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Geek Culture / Teenager Anarchy

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Killswitch
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Location: School damnit!! Let me go!! PLEASE!!!
Posted: 23rd Jul 2005 22:16
It really does annoy me when people apply the 'chav' stero type to all teenagers. This, in my experience, is espically true of elderly people on buses. This too may sound like an unfair sterotype, but they are the only people who have ever done this to me.

I have to get a lot of buses, I'm a 45 minute bus ride from my school and most of my friends. I try my hardest to give up my seats for people who deserve them more than I but sometimes I just won't. One time I was sitting in a seat that your specifically supposed to give up for those who need it more than you. I ws staring out of the window so I didn't notice most of the people when they came on. The I started hearing the guy next to me and an eldery lady who'd just come on the bus start talking about 'young people these days'. Saying how we didn't have any respect or disapline and do way too many drugs - and I saw her have a sideways glance at me!

This really, really wound me up. The hardest drug I've ever done is asprin, and I avoid taking those if I can help it. Granted there are *some* people who fit the sterotype she was using but there are many others who don't.

My friends and I also get followed by security gaurds in shops, even though we'd never shoplift - though I suppose the shop doesn't know that.

~It's a common mistake to make, the rules of the English langauge do not apply to insanity~
Megaton Cat
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Location: Toronto, Canada
Posted: 24th Jul 2005 06:50
Stupid question: What is a chav?


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Benjamin
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Posted: 24th Jul 2005 06:58
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=chav


"Lets migrate like bricks" - Me
DBAlex
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Posted: 24th Jul 2005 06:59
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Chav


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DBAlex
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Posted: 24th Jul 2005 07:02 Edited at: 24th Jul 2005 07:03
lol !



EDIT: I posted the above at the same time... I hadnt seen Benjamins post... Spooky...


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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 24th Jul 2005 07:20
Quote: "Picture this a young lad about 12 years of age and 4 ½ feet high baseball cap at ninety degrees in a imitation addidas tracksuit, with trouser legs tucked into his socks (of course, is definitely the height of fashion). This lad is strutting around, fag in one hand jewellery al over the over, outside McDonalds acting as if he is 8 foot tall and built like a rugby player, when some poor unsuspecting adult (about 17/18) walks round the corner wanting to go to mcdonalds for his dinner glances at the young lad, the young lad jumps up in complete disgust and says “Whats your problem? Wanna make sommin of it? Bling Bling” when the adult starts to walk towards the young lad, the young lad pisses himself and runs off to either his pregnant 14-year-old girlfriend or his brother in the army crying his eyes out.
My mate has become a chav what can i do? answer is shoot him before it is too late"


This is why I think British people are so funny.


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Blazer
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Posted: 24th Jul 2005 08:21
Quote: "Obviously, people are generally good"


are you sure about that? I guess it depends on your definition of good.

I discriminate against discriminating people....
BenDstraw
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Posted: 25th Jul 2005 16:34
good as in youll probaly never see anyone with a machine gun blasting people. most people are good if you compare to how bad people can get.

Megaton Cat
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Posted: 26th Jul 2005 02:39
I shall go crime-fighting.


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Briere
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Posted: 26th Jul 2005 02:47
I'm 16 and I do what ever I wan't. Luckily for my parents, I also happen to be a mature teenager, and behave very well

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David R
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Posted: 26th Jul 2005 03:02
Quote: "This is why I think British people are so funny."


And that's why 4/5 of people in America have relatives that can be traced directly back to Britain or British colonies

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BenDstraw
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Posted: 26th Jul 2005 05:44
Megaton Cat is from Canada theres a chance hes french.

Megaton Cat
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Posted: 28th Jul 2005 00:50
Quote: " Megaton Cat is from Canada theres a chance hes french."


Since when do French people reside in Toronto. O_o


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Jeku
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Posted: 28th Jul 2005 08:40
Since when didn't they? Or is that a joke? Hehe.

A hell of lot more people are french over there than over here. Here we have lots of Asians


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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 28th Jul 2005 11:35
This is Canada. It is universal that we have alot, if I may say, too many multi-cultural people. Saying something "He's Canadian. Good chance he's French" really doesn't mean anything, because...everyone is different here.


