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Geek Culture / what do u think about gm's hydrogen car?

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David iz cool
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:26
will u get one?
do u think all cars will be hydrogen powered someday?
etc??
CattleRustler
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:29 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 16:33
link?

hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe (aside from n00bism) so if they can make the refueling stations viable and practical, why not.

we need to switch off fossil fuels or we're ALL dead, sooner or later - why not do it now on our own terms, rather than when the planet is near dead, and/or when fossil fuels are all gone - which they will be at some point

Science, Mathematics, and Physics do not lie - only people do.
adr
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:30
I like the amount of effort you put into your question
Quote: "etc??"


Well researched.

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But you see, I have the will of the warrior. Therefore, the battle is already over. The winner? Me!
David iz cool
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:33 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 16:34
Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:36 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 16:38
imo hydrogen's the best solution for alternative fuels of the future or cars and bikes at least.

all this crap with biodiesel being environmentaly freindly is rubbish, even my stepdad says so, having recently set up a biodiesel import company. It boats about how all the carbon it creates is reused in the carbon chain. people seem to forget that oru carbon levels are already too high, keeping levels the same doesnt reduce them back to normality. while it is an alternative to petrol and diesil, it isnt a long term solution.

hydrogen however, is water, going through the process of hydrolisis (powered by wind or solar power) split into oxygen and hydrogen. in the engine of the hydrogen powered car, the hydrogen reunites with oxygen brought in from an intake. the reaction that causes the oxygen and hydrogen to unite making water releases a charge which drives the motor. the water that comes out is pure water, purer than what comes out of your taps etc, and people have demostrated this by drinking it.

also, when i say water comes out of this equation, i dont mean floods etc, it comes out in slow drops, so its not gonna make the roads slippy etc.

the current problem with this technology is the low mileage meaning refeulling stops are frequent, but the technology is relatively new, think of the mpg of petrol cars when they first came into existance. besides, having to stop more regularly for top-ups wont bother me as long as i know im not harming my kids/grandkiks futures.

Megaton Cat
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:38 Edited at: 8th Jul 2006 09:30
In Canada they have a car that runs on rabbit fur.


New Catfolio.net coming soon!
Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:40
Nice that you can change the body.

CattleRustler
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:44 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 16:50
Quote: "Chris Borroni-Bird, GM Hy-wire project director, told CNN's Chris Burns: "The beauty of hydrogen is that it can be made from electricity and water and electricity can be made form natural gas..."

what a dumbarse, but then he saved it...

Quote: "...or renewable energies like solar cells"

right! isnt the whole point to ELIMINATE fossil fuels - sheesh. I bet this guy is married to an oil exec, a male one.

Quote: "Drivers will use a videogame-style controller, called the X-drive, to operate the vehicle. The driver can accelerate by twisting a motorbike-style hand grip with either the right or left hand and brakes by squeezing, which is an intuitive thing to do," Borroni-Bird said."

that aught to be fun. is there a tv in the g-damn thing too?

Quote: "And if you get tired of the way the car looks, you can change it anytime you want because everything that propels the vehicle and controls the way it behaves is inside the chassis"

ever notice cars that are environmentally friendly (ie use less fossil fuels) are ugly as hell? No big oil corp influence there eh? And im sure the ever-dwindling middle class has the time/money/storage space for all of the extra "skins"

How about we all (all of us, as a species) get serious, do away with the "fluff" factors, and all of the big oil influnce, and focus on whats important - our survival as a species.

Science, Mathematics, and Physics do not lie - only people do.
Fallout
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 16:54
Nothing is green until it goes right back to the source. Green cars using hydrogen might require more energy earlier in the chain. It probably takes more energy to manufacter hydrogen than it does to drill for oil. That's a complete guess, but hydrogen has to be 'made' using electrolosis. If the power for that process is derived from fossil fuel powerstations (which is most likely is at the moment), then the whole thing is a waste of time. Unless they set up the whole infrastructure and development chain right back to the source so the hydrogen gathering process is green, than the whole thing is pretty much pointless.

