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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] New DBP IDE

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Me!
19
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Joined: 26th Jul 2005
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Posted: 6th Aug 2005 20:33
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not another gruesome VS style ide , I hate that MS uber techy pointless whizzbang stuff, whats wrong with a command line driven interface?

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Nicholas Thompson
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Location: Bognor Regis, UK
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 20:36
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JohnY - your missing the point.. why should DBP users PAY for it? Not just because we've already paid for DBP (and this IDE is not an addition, its meant to be a replacement), but mainly because I haven't seen it do anything special that most free text editors dont do...

My Website:
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John Y
Synergy Editor Developer
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Posted: 6th Aug 2005 20:39
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Quote: "It is up to YOU whether you buy Synergy IDE"



Http://www.DigitalOmega.Net
Http://synergyide.thegamecreators.com
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IanG
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Location: Cyberspace
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 20:41
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Quote: "whats wrong with a command line driven interface?"


They are not user friendly - cmd lines are okay but it's easier to have a nice gui - your compiling and you've made an error at line 2057, you don't want to have to search, or even count, to find that line, you want it to highlight it for you so that you can increase your output


amd athlon xp 2600+,1280mb,FX 5200 128mb,200gb,xp pro sp2
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David R
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Location: 3.14
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 20:47
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Quote: "It is up to YOU whether you buy Synergy IDE"


But as you said - the original IDE is dead

So TGC and you are just taking a commercial advantage of us (the consumer) by charging for this editor - which because the editor is 'dead', we apparently would need not just want




################Dream::Catcher#################
ITS COMING. NOVEMBER 1ST
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John Y
Synergy Editor Developer
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Posted: 6th Aug 2005 20:54
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I feel like I need BlueGUI to make nice GUI applications for my games, but instead I resist temptation and make my own with sprites.

It is up to you what you think you need to make a good game, there is cartography shop, do you think that should be free to Dark Basic users, as they need it?


Http://www.DigitalOmega.Net
Http://synergyide.thegamecreators.com
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David R
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Posted: 6th Aug 2005 20:57 Edited at: 6th Aug 2005 21:01
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I don't think you understand what I'm trying to say;

Cartog. shop etc. are nice little extra's etc. - but we were'nt given a free copy with DBP, then expected to pay in order to upgrade to a new version etc.

That is effectively what you are doing; as you said, the default IDE is 'dead' - and that's why we need to updgrade. TGC and you are just trying to leech an extra bit of cash off of everyone who wants rid of the annoying deafult editor bugs.

We were suppoed to have a working IDE when we bought DBP in the first place; not pay for a new one

EDIT: To everyone else; I'm just having a look at the famous GPL 'NetBeans IDE'. I've just found a 'porting to other languages guide'. I may have a little go at porting it to DBP.


################Dream::Catcher#################
ITS COMING. NOVEMBER 1ST
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Keaz
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Location: Somewhere in south Texas
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 21:01 Edited at: 6th Aug 2005 21:05
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My original IDE (DarkBlue) although not quite finshed used less memory than BlueIDE did(DB vs VB6 not a lot of difference and mine invoked DX). Not hogging memory is possible in DBPro it's more a matter of performance and features versus memory issue. Some tradeoffs in either direction are made. My new one, I'm striving to do even better without non windows plugings so that any DBPro user can compile/modify/dissect it for FREE.

If Synergy is a good byproduct(it's a byproduct of Omega Basic needing an editor) that can also stand in it's own right. Great. People will by it. But if a free IDE does better than it then people won't support it. To make this a viable commercial product it will have to stand far and above the free variants or gain a large "market share" before a free one passes it.

The biggest gripe I've seen has been a matter of presentation and wording. Saying that the original IDE is Dead and that you "need" this "upgrade" is what got feathers ruffled.

Breaking Stuff=Fun!,Bug Testing<>Fun!, Bug Testing=Breaking Stuff, so...
Bug Testing=Fun! Hmmmm....
DOES NOT COMPUTE! SYSTEM MALFUNTION!
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John Y
Synergy Editor Developer
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Posted: 6th Aug 2005 21:04
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The author of the original IDE has left, TGC have no source code and there has not been a release since 2002 or around then. It is not mine, TGC's or anyones fault this happend, but it did.

Your argument has changed to one like Dark Basic and Dark Basic Professional. Why buy Dark Basic Professional if you have Dark Basic, isn't it just TGC leaching cash off people who want a few extra features.

This IDE isn't just a quick rewrite or notepad or anything, please remember that. It has taken time and resources to develop, why should you get it for free?


Http://www.DigitalOmega.Net
Http://synergyide.thegamecreators.com
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Keaz
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Location: Somewhere in south Texas
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 21:08
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Quote: "If Synergy is a good byproduct(it's a byproduct of Omega Basic needing an editor) that can also stand in it's own right. Great. People will by it. But if a free IDE does better than it then people won't support it. To make this a viable commercial product it will have to stand far and above the free variants or gain a large "market share" before a free one passes it."

