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Geek Culture / D&D rules.

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Dextro
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 00:05
Hello.
Ive recently purchased the core manuals for Dungeons and Dragons (the role playing game, ver. 3.5), and Im having some trouble understanding certains rules.
Do any of you knows where can I find in-depth info about combat rules and such?
Ive tried googling but all I get are links for the MMORPG.
Thank you.
Chris K
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 00:12
Wikipedia?

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Preston C
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 00:35
There are several Dungeons and Dragons Veterans on this forum, many of us running the 3.0/3.5 Rules. I have manuals dating back to when they still used THAC0 for attacking. Maybe you could ask your questions here and we could help.

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Dextro
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 00:39
Couldnt find what I looked for in the wiki.
My question is, do I add a strength modifier to the attack roll/Damage roll, even if its negative?
I ask this because in the players handbook, it says you should add the bonus, but if its negative its not a bonus, its a penalty. The book differentiates between the two of them, so I think that if I should add a negative, then its a modifier, not a bonus.
Anyone that could shed some light on the topic would be greatly appreciated.
Saikoro
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 00:42
Yep, you add it. It like adding a negative number, haha. The bonus modifier is the name for whatever + or - you get from having that certain stat point.


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Preston C
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 00:46 Edited at: 17th Nov 2006 00:48
Yes, Saikoro has it right, you do recieve a penalty for a negative strength modifier. For more detailed info on that, Chapter 7: Equipment, Page 113, lists more STR Rules to melee weapons, as such:

Light Weapons: Add Strength Modifier to Light Melee Weapon Attacks.
One-Handed: Add Strength Modifier to One-Handed Melee Weapon Attacks, 1.5x Strength Modifier if Wielding One-Handed Weapon with Two Hands.
Two-Handed: Add 1.5x Strength Modifier to Two-Handed Melee Weapon Attacks.

One would also assume that the multiplication modifiers are applied to penalties as well, such that if you had a -2 STR Modifier, and wielded a Two-Handed Weapon, it would total to a -3 STR Modifier to damage, etc.

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Dextro
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 01:06
Thanks a lot for the help, it surely cleared things out.
Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 01:50 Edited at: 17th Nov 2006 01:53
Quote: "My question is, do I add a strength modifier to the attack roll/Damage roll, even if its negative?
I ask this because in the players handbook, it says you should add the bonus, but if its negative its not a bonus, its a penalty. The book differentiates between the two of them"


As stated above yes you "add" add the negative bonus to your attack and damage with a weapon, you also apply a negative STR modifier to damage from bows and thrown weapons. ANother intersting thing is DEX bonus, when flat footed you do not apply that bonus to your AC but you do still apply the penalty if you have one.


Quote: "One would also assume that the multiplication modifiers are applied to penalties as well, such that if you had a -2 STR Modifier, and wielded a Two-Handed Weapon, it would total to a -3 STR Modifier to damage, etc."


Interesting thought but you do not multiply a negative modifier for a 2 handed weapon, you do however subtract your full strength penalty from each weapon when using two weapon fighting.

EDIT Didnt notice this one
Quote: "1.5x Strength Modifier if Wielding One-Handed Weapon with Two Hands."


That is correct however unless a weapon is designed to be wielded with one or two hand such as a longsword, the wepon is considered innapropriately sized and you get a -2 attack penalty with it.

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Preston C
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 02:31 Edited at: 17th Nov 2006 02:34
Quote: "Interesting thought but you do not multiply a negative modifier for a 2 handed weapon, you do however subtract your full strength penalty from each weapon when using two weapon fighting."


Also Interesting, I've always believed Damage Penalties due to Strength would be multiplied by that value so long as the multiplication was over one. To me, it makes more sense, don't want a specific scrawny Wizard in the party I'm DM'ing thinking they can put enough force behind a Great Axe to even swing it properly, their low Strength making the actual impact less damaging.

However, yes, you're correct considering that. My little rule modifications are for my own group, and shouldn't be raised and enforced on other groups or DM's.

But the full penalty while two weapon fighting does make sense, something I overlooked in mentioning as well, good call.