I think this argument has been around sinse the start of the green campaign. There's no point making things use green fuel if the green fuel comes from non-green fuel. We should be starting at the beginning. It's nice to research green car technology so that we dont have to burn petrol, but until the hydrogen comes from a green source it's not worth us actually adopting it.

Kentaree
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:02 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 17:02
You know, funnily enough water vapour is one of the major causes of the greenhouse effect...

Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:04
If hydrogen comes from a polluted powerstation, then so does petrol probably. So you still gain something at the end.

Medieval Coder
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:04 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 17:05
I heard from somewhere that hydrogen is trapped under the ground.

edit: "You know, funnily enough water vapour is one of the major causes of the greenhouse effect..."

Who says the greenhouse effect is bad?

Kentaree
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:06
Water = H2O = 2 molecules of hydrogen, 1 molecule of oxygen. So the world's most abundant substance, water, is 2/3 hydrogen

So yes, hydrogen is trapped under the ground sometimes

CattleRustler
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:09 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 17:10
greenhouse effect is natural - a runaway greenhouse effect created by us is not natural

anyone ever look at what a world map would look like if the world sea levels increased by a few feet?

Science, Mathematics, and Physics do not lie - only people do.
Kentaree
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:13
Yep. True it's natural, if you look at the the effect that exhaust gasses have on the environment now, and replace that with water vapour, will there be an awful lot of difference though?

TDP Enterprises
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:24
Quote: "hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe (aside from n00bism) so if they can make the refueling stations viable and practical, why not."

Agreed, but i thought this car was a high up in the 6-digit price range... And arnt they having trouble A)-having a both cost effective and energy-effecient means of creating enough hyrogen for everyone and B)-creatign a safe way to store it?

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David iz cool
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:49
its too late to go back to horse & buggy.way too many people.

maybe they should try to make something thats human powered?
or maybe battery operated cars are the future??
Mikey P
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 17:51
Quote: "the power for that process is derived from fossil fuel powerstations (which is most likely is at the moment), then the whole thing is a waste of time."


Goorf mentioned that the idea is it comes from wind and solar power... I saw something on TV once about a hydrogen powered car being tested in one of the Japanese islands, they said the hydrogen was produced using electrolysis in a hydroelectric dam, on an island that recieves huge quantities of rain and so has abundant energy to use for such a project. Personally I think things like this are feasable everywhere, especially with things like offshore windfarms!

Medieval Coder
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 18:08
"anyone ever look at what a world map would look like if the world sea levels increased by a few feet?"

I always wanted a water front property.

Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 18:20
i think you guys who are debating about global warming from the greenhouse effect should look up global dimming.

and it is most probable that hydrogens electrolisis will come from wind power, since thats what's proposed by BMW, the company most backing hydrogen power, and who are putting funding into electrolyisis stations.

the reason i know this is because i recently did a physics project for a-lelvel, studying the effects of different car fuels, which involved a lot of communication with RND for different companies, most of which said they had no long term plan appart from BMW, who then sent me a load of presentations on the matter.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 18:48
Hydrogen power is a good idea, I mean it should avoid expensive fuel and should be less harmful to the enviroment to what we currently use, I think it makes sense, I mean more cars could qualify for lighweight races Also, we wouldn't be paying 98p per litre

TDP Enterprises
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 18:52
Quote: "I mean it should avoid expensive fuel"

Wroooong. Hydrogen is very expensive even with its extreme abundance. The cars themselves are even more expesnive.

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the_winch
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 18:57
Quote: "if you look at the the effect that exhaust gasses have on the environment now, and replace that with water vapour, will there be an awful lot of difference though?"


Since water is useful and easy to contain it would perhaps make sense to store it in a tank instead of releasing it into the atmosphere.

By way of demonstration, he emitted a batlike squeak that was indeed bothersome.
Fallout
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 19:02
Hey, you'd never run out of windscreen wiper fluid on the M3 again. How awesome is that?

Mr Underhill
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 19:54 Edited at: 7th Jul 2006 20:02
Quote: "Since water is useful and easy to contain it would perhaps make sense to store it in a tank instead of releasing it into the atmosphere."

