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Geek Culture / why is it? that help is not on the agender!!!!!!

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IMAGE 02
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 04:44
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why when you ask for help in the forums, is it that 80% of the response's are people telling you have made a spelling mistake, or a modirator aged 14, just wants to put me down or in genrail talking absolutley twaddle. i paid alot of money to various companys inconjuction with sark basic. and just want professional propper help. so come on guys (modirators more than not) get your acts together stop slagging everyone off for spelling mistakes or onot knowing as much as you or who owns a company and whos does'nt and get down to the true facts that these forums are here to help us not hinder us, oh incerdently out of ten threads only 1 was helpful. i think that says it all:

best of luck

Ed.

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 04:56
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If you ask sensible and well thought-out questions, you'll get mostly sensible replies. If you are not receiving the type of response you need - rephrase your question (or ask yourself if it's really relevant).

Also - spelling mistakes in source code will cause you a lot of problems, if your code has as many spelling errors as your forum messages, you might benefit from a good dictionary. Unless you are properly dyslexic, try running your messages through a spell checker before posting them - people will take you more seriously when you make an effort. Remember - forum users don't HAVE to help you.

Cheers,

Rich

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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 05:00
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hi rich the spelling mistakes i make are ussualy in posts not code, as dbp has a goos syntax editor and picks most of my mistypes up,

you are quite right they dont have to help anyone and usually dont, but is that not what he forums were designed for in the first place, so we all could help each other.???

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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 05:01
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goos should be good, im typing on a laptop with huge rubber fingers

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 05:02
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Sure it is - but as I've not seen any of your requests for help I cannot say why people are not helping - but the most usual reason is that someone comes in here saying "how do I do this?" without having shown any demonstration at all of trying it themselves. Or they ask for way-out help (like "how do I make an fps?") which people just don't have time to deal with.

Small, well-formed, sensible questions DO get answers.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 05:08
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and I have never understood why the code posted in the forums is not the Copy-And-Pasted code right from the dbp IDE? It makes no sense to post a "recap" of code to ask a question when doing so could cause so many new problems (where none existed) or cause helpers to miss the original problem because the repost eliminated the simple spelling mistake that was causing the problem in the first place.

get me?


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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 05:12
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well, if you post for help on an mmorpg, no one will help you

Once I dreamt that I fell into a lake full of the undead and demons. I screamed and hollered as my kitten jumped into it with me. None of my friends helped me.

I don't trust them anymore.
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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 07:21
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and its AGENDA
btw


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indi
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 13:47
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IMAGE DESIGN.

I take some offense to a small degree at your post actually.

There are multiple spelling errors within the actual content and you basically did a backflip with Rich and his comments.

I try really hard to provide contextual help to problems and sometimes yes i will jeer a coder because its too dam ironic/funny/tempting/silly to even comprehend as a real post or genuine problem.

Sure I may have a spelling or typo but hardly multi ones in a small amount of text.

If you spent more time researching your problem then making this post we would be closer to correcting any mistake or issue you had.

time well spent composing and replying.(sarcasm)


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Van B
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 14:49
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I used to help out a lot more than I do now, but recently I can't be bothered with the same old questions and problems being dragged up. If people did some research or even just looked at the codebase before posting there attitude all over the forums we'd all get more done.

I spent 2 nights working on a great tunnel generator for someone, then they did'nt even have the decency to reply. Frankly that kind of thing makes me think twice about helping people out to any sort of degree, never mind offering any coding help. I'm more likely to help people who email me than any of the code help requests here.


Van-B


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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 18:11
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i thought the idea of a forum is that you get quick help fast. from people who have been there and done it, if you cant be bothered helping people then why not give up your moderator status and let someone who is willing to help instead of been sarcastic. (americans) mainly but not always (back flip) im so energetic LOL (sarcasim)

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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 18:14
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oh by the way so much spelling and typo's in so little text is because i have a laptop and the keys are small so unless i type very slow i ussualy hit the wrong keys or i cant spell the word so im dyslexic so what? but this is what i am saying at the top most of you love more often than not to pleasure your selfs with arguing the toss rather than helping that does say it all.

