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Geek Culture / Broken Sword 4

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OSX Using Happy Dude
21
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Posted: 14th Oct 2006 00:19
I've finally completed BS4 a few days ago. It was a lot poorer than #3 - unfortunately a lot of the problems seemed to have totally illogical solutions, and George's pathfinding AI was poor. I know he's an American, but they are usually a bit smarter that him...

However, is does have many funny moments :





I would certainly like a BS5 - as long as its better quality that this one. Unfortunately, I cant see it happening.

Visit my web site for real bangin' stuff. Word.
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 14th Oct 2006 02:41
I really like adventures, and I also thought that #3 was pretty good (except for the final dragon part). I was looking fwd to this one, but the consensus seems to be that it is weaker...

... guess I'll just wait until it's on budget.

Currently waiting for my friend Raf Colantonio's game "Dark Messiah of Might & Magic"!

I have vague plans for World Domination
SpyDaniel
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Posted: 14th Oct 2006 03:05
I think Broken Sword has lost its "glosh" with becoming 3D. I liked the old 2D ones best, its just not the same with being 3D.

Raven
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Posted: 14th Oct 2006 06:01
I've not played 4 yet... I knew they were going to work on one after 3 despite wanting to keep it a trilogy.
Probably end up getting it just after christmas, would be cool to know some more thoughts.

Like is it an entirely new adventure with our old friend George?
Have the controls / puzzles improved since 3?
Have the graphics had an overhaul, cause 3's were good but they could've stood out much better if they'd used the potencial of shader cards.

just general things. i'm a huge fan of the series in general ^_^

Intel Pentium-D 2.8GHz, 512MB DDR2 433, Ati Radeon X1600 Pro 256MB PCI-E, Windows Vista RC1 / XP Professional SP2
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 14th Oct 2006 10:59 Edited at: 14th Oct 2006 11:20
Quote: "Have the controls / puzzles improved since 3?"

Keyboard control yes, mouse - no.

Quote: "Have the graphics had an overhaul, cause 3's were good but they could've stood out much better if they'd used the potencial of shader cards."

No, the graphics are much cheaper unfortunately - no lip sync to start with. Not terribly detailed in parts either. The person doing the voice of Nico isn't quite as good either - had a tendancy to speak without a Fench accent.

Quote: "Like is it an entirely new adventure with our old friend George?"

Oh yes. No Templars here...

Quote: "just general things. i'm a huge fan of the series in general ^_^"

Mee too. BS 2.5 may be okay, if thet find someone to do English voice overs - and they ever get it finished. However, without someone talking like George, it wont be worth it...

Visit my web site for real bangin' stuff. Word.
Kenjar
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Posted: 14th Oct 2006 23:31 Edited at: 14th Oct 2006 23:40
There's a broken sword 4??? Excuse me, I'm off to buy it! I loved the first three games. As for illogical solutions... try terry pratchetts discworld (the first) game. Now THAT is illogical.

I lay upon my bed one bright clear night, and gazed upon the distant stars far above, then I thought... where the hell is my roof?
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 00:09 Edited at: 15th Oct 2006 00:12
Discworld was pretty good - very funny.

Wait until you try some of the puzzles in BS 4...

Visit my web site for real bangin' stuff. Word.
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 00:17
I believe I only played Discworld 2 (got it free because I worked for Psygnosis at that time)... it was ok, but his books are better.

I have vague plans for World Domination
Kenjar
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 00:26
Oh absolutely better. I own all his books on audio (yes, I did pay for them, his work is worth it).

I do wish more people would make adventure games like these, with decent storylines. I'm writing a story now for a point and click, I've always wanted to write one. Has anyone else?

I lay upon my bed one bright clear night, and gazed upon the distant stars far above, then I thought... where the hell is my roof?
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 01:18
Its probably one of the hardest types of games to do - especially if your not going for text only : You need very good artists and animators and a decent script too/story too.

