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Geek Culture / zombie dogs are real

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Phaelax
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 18:36
For those of you who don't read Slashdot:

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,15739502-13762,00.html


Hmm, anyone else reminded of resident evil?

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BatVink
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 18:52
Scary!

"we can save your leg, but first we have to drain all the blood out of your body while we get you to a hospital."

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Jiffy
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 19:00
That is so Umbrella Corporationish! Seriously though, that is really weird.

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Osiris
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 20:15
All I have to say is, Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaammmmmmmnnnnnnnn! Also, did they already try this a while back but to no avail?

The Wendigo
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 20:37
?! Maybe i didn't read that right, but it sounded like they replaced its blood with a salt solution? I didn't read the whole article (I'm tired) but that wouldn't actually work. They wouldn't be able to bring oxygen to their brains and, thus couldn't feed even basic functions. Anyways, real or not, I highly doubt they would be doing that to humans soon. Could you imagine the amount of controversy?

All in all, a fun story though


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Eric T
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 20:42 Edited at: 28th Jun 2005 20:43
Quote: ""Plans to test the technique on humans should be realised within a year""




That and their blood is filled with Ice Cold Salt solution, then they get their blood replaced.

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BatVink
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 21:12
Quote: "They wouldn't be able to bring oxygen to their brains and, thus couldn't feed even basic functions"


I think that is the point...they are well and truly, clinically...dead But they do it in a way that tissue damage is minimal, allowing them to bring them back to life.

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robo cat
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 21:58
If its true it would be quite useful in all aspects of daily life. Get on a plane and then get killed and brought back to life at your destination. Or kill the person, shove them in a catapult and then bring them back to life when they land - no pain, just a few broken limbs and cheap fast travel.

Simple... yet fun!
Peter H
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 23:21 Edited at: 28th Jun 2005 23:22
Quote: "Get on a plane and then get killed and brought back to life at your destination"

LOL

slightly overkill (no pun intended ) when you could just use a sedative...

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 23:30
I'm confused. Are the dogs still alive after this? I mean do they retain thier memories and behaviour and such?

Peter H
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 23:32
yeah...all they did was freeze them for a bit

though who can tell if they keep their memory... (see if they still recognize their owner maybe)

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Keaz
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Posted: 28th Jun 2005 23:56 Edited at: 28th Jun 2005 23:58
According to the article. It goes like this.

Remove blood and replace with ICE cold salt solution. You now have a dead (no movement, heartbeat, or brain function) semi-frozen salty dog.(Thinks about leftover hotdogs in freezer)

3hours later(so your sure he's dead): Reinject the original blood after heavly oxygenating it. Shock the hell out of the poor bugger and scruffy comes back to life.

According to the article no brain damage(Yep, bubba he's barkin'and he looks pissed for some reason ) or major tissue damage occurs(Aka. We can fix that.)

This does bring up a new question if used on humans. When is the person truely declared dead? If humans have souls when do the soul leave the body? Only when your truely dead? Then technically when is that?

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dj blackdragon3710
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 01:14
Here we go again ....

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James Morgan
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 04:56
Hmmm, if they could bring us back then maybe it will show we have no souls...

Bring them back with an electic shock?
Bets on the first human to be brought back is going to be called Luc Deveraux or GR44!

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Ace Of Spades
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 05:10
That's not freaky at all, thats just plain damn cool!

If I get shot and killed, then brought back to life...I would be extremely happy and thankful. When they can get to the point of replace ALL your organs with artificial ones as well, we could essentially cheat death....how cool would that be?

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Mattman
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 05:21
But your skin would be all wrinkly...

Word.
Fallout
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 05:35
The easiest way to cheat death is to drink Grolsch.

It'll be interesting to see how the religious ones amoung us debate the soul issue when and if people can be frozen for days/months/years and brought back to life.

TravisP
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 05:54
Quote: "
This does bring up a new question if used on humans. When is the person truely declared dead? If humans have souls when do the soul leave the body? Only when your truely dead? Then technically when is that?"

They will just use an excuse like this!
"When you die you go to heaven/hell then you have no memories of it when your brought back alive!"


Ian T
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 06:27
Soul issue? What about the friggin' overpopulation issue?

If I looking for blog
Ace Of Spades
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 06:29
Quote: " What about the friggin' overpopulation issue?"