True, but then you'd need a portable electrolysis system and anonther power source like a solar panel on the hood.
Otherwise you'd just be carrying around your own exhaust.

And if electrolysis stations are set up, I think they should be built along the coastline. Salt water actually works better than fresh water for electrolysis, and with that setup you can get salt, fresh water, and fuel all at once.

In addition, with offshore wind platforms and other ocean-based energy sources becoming more and more viable, it seems logical to place electrolysis stations close to where the power source is. I can definitely see this happening in the near future.

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Bahamut
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 20:15
Quote: "maybe they should try to make something thats human powered?"


I keep tellng everyone....Giant hamster wheels and chavs. And people insist chavs have no purpose...

I don't know much about hydrogen power, but isn't alot of energy needed for hydrolysis? I mean all hydrolysis expriments we do in chemistry need to be refluxed with conc. acid (I think, anyway. That may actually be wrong, but I'm pretty sure I'm right). The only other time hydrolysis can really happen is with enzymes. Unless hydrolysing water is different from hyrolysing other substances.

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Matt Rock
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 20:55
Quote: "hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe (aside from n00bism)"

That's the answer! Noob-powered cars! Just attach some idiot who tk'd you or asked you to join their MMORPG team to the front of your Mazda and MUSH!

Quote: "You know, funnily enough water vapour is one of the major causes of the greenhouse effect..."

The greenhouse effect is a natural one, but humans and their stupid cars are speeding it up drastically. And before you say "global warming doesn't exist" take a look at my city, Binghamton NY. After the warmest winter in New York's recorded history as a state, we had massive floods that left 40k homeless. If global warming didn't cause it, what did?

Quote: "maybe they should try to make something thats human powered?"
Every year, humans get lazier. Technological advances are pushing these lazy trends along. But this is a FACT. How can I say that? Take a look at the obesity problem facing the United States that's now leaking into Europe. Expecting people to abandon their cars is unrealistic. But if you take their fossil-fueled cars away and give them pollution-free vehicles, they can help the environment and help themselves without realizing it

The "big three" in alternative fuels and their pros/ cons:

Hydrogen Fuel Cells: The cleanest, but the most complicated conversion and thus the most expensive. But the fuel is dirt-cheap (literally)... They literally run on water. They'll have a hard time getting off the ground because whenever people hear "hydrogen" they think of Bikini Atoll and the Hydrogen bomb, and stupid people (you know, most of them) tend to worry their car will explode and take out St. Louis. Sounds retarded, sure, but go ask three randomly-selected people what they think of when they hear the word "hydrogen." The results will make you giggle. At any rate: Pros = super-clean and cheap to fill; cons = expensive maintenance costs and extremely poor performance (hydrogen is "too" efficient, as hydrogen cars aren't very fast, and a lot of people like fast cars.

Corn Ethanol: This is the option that the government is trying to push on us the hardest. It's also the worst idea ever. It's almost as bad for the environment as petrol, and it's nothing if not problematic. While it'll be cheaper because it runs on corn, it'll be more expensive because the same five ****holes (yes, that was a four-letter word) will be earning all of the profit from it and firing the costs through the roof. Pros = we won't be buying oil from brown people anymore, the entire goal of the Bush administration in terms of "saving the environment"; Cons = Problematic, costly in the long run, and BAD for the environment

Sugar Ethanol: In Brazil, they're using Sugar Ethanol to power everything now, and it's working out splendidly. Sugar ethanol isn't as clean as hydrogen, but it's easy and cheap to convert, FAR cleaner than corn ethanol, and it's the most efficient in that it takes less sugar ethanol to power a car than petrol, and said car will be faster than the petrol-powered ride. Pros = super efficient, good performance, cheap as heck; cons = not as clean as hydrogen

There's my $229.79. We should all be on Sugar Ethanol until we can be weened onto hydrogen (and until technology can make hydrogen cars as efficient in terms of performance as petrol cars, because if they aren't, they won't sell).


