used to be more electric cars then gassoline cars?
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TDK
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Posted: 10th Jul 2008 16:32
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Quote: "but c++ is so complicated"


Agreed. But Delphi is a lot, lot closer to Basic than C++ as it's Pascal. Here's a small example of Delphi:



Although this code is made up, it is legitimate Delphi code and as you can see, it's not all that different to DB.

Delphi is a RAD language and is primarily for writing non-games Windows applications - and there's more chance of making a living with Windows apps than with games - the reason I suggested it. I wasn't being sarcastic - just honest.

You can download free versions of Delphi and if enough people are interested in learning it I can make a download available of an earlier version of Delphi on my web site and make a few intro tutorials.

TDK_Man

* TDK's Game Programming Forums - Open To All - DB & Team Request Boards *

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Irojo
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Posted: 10th Jul 2008 20:31
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That IS close to Basic... How do you know all these different codes? Don't you get confused?

I urge you to watch the film "Who killed the electric car". Support electric cars! Did you know their used to be more electric cars then gassoline cars?
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LBFN
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Posted: 12th Jul 2008 17:42
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I like and use both DBC and DBP. From what I have seen, on a program that will run in both, DBP will run it lightning fast as compared to DBC (because of the reason WK listed). However, with very large programs, you have an annoying wait while DBP compiles the code. In a game I am working on (8937 lines of code), it takes about 45 seconds to compile and another 10 seconds or so for the first screen to show up. This may not sound like much, but when you run and test it 20 times in a programming session, it gets a little aggravating (esp. if you have been working on it for months), when all you have done is tweak something a little bit and you want to see how it reacts.

I like the globals, types and animated sprites of DBP. I like the CLI in DBC much better and generally, I would say DBC is easier to use, but DBP is much more powerful.

There are some commercial programs that are made with DBC, but real world is that you will probably need C++ for games and you had better be really good in order to make it.

Good luck with whatever you end up doing,

LB

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Ed222
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Posted: 12th Jul 2008 19:12
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@LBFN
Quote: "takes about 45 seconds to compile and another 10 seconds or so for the first screen to show up"

I had experience that too it's not too bad once you get used to it.

@Sinani201
Quote: "I think there's a special deal for upgrading from DBC to DBP"

They don't have one

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Dark Dragon
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Posted: 13th Jul 2008 05:41
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D....B...C....
its way easier
its far 2der(ummm....)
its just uhh...

whatever, i'd say get to know them both and then choose like i did.

AM I UGLY OR WHAT??!!
What? It's My Sig!!...
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Sinani201
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Posted: 13th Jul 2008 21:59
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Quote: "D....B...C....
its way easier
its far 2der(ummm....)
its just uhh..."

Nah, PlayBasic is the best for "2Ders"


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Stig Design Stig Magne
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2008 02:11
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I think that DarkBasicPro are like pro in 3D but one thing that i have notised is that if you want to test your code in DBC it does so fast but if you do it in DBPro it makes the project to a .exe befor it Been showing result`s of what you have programmed But that is the i have notised in the DBPro Demo/Trial

sorry for the bad wrighting

Stig Design (Free Games,Sources,Textures,Photo`s)
Lisence Free at http://StigDesign.piczo.com
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Bluestar4
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Posted: 10th Aug 2008 19:18
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I have personally tested DBC,DB-PRO,and Dark GDK,
my results are as follows :
fastest framerates at run time of a compiled exe goes to the to GDk coupled with the c++2008 compiler
second place goes to db-pro
and last place goes to dbc -
it should also be noted that speed wise, db-pro outperformed dbc in a massive way , however, both db-pro and visual c+2008 require you to have directX 9 (august). now , if you have a pc that has any other version get ready because you will be updating to that speciffic version.

compatibility :
dbc takes 1st place on compatibility as its exes will both compile and run on systems that have dx7 dx8 ,dx9a,dx9b,dx9c and even on vista machines without requiring a massive overhal of the system. I cant say that about db-pro or c++2008(which requires additional .net components to be installed) so if your goal is for your game to actually be playalbe on a large amount of systems I would have to say go with dbc.

compile times - I also noted longer compile times with db-pro in certain situations

projects - dbc seems much simpler when it comes to handling projects because at the end of the day you only need to deal with archving one file providing that your entire source code is in that file by itself.

