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Geek Culture / Should PS3

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Von Cuddles
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 02:04
Should PS3 allow Fps creator games to be downloaded onto its hard drive or play fps creator games from blu ray discs?
Gil Galvanti
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 02:05
why does it matter? it won't ever happen, and who would buy them anyways.

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Von Cuddles
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 02:06
u could at least ask
Jeku
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 02:14
It's not going to happen. There is no way on earth Sony would allow it.

Von Cuddles
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 03:49
ok nw my hopes are gone
Toby Quan
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 06:17
Does the Sony PS3 play Windows XP, DirectX 9 and DirectX 10 games?

I'm pretty sure it does not.
Agent Dink
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 06:38
If you want to play your games on a PS3, why not just get a PS3 controller and hook it up to your computer with a USB adapter when it comes out, and hook your computer to your TV or get a bigger monitor. Then its virtually the same thing...

Sometimes the only way over a wall is to pile up enough bodies to climb over - Dave W.
Richard Davey
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 11:01
I'm pretty sure I can say this with some clarity:

FPS Creator games will NEVER run on a PS3

Never.

Ever.

Stop dreaming now kids. Game Over.

"Bite my shiny metal ass" (Futurama)
"Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth" (Dilbert)
ESP
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 13:32
But how about on the X-boxs??

Robin
Kentaree
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 13:38
Bizar Guy
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 17:31
...why would you want to run them on one?

ESP
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 18:05
They are dirt cheap, and Micro$oft are to release some kind of programming kit for them before christmas. Plus most of our potential customers do not even have or want a PC, but their kids have X-Boxes, or we could give one away with the product.

Robin
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 18:07
1)when was the ps3 released?
2)how do you hook up ps2s to comps?

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 18:36
Current-gen FPSC games will NOT run on an X-Box, PS2, PS3, Gamecube, Nintendo DS, X-Box360, Gameboy, Atari 2600, GP32X or ANY OTHER CONSOLE or handheld out there, period.

We have no intention of changing this for FPSC V1, so don't hold your breath.

"Bite my shiny metal ass" (Futurama)
"Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth" (Dilbert)
Megaton Cat
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 18:58
Here's a better question: Who gives a damn? Why would you want to run this stuff on the next gen systems? Who'd want to even play it??

David R
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 19:01 Edited at: 10th Oct 2006 19:01
Quote: "I'm pretty sure I can say this with some clarity:

FPS Creator games will NEVER run on a PS3

Never.

Ever.
"


I know its a total load of crap, but I would laugh very hard now if there was a sudden announcement to support FPSC games, after all the ranting about consoles + FPSC Not that I really give a damn, since the PS3 is an inferior console.... </start_flamewar>

Well, I finally decided to create a website that really reflects what kind of programmer I really are: OneManBand software: http://www.ombsoft.com
Richard Davey
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 19:15
Quote: "but I would laugh very hard now if there was a sudden announcement to support FPSC games,"


Considering they'd have to replace the custom version of Unix that runs on the PS3 for a Windows DX9 based operating system in order for them to get even close to it working, I wouldn't worry about splitting your sides any time soon.

The only console that could possibly work would be the 360, and no-one can get it working without our assistance, and we ain't working on it yet, simple as that.

"Bite my shiny metal ass" (Futurama)
"Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth" (Dilbert)
Kentaree
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 19:17
Richard Davey
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 19:24
Never say never

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Chris Franklin
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 19:37
my pc is enough ps3 = more epensive than my amd 64 x2 + physx card+ dual core gfx card + 4 gig ram i'm getting this christmas

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Chris K
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 21:10
Microsoft have this game making thing called XNA if you're desperate to program for a next gen console.

It's for C# and it's free, and it let's you make games for 360 and (potentially) release them on Live!.

Personally, I don't like C#. I'll get it as soon as they release it for C++.

Matt Rock
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 23:41
Quote: "1)when was the ps3 released?"

November 17th <-- Circuit City is already preparing to sell them

Quote: "2)how do you hook up ps2s to comps?"

My Sony Vaio PC has the iLink S400 connection that the original PS2 had, and my PS2 also has 2 USB connections. According to the manual that came with my Vaio, you can connect your PS2 to your Vaio PC and play games on your PC, or download/ upload contents from your PS2 memory cards. I've never done it though so I don't know how cool it is... there's two or three other PS2 fans on here though lol maybe someone else has done it.


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Jeku
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 00:23
Quote: "Personally, I don't like C#. I'll get it as soon as they release it for C++."


You'll be waiting a very long time, as I don't think MS plans on a C++ release. I don't mind C# so it's ok with me.

Kentaree
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 00:35
C++.net should be able to use it

Jeku
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 00:46
Right now it only supports C# as it piggybacks VC#.NET Express.

Von Cuddles
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 15:21
ok what if Sony does allow FPSC games on it`s PS3 do you think the publics reaction would be positive?
Von Cuddles
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 15:23
And wheres The Wii In all this any way?
Richard Davey
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 15:35
Quote: "C++.net should be able to use it"


Nope, here is a short extract from the Team XNA blog:

Quote: "Two recurring questions on the XNA Game Studio Express forums are:

* Why is XNA Game Studio Express only for C# developers (since .NET supports multiple programming languages)?
* Why is XNA Game Studio Express only available in Visual C# Express (and not in higher versions of Visual Studio like Standard, Professional etc)?"


You can read the answers here:

http://blogs.msdn.com/xna/archive/2006/10/10/XNA-Game-Studio-Express_2C00_-C_2300_-and-Visual-C_2300_-2005-Express-Edition.aspx

But in short, it's C# only at the moment and although they want to change this eventually, it'll take a while to happen.