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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 30th Jul 2005 19:19
anyone heard about this 16 yr old girl who was raped, and the whole thing was recorded on a mobile phone and sent around? i never thought it'd get any worse than recording assults etc. Sickens me.

To be honest i do think it's a class thing. A general rule is people will always become what you fear them to be. the toffs and upperclass pigs have always looked down lower classes seeing them as uncultured and unruly etc, and this is what has happened.

not just a class thing though, i also see it as a government/council thing, example below.

what i do hate though is the way chavs/neds/pikeys etc have given all kids a bad name. my village has been put under curfew many times, where 16 yr olds or under havent been allowed out at all after 6, or during day time in groups of more than 3. The irony is that most of the kids who cause trouble in this village come from the nearby town of redditch, and are aged 16-19. ruins it for the rest of my generation. we can't have any fun around here. money that was going to be spent on a skatepark was instead used to build a townhall, so us kids are still out on the street board, nothing to do. no wonder we're now kown as the generation who just sit infront of the x-box all day with an increasing obesity problem, while the other half of us go out, looking for something to do, and resort to being antisocial for kicks.
Benjamin
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Posted: 30th Jul 2005 20:06
I agree with you goorf, a lot of people cause trouble because they are just bored.


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Northern Lights
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Location: Minnesota, USA
Posted: 30th Jul 2005 20:55
Quote: "Do you get fed-up with the portrayal of teenagers in the news as being socially enept criminals, or do you think it's pretty accurate?!"


Based on where I live I would say that the news is pretty accurate. I go to one of the top five public schools in my state, where my school gets the highest test scores consistantly, and all you see in my high school is teenagers smoking pot/drinking to a point of addiction. I myself went out to a park in my town (mind you, this is a town with a population of 3000) with my dad and we found a ~20x20ft patch of land that somebody was using to grow marijuana. Meth is also a very common drug around my school. I think that it all stems back to parents not punishing their kids enough. I knew one boy who could do anything he wanted and all he got as punishment was a ten minute timeout(at the time, the boy was in sixth grade-far too old for timeouts) and from what I've seen, this form of punishment is very common. When I was a young child (4-8yrs) and I did something wrong, all it took was a good spanking and I never did it again. I think parents need to do things like that when their kids are young to make their kids respect their opinions from a very early age. When the child gets older, parents should start to take away things that they want the most when they do bad things, and above all - take every little thing very seriously because it may be leading to something bigger. Even if it doesn't, they should make sure that it never will lead to something more serious. Another example - A boy in my grade (typical spoiled, popular brat) would interrupt my elderly science teacher to make fun of her so the whole class could hear him. My teacher couldn't do anything about it because the worst the school can do is detention (this boy didn't care because his parents never punished him for getting detention). Another boy in my science class was sent to our principal for backtalking to the teacher. He went as far as to pick up a chair and act like he was going to hit her over the head with it while she had her back turned (very cowardly thing to do to a 60+ year old lady isn't it?)! Both of these last examples happened when I was in eigth grade(13-14yr old kids). I think all of those examples justify me thinking the media is actually right for once.

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 30th Jul 2005 22:46
Every kid is different, and many are just stupid. There isn't a single word that could catagorize all of them. Alot of people have behavior problems, some people can't sit still, others are selfish, and some grew up in a bad environment.


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UnderLord
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 06:15
The wya a person is molded into what they become depends on there enviroment the people they choose to hang out with where they grew up who raised them (which falls under enviroment) and the choices they make in life.

Watch the butterfly effect (a movie) it will show you the choices of life and how diffrent ones effect your life and the ones around you. Its not the nest movie in the world but its a pretty good example for this discussion.

I believe i turned out the way i did because of the people i hang out with and who i used to hang out with i used to hang out with people who got me into trouble eventually i discovered i was good with computers thus finding this out leads me to getting more involved with computers and will eventually lead me somewhere good or bad who knows.