Sutter Soft
http://www.geocities.com/suttersoft
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Rhymer
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Posted: 12th Aug 2008 17:18
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Is dark basic better than fps creator x10

http://www.narutohq.com/sprites.phpNaruto Sprite
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Bluestar4
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 14:38
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better? the right tool for the right job Rymer. Take a careful look at what its made for, its system requirements,compatibility issues of created exes, and then compare that with your projects goal then ask yourself "Is it the right tool for my project ?" If the answer is yes then thats what you need to use , if its no you should consider an alternative.

Sutter Soft
http://www.geocities.com/suttersoft
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Irojo
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 18:03
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And he hijacks threads too!

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Sixty Squares
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 18:12
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Quote: "And he hijacks threads too!"


Well now I believe he is banned for a week.

Snow Demo
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Irojo
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 18:15
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I can hear bells!

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Bluestar4
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 19:21
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Quote: "Well now I believe he is banned for a week."


who are you refering to , why and how ? hopefully not me

Sutter Soft
http://www.geocities.com/suttersoft
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NanoGamez guy
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 20:30
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http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=135123&b=10


On the other hand, you have different fingers.
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Ed222
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 20:50 Edited at: 13th Aug 2008 21:06
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Quote: "Hi guys, I've been programming with DBC for about 6 months now, and before I start getting into it's specialized code, I want to know: Should I switch to DB Pro? What's the advantages to it?"

Heres my opinion you should switch to dbp once you get used to DBC commands. Dbp has some features that DBC didn't have to help make games easier such as a create animated sprite command and play sprite command these have helped me alot through making my game. It also features a few more text commands such as left$,right$,mid$,len$ these commands will help you in extracting strings. And theres also no need to buy a Enhancement Pack to unlock all the commands because most all the commands are available to start off with(except some are now
obsolete).In addition DBP can also be extended beyond it orginal limits by adding plugins your games will also run faster thanks to the assembly compiler.
BTW those are just some of the commands to list them all would take too long also this avoided most of the 3d commands because I havn't used them yet.

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Bluestar4
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 21:35
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dbc has these same commands for text, one must however look for them in the included manual. It is true that db-pro is more exspandable and has more commands that are not in dbc, but in some cases such as particle effects and getting distances between two objects equivelent commands can be programmed into the source code if the user has the exsperiance to do so and actually takes the time to do it.

Sutter Soft
http://www.geocities.com/suttersoft
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Phaelax
DBPro Master
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 00:06
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Quote: "D....B...C....
its way easier
its far 2der(ummm....)"


DBP is better in every way. It's faster, more features, better support, more expandable. Anyone who claims DBC is better at 2D than DBP obviously doesn't know what they're talking about.

Unless you're unable to afford DBP or your target system can't run DX9(which is pretty standard today) then there's no reason not to go with DBP. What's my opinion based on? I've used DB for about 8 years now and still alternate between both versions. I mainly use DBC for supporting others and doing the DBC challenges.


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Irojo
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 01:24
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I fit the req for DBpro, and I can afford it, but (this is kind of sad/funny) honestly, I don't like how it looks. It's white, and it's a window. I like the way Dark Basic Classic is black, and full screen. It makes it easier to focus.

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LBFN
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 01:58
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Quote: "It's white,"


Quote: "I like the way Dark Basic Classic is black, and full screen."
Hehe, most people hate that screen. DarkEdit, which I use for DBC coding, is similar to the standard DBP editor.