"Bite my shiny metal ass" (Futurama)
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 15:38
Quote: "ok what if Sony does allow FPSC games on it`s PS3 do you think the publics reaction would be positive?"


It's nothing to do with Sony 'allowing it' (especially as its our choice to make, not theirs) - it's to do with a complete and utter hardware and OS incompatibility on every single level, and at every single possible aspect. Current-gen FPSC into PS3 does not go, in any way shape or form, at all.

"Bite my shiny metal ass" (Futurama)
"Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth" (Dilbert)
Bizar Guy
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 15:55
Quote: "And wheres The Wii In all this any way? "

Winning.

Raven
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 16:24
I wouldn't hold you're breath on XNA Game Studio Express (what the public uses) to support anything other than C#, this will be purely from a compatibility stand-point.

It would be nice to see FPSCreator on the 360, but tbh I very much doubt it would get past the TCR. It is a very strict process, and FPSCreator would not only have to pass the basic usability and functionality but also have added support for extras that are required for the 360.

This is on-top of the fact that DBP itself and ODE wouldn't be compatible, requiring it to be rebuilt from the ground up. TGC would probably move to Ageia PhysX to replace ODE; but again strict guidelines and no getting away without paying out for software physics license as the 360 doesn't have PPU hardware.

Either that or they could ask around the companies who've been using the XDK for a while if anyone has a free license version of a physics library they can use.
This is something I've found myself as an issue, as the market isn't friendly for "indi" developers on the 360 with everything having a nice HUGE pricetag to license.

Oddly enough, personally found it easier to develop libraries from scratch adding as I required rather than integrating another engine or recoding another one.

Price you pay for being dirt poor.

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 16:34
Raven,
I don't think he's talking about FPSC being run on the 360. I think he is more talking about FPSC generated exe's being run on the 360.

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Raven
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 16:58
Perhaps, but I see that in itself presenting quite a challenge.
Not sure how they'd be able to make the compatible formats, without licensed tools. Same goes for the engine still, that would need to be recoded without DBP as a backbone to work... plus to meet one of the requirements they'd have to change all the mesh to skinned mesh using bone over frame animation.

Those are just the issues that I can think in a few seconds.
Personally I would see it being more cost than worth unless there was a product at the end of it, which could hold it's own against the big boys.

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 17:09
Quote: "Perhaps, but I see that in itself presenting quite a challenge. "

No doubt. Still, not quite the same mountain.
Doesn't FPSC use skinned mesh bone based animations? They have a biped file that I have used pretty intimately???

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Raven
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 23:24
I don't think they do because Shaders + Bone Animation in DBP = Exploding Mesh. I think the Biped file is just for development means, but then I've not touched any of that sort of stuff cause the dev files are max only.

While it might be possible, another thing that worries me about giving people hope is that really TGC doesn't have the size for a project like that without other products suffering.

i.e. DBP, FPSCreator for Windows, etc.
Would it annoying to have the side projects cutting into other developments again. TGC really need to expand before thinking about something like this to allow better workloads. Just my thought on the issue though.

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Matt Rock
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 23:55
Quote: "ok what if Sony does allow FPSC games on it`s PS3 do you think the publics reaction would be positive? "

Assuming that we lived in a magical world where it worked fine and all was well... no, public reaction would not be positive. Not in the least. Please read on...

A long time ago, before many of this forum's users were probably even born, there was this console called "The Atari 2600." The Atari was groundbreaking in a number of ways and remains one of the coolest consoles of all time for many of us "old timers." In fact, it's achieved a level of legendary pop icon status that no other console has achieved, or so it would seem. But did you know that the Atari 2600 almost killed console video games (I mean the WHOLE INDUSTRY) entirely?

People were making Atari Games left and right, and it got to a point where, in the early 1980's, the market was literally flooded with crappy titles that no one wanted to play. This event is known as The Video Game Crash of 1983. There was no means of quality control for the Atari because the industry was still new at the time and trying to edge its way into the mainstreams of western civilization. The industry took some serious blows and some nasty lawsuits in those days, but that all changed with a little system called the Famicom. Released in 1985, the Famicom (known to most of us as the Nintendo Entertainment System, or NES) was developed by Nintendo (obviously), and introduced something pretty new and fresh to the console market: quality assurance. Nintendo had a rule that it had to qualify and certify games for release on its console, marking such games with the Nintendo Seal of Quality. This small gold label, which simply read "Official Nintendo Seal," informed consumers that the game was tested for quality by Nintendo, and helped prevent people from purchasing games that were made by people with little or no talent/ taste.

So in effect, if you were to have independently-developed console games roaming around, it could potentially end up having a negative impact on the people who own said consoles. Whose going to assure that the game isn't going to be riddled with glitches and pornographic material? The PC market and the console market are extremely different... they're pretty much different industries entirely. While on a PC you can experiment and provide a wide array of products, people are more prepared for problems when they occur with PC software, and they know that they're taking a risk when they purchase games. On the other hand, people expect a certain level of quality when they purchase a console and games associated with that console. They can't simply download a patch to fix a game... so they expect that game to work as perfectly as possible the second it comes out of the box. The ESRB is a strong player in the console industry, and if there's no ESRB rating on a console game's box, there's a good chance someone won't purchase the product (would you?).

Anyway, this is one of the many reasons why it would be impractical for TGC to release a console version of FSPC, unlikely that Sony/ Microsoft/ Nintendo would approve of it, and highly unreasonable why the public would endorse it.


"In an interstellar burst, I'm back to save the universe"
Saikoro
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Posted: 12th Oct 2006 00:50
Well said there, Matt. I always wondered about the Seal of Quality, not having been alive then. Good research


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Matt Rock
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Posted: 12th Oct 2006 01:44
thanks


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Zaibatsu
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Posted: 12th Oct 2006 06:19
what about N64?

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