Quote: "I agree on raven's viewpoint, minus the dragons. i never cared for the fantasy-like stuff like that."
Dragons and Gargoyles are important roles within the architectual design; Goyles are for fallen souls, who are often placed on buildings to show that god will punish those who do wrong.
The Dragons are really just a british thing born from the Welsh, and are shown as a power symbol.
Quote: "o yea. for those of you who think marilyn mansion is a goth. your wrong. marilyn mansion is a satanist"
I believe he said it in an interview before that actually the whole 'Goth' image was inspired by KISS. Think about it, his nitché markets now believe they're just for them;
personally i see them as a heavy rock band, nothing more.
I mean you don't head Slipnot being called a bunch of Chain-Saw Maniacs do you? but that's how the dress.
Quote: "As Maddox makes quite clear, there is no clear-cut definition of goth. All in all the whole 'goth movement' is nothing but a trend of people who get a little taste of life, don't like it and go into denial in the absolute stupidest way possible."
That doesn't make them Gothic, it makes them Teen Anxst. Putting on face paint, a frilly dress and saying your an individual by taking on the stereotypical american label of a Goth does not in any way shape or form actually mean that is what you really are.
Look at Wicca and Paegans in the US, they've been reduced to simply labels for evil people because of how the Church state-side sees them.
While this makes the label valid for the United States, there *ARE* countries outside of there you know who have had these brands of people longer.
Paegans and Wiccans are not evil people, they're not suppose to perform satanic rituals, they do not sacrifice people, they do not go around dressed like goats or death.
Paegans do use a pentagram for things, but it depends on the fashion in which you draw it and place candles in it which would cause certain things to happen. the 5 points stand for pretty bog-standard things iirc; Luck, Love, Revenge, Health and Wealth if i'm remembering right.
Wiccans are nothing by Herbalists, or Apothecaries. Doctors are the modern day equivilant.
But within the american culture you have your set views of these people and thus this becomes the *only* view you can see. What makes this all worse is that the internet allows much easier spreading of what quite frankly is pure ignorance to things which were neither born from your country nor really have anything to do with the crap that goes on there.
Quote: "there aren't many goths in my school, but all the goths that there are are the worthless, suicidal, devil-worshipping kind. ok i guess that makes them more satanits than goths."
Exactly, but the label is the same according to the Church in america. Basically anyone who turns thier back on a factional teaching of the bible is a Heretic/Satanist; this isn't helped for those who are true Gothics because for each one you have 9 other stupid morons who believe it is exactly what the commercialism version says it is.
As I said before Goth is born from Christianity itself. It was designed to put the fear of god into people before the creation of Hell by the Catholics. (before that it was just purgatory, and before that it was a case of just not being allowed into heaven and eternal life period)
Gothics are seen as those who work on that thin blue line between good and evil. It lead a rise to the Paladine Knights and the Tau Knights. While normal fighters would need such'n'such days of pray to repent for thier sins, a knight from the Gothic following doesn't have to; becuase he accepted the fact he would never reach heaven, or rather they wouldn't be allowed to mingle with everyone else.
Quote: "people, it's just a title. Find a more accurate description for yourselves if you must. I agree with Maddox completely. Anyone who labels themselves as goth have no hidden or profound meaning in my eyes. Just another normal Joe calling himself something that would lead me to believe they wear dark clothing and white makeup."
Unfortunately that is exactly what it is to alot of people isn't it.
if america says something, it is a case of that is essentially true.
this is why alot of people who come from long lines of the things that americans label, deem bad and then have thier teen culture show in the poor light just quite frankly hate about the country.
if it isn't enough to go to other countries and demand they act like america, they also have to take thier meaning for things.
Paegans are seen as almost like the ultimate evil religion, which i have no doubt the american version might be; but it was born in england against (not with) the druid cult. It isn't evil in anyway, it is simply what was believed in before the Romans brought us 'Christianity' the 'true' religion.
sorry, but just because the word means one thing to the american public does NOT mean it is the ONLY meaning.
for gods sake, to you people a Faggot is someone who is gay, which is just amazing... because to me a Fag is a Cigerette and a Faggot is a form of meatloaf.
to me neither words are cussive or bad; but if i were to sit there and talk about them in a forum i would have ALOT of american sitting there bitching at me about cussing and being abusive.
don't tell me i won't because it HAS happened quite a number of times before.
what truely pisses me off about these american goths is the fact that they are possibly some of the most close minded people i've ever met. if that's what they believe the Gothic culture is about, then they might as well call themselves what they really are...
Manic Depressive Satanic Clowns; individualism through copying everyone else, yeah that makes PERFECT sense doesn't it?
