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Geek Culture / Games Industry

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SpyDaniel
18
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Joined: 4th Feb 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 10th Oct 2006 19:20
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Nearly every advertised job you come across online, asks for 1-2 or more years of experience in that field, but how can you get that if your not accepted by that company you want to work for?

I have applied for many jobs and they all say the same thing, that I dont have the experience to get the job, or tell me in a nice way, Iam crap.

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Tinkergirl
21
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Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 10th Oct 2006 19:35
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It's the catch 22 of the games industry - you can do one of three things:

1. Go on a relevant university course, which will hopefully either be so useful that your degree will negate the need for 2 years experience in an entry level position, or will enable you to get a one year placement as part of your course.

2. Look in to getting into the industry lower down than you actually want - for example, look into QA or testing positions as a possible way of getting in to design. That is of course, if you're any good.

3. Create a portfolio of work so awesome that companies will decide to take a risk on you, despite your industry experience. Work on both open source teams that succeed, and on your own. If you're a coder, make your own game (in the language they want to see), if you're a designer then create levels in moddable games of various genres, if you're an artist then create beautiful environments in a moddable engine (and show that you're not a technical clutz) and also demonstrate classical artistic skill too (sketching, perspective, etc).

One of these might let you get into the industry. It all depends on what route you're chosing (art/code/design/music etc). For code, really do consider a university degree in proper (non-game?) programming for opening doors. (Jeku would know more on this.)

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SpyDaniel
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Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 10th Oct 2006 20:03
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I want to get into the modelling and level design side of it, but Iam no good with texturing, which puts me down when I try to model some thing, because I know ill have no texture for it when its done.

The texture skills that I do have, wont earn me any job. Iam probably better off reading the game texturing book I got and built up my texturing skills, then go back to modelling and build up a portfolio.

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Seppuku Arts
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Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 10th Oct 2006 20:17
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Quote: "I want to get into the modelling and level design side of it, but Iam no good with texturing, which puts me down when I try to model some thing, because I know ill have no texture for it when its done."


Texturing is a pain in the uranus for us 3D orientated dudes, things that could augment your texturing.

-Grab a texture generation program, like the demo of genetica or download wood workshop, see how each individual layer is formed and try to apply it to photoshop

-Get Bodypaint 3D, supposed to be the god for 3D texturing, I am trying to win it at the moment and it will come standard with Cinema 4D 10 when released, but bodypaint itself can be intergrated with 3DS Max, Maya and Softimage.

-Wait for my own version of a texturing tutorial based on one in a magazine, hopefully I will succeed in writing, if not, then I'll just host the tutorial itself.


As for books and game making, they are very useful, I have one on 3D Game Programming which is Torque orientated, but I've learnt things applicable to DBP, which I have used.

But if you want more experience, or qualifications, take a course in it, I do believe one of those ICT teaching organisations advertised on TV do game programming, as for modelling and texturing Escape Studios in Soho, London do good 3D courses, and there are photoshop courses around...certainly works out cheaper than uni Even if you did get 3DStudio Max and pro game programming tools.

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bond1
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 21:17
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Higgins, the experience requirement doesn't mean anything if you have a strong portfolio. And while having a degree is certainly useful, it's the quality of your work, not education that will land you a job.

There are people out there whose job is to scour dozens of portfolio sites every day looking for talent. Make a website, put only your best stuff up there showing mesh topology, turnarounds, and "in-game" screenshots. Anything can look good in a render, companies want to see that you know how to make stuff look good in-game.

Put your website and email address on your pictures. These headhunters will download pictures from websites that they like. If your info isn't on the picture and they can't remember where they downloaded it from, then you're screwing yourself.

My new website is only a week old, and already I've gotten a few emails from interested companies looking for freelance work. No big names, but still...I'm not looking for a career in the game industry, this is a hobby for me, but picking up some money on the side for freelance work is pretty awesome.

Good luck.

----------------------------------------
"Your mom went to college."
My FPSC stuff at http://www.hyrumark.com
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SpyDaniel
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Joined: 4th Feb 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 10th Oct 2006 22:10
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I think my character modelling is weak, its kind of basic and I havent changed the way I model for about 4 months. I watched that video, the one on how to character model by the french guy, but I havent changed my style since then.

I know you model with cylinders, Bond, but I always start with a box and use connect to make edges for limbs. Iam no good with animals, I tried making a dog and it sucked, it looked like crap.