Thats where nature comes in to even itself out, as it becomes overpopulated, needed resources will run out, then people will die off from lack of resources, until the resources can provide for the number of humans left. Its a balance system.

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Jimmy
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 06:42
That doesn't really work with humans.

If people start dying from lack of resources, the planet will erupt in panic and people will start killing and eating eachother. Then in less than 10 days the entire race will be non-existent.

Ace Of Spades
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 06:44
Quote: "Then in less than 10 days the entire race will be non-existent."


I believe in the strongest/smartest survive...as long as you can take stuff from others, and not have it taken from you...you'll be alright.

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Jimmy
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 06:52
No, because all the noobs will go first and we'll all die from noob poisoning.

DBAlex
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 06:52
Hahaha...




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mm0zct
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 10:25
lays, about cheating death, your brain cannot grow new neurones (brain cells) and they are constantly dying so eventually your brain tussue will break down to the point you are no longer fully fuctional ie memory/behaviour impairment and things gradually deteriorate. sinc these occur even in the lifespans we currently have extending much further does not seem likely.

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Ace Of Spades
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 10:27
Quote: "brain cells) and they are constantly dying"

I would suggest laying off the crack. Good fix for that sort of thing.

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UnderLord
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 11:03
I didnt read al lthe replys but it clearly said that they remove all the blood from the animal (and someday i bet person) then put in that solution which is only a few degree's warmer then zero then fix whatever killed them if they can then put the blood back in with 100% oxygen then give them a eletrical shock to bring them back...appearently its not theory anymore.

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dj blackdragon3710
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 11:08 Edited at: 29th Jun 2005 11:08
Doesn't this sounds kind of like Demolition man? Except all they did was externally freeze them....they shocked him back...

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Phaelax
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Posted: 29th Jun 2005 12:29
The article didn't say how long the dogs were dead, nor did it say how "alive" they really were. Did they get brain activity over a monitor? Or did the dogs get up and run around? It's very interesting, but also very scary at the same time.

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Jeku
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Posted: 30th Jun 2005 02:00
Quote: "They will just use an excuse like this!
"When you die you go to heaven/hell then you have no memories of it when your brought back alive!""


The only people who would say something that stupid are people who say religious people will say that.


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KYP
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Posted: 30th Jun 2005 07:07
i think when you get brought back, your brain still works but you have no personality...
you cant tell with dogs, cuz all dogs are the same : lick, jump, eat. if people actually tried on people, they would actually be "zombies" because they have absolutely no personality. if you asked them a question (eg: what is the stupidest thing you ever did?), they would answer without feeling embarrassment.



weird.

Zone Chicken
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Posted: 30th Jun 2005 07:33
Quote: "The article didn't say how long the dogs were dead"


From this line i would guess they where dead 3 hours

Quote: "But three hours later, their blood is replaced and the zombie dogs are brought back to life with an electric shock."


Since the brain will start dying after a couple mins with no oxygen from blood, after they drained the body of the blood they would have to get the ice-cold salt solution into the body extreamly fast. Pretty interesting stuff though if they ever do advance it to the point of human use since it could possibly save lives.

Quote: "you cant tell with dogs, cuz all dogs are the same : lick, jump, eat. if people actually tried on people, they would actually be "zombies" "


I might disagree with that because if you teach a dog tricks such as jump/rollover/bark/give paw these tricks would be in the dogs memory it is not something that a dog is born with (it is the dogs personality through experience). If the dog is brought back to life and all these things are in tack then i would think the same could be possible with human. The only way that memory should be lost is if the brain started to deteriorate, and what makes your personality is your memory its is all the experiences you have had in life and how those experiences have effected or changed you. (these are just my thoughts)

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TKF15H
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Posted: 30th Jun 2005 08:33
Quote: " i think when you get brought back, your brain still works but you have no personality..."

That makes no sense to me. Then again, I haven't gotten to the point of sticking my little brother in the fridge yet, I'll let you guys know the results when I do.

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qwe
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Posted: 30th Jun 2005 15:38
why dont i see the really cool news stories on the major news sites like cnn?