But children in todays society even if there parents are strict as all heck some still turn out bad because of the people they choose to hang out with. Advertisement and other things like music can also influence young people.

example -

most young kids i know who listin to rap think they are gangsters because the music talks about it (why i dunno) this leads to them being more violent as adults (but isnt a proven fact)

I myself am 20 i listin to rock this dosnt make me a rebel or anything liek that because society has dubbed rock music as music that rebels and the such listin to.

So in closer kids/ "young adults" are shaped and molded by who they pick as friends and there choices as well as parenting no kid thinks they can get away with anything because they think no one will care.

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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 19:38
to put it one way, anarchy comes in 2 forms:

those who want to be disruptive and cause trouble (chavs)

and those who just want to be themselves regardless of societies laws (skaters/goths/etc)

its society that always gets the 2 different groups of "anarchists" muddled, and very badly too.

i hope none of you are wearing hoodies btw, or rich shall ban you from the TGC shopping centre.
Drew Cameron
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 23:00 Edited at: 31st Jul 2005 23:05
They're called NED's, not CHAV's GRRR!!!!!!!!!!

I think a main cause of all these problems is boredom. When you've got no money and nothing to do, vandalism and trouble making can be fun.

I used to be a little rebel actually, I hung around with one guy who was in hindsight a real dick, and whenever he was bored he'd suggest vandalising or trouble making. I went along because I was bored and it was fun. He moved away and I grew up properly (IMO) after that. Thus proves the power of peers. I wasn't pressured in any way by him, because we were on an equal social level, but I didn't know any better and just went along with alot of his example.

He eventually moved back, and he is not a nice guy any more.


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Killswitch
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Location: School damnit!! Let me go!! PLEASE!!!
Posted: 31st Jul 2005 23:21
I bet you call grungers gribos!

~It's a common mistake to make, the rules of the English langauge do not apply to insanity~
Ian T
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 06:53 Edited at: 1st Aug 2005 06:57
The recent string of "happy slap" rapes makes a few things quite clear...

1. The people who do this have no respect or regard for other people's rights

2. The people who do this are either stupid or uncaring enough to distribute video evidence of what they're doing

3. The people who do this need to be shot

I don't think it's realistic to blame the parents. There is an extremely unhealthy culture of, basically, destruction-- self-destruction and complete disregard for other people. It seems like more and more people are joining those ranks every day. That kind of peer pressure and elitism is something that even very good parenting can't really cure. And how can parents be expected to be held responsible when the government teaches them to give their children up to the system from day one? Daycare through university, the government forces children to spend more time in their system than in their parents' care. And this is the ultimate result when personal authority figures are completely removed.

Of course I think parenting also plays a part - as well as desensitisation to sex and violence. Not to sound like a puritan here, but it's hard to deny that in a society where 12 yaer olds weren't expected to watch movies and play games with mature content that goes completely over their head and leaves only the impressions of the most visceral elements, this kind of thing wouldn't happen. And with that example again, blaming the parents doesn't work, because it's virtually impossible for parents to stop their children from being exposed to that kind of stuff at school, at friends' houses, etc.

It's amusing in a sad way how our society basically steals children from their parents and then uses them as the scapegoat for how fucked up they turn out.

If I looking for blog
Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 13:05
drew- just to point out, there is a ranking:

Townies (mostly tolerable- only go as extreme as wearing the same football shirt every day. These guys dont offend anyoen in any way however, unless you support an opposing footy team.)

Rudes (like townies, but more likely to go around making noise, or yelling your name in a silly voice as you enter the room etc- still nothing to worry about- if they realise they've offended you, they're most likely to apologise.)

CHAVs (These are the kids around here- there are the type that will go to vandelising extremes or being offensivly antisocial, and actually meaning it (so no apologies granted), you'll see the cops around there houses about once a fortnight)

NEDs (this is the scottish term for CHAV, meaning "non-educated delinquent". the rule is, you start south: chavs get worse the further north you go, until you reach scotland, then it goes to a whole new ranking. an example of an encounter with a group of NED's:
i was sitting outside a corner shop, when these neds came over, and a car alarm went off (for no reason)- the neds then circled the car, and hurled verbal abuse at it- you could say these guys are like chavs, but quite rightly, non-educated. ITS A CAR!)