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bond1
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Posted: 10th Oct 2006 22:48 Edited at: 10th Oct 2006 22:50
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If you want to get into the level design/environmental aspect of it, then concentrate on making entire environments that have a logical real-world layout. You'll also need to show that you have a good understanding of lighting.

So learn about setting up lights in max, and also learn how to use render-to-texture to bake out a lightmap for the entire scene. FPSC users have it easy when it comes to lightmaps. It's usually the artist's job to bake these out manually on another UV set.

About character modelling, it doesn't matter how you do it as long as it looks good. I've watched a character modelling DVD from Autodesk that uses the box method to start, then adds detail by building up edgeloops. The cylinder method I use I learned from a character modelling tutorial from Maya in fact... Still others insist the only way to go is to start with a single polygon and extrude edges. And if you really want to see a crazy workflow, look at the book "Modeling a Character in 3DS Max". On second thought, don't.

----------------------------------------
"Your mom went to college."
My FPSC stuff at http://www.hyrumark.com
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Matt Rock
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Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 10th Oct 2006 22:56
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One of my friends got into the industry answering phones. Seriously. He was doing tech support in San Diego and his boss saw his portfolio and sent it to one of his friends in development, and sure enough, he ended up on a development team doing gui stuff. Another one of my friends started out at a little indie team, then he worked for a tiny studio that no one had ever heard of, and after that he had some experience under his belt, applied at EA, and he ended up working at EA Tiburon until he quit a year or two later to work for Rockstar. I guess it's easier said than done, but hey, if it works...


"In an interstellar burst, I'm back to save the universe"
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Jeku
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Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 11th Oct 2006 00:29
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Quote: "for example, look into QA or testing positions as a possible way of getting in to design."


I have personally seen many QA go on to be producers (game designers). If you have a degree, it shouldn't be too hard to move from QA to be a programmer, either. Not too sure about 3D modellers though, sorry.

It wouldn't hurt to try getting into an art school and working at a game company as a co-op student and/or apprentice. If you're any good it should make it easier to get in full-time once you're done school. Good luck


http://www.codercafe.com - My blog
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Gil Galvanti
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Joined: 22nd Dec 2004
Location: Texas, United States
Posted: 11th Oct 2006 02:16
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Quote: "Nearly every advertised job you come across online, asks for 1-2 or more years of experience in that field, but how can you get that if your not accepted by that company you want to work for?"

Lol, I noticed and wondered that exact same thing. Where are you supposed to get experience if you can't go anywhere to get that experience?

Pirates of Port Royale
Live the life of a pirate.
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Agent Dink
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Joined: 30th Mar 2004
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Posted: 11th Oct 2006 07:26
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All I can say is practice tons, get an AWESOME portfolio going. I have the modeling and the texturing down pat pretty well, it is the UV mapping I hate.

You say you aren't so great at texturing. Well, the only way to get better is to practice. Work hard at it. I used to be horrible too, but I am getting decent now. Once you learn a few techniques, it will pay off. Tutorials are all over the internet, read them, remember the techniques, and apply them. It's rather simple once you learn the methods.

I plan to study game art and design at the Art Institute of Pittsburgh next fall. I'll get my bachelor's degree there, by then have an amazing portfolio, and hopefully land a nice job. (my dream lol)

Sometimes the only way over a wall is to pile up enough bodies to climb over - Dave W.
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Tinkergirl
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Joined: 1st Jul 2003
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 11th Oct 2006 12:18
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If you want to go into environment modelling (and that is different from level design - they are different beasts) then practice environment modelling - not character modelling. The games industry is getting increasingly specialised, especially in big companies, and if you're an environment modeller, you'll not be asked to do characters.

So model environments, do levels AND props - for example, do a model of your house, or a local car park, or the interior of the millenium falcon, or something else (with lots of detail). You can't expect to get in if your texturing sucks, though - a clever texture can often make a 'decent' model look great, but a bad texture will make any model look awful.

Practice texturing, look into making your own high res normal maps, specular maps, etc. The earlier poster who advises doing your work in game (whatever game) is right - make sure your textures are not stupid-sized (1024*1024 is a good limit to start with) and try to create lightmapped levels with a limited amount of realistic real-time lights - most games won't let you have more than about 3 overlapping in an area.

Good luck.

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Philip
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Joined: 15th Jun 2003
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 11th Oct 2006 14:45
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Thats good advice.

Cheer if you like bears! Cheer if you like jam sandwiches!
"I highly recommend Philip" (Philip)
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