Quote: "That is correct however unless a weapon is designed to be wielded with one or two hand such as a longsword, the wepon is considered innapropriately sized and you get a -2 attack penalty with it."


Hence why I stated One-Handed Weapons only, and not Light Weapons, both of which are labeled differently in the Weapons Table. Said weapons can be wielded with two hands and have the full multiplied strength bonus, without an innapropriately sized penalty, as noted on Pg.113:

Quote: "One-Handed: A one-handed weapon can be used in either the primary hand or the off hand. Add the wielder's Strength bonus to damage rolls for melee attacks with a one-handed weapon if it's used in the primary hand, or 1/2 his or her Strength bonus if it's used in the off hand. If a one-handed weapon is wielded with two hands during melee combat, add 1-1/2 times the character's Strength bonus to damage rolls."


Further Backed Up by Pg.134:

Quote: "Strength Bonus:

...

Wielding a Weapon Two-Handed: When you deal damage with a weapon that you are wielding two-handed, you add 1-1/2 times your Strength bonus. However, you don't get this higher Strength bonus when using a light weapon with two hands (see Light, One Handed, and Two-Handed Melee Weapons, page 113)."


Size penalties are for using weapons designed for creatures of different sizes than the character wielding the weapon only, I believe. A dagger designed for a halfing (a small creature) can only be wielded by a human (a medium creature) with a -2 penalty.

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The dude guy
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 03:48
How do you memorize all these rules?
Mnemonix
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 03:56
If you are going to be running a campaign then I suggest the monster manual and the dungeon masters guide.

If you are using the information to help you build a computer RPG then i still recommend the dungeon masters guide as it has a lot of information that will be useful to you as the creator, whereas the PHB only has information regarding the players rules.

WE SHALL BECOME ALL POWERFUL! CRUSH THE LESSER RACES! CONQUER THE GALAXY! UNIMAGINABLE POWER! UNLIMITED RICE PUDDING ! ! ! ETC. ! ! ! ETC.! ! !
Preston C
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 04:05
Quote: "How do you memorize all these rules?"


The basics usually become second nature after a few sessions, yet you should always have your Guides around, just incase a rule conflict comes up.

Or if you need to set a player back into line with a nice swift smack to the head by one of said guides

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 04:11
Yes those guides are dangerous weapons ^_^

WE SHALL BECOME ALL POWERFUL! CRUSH THE LESSER RACES! CONQUER THE GALAXY! UNIMAGINABLE POWER! UNLIMITED RICE PUDDING ! ! ! ETC. ! ! ! ETC.! ! !
Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 06:31
That's why I like Paranoia better... it's much easier to GM.

Ok Clust-R-BOM-3 you're pointing the mega blasto-ray cannon with bouncy bubble beverage cooler at your fellow troubleshooter Whine-R-RRR-5.

Clust-R-BOM: I shoot him.

Whine-R-RRR: (Hands me a written note that says: I use my telekinesis to pull his pants down.)

Me: Rolls 20 sided dice... I ignore the roll.

Ok... Clust-R-BOM just as you pull the trigger your pants fall down, you trip and accidentally shoot behind Whine-R-RRR. The Computers monitor is totally destroyed. Another monitor flashes on. You see the eye of The Computer... "Destroying computer property is treason.". Everybody shoots Clust-R-BOM.
Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 07:48
Grogs a mutant blast him, all hail the computer. On your way out dont forget to stop by R&D and try out our new prototype.

Quote: "How do you memorize all these rules? "


You just get used to them, also I have written numerous articles, modules, and sourcebooks so they get drilled in, of course sometimes you have one of those "does it still work that way in 3.5 or was that 3.0" moments.

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 07:48
Hahaha I always wanted to play paranoia. It sounds like a lot of fun. Isn't it correct that its a drinking game as well as an RPG?

WE SHALL BECOME ALL POWERFUL! CRUSH THE LESSER RACES! CONQUER THE GALAXY! UNIMAGINABLE POWER! UNLIMITED RICE PUDDING ! ! ! ETC. ! ! ! ETC.! ! !
Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 07:54
Quote: "Hahaha I always wanted to play paranoia. It sounds like a lot of fun. Isn't it correct that its a drinking game as well as an RPG?"


