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Geek Culture / A Very Strange Problem

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SageTech
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Joined: 3rd Dec 2004
Location: Orlando, Florida
Posted: 19th Sep 2006 21:39 Edited at: 19th Sep 2006 21:41
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Hi everyone,

The other day while at school, my teacher came up to me and asked me for assistance for a computer problem at his home. I had helped him last year with numerous small problems, so I figured Id get this out of the way in no time. After school, I went over to his house and He explained to me his problem, and it was like nothing Ive ever heard of before.

First off, he told me a ways back his isp(roadrunner) sent him an email telling him his virus protection(Norton) had expired. They warned him they would shut off his Internet if it was not renewed. He of course disregarded it, as it sounded to much like spam-mail to be taken seriously. However, a few months later his Internet WAS turned off, and forgetting about the email, called roadrunner and ask why. Sure enough, they told him his Internet protection had expired, and he needed to renew it.

This is all really odd to me, as I didn't even know Isp's would have that kind of info, or shut off internet because of that. Regardless, when we try to install the software, it gives an error about some missing file on the CD. I have no idea on where to go now, but perhaps someone here has had something similar happened to them?

EDIT: O ya, shiver me timber, can ye find the solution to my scalliwag problem? ARRR! YE better, or ye shall surly be walking the plank. ARRR!

Back by unpopular demand!
Battle Legacy has gone MMORPG! Nah, Im just kidding. But seriously, check the WIP

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Torsten Sorensen
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Joined: 23rd Oct 2005
Location: Seattle, WA
Posted: 19th Sep 2006 21:50
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I've never heard of that. Norton expires and they shut your internet off...? That sounds very strange, the ISP would have no need to do that anyway...

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Sid Sinister
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Posted: 19th Sep 2006 22:05
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Yes that is very strange indeed. The number that you called... are you sure that was RR's phone number or some scam artists...

I'd do a little more poking around on this one. Who knows you could unwravel a cybercrime group! Because if you ask me there is no reason RR should do that. I use RR and I have NEVER heard of that at all. Hit the RR forums.
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Tinkergirl
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Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 20th Sep 2006 00:26
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Actually, I can see a reasoning behind it - if your teacher's computer was taken over by a virus and caused untold amounts of damage through their connection (using their bandwidth etc etc) then they might be considered partly liable for it. Thus, your teacher's unprotected computer might be seen as a weak part of their defences. *shrugs*

It's a stretch, but it 'might' be what their thought process is doing. Still strange, and it would be good to look into it more.

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jinzai
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Location: USA
Posted: 20th Sep 2006 04:24
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Yes, denial of service attacks in particular often get into systems from the ISP's clients' machines. Most ISPs can handle that at this point. Internet security should flow firstly from the ISP to the user, and then be reflected back. While not arbitrary of the ISP, the action is fairly curious considering that the ISP should be reasonably protected.

Is that spelled out in the user's agreement...that he must have AV protection, and that it be Norton? If not, download McAfee, or stopsign for a 30 day trial instead. That will at least satisfy the requirement that the computer have AV software.
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Dazzag
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 10:46 Edited at: 20th Sep 2006 10:46
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Sounds strange.... When you say he called them, the phone number wan't within the email? I mean it could be any phone number (not his ISP). I remember getting a real mail (not email) from a web address company saying my web address was about to expire and I had to pay the yearly fee. Was actually the right time too and they had given my information in the mail, but I had never heard of them. Checked into it and they were bogus. Anyone can get your details. Forwarded to some government place and they shut them down apparently (was other people complaining apparently).

Anyways, I can't see how they would know what AV software you were running. Not without breaking those privacy laws. I mean they would have to scan your computer surely? Or Norton is setup to be easily detectable. Personally I would go with the idea that they have an agreement (ie. deal with money involved) with Norton and they provide them with, say, a monthly list of all of their clients who are still paying Norton. So going to another AV probably would not work, plus they could easily then say that only Norton passes their standards or some gumph.

Oh, and why not just change ISPs? Am sure they would stop such silly ideas if everyone left.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Van B
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Joined: 8th Oct 2002
Location: Sunnyvale
Posted: 20th Sep 2006 10:58
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It could be that Norton is actually supplied by the ISP, and he need's to pay a monthly fee to keep using it, which the ISP is not charging for yet - maybe first year is free?

But, besides that, the ISP will know if your PC is using more internet connections than it should, so virus can be detected by your ISP, and they can request that you take action or they'll suspend your service.

If this is neither case then I suggest getting your lecturer to actually call his ISP and ask about this properly - there's so much time wasted with IT minded folk being dragged into the homes of idiots to fix some inane problem, a lot of the time the problem needs to be resolved by the ISP. I'm sure it's illegal to enforce a product like that - they can pimp their virus protection, maybe even give you a discount, but they can't refuse service if your not using the preferred virus infection. Are you sure it mentions Norton by name?

''Stick that in your text and scroll it!.''
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indi
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 12:05
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if his machine became a zombie machine i would imagine the response.

run spybot / adaware / eiwido and put AVg on or nod 32 or something virii protection on it.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 12:21
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Quote: "the ISP will know if your PC is using more internet connections than it should"
Hmmm. Lots of different legit reasons why you could be using lots of connections.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Van B
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 13:35
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Yeah, but it's fairly easy to spot the patterns generated by viruses - like constantly accessing different addresses, sending the same data over and over - really we should be glad that ISP's warn us of this.

''Stick that in your text and scroll it!.''
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Dazzag
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 16:13
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Quote: "Yeah, but it's fairly easy to spot the patterns generated by viruses"
Perhaps, although I would be seriously annoyed if I got sprang on for testing out the same thing web related thing that you are developing again and again (which I do), which may not exist on the development machine. Or for some useful utility I used a lot. The Firefox weather one or news tickers surely fall under that category? Doubt it in this case though as they knew his licence was about to expire, so it would still have been working quite correctly. Almost definitely going to be a deal they have with Norton annoyingly.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Dazzag
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 16:15 Edited at: 20th Sep 2006 16:15
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Oh and you say constantly, but I had one on a friends laptop the other day that kept trying to access about 3 websites (the same ones all the time) but only about every 20 minutes or so, and only one request each time. Nothing at all inbetween.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Van B
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 17:22
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That's probably on purpose, so the virus fly's under that usage radar - that's what I'd do - if I wrote a virus I wouldn't let it go mad, the best viruses, well they tend to hide and wait on an apropriate time to strike - until that time they can mostly just avoid detection, because it's the behaviour of viruses that make them visible.

I find more viruses at work by monitoring web use than monitoring email - annoyingly BT gave us a really nice router that has lots of useful tracking features and flags.

''Stick that in your text and scroll it!.''
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NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 19:03
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Why don't the ISP install their own anti-virus? No problems then. Although, it probably wouldn't work properly.


Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
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Van B
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 19:07
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Some do, Blueyonder in the UK (my isp) have their own virus and malware protection system, it's actually pretty good too.

''Stick that in your text and scroll it!.''
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Fallout
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Posted: 20th Sep 2006 19:09
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I don't see how an ISP can scan incoming communications for viruses. I assume they can only scan their own servers.


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