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AppGameKit Studio Chat / Navmeshes in Studio?

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Tobias_Ripper
11
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Joined: 24th Mar 2013
Location: REPCONN inc.
Posted: 22nd Oct 2019 02:46 Edited at: 22nd Oct 2019 18:20
Hey fellas. Long time.

Any plans on getting Navmeshes into Studio? Every engine and their dog / mother has one.

And if not navmeshes, then how do you fellas handle enemy and npcs walking around an environment that's not simply a flat surface? For example caves, terrain, hills and pathways.
Eisenstadt Studio: Eisenstadtstudio.com
Composers Page: Milesthatch.net
Tobias_Ripper
11
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Joined: 24th Mar 2013
Location: REPCONN inc.
Posted: 31st Oct 2019 01:44 Edited at: 31st Oct 2019 01:45
Bump.

Sooooo just wondering, aside from a couple of guys who have tried creating their own, nobody is interested in having navmeshes in their games?
Eisenstadt Studio: Eisenstadtstudio.com
Composers Page: Milesthatch.net
Zigi
14
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Joined: 5th Jul 2009
Location:
Posted: 1st Nov 2019 20:43 Edited at: 1st Nov 2019 20:45
Quote: "nobody is interested in having navmeshes in their games?"

I've been requesting it since day 1. It is just not happening. Nothing is happening actually. Studio is dead in my opinion or TGC working hard on Studio 2 or AppGameKit 3.
Can't wait to see which one it is. Going to be extremely disappointed if it is going to be just an other maintenance release or even worst, just nothing.
Santman
12
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Joined: 15th Sep 2011
Location: Inverness
Posted: 3rd Nov 2019 02:19
What's a Navmesh???
Qugurun
Valued Member
9
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Joined: 8th Dec 2014
Playing: AppGameKit
Posted: 3rd Nov 2019 03:56 Edited at: 3rd Nov 2019 03:56
to Santman
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navigation_mesh
https://www.instagram.com/qugurun/
Ortu
DBPro Master
16
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Joined: 21st Nov 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posted: 3rd Nov 2019 04:00
A mesh used for ai navigation in 3d space
http://games.joshkirklin.com/sulium

A single player RPG featuring a branching, player driven storyline of meaningful choices and multiple endings alongside challenging active combat and intelligent AI.
Santman
12
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Joined: 15th Sep 2011
Location: Inverness
Posted: 3rd Nov 2019 10:49
Ah, got you.

So basically, a* in 3d. I took a different approach, I just scanned my maps to create an automatic a* array that could be used.

What's so difficult in producing a nav mesh?
janbo
15
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Joined: 10th Nov 2008
Location: Germany
Posted: 3rd Nov 2019 14:01 Edited at: 3rd Nov 2019 14:06
For A* you don't require a Grid you can take any Grapth also Meshes to navigate on them
I recommend this site: Red Blob Games
I guess you can get away with manually creating the Navmesh for your levels...Generating them makes problems most of the time anyway and you need someone to look over it and remove wrong parts.
Xaby
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
16
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Joined: 17th Apr 2007
Location: Berlin
Posted: 8th Nov 2019 11:03
So maybe for that we would also need something like an editor for 3D than?

Xaby
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
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Joined: 17th Apr 2007
Location: Berlin
Posted: 8th Nov 2019 11:12
@Zigi,

for me it was fine with App Game Kit Studio and the 2D editor integration they tried. And also the preview of 3D objects and textures.
But the 2D editor is not enough for bigger projects, so I have to still write my own.
And with the last update they only support Android 4.4, so that makes no sense for me at all, because my main focus was the OUYA. And App Game Kit was the best choice for that. But the OUYA only has Android 4.1
So I use a version before.

And the other thing is the Particle Editor. I don't really know, what is that for. It is about the same price as App Game Kit or GameGuru or both on Sale. It is only a PlugIn not standalone, but we have no propper 3D environment editor, so for all the other things I still have to write my own editor.
The effects are looking nice, but for whom is that? It is an overload for 2D and 2.5D and in 3D we have other things to solve before.