"pikeys" go in there somewhere but i dunno where.
Drew Cameron
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 15:19
Yeah, I know about the 'rankings' and I definately know what a NED is thankyou. I live in Scotland.



No offence of flaming intended! I agree with your descriptions.


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David T
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 15:49 Edited at: 1st Aug 2005 16:00
Quote: "Kids are forced into dress codes all day, (Unlike my school) which drives them mad"


It's called a uniform We have one, it's a good idea. Stops any problems arising from fashion / stereotypes etc.

Quote: "I disagree with this and believe it's more an issue of social class / parenting / environment that breeds this, just like it did 20+ years ago when I was a kid. I don't believe the root causes have changed.

But, as I'm not actually a teenager any more and don't attend schools - what do you all think? Seeing as most of you are. Do you get fed-up with the portrayal of teenagers in the news as being socially enept criminals, or do you think it's pretty accurate?!"



Yes.

I'm an (admittedly) clever, mild mannered teenager friends with mild mannered people (and most are the more clever ones, I admit).

Then again there are also people in my year who I wouldn't touch with a barge pole.

Going to a private school I haven't been exposed to society's full spectrum but even now I can see its entirely down to upbringing. The only reason there is so much media attention on teenage behaviour is because those that cause it go out and do it.

It's just that the sane of us don't. Hence you never hear about us.

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
Megaton Cat
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 16:43 Edited at: 1st Aug 2005 22:26
Quote: "It's amusing in a sad way how our society basically steals children from their parents and then uses them as the scapegoat for how f*cked up they turn out."


So you suggest the entire country becomes home-schooled?

And also, what is a "happy slap" rape? :S

EDIT:

And mods, next time please post responsibly and remember that we users still have the language filter set, so it's a pain in the ass having edit all your "f*cks" and "sh*ts" everytime we wish to quote you.

thanks



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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 19:59 Edited at: 1st Aug 2005 20:00
happy slapping is the new chav craze. its where they go an attack people in the street or on the bus or in school etc, while someone else, or a group of other people film it on their mobile phones, and then send the footage to all their friends, or put them on kazaa etc
Benjamin
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 20:43 Edited at: 1st Aug 2005 20:43
Society is messed up. Bugger putting these people in prison, just shoot them I say.


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David T
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 22:08
Quote: "And mods, next time please post responsibly and remember that we users still have the language filter set, so it's a pain in the ass having edit all your "f*cks" and "sh*ts" everytime we wish quote you."


Why not just ask the person directly, reading that comment above makes us all look like swearing lunatics.

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
Benjamin
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 22:19
Theres nothing lunatic about swearing.


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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 22:25 Edited at: 1st Aug 2005 22:26
Even though it's usually 2-3 specific mods who do this, I think they know who they are.


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Benjamin
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 22:39
And an administrator. I won't be naming anyone now..


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AluminumPork
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2005 14:56
I've been 18 for a little while now, and I'm starting college (univ?) in a few months as I live over in the states. I consider myself a "good kid". Don't really get into much trouble, no drunks, alchohol, smoking, etc. I treat people with respect, hold a higher than most job and drive a higher than most car (only because I'm an enthusiast, not a snob).

In some way, I do blame bad parenting. In general, the people I know who are racist, have racist parents. The people who have 2 kids at 19, have parents who had them at 15 or 16. It seems that kids follow parents in alot of respects. My dad's a gearhead, therefore I'm a gearhead.

But there are the exceptions, I know quite a few people who are heavy on drugs who don't have parents that were into that sort of thing, but in these cases there are generally other sources that I can see threw them in the wrong direction. I don't blame games, but I can see why parents feel that games may be a problem. I don't see any connection from games to "bad" people I know. In most cases, they're the nicest, non-violent people I know. I was, for example, pretty heavy into games early on, and yet I've never thrown a punch.

Actually, it seems that too much parenting is the cause for violence/disrespect/drugs/alchohol/smoking. I've seen parents who punish their kids for every last thing, constantly cutting their kids down at an early age. It seems that those kids are the ones who "lash out". Their parents want them to be so perfect and so involved, instead of being happy, or having friends or having a good parent-child relationship.