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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 18:14 Edited at: 18th Apr 2004 18:15
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ok....racism isn't a good way to get help....I'm American, as are most (I think that's what Rich said) people here...

Once I dreamt that I fell into a lake full of the undead and demons. I screamed and hollered as my kitten jumped into it with me. None of my friends helped me.

I don't trust them anymore.
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Drew Cameron
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 18:45
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Take the time to type properly and add in some nice new paragraphs.

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David T
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 19:33 Edited at: 18th Apr 2004 19:33
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Quote: "racism isn't a good way to get help....I'm American"


Not wanting to interject but... Racism? - Looking at what Image Design said, he made no racist comment.

A nation of people can be made up of numerous races, segregating those races is racism. There is not, as yet, an American race.



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Van B
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 19:48
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He did say:
Quote: "instead of been sarcastic. (americans) mainly but not always "


I would'nt call that very offensive in my book, but it's not really a good idea to generalize at all when posting here.

I find it funny though, how IMAGE is picking a fight with Indi, who's a) Australian and has b) Helped more newbies than most of us have had hot dinners.


Van-B


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medwayman
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 20:09
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The same posts appear over an over and sometimes on the same page. This just shows people can’t be bothered to look very far for answers. The db forums should be the last place you ask for help not the first.

There are plenty of tutorials out there and the built in help files, while not great, do offer explanations for each command. I wonder how many people even get as far as the help files before deciding to post on these boards? Judging by the content I would say not many.

Quote: "if you cant be bothered helping people then why not give up your moderator status and let someone who is willing to help instead of been sarcastic."


What has being a mod got to do with helping people? As far as I am aware it’s not part of the job description. The job of helping people is for anyone who wants to do so regardless of there forum status.

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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 20:31
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ah, yeah, indi is actually very helpful (not sarcastic)

Once I dreamt that I fell into a lake full of the undead and demons. I screamed and hollered as my kitten jumped into it with me. None of my friends helped me.

I don't trust them anymore.
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IanM
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 20:41
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Quote: "i thought the idea of a forum is that you get quick help fast"


Well, that's not true. This is a forum, not a chat session. You are basically waiting for someone to come along and answer a question for you or to help in some other way. You may need to wait a few minutes, hours or even days for the answer that you need.

Of course, even when someone comes along who can answer your question there is no guarantee that they will see your post, read your post or even be bothered to type the answer in.

There are several ways to get your thread looked at and answered:
1) A title that describes your problem.

A title of 'Help with simple problem' or 'is it just me' (just to pick 2 current posts) is not going to get me to look at them at all.

A post of 'DBP : Finding MAX VALUE in an ARRAY' gives you a good idea of what you are going to see and what the poster wants.

2) An easy-to-read post.

This means:
- Blank lines.
- Punctuation.
- Spelling.

If people see one long sentence or a big block of text then they are unlikely to read it.

3) Politeness.

It amazes me how many people don't post a simple thank-you to an answered post. If you don't thank the person who helped you, why should they help you the next time?

If you don't get the answer that you need, don't rant. Just post a followup in the thread to get someone to try again for you.

In fact, take a look at the post 'DBP : Finding MAX VALUE in an ARRAY'

4) A reasonable attempt to work out the problem yourself before posting.

Why should anyone bother looking into your problem if you haven't bothered? Post code and describe what you have already attempted. This shows that you've at least thought about the problem.

This also covers searches. If the answer is to your question has already been posted in the last few days you can expect a sarcastic reply.

