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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / The future for DB Pro ?

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DrFloyd
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Joined: 12th Feb 2021
Location:
Posted: 13th Feb 2021 16:01
Hello

I am back with DARK BASIC Pro... and happy !

Thinking that DB wad dead since... 10... 15 years.... I discover it again by chance

So I have a question :

Why DB Pro is so discreet ? As for me it is the BEST WORLD BASIC for 2D, still in 2021, esy and powerfull
PURE BASIC is great but a little complex
RC BASIC is great but interface + compilation are perfectible (lot of DLL)
GFA 32 is great (but special)

On google, on forums, on facebook, on twitter, nobody speak about DB... but about QB64, Free Basic, Liberty Basic, Pure Basic....

It should be highlighted by THEGAMECRETORS ! Lot of people prefer this kind of basic... AppGameKit is not for me, it's not basic.

What is the future for DB Pro ? Still updates coming ? I hope...
Ortu
DBPro Master
13
Years of Service
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Joined: 21st Nov 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posted: 13th Feb 2021 17:27
No official updates will be coming, DBPro has been fully deprecated by TGC and it has been turned over to the community as open source.

I still use it and it is still one of my favorite languages for graphics. It has its quirks and limitations, but also a lot of advantages with an absolute wealth of plugins, code samples, and knowledge still available here in these forums.
http://games.joshkirklin.com/sulium

A single player RPG featuring a branching, player driven storyline of meaningful choices and multiple endings alongside challenging active combat and intelligent AI.
Bored of the Rings
16
Years of Service
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Joined: 25th Feb 2005
Location: Middle Earth
Posted: 13th Feb 2021 18:56 Edited at: 13th Feb 2021 18:56
I still use it alongside c+ and there are tons of plugins. It's pretty fast and easy to use. This guy has done some pretty awesome stuff with it.
http://www.evolved-software.com/
Professional Programmer, languages: SAS, C++, SQL, PL-SQL, DBPro, Purebasic, JavaScript, others
chafari
Valued Member
15
Years of Service
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Joined: 2nd May 2006
Location: Canary Islands
Posted: 13th Feb 2021 21:03
Hi there . Glad to see some old friend around ....
I still use it to do quick tests of my functions to apply them later in Agk or other languages .

Cheers.
I'm not a grumpy grandpa
Raven
16
Years of Service
Recently Online
Joined: 23rd Mar 2005
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 14th Feb 2021 00:46
Quote: "Why DB Pro is so discreet ? As for me it is the BEST WORLD BASIC for 2D, still in 2021, esy and powerfull"


Dark BASIC Professional was retired by TheGameCreators in 2009., but essentially had abandoned it in Autumn 2007 (when Update 7.7 was released).
Then in 2012 it was made Open Source along with a Free to Download & Use with the Activation System By-Passed & Disabled., along with the source to all of the internally developed plug-ins that they also provide with the pre-built version.

From there it was essentially left in the hands on the Community to "Continue Development"., the problem is by that point most of the community had been left in the dark and cold for too long... they'd moved on.
So there really wasn't much of a Community (or at least not those with the Time or Skills) to really delve into "Fixing" DBP and keep it alive through Community Support.
I think had TGC made it Open Source immediately... well the situation would've probably been different.



Quote: "PURE BASIC is great but a little complex"


Pure BASIC is actually more or less C with a BASIC like Syntax., but how they chose to implement that syntax is what makes it needlessly unintuitive.
It's a great language and frankly THE Fastest BASIC that presently exists... the thing is it's more-or-less JUST the Language, and the strange take on BASIC somewhat makes it a little redundant.
I remember working with Dark Girl on a few projects that began in Pure BASIC., but then migrated to Visual C++ as it was just easier for both of us.

Quote: "RC BASIC is great but interface + compilation are perfectible (lot of DLL)"

Don't know this one. Looks interesting., but a little "Basic" (pardon the pun)

Quote: "GFA 32 is great (but special)"


GFA Basic 32 is VERY "Old School" in regards to how it approaches the BASIC Language

Quote: "On google, on forums, on facebook, on twitter, nobody speak about DB... but about QB64, Free Basic, Liberty Basic, Pure Basic...."