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Mattman
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 04:24
Quote: "[quote]brain cells) and they are constantly dying"
I would suggest laying off the crack. Good fix for that sort of thing.
"
[/quote]

Crack has nothing to do with it. All of our brain cells would die if we could escape death. And there isn't really a way of creating new ones (at least without keeping your memories intact)

Word.
James Morgan
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 04:36
Quote: "Crack has nothing to do with it. All of our brain cells would die if we could escape death. And there isn't really a way of creating new ones (at least without keeping your memories intact"


True, but I think I read somewhere that certain sea creaters such as sharks don't loose braincells. Maybe when they master genetic engineering they could stop our cells dying.

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Keaz
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 05:02 Edited at: 1st Jul 2005 05:06
A couple of medical facts:

@mm0zct
"Neurons" and "glial cells" AKA Brain and Spinal cord cells can be regenerated. They are orginally produced while we are children from stem cells. This is the purpose of stem cell research. However they are dead they're stored information is lost. So while life span can be extended by regenerating(cheat death) them memory can not(quality of life issues like alzheimer's). However motor functions can adapt to new cells(They can remove half your brain and you can live and regain full motor control.A hemispherectomy is used in some severe epilepsy patients). There is resarch into repairing damaged cells going on as we type. This is the only way to truely improve natural life span.

@Leys
Quote: "I would suggest laying off the crack. Good fix for that sort of thing."

But I like the "fix" it gives me.

This is one step closer to cryogenics (technically it's 3 hour cryogenics)

The 5W's about the:
Who: Dr. Peter (Now deceased 8/03) Ironic? AKA "The father of CPR"
Nominated for Nobel Prize 3 times etc...

What:Replaced dog's blood with saline solution and 7Deg Cel. waited upto 3 hours (generally only successfull after 1 to 2 hrs max.). During which time there was no brain activity, or heartbeat AKA they were clinically dead. Replace saline soultion with heavily oxygenated blood. Shock the poor buggers. And they were brought back to life with little or no "major organ damage".(That would seem to indicate fully alive and moving around.)

When:About 3 days ago. (The good doctor didn't see his last work reach fruition.)

Why:To advance medical science and save lives. (Hmmmm... No time for surgery! Let's replace their blood and kill them?) Practicality, if you don't have time for surgery, do you have time to replace their blood?

Next up: Next up dogsicles brought in from China by PETA(People for Eating Tasty Animals.

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Keaz
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 05:05
@James
Sharks do lose brain cells, but don't get cancer(including brain cancer).

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KYP
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 08:13
zone chicken: if i post something, i usually thought of it, so i might be wrong.

Philip
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 08:23
Quote: ""Plans to test the technique on humans should be realised within a year""


I look forward to seeing them find some genuinely willing volunteers. Lets assume a hypothetical scenario of you wandering through a shopping centre and being approached by a lady holding a clipboard and wearing a suspiciously wide smile:

"Sir ... I wonder ... have you ever considered volunteering to die?"

Doesn't sound terribly inviting, does it?

Also, the law is well and truly in the way. As a matter of English law, you cannot consent to someone else killing you. So even if the scientific company gets forms completed by you in triplicate, and then something goes wrong, and you don't revive, then the medical scientists who conducted the operation will all get successfully prosecuted for murder (which carries a mandatory sentence of life imprisonment), and the directors and officers of the medical company (as well as middle management) will probably be: (a) prosecuted for corporate manslaughter (if not murder); and (b) have their bottoms sued off until they have no personal assets left.

Hence the reason why, when a Hospital wants to pull the plug on a brain dead patient (which is an extreme fact scenario a long way distant from the fact scenario of a healthy person agreeing to be technically killed), the NHS trust which runs the Hospital has to make an application to the Court and ask the Court to decide what to do. The Court almost invariably says that the Trust has to keep providing medical care and cannot terminate the patient.

So, realistically, this technology is NOT going to happen, even if it is feasible.

Philip

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indi
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 11:31
this is going to stuff up the whole life insurance forms for application.

i can see a checkbox now : have you recently died?, how many times have you been revived?. this factors in your well being and only increases the premiums

also: does this mean you can hang your death certificate on the wall next to your birth certificate, does this mean that once your dead your property and assets are lost?. do you have to reapply for your credit cards

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qwe
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 12:33
here's my 2 bucks

"But your skin would be all wrinkly..." once we get the technology to cheat death, i think we'll have the technology to keep our bodies younger as well...

