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AppGameKit Studio Chat / [LOCKED] Engine within an engine

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Aidan
User Banned
Posted: 17th Nov 2023 18:45 Edited at: 17th Nov 2023 19:33
I'm always fond of game engines since God knows when, I like creating tools rather than apps for others to use and enjoy, but AGk bet me to it, but I like the thought of doing it anyway.

Been thinking of something similar to how clickteam fusion works but through AGk. Which will include 3D and world apps through chunk rendering plus more.

Is this allowed? It will still use the AGk player / compiler, but design own apps via like how clickteam Klik and play does theirs then export into pure AGk code so you can add more of your own personal things.

- maze games
- 2d games platform eg
- 2.5 isometric games
- world games
- 3d games
- collisions
- tweenings
- fading sequences
- lights
- independancies on objects
- importation of objs
- UV management for your objects
Etc
Etc

This won't be done soon - it will be a yearly project as this will be a huge project

If we can make fully functional games over a weekend, wonder what can be avheived with more time (like suggest be near on a year for this one)

What I like most is exporting to AGk code, add your own stuff, then recompile for your own needs.

Who interested if allowed

Thanks
Phaelax
DBPro Master
20
Years of Service
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Joined: 16th Apr 2003
Location: Metropia
Posted: 21st Nov 2023 17:38
You might want to explain what clickteam is for those of us who've never heard of it. But I'm guessing you want to make an app that generates agk code? Sounds like you could just design some templates and plug in a few variables.
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qweQua
1
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Joined: 24th Oct 2022
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 05:48
Th licence doesn't allow it I'm afraid. You would probably need to get written consent from TGC to be able to do this.

This was probably done to prevent people from directly competing with appgamekit with something that is based on AGK.

Here it is in the AppGameKit licence:
Quote: "1.4 For the purposes of this Agreement the term 'App' means an interactive entertainment software game whose sole purpose is to entertain its user and which is made using the Software in accordance with its associated documentation. The term App expressly excludes:

(a) any software tool or software product which can (or might) be used in order to create further games or other software products;

(b) any software library, compilation or collection of graphics and / or sounds from which a particular graphic or sound may be extracted to be used independently of the software in which it was first incorporated;

in each case irrespective of whether or not the primary purpose of such software is to entertain its user."
qweQua
1
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Joined: 24th Oct 2022
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 05:50
Clickteam fusion isn't based on AGK. Aidan was (i assume) trying to discuss the possibility of making something similar to fusion in AGK.
hendron
8
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Joined: 20th Dec 2015
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 13:34
Quote: "(a) any software tool or software product which can (or might) be used in order to create further games or other software products;"


While this is a little vaguely worded, I'm guessing it's really only meant for software that can be used to create games/apps directly. A tool that only exports AppGameKit code/projects that the user would need to compile themselves is probably fine. It would pretty much fall under the same category as a third party IDE, which TGC have never had issues with as far as I know. But yeah, as the EULA is vague, it'd be best to ask TGC first.
Aidan
User Banned
Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 14:51
Thanks guys, hendron got it spot on.

I'll have a rethink of my next project in the new year.

Clickteam is a click and play system run by event systems foundered by Francois Lionet

It was worth a try
smerf
19
Years of Service
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Joined: 24th Feb 2005
Location: nm usa
Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 15:50
Yeah I'd say as long as it doesn't compile or wrap the language inside it should be fine because there's no way to create a game. It's the key word CREATE which a tool can help with development but not create. I'm building an advanced level editor but it purpose is to produce agk code that requires the purchase of agk to run via it's compiler

Aidan
User Banned
Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 15:56
Thanks for that.

The idea for here is to build something similar, to do create games by event systems and then export to AGk code. Of which then can be later used by us to run it in or compile it inside AGk itself.

That code then can show how that game is built.

The games created will not be solely independant, just to export to AGk code - nothing more nothing less.

Just gives the beginners some inspiration on how games are built with a few clicks of a button and then bring it into AGk to recompile and distribute where ever they feel necessary.

Hope all that makes sense



Phaelax
DBPro Master
20
Years of Service
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Joined: 16th Apr 2003
Location: Metropia
Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 18:24
Quote: " any software tool or software product which can (or might) be used in order to create further games or other software products;"

nope sorry, to me that's like saying you can't use C++ to create a competing language. When I buy something I intend to use it for whatever I want. Or that I'm not allowed to create something like SEUCK (amiga game designer thingy). It's like when a vendor sells you a console or something then says you're not allowed to modify the product you now own.
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hendron
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2023 19:26 Edited at: 22nd Nov 2023 19:37
Quote: "nope sorry, to me that's like saying you can't use C++ to create a competing language."


I get where you are coming from, but C++ is a free and open source programming language, while AppGameKit is a commercial product, so it's not exactly comparable. I'm not speaking to the ethics of it or anything, but TGC are almost certainly within their legal rights to say that users can't use the AppGameKit runtime (or libraries in the case of Tier 2) to create software that competes directly with AGK. If OP were to make a software tool with AppGameKit that users can use to create desktop and mobile games/apps without needing to own AppGameKit themselves, it's easy to see how that could be a problem for TGC. I'm guessing this is a fairly standard usage restriction for this type of software (excluding FOSS). I know that Unity also include a clause in their EULA that forbids the use of Unity to develop competing game development software, at least.

edit: I should clarify that I'm talking about software that is intended to be distributed. If you were to make a game creation tool with AppGameKit for your own personal use, I don't personally see why that would be a problem. It'd be an un-enforceable restriction anyway.

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