I think you have to keep in mind that all of those are still in Active Development., and they also have more of a "Hobbyist" Community.
Dark BASIC Professional., well there's two aspects here.

Many who got into DBC / DBP were essentially 18 - 24 at the time., and we're talking about 15 - 20 years ago now... so today, you know they've HAD to move on and focus on other things (Family, Work, etc.)
The other thing is that it was never marketed or promoted as a "Hobbyist" Language.
You've got to remember that it was essentially the FIRST Middleware on the Market that was realistically available at a price point for the Bedroom / Garage Programmer., of course over time Unity 3D (inspired by DBP) would appear and eventually take it's place as the "Defacto" Indie Middleware;
but yeah Dark BASIC Professional was a SERIOUS piece of Software during it's hay day.

Feature wise it more or less gave you almost complete access to DirectX 9.0c' Features with a BASIC Language (which was far easier than C++ to not only learn but get up and running).
It was essentially the PERFECT Middleware for those looking to make their own Games.
Many of those who got their start on Dark BASIC Classic or Professional., have moved on to Unity today... or even have moved on to Professional Studios.
And as noted, others simply had Life become a more important factor than tinkering with Game Development; those who did use DBP as a "Hobby", well most of them still knock about the forums but are far less active.

Quote: "It should be highlighted by THEGAMECRETORS ! Lot of people prefer this kind of basic... AppGameKit is not for me, it's not basic."


AppGameKit is BASIC and it's arguably the spiritual successor to Dark BASIC Professional in both Syntax and Concept.
But aside from the fact that once against TGC's attention seems to have turned back to "Other Middleware" Projects (GameGuru Max for example) and AppGameKit is seeing a similar decline in Updates we saw from DBP when their focus shifted last time., likely meaning that we could be seeing a repeat of History.
Heck there have already been some Threadnaughts about such a situation and people are understandably concerned.

Quote: "What is the future for DB Pro ? Still updates coming ? I hope..."


Updates... I'm not sure.
The problem is we're not really a close knit cohesive community anymore.

I'd say keep an eye on the forums though., there are some VERY interesting projects in the works at the moment from various members that hold a lot of promise.
DrFloyd
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Joined: 12th Feb 2021
Location:
Posted: 14th Feb 2021 12:47
Thank you for this great reply Raven ! I appreciate your expertise

Of course AppGameKit is still a basic, but not a real retro basic like AMOS/BLITZ (ST/AMIGA) spirit

In my opinion basic should stay in that spirit. If it is somewhere on the middle, people don't stay after a wile, as there is no spirit.

It is not possible for a "rookie" to raise a little game with AppGameKit without long study and tutorials... with DBPro, in 1 day you can do something. THAT is Basic spirit for me.

Sorry for my bad english spoken, hope you understood
DrFloyd
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Joined: 12th Feb 2021
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Posted: 14th Feb 2021 12:48
a question : is there any interest to still use DARK BASIC (classic) insteed of DARK BASC PRO ????
Raven
16
Years of Service
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Joined: 23rd Mar 2005
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 15th Feb 2021 13:46
AMOS (at least to me) always felt more BASIC inspired but was DEFINATELY it's own unique Language.
Was never a fan of it... heck it almost put me off Developing on the Amiga, as it was so highly praised... so many loved it.
Specifically for being a "BASIC" Language., but it just confused the heck out of me how it worked. (Frankly it still does)

Blitz I never really used., it was more an Atari ST thing (and I never had one)... when Blitz3D came out on PC, I think I tried it; and it was "Okay" but I preferred Dark BASIC.

Now as for interest in Dark BASIC Classic., eh... the key problem today is getting it to not only work, but support it's features properly.
DirectX 8.1 is not easily emulated in DirectX 10 / 11 / 12; and frankly some Hardware Features no longer even exist on Modern Hardware.



