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Geek Culture / ummm, a lil help please

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 20:06
as I am looking for a new graphics card, I have found a few, I know my PC is AGP slotted, and the requirements fit, but I don\'t know whether it handles AGP 8x my current card is AGP 4x, so can some dude tell me how to find out with out taking my computer apart

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David R
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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 20:17
The free version of 'system information viewer', will allow you to see your chipsets speed etc.

http://www.lavalys.com/products/download.php?pid=1&lang=en

Look for a screen like the following, once you've downloaded;




################Dream::Catcher#################
ITS COMING. NOVEMBER 1ST
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 20:17 Edited at: 10th Aug 2005 20:35
thanks dude

[edit]

bugger only up to 4x!!!!

So can anyone tell me where I can get a decent graphics card that fits into AGP 4x I'm looking for a 128MB one or better

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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 21:23 Edited at: 10th Aug 2005 21:26
an agp 8x card will fit and run, it just can`t go as fast as it could on a 8x port, but it will go as fast as the 4x port will allow, so it would go as fast as an hypothetical 4x card would, I doubt you could find any 4x cards any more (unless they are old stock), but an 8x will work fine.



[edit} at that you don`t realy need anything much more than a fx5200 or the ATI equivalent, anything much faster couldn`t actualy GO faster on that port.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 21:30 Edited at: 10th Aug 2005 21:33
k cool thanks, I'll see what I can get
[edit]
I checked that one out, but all on ebuyer were AGPs, my real thought is, can a 4x go as fast as 128mb? then if it can, then if AGP 8x works just fine, then I don't care, because I'm not gonna get a card if my PC's maximum is 128mb as my current card is 64mb

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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 21:44
umm?? 128mb is the amount of memory on the card that holds all the textures etc, all that a slower port means is that the memory takes longer to fill with data so your software initialises a bit slower as it stuffs all the textures and models onto the gfx card, most games currently don`t benefit from more than 128mb anyway (but more is always good), games like DoomIII are more hungry for system memory, its playable (with odd stutters) on 512mb but 1gig of ram speeds it up nicely, the number after agp (like 2x, 4x, 8x etc) is the speed of the interface, it has nothing to do with the memory, you can stick a 256 or 512mb card on a 4x port, it will just run slower when it has to swap data in from the main memory, although most coders try to keep all the models etc in the card memory, so it shouldn`t show during normal gameplay apart from when the card suddenly needs the next area of a map and its textures etc.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 21:48
so whats the maximum speed on a AGP 4x, as I always get a low FPS and on my Ronin engine the graphic stutter, and the more features I add onto some games and quality it gets even slower, and I can't handle shaders, so what would I search for there? (I know for shaders I need a graphics card that can handle em, I've found tonnes that can)

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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 22:06 Edited at: 10th Aug 2005 22:19
think of it this way, the pc memory is the storage area for the data for the game, the agp port is the motorway to the gfx card, the memory on the GFX card is the storage for the gfx and textures/shaders being used in the game, the 2x, 4x, 8x are the number of lanes leading to the card (like a motorway), the more lanes the faster the card can load data, but the card runs at a speed all of its own.

a cheap 8x agp card will run no faster than an old TNT2, a fast 8x card will blow your socks off, the only time the port slows down the card is if you need to swap huge amounts of data onto the card in a very small amount of time, and that doesn`t happen often, your stuttering before was not an issue with the port, just that the GFX card was well dated and struggling, the GFX card is a seperate computer dedicated just to rendering GFX, nothing else, the speed of that card is what gives you results, I know that on a lower spec athlon cpu (1.4ghz) with agp4x and a 128mb fx5200 graphics card, and 512mb of system ram, that Unreal tournament 2004 and Farcry run ok, as do RTCW and anything before that.

thats pretty good for older technology, from what I read of your specs your bigger issue is going to be the CPU, 1.5gighz will start to look slow in the next few years, any modern card (eg fx5200 ultra) should suit you fine.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 22:20
I know, I might end up getting a new pc, or just buy updated parts for it, which maybe cheaper, after gfx card, may as well try motherboard, so may as well go for an agp 8x as it may prove more useful later, of course I'd prefer to get a boxxtech or alien ware computer, but my wallet will not like it, so prolly end up just keep updating my system

and cheers for the advice dude, I'll check the computer shop where my sister got her card from and see what they'll say about motherboards etc whiles I am at it