Visit my web site for real bangin' stuff. Word.
Kenjar
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 01:26
Oh I dunno, the framework wouldn't be that much harder than any other game with a story. You are correct about the media requirements though. But I was thinking more along the lines of a 2D rather 3D affair for a single person. Again, the art requirements are high, as is the story writing. But it would be totally worth it. But it's definately not something someone could do on their own.

I lay upon my bed one bright clear night, and gazed upon the distant stars far above, then I thought... where the hell is my roof?
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 01:38
Indeed not - even 2D would be hard work.

Its also one of the least popular types too, unfortunately. You need to keep the player interested, whilst also providing logical and interesting puzzles.

BS 2.5 would be great if they could get Rolf Saxon to do George again. Unfortunately it'll be unlikely...



Visit my web site for real bangin' stuff. Word.
SpyDaniel
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 01:49 Edited at: 15th Oct 2006 01:57
Disc World didnt like me, I got all the way to deaths realm and the disk packed in and wouldnt work past a certain stage. I would really like to play that game again.

Ive attached an image of my disk.

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Miguel Melo
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 02:53
Quote: "I do wish more people would make adventure games like these, with decent storylines. I'm writing a story now for a point and click, I've always wanted to write one. Has anyone else?
"


The game I am (re-)starting now happens to be a 3d point'n'click adventure, so for me the answer is yes.

As for it being impossible to be a one-man show, unfortunately I'm finding (more _confirming_) this to be true.

I've got the gist/setting/timeline/twist of the story down, but will need to flesh it out, while all the while I'm doing the code, fighting DGDK bugs, writing a nuclearglory collision wrapper for DGDK and having a go at modelling locations in 3DWS.

Since this is all proving impossible, and I'll clearly need more people that I can't afford to pay, I'm wrapping it all up by learning about AND doing a business plan for a game studio!

Of course, all this on top of a fulltime job, wife and kid...

I have vague plans for World Domination
Raven
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 03:00
I liked the Discworld Series too, but never could figure out how to complete Noir.
Oh well I'm still gonna see about getting 'The Angel of Death' but doesn't sound quite as appealing now.

In BS-TSD I used my controller (Gameware PS2-Clone USB) which worked very well for the new control system they did. Hope they've added support for the 360 controller though, because it dropped 2 buttons and had no vibration on TSD. Wasn't expecting full support but did hope that the patch helped.

Wish more companies would support the 360 controller tbh, as I find it much better for playing games. Tomb Raider Legend, was bloody awesome with it. So was F.E.A.R. really don't understand developers reluctance to patch support for it in more FPS games.

Half-Life 2 for example the controller support really isn't worth there being an option as all you can do is have it for looking.. nothing else. I had to add support to Doom 3 myself for the 360 controller (which was annoying given id software code is just truely a nightmare to alter)

Controllers are now becomming more popular, and just think that far more games should really start supporting them as standard rather than as some sort of after thought. It's really bizare to see some top console titles be converted and yet not have support for them. Halo for example was an absolute shocker, as it has just enough controls on the Xbox to fit the pad perfectly; but on the PC it seperates them so you can't have two actions to the same button. As a result you loose so much functionality by being forced to set things to the D-Pad.

But oh well ^_^

Intel Pentium-D 2.8GHz, 512MB DDR2 433, Ati Radeon X1600 Pro 256MB PCI-E, Windows Vista RC1 / XP Professional SP2
Kenjar
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 11:39
I still prefer the flexibility of a good keyboard and mouse combo. Remember the old X-Wing games? over 104 different commands via the keyboard. Now that's flexibility, and S for shields, always made more sense to me than button A, B, C etc. No controllers are ok, but I'd still rather have a programable force feed back joystick with a throttle control in front of me. * looks lovingly at old logitec wingman *

In reguards to Migual Melo, I don't think it's realistic to market of point and click unless it's got a really compelling storyline. If I where you, I'm focus on making a framework. A collection of functions that handles dialog, sprite animation, backgound pasting and scrolling, and area's of the screen that are mouse sensitive so you can click on them and call another specalised function. This way others of a more artistic nature, and less skill at programming can pop along and use your framework.