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Mentor
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 21:43
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I don`t mind helping and often ramble on for ages when I reply and post code, several things are guaranteed to get me to ignore posts, posts like this

what happens if I type print "hello" into the editor?

try it dumbass , (we actualy get quite a few of these)

posts that read

I am making a massive multiplayer online game, can you tell me what I do next?, heres my source

print this is my game
inkey$()=43
load world
rem this is my cool ubergame
`I need the monster to move about

er yeah! right!

people who you tell the answer to their question repeatedly and they get abusive (so annoying)
people who change what they want to do from post to post in the same thread

(q) how do i load an object
(a) use load object 1,"model.x"...long explanation
(r) actualy how will i save the score
(a) .........long reply
(r) what do i need to revolve a item
(a) ????
etc

you have NO idea if they are just taking the p**s or following your replies, or if you are giving advice about 3 seperate games or what

one pet hate especialy is posts typed in l33t (cybergibberish)

ths dnt wrk cz of d frnt nd bch mdl, cls d ap 2 c

and then every week you get the same

<basic essential function> does not work

type post, and you just can`t convince Mr Mastermind that PRINT does work...sigh!, then you get the

give me da codez
I don`t want books, books is stupid
whats with this text editor..wheres the level editor

posts, make you weep for the stupidity of man they do, they buy a language that is available as a free demo and then wonder why it isn`t a point and click gamemaker AAARGH!

then theres Mr Supercoder, he just wrote his first program last night and tries to tell everyone he`s a Expert in 500 languages and the source for his supergame is copyrighted, then when you finaly get him to post the source you see

goto gosub
""prin supergame"
make object sphere 1,1,1,1
load sound "coolbelch.3ds",11,
make matrix 10x10
load movie, of ,telly
doit
syncro
loopy

or some heady mishmash of cut and paste that mixes 2d, 3d and 1d code with a bubble sort and some stuff (mistyped) from a c manual AAAAAAAAAARGH!!

some tips for newbies, you are NOT and maybe NEVER will be a threat to ID, definitly not within your first 3000 posts, your source will NOT be stolen by someone to make their fortune, most of the time it will just be "block on a matrix" anyway, (or "bloke on a matrix" if you sussed the load object command), the people giving good advice are not happy when they spend 15 minutes (or 2 days as one post mentioned) making code or typing in long explanations when they get a reply that obviously means you never bothered to read their post in the first place, otherwise you would not have asked that question, or you just don`t reply at all.
If you want help then by all means ask for it, but please don`t make posts that are so cryptic MI5 wonder if it`s a terrorist transmission, remember WE cant see your code or your screen, explain the problem clearly ("this thing here gets stuck under the block" does not cut it as "clearly"), and POST THE CODE (preferably with the function you think is the problem highlighted by rems), if you are asking sort of question on this forum then you are not that advanced to be at risk of getting your code stolen and profited from, we can help you, but you have to help us, end of rant.

Mentor.

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Magpie
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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 22:24
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That wasn't a rant, that was a lecture!


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Posted: 18th Apr 2004 23:51
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well thankyou everyone for all your comments i will take it on board and lets see if it works.

or maybe the whole world is against me. LOL

thankyou.

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Peter H
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Posted: 19th Apr 2004 01:52 Edited at: 19th Apr 2004 01:55
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Quote: "if you cant be bothered helping people then why not give up your moderator status and let someone who is willing to help"

speaking of being willing to help...you have to be willing to try to help yourself before you ask other people to help YOU...you're the one being selfish

[edit] oh i didn't see...i guess RPgamer beat me to the punch


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Rob K
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Posted: 19th Apr 2004 02:15
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Quote: "if you cant be bothered helping people then why not give up your moderator status and let someone who is willing to help instead of been sarcastic"


I think you are forgetting that moderators are ordinary DBPro users who do this for a hobby, we do not have any special affiliation with TGC, and we do not get any special privileges - other than the ability to manage threads and posts in the forum.

Often when a question is asked, the answer is not a simple two-line response. Someone may need to sit down and spend a few minutes writing & testing code to help you. If you give the impression that you can't be bothered and want someone else to do everything for you by:

a) - Posting a vague, open question
b) - Not providing any evidence of attempts to do it yourself
c) - Not searching the forum first

Then not surprisingly other forum members will not be keen to help and sarcastic replies will result instead.

If you follow the guidelines already mentioned, you will almost certainly get a helpful response.

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