"In an interstellar burst, I'm back to save the universe"
Slaid
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 22:09


What burns? Hydrogen, what else burns? Nothing.
Gas, buton, ethanal, achohal, its all hydrogen based, hydrocarbons. Pure oxigen will not burn unless hydrogen is present. Why dosn't water burn, because it allready has when it combined.
H H H H H A Hight octan gas molecule looks
/ / / / / something like this, carbon that has
H-C-C-C-C-C-H bound hydrogen to it. Heat breaks the
\ \ \ \ \ chains alowing oxigent to bind with it.
H H H H H
Wood burn because a plant has let the oxigen go and produced suger using the hydrogen.

When the Hindanberg burned it was the fuel in the motors that killed people. The hydrogen gas went straight up and burned. Don't believe me look att a old film av the accident.

I have had the good fortune of haveing built a hydrogen powered car.
Major Problems with pure hydogen
1.It can not be easely compressed. It's already the smallest molecule.
2.It burns to fast, we had to spray in a fine mist of water direct into the carbarator to slow it down.
3.Our fuel tank was filled with rare earth metals that under pressure combined with the hydrogen. As the pressure was released more hydrogen was released from the metal. The tank was expesive.

Pure hydrogen powered cars will problely never be the answer. Hydrogen has to be bound to something to make it managable.

I myself have solar heating in the sommer, wood in the winter and my computer runs on solarcells and batteris in the basement. My car allso run on 50 percent alcohol.
Soon a wood powered sterling motor in the basement to power the whole house.

Big buissness will never give us the answers to the energy problems with out making use pay big time. Screw big buissness and do it yourself.

May the sun shine on the soles of your feet.
CattleRustler
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 22:30
Slaid, where are you from?

Science, Mathematics, and Physics do not lie - only people do.
dab
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 22:46
The car design doesn't sound safe, with the crashing wise. How does a wire and skin sound like a safety feature? The cars we have took years to get even somewhat safe. So, making a removable frame makes me think of an unsafe car. Though, I'm not too sure about what I'm talking about.

CattleRustler
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 23:18
im sure its locked on securely, and they were pointing out that all the innards end up in one thick wire with a honkin' molex connector on the end - i guess

Science, Mathematics, and Physics do not lie - only people do.
Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 7th Jul 2006 23:24
Quote: "And before you say "global warming doesn't exist" take a look at my city, Binghamton NY. After the warmest winter in New York's recorded history as a state, we had massive floods that left 40k homeless. If global warming didn't cause it, what did?"


Giant Hamsters, No WMD's, whatever. Nature moves in cycles we are just to darn short lived to really notice it, just because you had a warm winter and alot of rain does not prove/ nor disprove global warming. This year was not to bad here in MA , but surely not our warmest winter, and last year was our coldest recorded winter and the second highest recorded snowfall. I can't say global warming does not exist, but at the moment it cannot be proven, and even if proven how do we determine what was caused by it and what was not.

Hurricanes seem to get blamed on GW, but something I saw recently was showing that the waters in the atlantic are warmer because of a shift in terrain that has messed up the way warm water travels into polar regions, cools down, and returns. A group funded to study GW actually reported that the ice caps are getting thicker, and they were pretty dead set on proving otherwise.

All in all I think GW is being used as a buzz word to gather votes, funding, whatever. We are certainly messing up our world and over consuming it resources and that is gonna bite us sooner than later.

To conclude I say the following:

If you can walk there in 10 minutes don't take your car.

Don't flush if its only yellow.

Don't let the water run while you wash your dishes.

buy energy efficient appliances, lightbulbs, electronics.

Use mass transportation if possible.

and don't ever, ever, vote for John Kerry for president, he's not a liberal, hes not a conservative, he's a weasel.

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David iz cool
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 01:08
well,i know electrical cars exist but theres a problem keeping them running very long.maybe if we could plug them in at home & at work or at shopping centers?they also say it doesnt go very fast but that could probablly decrease accidents.

i watched a old show called macgyver once & he had a clock plugged into a potato.potatos! yeah thats the answer. lol
TDP Enterprises
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 01:10
Quote: "i watched a old show called macgyver once & he had a clock plugged into a potato.potatos! yeah thats the answer. lol "
And cause another potato famine? I think not.