I think it's perfectly possible to put something together in AppGameKit (at least a small / simply project) just as rapidly as you could in DBP.
The problem for me with it is Performance and Limited Functionality.

It feels more-or-less like a Polished but Cut-Down version of DBP for Mobile App Development., and that's a bit of a shame.
DrFloyd
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Joined: 12th Feb 2021
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Posted: 15th Feb 2021 14:52
Just for information (or for LOL ?) here is a link to my modest/rookie games :
http://www.gamopat.com/page-8134772.html

I know, I am a french frogger newby ... but old (51 years)

But, please note that the CRASH TIME PLUMBER & SUPA ZAI DA ports to Atari STE (done by a friend) won the price of best games in a Atari convention

When i will have finish my ATARI ST/STE/TT/MEGA/FALCON game (COSMOS CHRONICLES), I will start my DB Pro role-game sci-fi.

But what I really need with DBPro is a low Res with no Blur. I want to use a resolution near from 320x240

Raven, you are my last hope be the force with you
Juggernaut
9
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Joined: 12th Mar 2012
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Posted: 16th May 2021 13:38
Hello,

I own most of the AppGameKit products along with Game Guru.

But I am looking for a copy of the old DBPRO 7.62 along with all the official and the third party plugins.

Can any body help ?

Thanks,
Kuper
13
Years of Service
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Joined: 25th Feb 2008
Playing: Planescape:Torment
Posted: 16th May 2021 17:34
I'm still using DBPro after all this years.I think it is excellent solution for creating small programs alone or by small group of developers ( like TreeIt made by Evolved )
However DBPro community not big at all and I didn't find any mentioning about DarkBasic on other web sites. Such places like YouTube have some stuff from 2007-2010 years but no fresh stuff. Some time ago I thought about making series of tutorials about DBPro on YouTube.
I think that it is very important to attract new users. After years we will get new games, new tools, new code. As a result DBPro will live and prosper. What do you think about it?
Unseen Ghost
19
Years of Service
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Joined: 2nd Sep 2002
Location: Ohio
Posted: 8th Jun 2021 16:57
Quote: "I think that it is very important to attract new users. After years we will get new games, new tools, new code. As a result DBPro will live and prosper. What do you think about it? "


I think it is a great idea. I have spent many hours on the DBP forum looking for latest version of all the user created plugins. I too still us DarkBASIC Pro a lot People still post here, but it has slowed way down considerably. To my knowledge most of them have moved on to App Game Kit which I have bought, but I'm not fond of. I will alway use DBP as long as it works on Windows even future versions. I currently use the 9Ex version with all the plugins. It works well on Windows 10 64 bit which I have.

Looking forward to seeing your series of tutorials for DBP
Gigabyte Board/ AMD 3.3 Ghtz Quad core/8GB Ram/Nvidia Geforce 730 2GB/1TB Western Dig. SSD/Windows 10 Home/Dark Basic Pro 9Ex

No one cares how much you know until they know how much you care.
Unseen Ghost
19
Years of Service
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Joined: 2nd Sep 2002
Location: Ohio
Posted: 8th Jun 2021 17:15 Edited at: 9th Jun 2021 11:08
Quote: "But I am looking for a copy of the old DBPRO 7.62 along with all the official and the third party plugins.
"


Here is a link to plugins you might be wanting, but the link for DBP 7.6 is dead. They removed the file I think.

https://anyhowengine.wordpress.com/useful-links/
Gigabyte Board/ AMD 3.3 Ghtz Quad core/8GB Ram/Nvidia Geforce 730 2GB/1TB Western Dig. SSD/Windows 10 Home/Dark Basic Pro 9Ex

No one cares how much you know until they know how much you care.
Bored of the Rings
16
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Joined: 25th Feb 2005
Location: Middle Earth
Posted: 9th Jun 2021 05:29
I have all versions including 7.62
Professional Programmer, languages: SAS, C++, SQL, PL-SQL, DBPro, Purebasic, JavaScript, others
Ermesjr
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Joined: 11th Feb 2021
Location:
Posted: 13th Jul 2021 07:15
Hello,