That's what I just said and wish you luck, but read the end of the last statement I made and you begin to see why feathers are ruffled other than the I want everything free guys or the if they're doing why aren't you guys.

Breaking Stuff=Fun!,Bug Testing<>Fun!, Bug Testing=Breaking Stuff, so...
Bug Testing=Fun! Hmmmm....
DOES NOT COMPUTE! SYSTEM MALFUNTION!
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Xolatron old
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Location: The Star Forge Language: DBpro
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 21:12 Edited at: 6th Aug 2005 21:13
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I agree with Keaz (2nd of his post above esp). Synergy IDE needs to be FAR above the free competition and Original IDE to get buys. The comparison table tries to show this, but I believe that it is a little unfair:
- It only compares Synergy o the Original IDE, not BlueIDE or Twilight.
- It offers few specific details when giving the Original IDE a lower rating.
- It is biased towards Synergy's way of doing things. Why are project settings better in a table than in tabs?
- It only has table elements that Synergy is good at. For example, there's no cell for cost or file importing (convert to data statements)

-Xol

Ion Extension Pack: 50 funcs
IonRay IDE
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the_winch
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Joined: 1st Feb 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 23:25
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Quote: "The author of the original IDE has left, TGC have no source code and there has not been a release since 2002 or around then. It is not mine, TGC's or anyones fault this happend, but it did."


It's entirely tgcs fault. They decided to have the ide developed externally without access to source code. Perhaps it was the best option available to them at the time but how can it not be their fault? It's their product.

I think it's unfortunate when they start selling third party fixes for their products as it provides no incentive to fix them.
Why would they improve the collision when they can sell you ngc?
Why would they do anything about the ide situation when they can sell a third party one?
Why would they improve the compiler when they can sell you darksdk.
etc.

What's next? Third party debugger or help files would be my guess.

Sure they have to make money but I think they sometimes go a bit too far in the wrong direction.
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MikeS
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Posted: 6th Aug 2005 23:35
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I'm kind of amazed that less than a month ago everyone wanted a new IDE. Now that their is a commercial one in development, everyone is complaining. There are still many other free ide's around 3 which I could find in the W.I.P boards right now. If you use Omega Basic& DBC/DBP, then JohnY's ide may be perfect for you. If not, then maybe you'll want to consider another alternative. That's the way I see it at least.



A book? I hate book. Book is stupid.
(Formerly Yellow)
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Xolatron old
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Location: The Star Forge Language: DBpro
Posted: 6th Aug 2005 23:48
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Yes, everyone wanted TGC to make one of the free IDEs 'official', or to make a new, FREE IDE. Nobody wanted another 'Let's see if they will buy this too' product. It's enough having the expansion pack when many DBpro commands are bugged.

-Xol

Ion Extension Pack: 50 funcs
IonRay IDE
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David T
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Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: England
Posted: 7th Aug 2005 00:12
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Quote: "People don't realise how difficult a good syntax highlighter is to make"


Don't, use something like codemax (Jeku got it working in .net)

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
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Jeku
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Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 7th Aug 2005 22:02
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Quote: "We were suppoed to have a working IDE when we bought DBP in the first place; not pay for a new one"


The original one IS working and it's just fine. JohnY isn't holding a gun to your head and saying you must upgrade. What's the big deal? If he developed an awesome IDE and would like some compensation for it, who are you guys to knock him for it?

What is this, communism? Everyone must work together and release their products for free?

For those complaining that it's not as good as Blue, or whatever, then don't buy it. I use Visual Studio everyday at work and I happen to think it's got a great interface. The best development IDE out there. Did I expect it for free? No. I know I'll be looking forward to trying out all the new IDEs, regardless of their market, including Fuse and Synergy.


My "everyone else has one so why can't I?" blog: http://www.jeku.com/blog/
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David T
Retired Moderator
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Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: England
Posted: 8th Aug 2005 01:27
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Fuse and Synergy do sound the same don't they?

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
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PowerSoft
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Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 8th Aug 2005 12:06 Edited at: 8th Aug 2005 12:07
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*edit*

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Dave J
Retired Moderator
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Location: Secret Military Pub, Down Under
Posted: 8th Aug 2005 14:52
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Quote: "It's entirely tgcs fault. They decided to have the ide developed externally without access to source code. Perhaps it was the best option available to them at the time but how can it not be their fault? It's their product."


Lots of companies outsource parts of a project, it's common practice in the industry and it's not unusual for things to go sour resulting in lost work.


Either way, we've gone over common ground here a hundred times before. Let's stop this now before it degrades anymore.


"Computers are useless, they can only give you answers."
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