That's my take.

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Ian T
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2005 21:50
Quote: "So you suggest the entire country becomes home-schooled?"


Hardly. I'm not suggesting anything, I'm observing a problem. Schools are not equipped to give children the care, discipline and moral teaching they need from parents, but they try to anyway. It doesn't help that most parents are expected, and many have to, work full-time jobs leaving little room for their children. There's simply not enough time being spent with the younger generation, and with cable television and the internet, the result is that they're "growing up" faster, but without the maturity and steadfast moral compass they would have if their parents spent more time with them. Now, again, I don't think this is bad parenting, I think the problem is that most parents work too much and the schools demand too much time from children.

This is all from personal experience, really. I've known (not well, but indirectly) too many good parents of druggies and the US equivilant of chavs. They did their best with the time they had, but they just didn't have enough time.

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DARKGuy
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Posted: 3rd Aug 2005 01:30 Edited at: 3rd Aug 2005 01:36
I've been reading this thread and cool things have came on mind...

I'm a teenager, 16 years old, and I've basically grown up in the computer. Why? Dad never took us (I have a sister too) out, his excuse was "We have no money" yet he was a lazy... bum and didn't even bothered to find a job. I have been raised "the good ways" as some say, I don't hit girls (I hit ON them though ), I didn't watched any terror movie in my childhood and was 90% of the time in front of a monitor, a keyboard and a mouse. I remember when I was like, 14, I was in a PSX game store looking around a CD to buy, and then a little kid (he couldn't be more than 10, he was smaller, too) was next to me looking too, and then he calls his mom and goes like "Mommy mommy, I want this one! " pointing at Resident Evil, and the mom goes like "Okay" and buys him that game (Good thing people here speak Spanish, it would have been more disturbing for him if it was in Spanish and not in English). Hell, I can try play that game now and I'm sure my stomach will turn upside down (But Half Life/Q3A/Doom3 doesn't do that to me, curious huh? XD)... I mean, what the hell? the CD cover clearly had a big ESRB logo at the lower-right corner of the cover that said "M" and in small letters "Mature". Psh, like if they both cared.

My sister's friends are kinda like that too, y'know in TV (at least here) they put novels from like 12pm to 3pm for then putting some cartoons and then back to novels from 7-8pm to 12am, then pr0n/terror movies 'til 5:30am, and I was surprised to know that my sister's friends asked her why she didn't watched TV novels, she (being raised as good as my parents could raise us (and still are, at least my sis)) answered with "That's for adults, I don't watch that" yet her friends consider her "weird" and "kiddy" because of that, looking at her like if she's some kind of alien or something like that because she doesn't do what others consider "normal" (which I don't).

All I can say is, that if you're the parent, it's your responsibility to educate, raise and control what your child must and must not see/do, don't expect others to do it for you, I learned what was... er... y'know, at the age of 12, my parents never told me that, and school did it when I was 14 -_-.

[edit]
And... yeah, society sucks now, I hate to see other people of my age (more than 15) and they already smoke and drink, I mean, wtf?? we were talking once with this one pretty girl (who we call "the rapper" just 'cause she looks like one xD) and she was like "Um, I tasted a cigarrette when I was like, 12, and started smoking at 13" we all just nodded and kept talking, but back in my head... hell, I mean, this is depriment. I like Rap/HipHop though, s'cool, what it isn't cool is the lyrics/theme they use nowadays (try to listen to DZK - The DZK (from http://www.soundclick.com and you'll see that's the only song (I think) that doesn't uses the whole lot of trash some hip-hop-pers throw in their "songs" and it has at least some nice lyrics, and it has nothing about killing, getting high, etc, basically an ego-like song, but it's a good one, compared to the type of songs we hear nowadays...) not to mention the Reggaeton, that music, okay, it's highly dance-able, but the lyrics are trash, they deprive women so badly that I don't listen to it because it's offending, just... ew.
[/edit]

Wanna read something funny about an angered mom and the Furcadia game? (it's good, but read the logfile, it was the mom's fault anyways (and someone there explained why, and he's right)) -> http://sen.nova-cl.net/pub/rofl.txt


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