You can customize the DBP editor screen and text (to some degree) to fit your taste.

There are other IDE's available for DBP also.

LB

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Bluestar4
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 02:03
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Quote: " Anyone who claims DBC is better at 2D than DBP obviously doesn't know what they're talking about."

I aggree on this one. I have done two 2d games using dbc and in both of them had to work around some of the bugs that deal with sprites

Sutter Soft
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Irojo
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 02:35
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I can customize it!? Sweet. I'll have to get DBpro. But first, where can I find my direct x data, so I know oif it fits the requirement?

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Phaelax
DBPro Master
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 06:09
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Click on your Start menu and goto "Run" and type in "dxdiag" then hit OK. The first tab "system" will give the info you need. If you don't have DirectX 9c then you can always update it, unless you have a really old computer.

I hated the DBC editor, stuck at a 640x480 resolution. I wasn't even confined to that in the days when I did Pascal.


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Irojo
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 07:47
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Excellent thanks Phaelax! 9.0c

Haha, I seem to be the only person who prefers the dbc editor.

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BN2 Productions
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 09:12
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Nope, I do too! The only annoying thing is that it can't be windowed, which would be nice when I instant message people while coding.

Ever notice how in Microsoft word, the word "microsoft" is auto corrected to be "Microsoft" but "macintosh" just gets the dumb red underline?
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Irojo
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 18:02
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That's some serious multi tasking.

Do you have DBpro? And how do you feel about it if you do?

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tha_rami
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 20:16
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For some reason, every truely amazing game besides Geisha House seems to be made in DarkBASIC Classic (Soulhunter, Starwraith/Riftspace/Arvoch/Evochron, Dream) - however, I feel that is because those people are really good at their stuff.

I think that starting with DBC and learning to live with its shortcomings as a new programming will give you the right mindset to program with 'limited resources' in DBP.

Yes, DBP has more options and yes, DBP will run faster. No, I still prefer DBC although I've started working in DarkBASIC Pro as well. I think it's a case of the right tool for the job.


A mod has been erased by your signature because it was larger than 600x120
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Ed222
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 21:27 Edited at: 14th Aug 2008 21:40
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Quote: "Hehe, most people hate that screen. DarkEdit, which I use for DBC coding"

I hated that screen but I stuck with it(until I moved on to DBP) because it was the only one that had context sensitive help another reason I hated it was because of the ide Background it was black if you stare at all day long along with the poor resoltion not to metion having to make sure you typed in the right command because the ide didn't highlight the words your eyes are going to hurt alot when you done.
[edit]
heres a better example of ide highlighting in dbp if you type in a command correctly it should be highlighted blue if you type in a string it should be in purple if it's a remark or you use this ` it'll be in grey if you type in a variable it'll be in black if you type in a number it'll be in green.Btw the colors are changeable too.


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BN2 Productions
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 22:23
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Quote: "Do you have DBpro? And how do you feel about it if you do?"


I don't. My friend did and I used to mess around on it sometimes. The user interface WAS nice, but it didn't make up for the fact that there is a whole skill to make it compile quickly. Sometimes it would take me 5 minutes to compile then in dbc it took 5 seconds. So I mean yeah its nice, but it was also equally frustrating.

The extra commands I didn't use much because I was already used to DBC. I did like that the help browser could be opened multiple times, but I missed being able to close it with f11 (I know, stupid reason not to like, but it gets annoying doing everything with the keyboard and then you need the mouse to close the help).

So most of it is just a matter of preference. Unfortunately you can't compile in the free trial so you can't really get a full feel for all of it, just the ide.

The big loss in my opinion are the compiling times.

Ever notice how in Microsoft word, the word "microsoft" is auto corrected to be "Microsoft" but "macintosh" just gets the dumb red underline?
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Ed222
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 22:45
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Quote: "The big loss in my opinion are the compiling times"

yes but you'll get use to it after a while also it makes up with it gamespeed.

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