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Alright, I would like to make graphics such as in Diablo, Baldur's Gate, etc., but I have no clue where to start! Do any of the programs that The Gamecreaters sell help? I have noticed that they are all 3D graphics programs... but is this what I need?

Also, can anyone recommend any RPGs written in DB or DBPro? I didn't see many in the Showcase.

If you want to do 2d graphics you need a drawing program. You may find that it's actualy easier to use 3d once you build objects and learn how to use it.

Either way you want to get a tutorial or 2 or 10 first, especialy if you don't know where to start. Unless you have lots of money, I sugest making a few simple games like what you want to make with simple objects (dudes are circles) before you go and buy everything.

Hi GuruSY,
I know exactly what you're talking about for graphics. There is a slight difference between the Diablo and BG graphics styles. They're both a top-down view, but if you pay attention you'll see that characters in Diablo can only move in eight directions (N,NE,E,SE,S,SW,W,NW). This is ahieved by using a 2D art program like Paint Shop Pro, Photoshop, or regular old MS Paint (which could be more difficult than others).

In Baldur's Gate the characters have free rotation, which either means they have a cool way of manipulating 2d images, or they used a 3d modeller. Using a modeller from here such as gameSpace(which I highly recommend) allows you to create a 3d character you can twist and turn in whatever direction you want. This could allow you to do a game with art similar to Dungeon Siege or Neverwinter Nights with Baldur's Gate or Diablo style gameplay.

Some 2d Programs:
Paint Shop Pro 8-powerful but relatively affordable, $70-$100
Adobe Photoshop-big grandaddy of 2d, but $500
MS Paint-free probably came standard with your computer, but limited
GIMP- the Free Software Foundation's solution for 2d

Some 3d Programs:
gameSpace- gamemaker's ideal version of Caligari's TrueSpace, $300
nice interface
3d Canvas Pro-affordable, but could be difficult to use and a
little limited
3d Studio Max-professional grade, expensive $3500
Maya- better quality than 3d Max, and $5000
Lightwave-still high quality, but cheaper than 3d Max, $1500
Milkshape3d- powerful for only being $25, RPGamer can tell you all
about this one
Anim8or- free, but can difficult to learn, and a bit limited
trueSpace3.2- now free, but very limited, gameSpace is based off
this interface, it's a nice interface, just limited
DeleD- a rather nice free 3d modeller written by a cool guy you can
findround here
JT Edit- like DeleD, a pretty darn good free 3d modeller from a guy
within these forums
Wings3d- a free and pretty powerful modeller, but no animation
Blender3d- this is very difficult to learn, but has everything you
need
gmax- free, mainly used for mods, but you can export unanimated
models to a .md3, and then convert to .x
3d Exploration- General graphics view and converter
MatEdit- Creates and edits matrices, the terrain format DarkBASIC
uses, MatEdit has a tile per tile editing system
MagicWorld- A matrix editor that allows you to place 3d objects onto
matrices and has a mouse-dragging interface like most
scenario editors for pc RTS games

And that's about all I can think of for now.

Good luck, keep asking questions,
Crazy Donuts

[EDIT]Sorry bout that Lord Helmet, posted at the same time.

Thanks Crazy Donut for the great reply! The DB community is very helpfull!

I suspected that a 3D modeler might be in play for the Baldur's Gate type graphics. I'll try out some demos of the cheeper ones that you suggested.

Another question... How do you think the maps are generated for Baldur's Gate? They are very beautiful, but not 3D. I hope someone did not make those in paintshop, because that would be insane.

Thanks again!

Theres another way using DarkBasic Classic on its own or Professional with the save image DLL made by Guy Savoie.

The open source snippet Ive made will take a 3d model and rotate it around and while its doing this it will save bmps to the folder, essentially rendering the 3d object into 2d images.


http://www.lunarpixel.net/db_code.htm



look for this example:

3D to 2d Render Script:
This script will take a 3ds or X model of your choice
and export how ever many rotations
you require of the image into BMP files.


The script is open source so you can modify it to work on the fly inside your program or as a tool creation for your game.



The script is set up like a freeware perl file, you alter the variables at the start and then run it, this allows you to modify it to your hearts content.

Im working on an RPG Tutorial that may be some help to you

My team is also working on an RPG (see sig)

RPGamer

Yes, a tutorial would be much help RPGamer!

Anyways, Last night I was looking at a book I bought a while ago when I was trying to learn how to code games in C (I gave up eventually). It is "Tricks of the Windows Game Programming Gurus", and here is what LaMothe said about Isometric RPGs:

Three ways to do it:

1. Cell-Based, Totally 2D - use 2D tiles that are drawn all at the same isometric angle.

2. Full-Screen-Based, with 2D or 3D Collision Networks - Basically draw an ISO 3D world, then create a secondary data structure that contains the collision information that is overlaid onto the fake 2D world. So basically you map out where the movable sprites can go.

3. Use Full 3D, with a Fixed Camera Angle - LaMothe says that this is how alot of 3D Iso console games work.


Anyone have any experience doing any of these? Any pointers or thoughts? I'm learning toward #3 because DBPro supports 3D real nice, and it looks the easiest.

That is a good idea, trying to combing 2d and 3d either gets very complicated, or just results in some cheap looking 3d. In case I didn't mention it before, NuclearGlory has some excellent collision .dlls that make it so much more easier and beautiful.

[img] Try gmax in discreets products.