Like all the problems with animations. Or deforming meshes. Maybe there will be a big update and we get something like Unreal or Unity, but a 3D Particle editor, I don't get it. 15,- $ okay, but 40,- $ at this point, when other things are more important.
BHoltzman
21
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Joined: 29th Aug 2002
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Posted: 14th Nov 2019 01:48
@Xaby: Yeah, I was wondering the same thing. I'm not sure how a 3d particle editor fits in with a 2d game editor. I'm probably just not understanding the use case.
GaborD
6
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Joined: 3rd Dec 2017
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Posted: 14th Nov 2019 04:17 Edited at: 14th Nov 2019 04:21
Two separate things, not really connected. The particle editor was in development before Studio was announced, was originally planned as an addon for what is now Classic. (it works with both versions).
TGC didn't develop the particle editor, the whole line of "more important things to do" reasoning makes no sense in this case.

As to navmeshes that can handle any 3D geometry, you'd kinda really need an editor for a solid implementation, agree to Xaby in that regard.
Auto-generation from loaded and pieced together scene geometry tends to create subpar results, especially for games that have quite a bit of verticality. You need something editor-ish for tweaking, fixing auto-gen issues and adding custom paths/jumps/ladders etc.
I am sure it can be solved, even without a fully editor driven workflow, but it would take some effort.
Zigi
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Joined: 5th Jul 2009
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Posted: 17th Nov 2019 16:33 Edited at: 17th Nov 2019 16:36
Quote: "Two separate things, not really connected. The particle editor was in development before Studio was announced, was originally planned as an addon for what is now Classic."

But this is my problem. Why released as an addon or DLC if it got nothing to do with AppGameKit other than generating Tier1 code? Why TGC did not released this as a 3rd party tool that export to AppGameKit or why didn't you(?) released on itch.io?
It is not that difficult, you can upload anything to itch.io and tell them to pay the money directly to your PayPal, job done. Why TGC and why as an addon? I honestly don't get it.
It makes no sense to me to make DLC's like this that do not integrate with the base product in any ways, only export in a compatible format. I don't like this strategy.

Quote: "As to navmeshes that can handle any 3D geometry, you'd kinda really need an editor for a solid implementation"

Regarding navmesh, Studio do have a 2D level editor and we could use some paths and pathfinding also in 2D not only 3D. Maybe the OP was referring to 3D as everyone else, but hello Studio is a 2D first development tool at the moment.

But frankly, I think Studio is done, and the level editor is done. I have received the latest news letter and the only thing they mention is that new bug fixes are coming. Very exciting.
For a very long time they don't even bother to at least flag bug reports and requests on github related to the level editor. The GitHub issue tracker for Studio and especially for the level editor is becoming an ever growing mess.
Of course I could be wrong. Maybe there is something in the making but I don't get it why TGC is not open about their plans. Like they announced Studio out of the blue without ever asking what we need and how and now the level editor that is integrated is OK at best, it is not great at all and even though we have it, I can't even say it is great, I would still prefer using Tiled for 2D levels and not the one bundled with Studio which should be not the case. The idea to use a 3rd party level editor when we have one built-in is ridiculous but REAL!
Ortu
DBPro Master
16
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Joined: 21st Nov 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posted: 17th Nov 2019 17:33
Quote: "Why TGC did not released this as a 3rd party tool that export to AppGameKit"


Isn't that basically what they did? You you can get it straight from tgc, but also providing it as DLC is an obvious choice for the benefits that steam provides.

Quote: "hello Studio is a 2D first development tool at the moment."


Because that has been the focus, and will only ever remain the focus with your line of thinking. I would love to see more focus on 3d, and any plugins or dlcs that focus on 3d are highly welcomed in my view even if they don't have much benefit for the current 2d focused users.

Frankly, it already provides just about anything you could need to work in 2d. There is still a lot of untapped potential that it doesn't yet cover for 3d

The common complaint about anything that doesn't benefit or support 2d on the lowest spec mobile device is silly and holds the platform back.
http://games.joshkirklin.com/sulium

A single player RPG featuring a branching, player driven storyline of meaningful choices and multiple endings alongside challenging active combat and intelligent AI.

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