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Posted: 10th Aug 2005 22:59 Edited at: 10th Aug 2005 23:01
no problem, if you plan on upgrading then plan for the future, see if you can afford a PCI express mobo and GFX card, that should give you a serious speed boost in the gfx department above and beyond what agp can manage.



ps: as long as that shop isn`t PC world, their advisors are often worryingly wrong in almost all respects
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 11th Aug 2005 00:30 Edited at: 11th Aug 2005 00:49
cool thanks, funny thing is my to old broken PCs were PCI, and well mine and my sisters where AGP, so I assumed AGP was better nope, just motherboards in Compaqs are better than ones in Packard Bell I guess, even though the mother boards could only hack up to Pentium II

[edit] sweet I found an interesting mother board with

1xAGP 8x
3x PCI
and an AMD Sempron 2400+ processor (guessing thats around 2.4 ghz)
and a bunch of essential crap, just hope it'll be able to fit in with my system

and for only £60

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Posted: 11th Aug 2005 14:09 Edited at: 11th Aug 2005 14:11
no..not PCI, PCI express, it`s the new high speed graphics port to replace agp, you either have PCI express or agp, you don`t get both, agp is faster than PCI, but both of them are way slower than PCI express.

that board you mention is agp 8x only, only get an agp card for it, and make sure the socket on the mobo fits your CPU, eg amd Athlon/Duron socket A needs socket A motherboard, some boards wont fit some cpu`s and an AMD board will not take Intel cpu, or a Intel board wont take AMD etc, plus you need to make sure you have the right slots for the ram you have, you will need to do some research (and post back here to make sure) before you buy anything, you need to make sure the parts you buy are all compatable,

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 11th Aug 2005 14:19
I see, I've saw PCI express on a website earlier, made me feel like an idiot thinking you meant plane old PCI lol

Yeah I will post here, I'll ask the guy at the shop when I take my PC in for what kinda of motherboards I can have fitted and if they have any I could buy for it, I'm taking it to the shop because I'm that lazy, and well it was annoying fitting in a card on me old PC lol

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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 12th Aug 2005 03:19
i beliebe the radeon 9800 s the best ati card you can get for agp x4, dunno about the nvidea side though.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 13th Aug 2005 00:22
I know about the nvidia side no worries, I went into the computer shop in main cambridge today, found a 256bm nvidia card and had a lotta spec, was 8x, I asked the guy what Me! said was true about backwards compatible, meaning I can run at 8x, but I will prolly have to get the shop to fit it

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Dot Merix
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Posted: 13th Aug 2005 01:34
Quote: "i beliebe the radeon 9800 s the best ati card you can get for agp x4, dunno about the nvidea side though."


You can use 8x graphics cards on 4x slots correct?

Therefore the ATI X800 8xAGP would be the best would it not? Possibly not the best, but an example of one thing better.

http://www.bestbuy.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&sku_id=0926INGFS10044720&catid=



WindowsXP Home(Service pack 2), Athlon XP 2400+(2.1Ghz), 1GIG Ram, Ati Radeon 9800Pro 128MB.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 13th Aug 2005 12:06
thats a lil expensive, I'm going for a XFX GeForce FX 5200 256mb AGP 8x graphics card

I'll link you

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/tg/stores/detail/-/electronics/B0000E2Y8M/system-requirements/ref=ed_tec_dp_2_1/202-5697437-1439005

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Dot Merix
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Posted: 13th Aug 2005 23:53
Ahh yes, i know it's quite expensive... Author Message
Seppuku Geijutsu

Teh Go0rfmeister had said: "i beliebe the radeon 9800 s the best ati card you can get for agp x4, dunno about the nvidea side though."

I was just clarifying that there are better cards out there which can fit the agp slot... Including the ATI brand.



WindowsXP Home(Service pack 2), Athlon XP 2400+(2.1Ghz), 1GIG Ram, Ati Radeon 9800Pro 128MB.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 14th Aug 2005 01:21
I see, well I'm either gonna go for a Radeon 9600 or Geforce FX 5200, most likely the radeon, they are the leading brand and are supposed to be better

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Dot Merix
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Posted: 14th Aug 2005 05:13
it's definately better.



WindowsXP Home(Service pack 2), Athlon XP 2400+(2.1Ghz), 1GIG Ram, Ati Radeon 9800Pro 128MB.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 14th Aug 2005 15:07
Yup, if its the choice of apple macs, and everyone loves em, so well its bound to be better, which is why after me holiday I'm ordering it

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PC- 1.5ghz 64mb graphics gforce 2 256mb ram. And a pain in the butt

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