"Soul issue? What about the friggin' overpopulation issue?" There is lots of unused usable land. We aren't overpopulated, we are just focusing all of our wealth in tiny areas, ie, western society. its a distribution of resources crisis, not resources crisis

"Thats where nature comes in to even itself out, as it becomes overpopulated, needed resources will run out, then people will die off from lack of resources" Or we'll be in space by then

"If people start dying from lack of resources, the planet will erupt in panic and people will start killing and eating eachother" People are dying from lack of resources all the time in Africa, and you don't see cannibals eating eachother on the news there

"I believe in the strongest/smartest survive...as long as you can take stuff from others, and not have it taken from you...you'll be alright." A panicy world as described.....would be too random to say skill would keep you alive. not that this world will occur though

"lays, about cheating death, your brain cannot grow new neurones (brain cells) and they are constantly dying so eventually your brain tussue will break down to the point you are no longer fully fuctional ie memory/behaviour impairment and things gradually deteriorate. sinc these occur even in the lifespans we currently have extending much further does not seem likely." Again... if we get the technology to cheat death, part of that technology will be growing new neurons which our brain will use automatically

"I would suggest laying off the crack. Good fix for that sort of thing." A better fix would be smart drugs like aniracetam which are neuroprotectant

"you cant tell with dogs, cuz all dogs are the same : lick, jump, eat"...i dont think you're a pet owner... dogs recognize people, have distinct behavior patterns, have learned tricks, etc.

" if people actually tried on people, they would actually be "zombies" because they have absolutely no personality" you're stating your speculation as if it's fact. this has the potential to save lives, i think we should try it before making such strong conclusions

by the way, neurons in the hippocampus and one other area of the brain naturally reproduce. i'm sure we could get the other brain cells to reproduce with teh right science

"I look forward to seeing them find some genuinely willing volunteers. Lets assume a hypothetical scenario of you wandering through a shopping centre and being approached by a lady holding a clipboard and wearing a suspiciously wide smile:" I imagine you'd sign something saying they can freeze you if you are injured and losing a lot of blood and the only way you have a chance at living is by this method

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qwe
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 15:32
we arent going to be able to keep people from dying any time soon. i think (hope) by the time we can, resources wont be a problem. there are many technologies that may become available that will change the resource picture, like AI, space colonies, hydrogen (or other non fossil) fuel, and any new scientific discoveries

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MiR
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 20:58
Quote: "there are many technologies that may become available that will change the resource picture"

And what´s wrong with RECYCLING? Seriously we shouldn´t be looking at ways of gaining more resources but instead on ways that we can minimize what we use and resue what we have.


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Ace Of Spades
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2005 01:11
Quote: "as population increases city size increase
as city size increases farm land decreases
as farm land decreases food supply decreases
as food supply decreases people starve to death..."


as people starve to death city size decreases
as city size decreases farm land increases
as farmland increases population increases until it hits your cycle again...

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qwe
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2005 03:58
Quote: "as population increases city size increase
as city size increases farm land decreases
as farm land decreases food supply decreases
as food supply decreases people starve to death..."


Replace the text "food supply decreases" with "farming technology increases"

No one is going to starve to death lmao

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Mattman
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2005 05:21
Quote: "No one is going to starve to death lmao"



Yeah they are. Someday the only living people will be cannibles. Then the cannibles will eat each other until there is one left and he gets bored so he eats himself. The End

Word.
Jeku
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 17:36
@Philip - But you're assuming they would need to kill someone to test this. They could test it on people that have been killed naturally (i.e. car accident, drowning, etc.). The family would probably be more than happy to allow the doctors to revive their little Johnny Sixpack


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Undercover Steve
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 20:03
My opinion is that when ww3 happens, the world wont have over population issues. We might have soldiers that can live forever (there goes fun war games), and civilians that who happen to be real rich leaving for a while too.
Keaz
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Posted: 4th Jul 2005 00:00 Edited at: 4th Jul 2005 00:19
Just being able to repair the wounds later doesn't take the fun out of war. Just look at FPS's... no real death but still fun. Maybe one day we can have a sort of real FPS that goes a little further than paintball.

P.S. I still believe nanobots are the real future of medical technology. I only hope I live to see it. BTW The human genetic code has about 3 Billion 2bit intructions (4 combos per instruction) so a nanobot would need 6 gigabits(750 Megabytes) of memory just for genetic code. It would need to be as small as a cell and carry the aprropriate tools for repairs. So, it's stills a ways off, but they do have 2 Gigabyte SD cards.

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