I lay upon my bed one bright clear night, and gazed upon the distant stars far above, then I thought... where the hell is my roof?
SpyDaniel
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 13:27
Raven, did you complete Discworld II?

I remember being stuck where you needed to get the mouse blood, but all you had to do, was order a mouse burger

Miguel Melo
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 13:46 Edited at: 15th Oct 2006 13:48
Well, I'm writing it so as to be heavily reusable. I have a set of scriptable classes and graphical classes (basic gfx and mesh gfx) from which I derive the adventure classes such as Location, Character, HotSPot, navigation mesh etc.

Most of the logic, from loading resources/locations, switching locations, triggering events etc is handled via script. I'm doing this so that I might do further games in the same style more easily... but licencing the engine could also be a possibility. But it is all too early to say.

As for the story, I think it's a pretty good premisse that admitedly needs fleshing out. It weaves historical figures and places with made up events and spans some over 110 years. We'll see what comes out of it...

I have vague plans for World Domination
Chris K
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 13:47
It would be cool if you could get force-feedback keyboards and mice.

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 13:47
I finished DW2, but can't quite remember what I went on. What I do remember is that my MotherBoard at the time fried while I was playing it!

I have vague plans for World Domination
Raven
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 14:18
Discworld 2 was pretty short and easy on the whole.. compared to the original.

Quote: "It would be cool if you could get force-feedback keyboards and mice."


Been and gone, they didn't catch on. I like that new Mouse & Keyboard combo from Microsoft though, looks amazing. Want to get one as soon as.

I do like the keyboard for certain games, but guess I'm just getting far too used to console games. Feels like you get more control. I don't expect Flight-Sim to fit on a controller, but why can't racing games or action adventures, etc.

Intel Pentium-D 2.8GHz, 512MB DDR2 433, Ati Radeon X1600 Pro 256MB PCI-E, Windows Vista RC1 / XP Professional SP2
Kenjar
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Posted: 15th Oct 2006 14:51
I am exactly the oppersite. The controller feels clumsy, it puts too much stress of the thumb and fingers as you move them into unnatural positions. The buttons with squres, triangles, numbers or letters don't mean much to me. The joystick on the other hand does, the hat switch to move the view, main button to fire, first button for missle, then the rest for special functions. Admittedly I have to remember these as well, but more often than not I can program in the keyboard letters into the joystick myself into a pattern that makes more sense. And of cause I still have the keyboard with letters like K for kick, or R for run. Admittedly space isn't make much logical sense for jump, it can be twisted to say the oppersite. But the simple fact of the matter is I've used keyboards, mice and joysticks since my 286 PC, I used them before that for the Atari ST, I certainly used a joystick for the Atari 400, and the keyboard for the BBC Master. I'm not too old to learn how to use a joypad, but the combination of keyboard, mouse and joystick gives a far greater range than the console does. Many games programmed around the controller interface (Such as X3) where horrible interfaces I think. Rather than hitting F1, F2, F3 or whatever for a quick screen, you are forced do select menu, then move to this, select that, and then get to your screen. It's far less efficant, though admittedly there is a certain amount of memorizing to do, but again, there are features I use rarely and features I use constantly. Either way, I still find the controller less usable than the classic keyboard, mouse, joystick combo.

I lay upon my bed one bright clear night, and gazed upon the distant stars far above, then I thought... where the hell is my roof?
Kenjar
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Posted: 17th Oct 2006 20:45
I just bought broken sword 4, and it's brilliant, up too working out the map bit just after the meat factory, nothing illogical so far. Except possibily the "push the cabinate into the bone cruncher" thing, to my mind you'd likely destory the map too. But reguardless it was easy enough to work out.

I lay upon my bed one bright clear night, and gazed upon the distant stars far above, then I thought... where the hell is my roof?
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 17th Oct 2006 22:35
Wait until you get further...

Visit my web site for real bangin' stuff. Word.

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