Snow Wars is making its return, check out the Game Design Theory board for more info...
CattleRustler
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 01:14
you have kerry confused with hilary. anything is better than the current lying murdering fascist thieves, wouldnt you agree? and in the context of this threads topic, they all come from big oil - theyll never do anything to reduce exxon-mobil's bottom line, even if it means our planetary demise. why? they dont fear a demise, they help usher in the rapture gladly.

/me smacks me

k.

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Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 01:25
Quote: "anything is better than the current lying murdering fascist thieves, wouldnt you agree?"


Off Topic:

No, I am no fan of Bush, but I knew what we were getting with him, religious, power hungry, guy who cant open a door.

With Kerry on the other hand who knows what the hell would be going on the guy changes his mind on issues according to who he is talking to. He is always on some Fact finding trip that blows a bunch of money for no reason, and the guy is Tax happy.

I liked Wesely Clark, the Democrats had a great candidate in him and they blew it.

Don't think there is any real difference between these guys anyway they all break bread together at the top and make us believe that we have some kind of choice.

I want Jesse Ventura!!
I may not agree with everything he says, but he says what he means and does what he promises.

On Topic:
Alternative fuels are the way to go, we need to find a more efficient way to gather solar energy and make wind easier to set up. We had a wind farm nixxed because geese migrate through the area. I think the 10-20 geese a year we might lose is a little less important to the planet than getting away from fossil fuels.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 01:33 Edited at: 8th Jul 2006 01:38
for the "off topic" in us all



on topic:
agreed, screw the geese! hey, can we do anything with beef? I got loads of these fat ass cows around, surely we could power something with them, no?

Science, Mathematics, and Physics do not lie - only people do.
Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 02:01 Edited at: 8th Jul 2006 02:02
Still off topic



for the cows we could use em to plow fields, pull carts etc thus saving on the use of fuels. Or make em into a heck of a quarter pounder

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David iz cool
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 02:07
Quote: "Or make em into a heck of a quarter pounder"


im with hobgoblin lord,thats sound like one great idea about right now.(smacks lips.)
CattleRustler
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 02:32 Edited at: 8th Jul 2006 02:33
off topic


in topic (kinda)
Im actually about to have KFC

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Hobgoblin Lord
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Slaid
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 11:52
Hej, CattleRustler

I'm from Sweden.

The tank in the car was safe because the hydrogen bound to the metal could only release itself so fast. The tank could take a lot of punishment. A gas tank is easy to get a whole in. There was a test done on a hydrogen tank. They shot it with a rifle, the only thing that happened was a blue flame coming from the whole in the tank.

1 cubic meter hydrogen gas has allmost as much energy as one Kilowatt electricity. It take 1.15 KW el to make 1 cubic meter hydrogengas.
1 cubic meter hydrogengas is allmost the same as 1 liter gasolin.

An onboard batteri powering an onbord hydrogen producing plant would give you power when needed and keep the amount of hydrogen in the vehicle to a very small amount. Then you could use both the hydrogen and oxygen that is produced.

But no matter what you do simple phycics apply, you cann't get anything fri. You allways have losses.

May the sun shine on the soles of your feet.
RUCCUS
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 20:24 Edited at: 8th Jul 2006 20:33
There was a special on Discovery Channel a while back with an inventor showing his electric-generator he created. Its basically a speed bump that when a car rolls over it generates electricity through turning a motor. This electricity can be stored and used to power the street lights, hospital eletricity, etc. I cant find a site about the invention right now but it worked excellently, here's a quick flash of what the idea looks like;



So why stop there? Add a bumper-cart style metal rod below every car that gathers the electricity and powers the car. Place enough of these on down hills or at stop lights, in high-traffic areas, and you've got a huge power source. Instead of electric-gasoline hybrids they should be thinking about electric-hydrogen hybrids, use both powers when viable.

That raises another question, if cars had fan-generators on them then as they drive the fan would generate electricity s well. Pretty much anything that turns can, and should, be used to help get to the goal of a perpetual motion machine. Add solar panels (I havent read much so Im not sure if they're causing problems with the environment or not), lighten the cars as much as possible through carbon fibre (light, strong, and I believe cheap though I may be wrong), and we're well on our way to eliminating the number one cause of polution in the world (cars).