Depends on how the GM runs it, I used to arm all the players with squirt guns, some larger than others for yellows and the like, so they could shoot the crap out of one another. The game was very physical also, if a higher rank told you to do 20 pushups the player darn well got down and gave em before he needed his next clone.

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transient
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Posted: 17th Nov 2006 11:43
They should make people do this before they log on to wow. Goodbye teenage obesity.


Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 18th Nov 2006 00:54
Quote: "Depends on how the GM runs it, I used to arm all the players with squirt guns, some larger than others for yellows and the like, so they could shoot the crap out of one another. The game was very physical also, if a higher rank told you to do 20 pushups the player darn well got down and gave em before he needed his next clone."


I have a huge plastic bin (in storage right now) full of weird equipment for R&D. Everything from womens bracelets and transparent ice scrapers to plastic phones (that once had candy in them) with batteries wires and small plastic containers of saltwater (is it a bomb?!). And of course many old computer motherboards, connectors and isa cards. Lots of plastic guns too.

Being the happiness officer was always the coolest. I always made sure they had Smarties candy to give to players that weren't happy enough.
SunnyKatt
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Posted: 18th Nov 2006 02:03
lol dungeons and dragons is so complicated that when i was younger i just bought craploads of them and made my own rules and had 3 day long seiges with my friends. good days. gooood days.

IM NEVER ONLINE TILL SOMETIME AT NIGHT!!! god dont expect me to be sitting at my computer all the time
CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Nov 2006 02:10
I still have all my AD&D stuff from early 1980's in a box in the basement. It includes all the original Gary Gygax books, a slew of modules, dice, dm screens, etc. Ah, the good ol days.

Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 18th Nov 2006 02:16
Yeah the closet in my bedromm has no clothes shoes or anything in it but a filing cabinet and roleplaying books, over the years I ammased all the d&d books from ziploc whites to 3.5. The only thing (that has not come out in that last year or so) that I am missing is the orange cover version of B3 palace of the silver princess. Though I do have it as an electronic DL that wizards released. Have all the versions of the original 1st edition stuff including all covers, the Elric/Cthulu Deities and demigods and pastel cover versions of all the mods. I used to have a table at gaming cons selling vintage stuff but got tired of all the lugging now I just go to play.

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Dextro
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Posted: 20th Nov 2006 06:22
Uhm.
I got another question, how do i calculate the flat footed AC and the touched AC in PCs and NPCs in general?
Saikoro
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Posted: 20th Nov 2006 06:25
Subtract the Dexterity modifier of the victim from the victim's AC I believe.


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Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 20th Nov 2006 15:44
Flat footed loses any dexterity modifier, dodge modifier(unless stated otherwise) and possibly shield modifier if it is not already drawn. Touch ac adds only dexterity, dodge and deflection bonuses to armor (Armor bonus, natural armor bonus and shield bonus are not added).

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indi
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 09:53
so thaco is out with 3.5? i stopped after 2.0 with the brown additional classes supplement books.

you could not do better then a bard jonguler halfling monk, basically 50% dodge everything at 1st level.

The game was great, it was the power gamers who would ruin it for everyone.

Dextro
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Posted: 24th Nov 2006 03:56
Got another question, unspecified on the core manuals (or so I think):
When, for example, I cast Bull's Strength on my self and my strength raises, so does the modifier?
Saikoro
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Posted: 24th Nov 2006 05:44
I do believe so, otherwise Bull's Strength wouldn't be of much use then would it? haha


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Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 24th Nov 2006 09:33
Quote: "Got another question, unspecified on the core manuals (or so I think):
When, for example, I cast Bull's Strength on my self and my strength raises, so does the modifier? "


Yes, remember it is an enhancement modifier and except for Dodge, Circumstance and unnamed modifiers, you use only the highest modifier. Example a player is wearing gloves of Ogre power (+2 strength enhancement bonus) that player has bull's strength cast on them (a +4 enhancement modifier) the player only has a +4 to strength not a +6.

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Kaurotu
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Posted: 24th Nov 2006 15:50
Yeah D&D rocks.

I might even be playing tonight.

Good luck on your D&D adventures!

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