DBPRO was the best i've ever used, i'm aged and far time ago i start coding with C64 assembly, Amiga with AMOS, Amiga with Blitz, then pc with DBC and finally DBPRO. the Great DBRPO.

a huge smash to my heart knowing TGC kill the best app they ever made. Thumbs up.
Bored of the Rings
16
Years of Service
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Joined: 25th Feb 2005
Location: Middle Earth
Posted: 14th Jul 2021 19:25 Edited at: 14th Jul 2021 21:30
I still write commands for dbpro in visual studio. I'm planning on giving the source a good overhaul.

Below, shows I extended the maximum number of memblocks from 255 to 300 (for now). The source code is actually inconsistent, so made some updates to all memblock functions where the inconsistency occurred. It's a shame I don't have the source code that Rudolpho did for DBProEX, I would improve on it.

Professional Programmer, languages: SAS, C++, SQL, PL-SQL, DBPro, Purebasic, JavaScript, others

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Seditious
8
Years of Service
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Joined: 2nd Aug 2013
Location: France
Posted: 15th Jul 2021 10:25
Why have a limit of 300?
2002 - Present
Bored of the Rings
16
Years of Service
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Joined: 25th Feb 2005
Location: Middle Earth
Posted: 15th Jul 2021 10:49 Edited at: 15th Jul 2021 11:37
well that was just simply a test, hence why I put "(for now)" in the post. of course thie updates will only be for me and not you guys, I have no intention of sharing.
Professional Programmer, languages: SAS, C++, SQL, PL-SQL, DBPro, Purebasic, JavaScript, others
Xarcolt
13
Years of Service
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Joined: 29th Sep 2007
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Posted: 15th Jul 2021 21:51 Edited at: 15th Jul 2021 21:59
Just wanted to reassure anyone who was worried about the future, I just installed DBP on windows 11 and it is working fantastically.

EDIT: Even my wannabe rpg game is running "correctly" on windows 11 as well. So long as you get a copy of DBP running, you should be fine!
Kuper
13
Years of Service
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Joined: 25th Feb 2008
Playing: Planescape:Torment
Posted: 16th Jul 2021 21:19
Quote: "But I am looking for a copy of the old DBPRO 7.62 along with all the official and the third party plugins."

here is 7.62 update
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kssrAmDMpelYFQyo9OLgysFwgmltd9v3
IMHO it is not polite from TGC to remove this link from official site because (as I know) it is last official update for DBPro.
Update 7.7 not working with plugins like DarkDynamix ( which was one of the last officially released plugins ) so if anybody have copy of DBPro he has to update to 7.62 and will not be able to download it from this web.
Xarcolt
13
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Joined: 29th Sep 2007
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Posted: 18th Jul 2021 03:54
The 7.62 seems to break DBPs ability to compile and run anything outside of the temp folder for me, even when opening other projects ! Literally what I've been doing is installing from the literal "Dark Game Studio" installation CD that I purchased back in its day. And then copying the github build followed by version 9Ex over that. afterwards replacing the "Editor New.exe" with the synergy editor renamed as such. Feels clunky but damnit it legitimately works like it "should" (i.e. install from a media, and it just works with everything playing nice together). I've actually put everything needed after the physical DISC on a flash-drive in the event I need it up and running from a clean install of windows. .. would there be a good place to send it all for someone more intelligent than myself to make a proper installer for these? I mean, it legitimately installs on newer and older OS(s) with zero workarounds needed after the fact.
Marvey
18
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Joined: 15th Oct 2002
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Posted: 14th Sep 2021 23:23 Edited at: 14th Sep 2021 23:25
i think i visit this forum 5 in 5 years allways expecting to have good news about dbpro... but well... seems the good knews will never happen... i dont understand why this amazing product was shutdown... anyway see you again in 5 years

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