For the past few years I've been constantly designing/inventing new perpetual motion ideas, I must have like 300 different methods of obtaining energy through every-day activities drawn out, sadly nobody will take the stand to put ideas like these in place because of the fear that it will take too long and will lose them monehs. Im not sure about anyone else here but I plan to create a company based on inventing things like this to help the world get greener.

Im definitely for the hudrogen-powered cars, I dont have a car yet but when I do get one I wont be looking at it's design (cosmetically wise atleast).

<EDIT>

On the topic of pollution, I was thinking about how we're managing our garbage collection. Now Im not one to just throw our problems away and hope they'll leave us alone, but Im starting to see the pro's in sending our garbage to a storage facility in space.

Think of a plastic container, inside the container is a sandwhich. The sandwhich has salami and lettuce. The container represents space/the universe, the sandwhich represents Earth, the salami represents everything we like and want to keep here, and the lettuce is our garbage. If we take the lettuce out of the sandwhich and place it inside the container, beside the sandwhich, we haven't increased the amount of lettuce inside the container, we've just shifted it around. The same would go for space, we aren't adding garbage to space because we're inside space so our garbage is in it too, we're just moving it to a safer location where it (as far as we know) wont hurt any other life forms and wont come back to hurt us. Assuming we keep it in a controlled environment and monitor it intensively, I dont seethe problem myself.

Then again there's the human arrogance coming back, "as far as we know isn't harming any other life forms", I guess I'm assuming we know there isnt any way it could backfire but thats human nature.

K', rant done, for now.

- RUC'

the_winch
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 20:52
Quote: "That raises another question, if cars had fan-generators on them then as they drive the fan would generate electricity s well."


What's the point in fitting a fan making it harder to push the car through the air to get back less energy than you would have saved by pushing the car without a fan through the air?

By way of demonstration, he emitted a batlike squeak that was indeed bothersome.
RUCCUS
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 22:51 Edited at: 8th Jul 2006 22:52
Fans can be fitted throughout the car's casing to add aerodynamics and a boost of speed instead of slowing it down, super cars have this kind of technology in place. However, adding an inner gear to the fan system and hooking up a low-torque motor would add the abaility to generate electricity without losing too much aerodynamics.

Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 23:37
heck why not just dump the garbage from orbit and let it burn up in the atmosphere, just hope it all does I dont want to get hit by a toilet from space.

Really though we need to find a better more viable and easy for the common man way to recycle, you could make a mint if you found a good way to recycle disposable diapers that was easy on the consumer, or they won't do it. They are the biggest gluttons to our landfills right now.

Soon topographical maps of my area will include MT. Trashmore, our 400' man made mountain

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the_winch
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 23:37
You are never going to get more energy from the fan than you have to use to overcome its drag. It's simply impossible, where does this extra energy come from?

By way of demonstration, he emitted a batlike squeak that was indeed bothersome.
David iz cool
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Posted: 8th Jul 2006 23:45
if they could just figure out how to harness a lightning bolts' energy.i heard somewhere that one bolt of lightning could power new york for a whole year!

also i heard nuclear power is clean.maybe theres some way nuclear power could be sent to individual cars?
TDP Enterprises
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Posted: 9th Jul 2006 00:56
Quote: "also i heard nuclear power is clean.maybe theres some way nuclear power could be sent to individual cars?"
Yes, i want to put a nuclear reactor in every mini-van on the road. THAT seems safe, why with terrorists abundant as ever and now you can make the rate of radioactive waste increase exopentially....yesss....sounds like a plan to me.

Snow Wars is making its return, check out the Game Design Theory board for more info...
Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 9th Jul 2006 01:53
Heck we don't even need to harness lightning itself there is a massive amount of energy in the air already. Saw a thing once that Tesla found a way to harness this but destroyed it because it could be used as a weapon. Some thing about him accidentally blowing up a bit of Russia in a test.

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